Where is the New Jerusalem?

VictoryinJesus said:

All I’m suggesting is the right eye that offends was plucked out and the right hand that offends was cut off at ...your husband is dead; you are free to go marry another.

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Hmm, I don't see the connection, at least not yet. How was the right eye plucked out again, in your scenario there?

"and the right hand that offends was cut off at?"

"ByGrace" said:

There will be much disappointment.

Just as in Jesus day...they were all excited , expecting Him to literally restore and "bring in the kingdom". He DID, spiritually, not literally.
The New Jerusalem in my book it's the completion of Jew, Gentle and Bride. ...
"Abraham looked for a CITY which hath foundations..who's builder and maker is God. "
"For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ."

Nothing is said about anything which does not show Jesus Christ as it rock and centre . The New Jerusalem is not separated from HIM, ..in Him ALL things consist ... it is not a 'literal something' but a spiritual realm in Him in which we live and move and have our being.

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ha I knew if pEnoch dissed it, it would be gold lol. Ty

Enoch111 said:

I'm sure ScottA is delighted with this spiritualizing away of Scripture. The fact that we live and move and have our being in Christ DOES NOT nullify the reality of an eternal heavenly city specifically created by God for His saints to dwell eternally.

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I don't think he meant to imply it wasn't real, pEnoch, just not material?
Won't come by observation, etc?

bbyrd009 said:

haven't we already accepted that as a valid assumption? Without the Spirit could I draw a breath? So I'm not getting your point I guess sorry

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No point other than on my end.Questions I’ve been struggling with concerning the overall endless debate of if man has the power within himself to get up and do anything apart from God. Like Daniel 4:37 Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase.

“those that walk in pride he is able to abase.” Not directed at you; this has been a longtime question of my own. Why doesn’t God abase all those that walk in pride (flesh) since God is able? Why do some who walk in pride die in it and are never abased? If to be abased is to enter into New Jerusalem ...God is able. (Matthew 5:3-10).

Matthew 23:12 [12] And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

Is not all flesh abased (brought low) at the crucifixion?

bbyrd009 said:

m Ross I'm curious bc you must have some reply ready for when ppl ask this irl and you can't employ the same tactics to avoid and ignore that are available on a forum,

how do you respond to No one has ever gone up to heaven in that case? Ty

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But Enock did or is that just a fable?

Now did Elvis sing a song about it?

VictoryinJesus said:

Why do some who walk in pride die in it and are never abased?

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example?

VictoryinJesus said:

If to be abased is to enter into New Jerusalem .

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don't see how this could be possible, sorry

VictoryinJesus said:

Is not all flesh abased (brought low) at the crucifixion?

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hmm. Imo yes, but the phrase is so occluded as to be moot, and I would be asking which crucifixion there, Jesus', or our picking up our own crosses and Living Sacrifice? Iow to whom are we appealing with this concept, God--wherein your answer is great imo--or man, who cannot hear Word?

See bc practically speaking your Q up there is not much use to the world (the vast majority of believers) imo, even though it is true enough. Assuming by "flesh" you mean "worldly thinking" anyway, not actual flesh

Jay Ross said:

But Enock did or is that just a fable?

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well, I note that we cannot Quote that right

Now Enoch walked with God; and was no more

if I remem right

bbyrd009 said:

don't see how this could be possible, sorry

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2 Corinthians 10:5
[5] Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

bbyrd009 said:

example?

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Again the example would be: 2 Corinthians 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Don’t always see this happening but instead it sometimes looks like the opposite as in high things exalted above the Lord.

Maybe even Revelation 17:16-17 would be an example “And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.”

VictoryinJesus said:

2 Corinthians 10:5
[5] Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

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Well imo that is just a restatement of "abase yourself that you may be exalted," the valid desire there being "exalted?"

And imo the general (mis)application of "it is finished" where most seem to prefer applying it to themselves doing anything rather than God being all done doing everything He needs to do plays in also

bbyrd009 said:

Well imo that is just a restatement of "abase yourself that you may be exalted," the valid desire there being "exalted?"

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The desire there being abased ...under Him where He is exalted.

Psalm 37:4-9
[4] Delight thyself also in the Lord ; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart. [5] Commit thy way unto the Lord ; trust also in him; and he shall bring it to pass. [6] And he shall bring forth thy righteousness as the light, and thy judgment as the noonday. [7] Rest in the Lord , and wait patiently for him: fret not thyself because of him who prospereth in his way, because of the man who bringeth wicked devices to pass. [8] Cease from anger, and forsake wrath: fret not thyself in any wise to do evil. [9] For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the Lord , they shall inherit the earth.

VictoryinJesus said:

Again the example would be: 2 Corinthians 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Don’t always see this happening but instead it sometimes looks like the opposite as in high things exalted above the Lord.

Maybe even Revelation 17:16-17 would be an example “And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.”

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Well I meant a real-world example...um and we have a Discussion about this not being able to see how the proud are brought low in the moment, psalms maybe? Too loud where I am to think anymore, and it's raining outside lol sorry

bbyrd009 said:

"and the right hand that offends was cut off at?"

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bbyrd009 said:

don't see how this could be possible, sorry

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Isaiah 10:33-34
[33] Behold, the Lord, the Lord of hosts, shall lop the bough with terror: and the high ones of stature shall be hewn down, and the haughty shall be humbled. [34] And he shall cut down the thickets of the forest with iron, and Lebanon shall fall by a mighty one.

Consider: Cut off there at ‘Lebanon shall fall’. It is the nature of the flesh which offends? Isaiah 11:1-2
[1] And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: [2] And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord ;

Lebanon...consider the Lord planted the trees there but they are full of sap...but that is not the end... “abased” brought under Christ (out of the stem of Jesse).

1 Chronicles 17:1-6
[1] Now it came to pass, as David sat in his house, that David said to Nathan the prophet, Lo, I dwell in an house of cedars, but the ark of the covenant of the Lord remaineth under curtains. [2] Then Nathan said unto David, Do all that is in thine heart; for God is with thee. [3] And it came to pass the same night, that the word of God came to Nathan, saying, [4] Go and tell David my servant, Thus saith the Lord , Thou shalt not build me an house to dwell in: [5] For I have not dwelt in an house since the day that I brought up Israel unto this day; but have gone from tent to tent, and from one tabernacle to another . [6] Wheresoever I have walked with all Israel, spake I a word to any of the judges of Israel, whom I commanded to feed my people, saying, Why have ye not built me an house of cedars?

Did God say “Why have you not built me an house of cedars?” When what He desires is mercy?

Zechariah 11:1-7
[1] Open thy doors, O Lebanon, that the fire may devour thy cedars. [2] Howl, fir tree; for the cedar is fallen; because the mighty are spoiled: howl, O ye oaks of Bashan; for the forest of the vintage is come down. [3] There is a voice of the howling of the shepherds; for their glory is spoiled: a voice of the roaring of young lions; for the pride of Jordan is spoiled. [4] Thus saith the Lord my God; Feed the flock of the slaughter; [5] Whose possessors slay them, and hold themselves not guilty: and they that sell them say, Blessed be the Lord ; for I am rich: and their own shepherds pity them not. [6] For I will no more pity the inhabitants of the land, saith the Lord : but, lo, I will deliver the men every one into his neighbour's hand, and into the hand of his king: and they shall smite the land, and out of their hand I will not deliver them . [7] And I will feed the flock of slaughter, even you, O poor of the flock. And I took unto me two staves; the one I called Beauty, and the other I called Bands; and I fed the flock.

It is the nature of the flesh...pride exalted brought down low in submission to the obedience of Christ.

Too much??

VictoryinJesus said:

It is the nature of the flesh...pride exalted brought down low in submission to the obedience of Christ

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Hmm. Well, every knee will bow, every tongue confess right, and believers have this thing where in their opinion this "confession" = "salvation," yet many will cry "Lord, Lord."
So my reply would have to be "it depends"
Is the "confessor" repentant, or doubling down?

bbyrd009 said:

Hmm. Well, every knee will bow, every tongue confess right, and believers have this thing where in their opinion this "confession" = "salvation," yet many will cry "Lord, Lord."
So my reply would have to be "it depends"
Is the "confessor" repentant, or doubling down?

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Not like He doesn’t already know who cries “Lord, Lord”. The whole point of all these post was that: If it is of men it comes to nothing. If it is of God you cannot overthrow it.

Acts 5:38
[38] And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought:

Acts 5:39
[39] But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God.

VictoryinJesus said:

You had to have brought up plucking out your right eye in regard to where is the New Jerusalem for a reason?

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To emphasize the point about how people SAY that they believe things are literal .... UNTIL the 'sermon on the mount'...when they do NOT take it literally !! ...I have seen no christian church group which has one eyed and one handed people!!
Obviously the New Jerusalem is not literal...
The people ignore the little words like in REV 21
2 "And I John saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

How anyone makes that literal I have no idea!!

@VictoryinJesus quoted.

< " 2 Corinthians 10:5
[5] Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;" >
The way to be abased, is to lift Jesus higher...
It is His obedience to His Father that saved us... We seem to be so caught up in what 'we' have to or should do. It is ALL about Him...and HE gets all the glory. Not about us.

@bbyrd009 said:-

< "Well imo that is just a restatement of "abase yourself that you may be exalted," the valid desire there being "exalted?" >

Even our 'confession' is about Him...not us, don't you think?
We confess HIM...not ourself.