Trinity vs. Tritheism: Understanding the Trinity.

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justbyfaith

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I am satisfied...

I know that I do not deny the plurality of our Triune God, even though I seek to emphasize His Oneness in order to fight against the heresy called Tritheism.

As Paul said in Ephesians, so I say to all of you:


Eph 3:3, How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Eph 3:4, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

posts #1-#4 of this thread are things in particular that this applies to.

shortcut:

Trinity II
 
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Dave L

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I am satisfied...

I know that I do not deny the plurality of our Triune God, even though I seek to emphasize His Oneness in order to fight against the heresy called Tritheism.

As Paul said in Ephesians, so I say to all of you:


Eph 3:3, How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,


Eph 3:4, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

posts #1-#4 of this thread are things in particular that this applies to.

shortcut:

Trinity II
Scripture says people cannot see God. “But He answered, “You cannot see My face, for no one can see Me and live.”” (Exodus 33:20) (HCSB)

Jesus says no man has seen the Father. “No one has ever seen God. The One and Only Son — the One who is at the Father’s side — He has revealed Him.” (John 1:18) (HCSB)

“The LORD spoke with Moses face to face, just as a man speaks with his friend. Then Moses would return to the camp, but his assistant, the young man Joshua son of Nun, would not leave the inside of the tent.” (Exodus 33:11) (HCSB)

So Moses must have been speaking to the preincarnate Son who is at the Father’s side who reveals Him.
 

justbyfaith

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The Son declares the Father.

When we see Jesus we see the Father according to John 14:7-11.

This is because the the Father is in Jesus and Jesus is in the Father...the Father is the Spirit of Jesus. Compare John 4:23-24 with John 14:7-11.

A Spirit is something that cannot be seen...but if a Spirit takes on human flesh, we can see the Person that that Spirit is by looking at the flesh of that Person, by extension.
 
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Dave L

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The Son declares the Father.

When we see Jesus we see the Father according to John 14:7-11.

This is because the the Father is in Jesus and Jesus is in the Father...the Father is the Spirit of Jesus.

A Spirit is something that cannot be seen...but if a Spirit takes on human flesh, we can see the Person that that Spirit is by looking at the flesh of that Person, by extension.
But oneness makes scripture contradict itself. "No man has seen God", "Moses spoke face to face with God". You need the trinity to solve this.
 

justbyfaith

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But oneness makes scripture contradict itself. "No man has seen God", "Moses spoke face to face with God". You need the trinity to solve this.
And I have the Trinity.

It is just that my version of the Trinity rejects the heresy of Tritheism.
 
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Dave L

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That is your contention. When I look at the creeds, I do not see them contradicting the Trinity as I understand it.
If you agree with the following points, you agree with the trinitarian creeds. (1) There is only one God. (2) The Father is God. (3) The Son is God. (4) The Holy Spirit is God. (5) The Father is not the Son. (6) The Son is the not the Holy Spirit. (7) The Holy Spirit is not the Father.
 

justbyfaith

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There is a sense in which I have always agreed to these things.

But then, if I disagree, it has to do with the context of the discussion.

Because there is a sense in which the Holy Spirit is the Father (and another sense in which He isn't).
 

justbyfaith

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Also, he that hath the Son hath life.

How can this be if the Son is not a Spirit?

And yet, Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.

Figure that one out.
 
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justbyfaith

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@Dave L:

Is the Spirit of Christ a different Spirit than the Holy Spirit?

Because there is a sense in which the Spirit of Christ is Jesus Christ.

I am a spirit, I have a soul, and I dwell in a body. Is this not the common teaching?
 
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Dave L

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@Dave L:

Is the Spirit of Christ a different Spirit than the Holy Spirit?

Because there is a sense in which the Spirit of Christ is Jesus Christ.

I am a spirit, I have a soul, and I dwell in a body. Is this not the common teaching?
I posted this in another thread a few days ago. It shows my present level of understanding about God. I shortened it to answer your question.

If you point in any direction, God is there. And if you travel in any direction to the point where space is too thin for matter to fit into, and no longer exists, God is still there. And if you punch through and keep going forever, God continues without beginning or end. This is called God's immensity in historic theology.

God created time, space and matter within his eternal spiritual presence. Paul says; “For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.” (Acts 17:28) (KJV 1900) So he is everywhere present through all and beyond all creation. The Psalmist says, “Whither shall I go from thy spirit? Or whither shall I flee from thy presence? If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: If I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.” (Psalm 139:7–8) (KJV 1900)

So if you strip away time, space, and matter, you have the spiritual dimension also called the Spirit of God (God is Spirit). And therein is his eternal decree. Of all that ever was, is, or ever will be, including the New Heavens and earth. All made visible by time, space, and matter.

But the Spiritual dimension, (God) is the holy trinity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit each everywhere eternally present as God.
 

justbyfaith

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Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, being the one Spirit, the one Lord, and the one God..
 
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CoreIssue

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I am satisfied...

I know that I do not deny the plurality of our Triune God, even though I seek to emphasize His Oneness in order to fight against the heresy called Tritheism.

As Paul said in Ephesians, so I say to all of you:


Eph 3:3, How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Eph 3:4, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

posts #1-#4 of this thread are things in particular that this applies to.

shortcut:

Trinity II

Do you mean polytheism?

I understand what you're getting at and agree.
Scripture says people cannot see God. “But He answered, “You cannot see My face, for no one can see Me and live.”” (Exodus 33:20) (HCSB)

Jesus says no man has seen the Father. “No one has ever seen God. The One and Only Son — the One who is at the Father’s side — He has revealed Him.” (John 1:18) (HCSB)

“The LORD spoke with Moses face to face, just as a man speaks with his friend. Then Moses would return to the camp, but his assistant, the young man Joshua son of Nun, would not leave the inside of the tent.” (Exodus 33:11) (HCSB)

So Moses must have been speaking to the preincarnate Son who is at the Father’s side who reveals Him.

The pre-incarnate son what's the second person of the eternity, not Jesus Christ.
You do not have the doctrine of the trinity found in the ecumenical creeds.

Why do you keep going to the creeds instead of the Bible?
 

Helen

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Oneness is modalism.

Every tab or new page I try to click into on your Site says -

< This site can’t be reached
christiantalkzone.net took too long to respond. >

I got the Forum page, but could open anything else :(


 

justbyfaith

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Oneness is modalism.
I do not believe in modes, so I must be a Trinitarian. :):):).

I do emphasize that the Lord is one according to the first and great commandment, Mar 12:29.

And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: