Is Faith in Jesus Faith to Keep the Law?

marks · Mar 1, 2019

bbyrd009 said:
Imo it's so much easier to dismiss the Law--the only thing we can put a finger on deemed "Holy" in the Bible btw--than to recognize that "the law is insufficient" means that we are to do even better than it, it is the minimum standard iow.

Of course it follows that if there is no law, no confession need ever be made right? I have been documenting the various ways we avoid confession over the last week or so, quite revealing imo. We are all experts at this I guess

I'm sure you are right!

Romans 4:14-16
14 For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless, 15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression. 16 Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.

Much love!
Mark

BTW . . . wasn't the "standard" met by Jesus?

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
It is so funny that the lawyers of this world always need to justify sin, is not the law for sinners?? what has the righteouness of Christ got to do with sin.

The zenith of human, yea, satanic arrogance, that and nothing to do with anything of Christ! And there is nothing funny about, the Law is for sinners, but you of course is not a sinner. Why, and that, two, question marks?

marks · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
This is the sum-total of all difference between free-will and free grace religion. God does not "'make us better'", and I for one, do not "'see His glory reflected in our lives'" BUT MARRED and grossly caricatured, baddest and saddest in such reflections by the spirit-of-self-filled Christianity -- in a word, in Roman Catholic doctrine.

Hi Gerhard,

You are correct, I mis-spoke. God does not "make us better". He begot us rightous and holy when we were born again. So in that sense, we cannot be made better. God does not make us better in our flesh, either, since the flesh is hopelessly corrupted, and is condemned. So our flesh is not improved, and so you are right, God does not make us better.

What I should have said was that God gives us greater self-control, something that we sometimes refer to as sanctification, in which our righteous and holy new creation spirit takes greater and greater control over our corrupt and condemned flesh, so that it does not do the things it wants, but rather we impose our will, from the mind of Christ within us, over that flesh, to make it serve the new man.

And I feel sorry that you do not see God's glory in those Christians you know, and even in yourself. For those he called, he also justified, and those he justified, he also glorified.

Much love!
Mark

marks · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
What has man's crap and crowing roostership to do with Grace? But Paul tells you what the Law has to do with Grace, Romans 5:20,21!

Do you mean my crap and crowing roostership?

I'm sorry I offend you so!

Much love!
Mark

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
you and all your lawyer friends by your very own words, make yourselves sinners, the very thing you claim the law is supposed to stop you doing,

"'the law is supposed to stop you make yourselves sinners" is YOUR false arrogation, not mine.

The Law also cannot make me a sinner, I am one of myself and so are you.

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
PAnic over what, my faith is in Christ, I cant save myself...

"'Panic over what?'", I have seen a lot of this recently. Can't save myself and can't be convinced of my sin and judgement, and cannot see my righteousness is in myself.

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

Salvation is no matter of laissez faire; "The Spirit of Truth which proceedeth from the Father, He, shall testify of Me", JESUS, "He will reprove / convince of SIN and of JUDGEMENT, and of Righteousness..." CHRIST "THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS!" "He shall not speak of Himself but shall glorify Me for He shall receive of mine and shall show of mine to you all things of the Father which are mine."

But what is shown and seen and heard instead? The spirit which proceedeth from man!

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
"'Panic over what?'", I have seen a lot of this recently. Can't save myself and can't be convinced of my sin and judgement, and cannot see my righteousness is in myself.

Because we have no righteousness of our own, we can stand before God, because of the righteousness of Christ, we will never do it of ourselves.

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
"'the law is supposed to stop you make yourselves sinners" is YOUR false arrogation, not mine.

The Law also cannot make me a sinner, I am one of myself and so are you.

You are because you are not in Christ, you simply miss the point,

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Rom 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

As JEsus put it.

It is finished, you simply dont believe it.

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
The zenith of human, yea, satanic arrogance, that and nothing to do with anything of Christ! And there is nothing funny about, the Law is for sinners, but you of course is not a sinner. Why, and that, two, question marks?

Not before God, no once one is in Christ, we are no longer sinner, if it where the case, no flesh would be saved, none, and that would make God a liar, as so many try make Him out to be.

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
What has man's crap and crowing roostership to do with Grace? But Paul tells you what the Law has to do with Grace, Romans 5:20,21!

So what you are saying is you keep the law, knowing at that you will fail, so that you will sin more, so that grace will abound more. dont you know Jesus died to sin once and forever?? how many times a day do you need Him to get back up on that cross for you, was once not enough.??

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

Mens Idols, you reveal them to men and boy do they get mad...

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

marks said:
You are correct, I mis-spoke. God does not "make us better". He begot us rightous and holy when we were born again. So in that sense, we cannot be made better.

From arrogance to flippancy.

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

marks said:
God makes us better, and this is one description of how. We see His glory reflected in our lives, as He is making His glory to be our glory, just as He has given His righteousness to be our righteousness, His death to be our death, His resurrection to be our resurrection. Yes. It all comes from our God.

Amen, ,and that is the best outcome unless God can improve on Himself..

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
Maybe trying to show man can keep the Law has something to do with many trying to prove themselves to God. But what has the Law got to do with all man's crap and crowing roostership?

Well I guess you will have to answer that, are you not the one trying to justify the law.... otr is it to do with this,

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
Mens Idols, you reveal them to men and boy do they get mad...

I cannot recommend quack or cure for the Sick.

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
So what you are saying is you keep the law, knowing at that you will fail, so that you will sin more, so that grace will abound more. dont you know Jesus died to sin once and forever?? how many times a day do you need Him to get back up on that cross for you, was once not enough.??

If you were God's Holy Spirit you might have been right.

GerhardEbersoehn · Mar 1, 2019

mjrhealth said:
Well I guess you will have to answer that, are you not the one trying to justify the law.... otr is it to do with this,

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

As I said, If you were God's Holy Spirit you might have been right.

mjrhealth · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
I cannot recommend quack or cure for the Sick.

Should one repeat ones self

Mat 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?
Mat 15:17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?
Mat 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
Mat 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

marks · Mar 1, 2019

GerhardEbersoehn said:
From arrogance to flippancy.

Perjoratives instead of evidence. And I'm curious, what do you find about my post to be flippant?

You've pointed to an error I made, I acknowledged it, and corrected myself. Is that so unheard of?

Much love!
Mark

Is Faith in Jesus Faith to Keep the Law?

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads