Can We as Saved Christians Lose Our Salvation?

APAK said:

@Berean if you are actually a strict adherer in the meaning of scripture, I'm surprised you don't view the context of what you pose in scripture.

Well to the next verse on your list…2 Corinthians 6:1

This verse pertains to spiritual immaturity and laziness of believers.

To remind many Corinthians that are saved to continue to work as servants of God and spread the gospel in the spirit of Christ. Many needed reminded that they were saved by the grace of God and not by themselves and just for their own benefit.

(2Co 6:1) And working together with him we entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain.

Now this verse is the continuation of thought and context of the entire previous Chapter 5, at least. One must read it all before understanding and reading 2 Corinth 6:1.

This verse has nothing to do with losing salvation. It is all about being saved by the grace of God and then misusing or not growing in the spirit because of the things said in Chapter 5 at least. This is what is meant by receiving the grace of God in vain – for the wrong reason(s). This grace saved us but we can abuse this new life by not extending it to others because we are not working in spirit with Christ, in cooperation, in sanctification and personal spiritual growth. This is the point! We must speak of the gospel in the spirit of Christ, as to be blameless as we endure under hardships – read verse 2 and on…

(2Co 6:2) For He said: In a time of acceptance I hearkened to you, and in a day of salvation did I succour you. Behold, now is the time of acceptance; behold, now is the day of salvation.
(2Co 6:3) We aim to give no reason for stumbling in anything, that our ministry is not blamed.
(2Co 6:4) But in everything, commending ourselves as servants of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses,
(2Co 6:5) in stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults, in labours, in watchings, in fastings.
(2Co 6:6) In pureness, in knowledge, in patience, in kindness, in the Holy Spirit, in sincere love,
(2Co 6:7) in the word of truth, in the power of God; by the armour of righteousness on the right hand and on the left,

………………..etc


Paul is again echoing his determination of a reward and prize to win as a race at the judgement seat of Christ in the future. He wants the Corinthians to become as he, in heart and mind...not to have received God's grace for salvation for the wrong reasons. Paul wanted them to rediscover why God gave this grace to mankind for salvation in the first place.


Bless you,


APAK

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"ByGrace" said:

Hey BOL
Agree, we can absolutely lose our PLACE/Position ...but too many equate that with salvation. A son is a son is a son.
The prodigal was a son..a stinking son, a pig pen son...nevertheless his Father looked daily for His sons return. The son was not un-son-ed.

We know that Jesus showed many times positions in the kingdom.( the talents etc) ..and when James and John said " Grant that we may sit on your left and right in the kingdom. Jesus did not say..."Don't be daft, there is no positioning" He said " It is not mine to give, but God's..."

That is why Paul "pressed toward the prize of the High calling."
God is the Prize..and in Him are many places ( mansions)

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Nancy said:

Well said @APAK
Are we not to "work out our own salvation"? Which, to me anyhow means to extend the same grace and love and forgiveness that has been given us.

...2 Cor 6: For He says: “In the time of favor I heard you, and in the day of salvation I helped you.” Behold, now is the time of favor; now is the day of salvation!…
♥

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Nancy said:

Well put, very much so! I now have a new way of looking at this. Un-son-ed

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BreadOfLife said:

WHO said anything about being “un-soned”??

Did God “stop” loving Israel because THEY were unfaithful to HIM?? No.
The Scriptures tell us that God hates DIVORCE (Mal. 2:16) – not Israel. He didn’t cut THEM off – they cut HIM off.

It’s the same in the New Covenant.
Nobody can snatch us out of His hand – but WE can jump out of our OWN will. God is NOT a Cosmic Rapist who forces His love on us. He gives US the choice to love Him. He doesn’t drag ANYBODY kicking and screaming against their will into Heaven – and He doesn’t send ANYBODY kicking and screaming against their will into Hell.

It’s all our choice.
That’s what FREE WILL is all about.

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Nancy said:

Well said @APAK
Are we not to "work out our own salvation"? Which, to me anyhow means to extend the same grace and love and forgiveness that has been given us.

...2 Cor 6: For He says: “In the time of favor I heard you, and in the day of salvation I helped you.” Behold, now is the time of favor; now is the day of salvation!…
♥

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Nancy said:

Well said @APAK
Are we not to "work out our own salvation"? Which, to me anyhow means to extend the same grace and love and forgiveness that has been given us.

...2 Cor 6: For He says: “In the time of favor I heard you, and in the day of salvation I helped you.” Behold, now is the time of favor; now is the day of salvation!…
♥

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Episkopos said:

Jesus said...they who endure to the end will be saved....not all will endure to the end. Jesus also said that many try but few are able to enter in the gate.

What is that gate? Jesus is the gate to heaven. Very few will enter in and find rest in the heavenly realm of the Spirit.

I think our modern privileged generation can't stomach the idea that everything isn't provided freely at the outset. Some seeking will be required.

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BreadOfLife said:

Another thing – remember that Jesus taught that believers CAN fall away in the Parable of the Sower:
Luke 8:13
"And the ones (seeds) on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away."

This is NOT about a person who rejected Christ – but RECEIVED Him and later fell away.

Peter expounds on this by saying that it would be better to have NEVER believed than to have believed and later fallen away:
2 Peter 2:20-21
"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE (epignosis) of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."

Finally – Paul drives home this point:
Phil. 2:10-14
. . . that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death; in order that I MAY attain to the resurrection from the dead.
Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus. Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead, I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

ALL 3 of these passages speak of the possibility of the born again Christian NOT being saved.

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BreadOfLife said:

WHO said anything about being “un-soned”??

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marks said:

What part of "for he has promised, I will never leave you nor forsake you" is ambiguous?

Never is never is never. And I don't see any qualifiers, like, unless you blow it big time . . .

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APAK said:

@Berean if you are actually a strict adherer in the meaning of scripture, I'm surprised you don't view the context of what you pose in scripture.

Well to the next verse on your list…2 Corinthians 6:1

This verse pertains to spiritual immaturity and laziness of believers.

To remind many Corinthians that are saved to continue to work as servants of God and spread the gospel in the spirit of Christ. Many needed reminded that they were saved by the grace of God and not by themselves and just for their own benefit.

(2Co 6:1) And working together with him we entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain.

Now this verse is the continuation of thought and context of the entire previous Chapter 5, at least. One must read it all before understanding and reading 2 Corinth 6:1.

This verse has nothing to do with losing salvation. It is all about being saved by the grace of God and then misusing or not growing in the spirit because of the things said in Chapter 5 at least. This is what is meant by receiving the grace of God in vain – for the wrong reason(s). This grace saved us but we can abuse this new life by not extending it to others because we are not working in spirit with Christ, in cooperation, in sanctification and personal spiritual growth. This is the point! We must speak of the gospel in the spirit of Christ, as to be blameless as we endure under hardships – read verse 2 and on…

(2Co 6:2) For He said: In a time of acceptance I hearkened to you, and in a day of salvation did I succour you. Behold, now is the time of acceptance; behold, now is the day of salvation.
(2Co 6:3) We aim to give no reason for stumbling in anything, that our ministry is not blamed.
(2Co 6:4) But in everything, commending ourselves as servants of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses,
(2Co 6:5) in stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults, in labours, in watchings, in fastings.
(2Co 6:6) In pureness, in knowledge, in patience, in kindness, in the Holy Spirit, in sincere love,
(2Co 6:7) in the word of truth, in the power of God; by the armour of righteousness on the right hand and on the left,

………………..etc


Paul is again echoing his determination of a reward and prize to win as a race at the judgement seat of Christ in the future. He wants the Corinthians to become as he, in heart and mind...not to have received God's grace for salvation for the wrong reasons. Paul wanted them to rediscover why God gave this grace to mankind for salvation in the first place.


Bless you,


APAK

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"ByGrace" said:

Sorry ..but the only seed that took ROOT and thrived were the good seed. It is just the same as the 10 talented man, the five talented and the 1., who just buried his..= no fruit.

Once SAVED, always saved.

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"ByGrace" said:

I did. Once a son is born, he is born...you cannot poke him back in.
Once a son, always a son. ( Until a Bride!!! )

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BreadOfLife said:

Then you didn't actually read the passage.
Jesus stated clearly that the person RECEIVED the Word (Him) with joy - and then fell away.

This is not a person who rejected the Word or simply let it pass on by.
It is a born again person who fell away . . .

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CoreIssue said:

In all this discussion about enduring to the end the simple reality is being missed. This was written to Jews when Mosaic law was still in force. Not to the church as too many people are reading it.

Before the resurrection one could lose the promise of salvation. Simply because no one will begin until the resurrection.

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"ByGrace" said:

In my time I have seen many, MANY "get all excited" come along to a few meetings....get bored and fall away like a puff of wind...they had no root in HIM.

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BreadOfLife said:

NOT according to the Bible . . .

Romans 11:22
“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God's kindness to you, provided you REMAIN in his kindness; otherwise you to will be cut off.”
Paul is warning the faithful to REMAIN in God’s favor or they will lose their salvation. How can they lose what they never had?

Hebrews 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”
This is a clear warning that falling away from God will result in the loss of our salvation. The Greek ford for “knowledge” used here is NOT the usual word (oida). This is talking about a full, experiential knowledge (Epignosis). This verse is about CHRISTIANS who had an EPIGNOSIS of Christ and who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

2 Peter 2:20-22
For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.
For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.
Here, Peter illustrates that those who had a full, experiential knowledge (Epignosis) of Christ – CHRISTIANS – who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Matt. 5:13
You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.
This one is self-explanatory - even to a deaf, dumb and blind person . . .

1 Cor. 9:27
"I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."
Paul is saying that he wrestles with his own fleshly desires so that he might not fall back into sin.

2 Peter 3:17
Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and fall from your secure position.
Peter is warning the faithful not to fall back into sin and lawlessness.

1 John 2:24
See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. IF it does, you also will REMAIN in the Son and in the Father.
This is an admonition to try to remain faithful.

Rev. 3:5
He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.
God cannot "blot out" a name that was never there in the first place. He is talking about CHRISTIANS who are already saved and how they can LOSE their salvation.

Rev. 22:19
And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
How can God take away somebody’s "share" of heaven if they never had it to begin with? This is about CHRISTIANS who may or may NOT make it into Heaven.

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CoreIssue said:

Is this another example of Catholic thinking?

All the verses you quoted are after the resurrection of Christ.

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BreadOfLife said:

Didn't YOU say that the teachings about "enduring" were only for the JEWS in regards to the Mosaic Law?
The passages I presented show that this teaching is for EVERYBODY who is in Christ.

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