The Issue of Calvinism.

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Kermos

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I did what the Bible says is needed:

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11, For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12, For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
There exists a fatal flaw within the argument of the people promoting free will, that is that the creature must choose Christ at some level. For example, the people promoting free will expouse that people "choose to believe" a.k.a. "choose to put their faith in".

Let us start by examining Romans 10:9-13 for indication of "choose to believe". Here are all occurrences of "believe" with adjacent words:

- "shalt believe in thine heart" (Romans 10:9 - no choice indication here)
- "with the heart man believeth unto righteousness" (Romans 10:10 - no choice indication here)
- "Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed" (Romans 10:11 - no choice indication here)

Romans 10:9 does not contain "choose to believe". Romans 10:10 and Romans 10:11 do not contain "choose to believeth".

Let us next examine the words of the Lord Jesus Christ as recorded by the Apostle John (John 3:16):

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life."

Take notice that Jesus did NOT say "whoever chooses to believe", rather the King of Glory said "whoever believes in Him shall not perish".

The Lord Jesus told us the source (1) for a person to believe, (2) for a person to have belief, and (3) for a person to have faith. Behold, this exchange in which the Lord Jesus Christ declares the source of belief/faith (John 6:28-29):

28 Therefore they said to Him, "What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."

A person believing in Jesus whom the Father has sent is the work of God. The Lord Jesus did not say it is a work of a person, no! The Lord Jesus did say believing is the work of God.

A person can do nothing apart from Jesus, for He said:

"apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5)

A person can NOT choose the Lord Jesus Christ, for He said:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you" (John 15:16)

The Apostle John recorded the Lord Jesus Christ saying "You did not choose Me" meaning a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ does not choose Him at any level, but He closed the loop with "but I chose you" declaring that God does the choosing.

We know that the words of Jesus Christ matter tremendously, yet I can not express is sufficiently, but the Master Orator Himself, He expressed the importance of His words perfectly (Matthew 7:21-27):

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven [will enter].
22 "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'
23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
24 "Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and [yet] it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell - and great was its fall."

And, again the importance of the words of the Lord Jesus (John 12:48):

"He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day."

It is rejection of the Lord Jesus Christ to not give Him His due glory! Saving faith is for His glory.
 
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justbyfaith

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There exists a fatal flaw within the argument of the people promoting free will, that is that the creature must choose Christ at some level. For example, the people promoting free will expouse that people "choose to believe" a.k.a. "choose to put their faith in".

Let us start by examining Romans 10:9-13 for indication of "choose to believe". Here are all occurrences of "believe" with adjacent words:

- "shalt believe in thine heart" (Romans 10:9 - no choice indication here)
- "with the heart man believeth unto righteousness" (Romans 10:10 - no choice indication here)
- "Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed" (Romans 10:11 - no choice indication here)

Romans 10:9 does not contain "choose to believe". Romans 10:10 and Romans 10:11 do not contain "choose to believeth".

Let us next examine the words of the Lord Jesus Christ as recorded by the Apostle John (John 3:16):

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life."

Take notice that Jesus did NOT say "whoever chooses to believe", rather the King of Glory said "whoever believes in Him shall not perish".

The Lord Jesus told us the source (1) for a person to believe, (2) for a person to have belief, and (3) for a person to have faith. Behold, this exchange in which the Lord Jesus Christ declares the source of belief/faith (John 6:28-29):

28 Therefore they said to Him, "What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."

A person believing in Jesus whom the Father has sent is the work of God. The Lord Jesus did not say it is a work of a person, no! The Lord Jesus did say believing is the work of God.

A person can do nothing apart from Jesus, for He said:

"apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5)

A person can NOT choose the Lord Jesus Christ, for He said:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you" (John 15:16)

The Apostle John recorded the Lord Jesus Christ saying "You did not choose Me" meaning a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ does not choose Him at any level, but He closed the loop with "but I chose you" declaring that God does the choosing.

We know that the words of Jesus Christ matter tremendously, yet I can not express is sufficiently, but the Master Orator Himself, He expressed the importance of His words perfectly (Matthew 7:21-27):

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven [will enter].
22 "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'
23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
24 "Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and [yet] it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell ? and great was its fall."

And, again the importance of the words of the Lord Jesus (John 12:48):

"He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day."

It is rejection of the Lord Jesus Christ to not give Him His due glory! Saving faith is for His glory.
Therefore, confessing the Lord Jesus is something that I do not choose. God attaches a puppet string to my mouth and tongue and causes me to do it.

:confused:o_O:rolleyes:
 

Enoch111

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A person believing in Jesus whom the Father has sent is the work of God. The Lord Jesus did not say it is a work of a person, no! The Lord Jesus did say believing is the work of God.
That is a serious misinterpretation of that passage. The Jews generally believed at that time that the works (or deeds) of the Law -- obedience to the Law of Moses -- could justify them before God. This is very clear from the New Testament. Therefore they asked this question (in all sincerity):"What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"
But since faith is NOT a work but simply believing and trusting God and Christ, Jesus answered "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."

In effect, Jesus was telling these people that there is no work that they can work for their salvation. Simply believe. Simply look upon Christ. Hence He likened Himself to that Brazen Serpent. It was simply by looking on that Serpent that the Israelites were saved from immediate death.


Now notice who is supposed to do the believing. "That YOU believe" means exactly what it says. It is the sinner who must put his total faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption. Hence we have this dialogue: And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. (Acts 16:30,31)
 

Kermos

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Therefore, confessing the Lord Jesus is something that I do not choose. God attaches a puppet string to my mouth and tongue and causes me to do it.
...snip
Your first sentence is an accurate statement that reflects the words of the Lord Jesus Christ; however, it appears you do not believe your first sentence based on what I perceive as insulting mockery of your second sentence toward the words of the Lord Jesus Christ as provided in the "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post".

Kind of like Caiaphas prophesying Jesus' death (John 11:48-53), eliminating the mockery of your second sentence, there is an element of truth in it too, for God is the Potter and we are the clay with some made for honorable use meanwhile some others made for dishonor (Romans 9:20-22, Isaiah 10:15, Isaiah 45:9, Jeremiah 18:6).

There is great relief, wonderful rest (Matthew 11:28) in Christ Jesus for the love of Christ controls us believers (2 Corinthians 5:14)!
 
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Kermos

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That is a serious misinterpretation of that passage. The Jews generally believed at that time that the works (or deeds) of the Law -- obedience to the Law of Moses -- could justify them before God. This is very clear from the New Testament. Therefore they asked this question (in all sincerity):"What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"
But since faith is NOT a work but simply believing and trusting God and Christ, Jesus answered "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."

In effect, Jesus was telling these people that there is no work that they can work for their salvation. Simply believe. Simply look upon Christ. Hence He likened Himself to that Brazen Serpent. It was simply by looking on that Serpent that the Israelites were saved from immediate death.


Now notice who is supposed to do the believing. "That YOU believe" means exactly what it says. It is the sinner who must put his total faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption. Hence we have this dialogue: And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. (Acts 16:30,31)
You are not listening fully to the robust response that the Lord Jesus gave because you try to write that believing/faith are not being defined by His words. He said:

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
(John 6:29)

These words of Jesus do not say that it is works of man to believe, clearly not the case, yet according to the free will argument the choice is a work for the "sinner who must put his total faith" (your words, notice there is work in your statement); on the other hand, these words of Jesus do clearly say that believing/faith is the work of God.

Behold that Acts 16:30-31 contains first a command with "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" and second a promise in the words "and thou shalt be saved, and thy house". That is a command not a choice.

So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy (Romans 9:16).
 

Enoch111

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These words of Jesus do not say that it is works of man to believe, clearly not the case...
First of all faith is not works, and works is not faith. Then you are trying to take one Scripture and distort the truth. So here are the words of Christ to confirm that it is not God who does the believing but men who must believe in order to be saved:

JOHN 3
16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.


What is the Lord saying here? If all would believe, all would be saved. But some will believe and some will not. Nowhere will you find that God does the believing. THAT WOULD BE ABSURD.
 

justbyfaith

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Your first sentence is an accurate statement that reflects the words of the Lord Jesus Christ; however, it appears you do not believe your first sentence based on what I perceive as insulting mockery of your second sentence toward the words of the Lord Jesus Christ as provided in the "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post".

Kind of like Caiaphas prophesying Jesus' death (John 11:48-53), eliminating the mockery of your second sentence, there is an element of truth in it too, for God is the Potter and we are the clay with some made for honorable use meanwhile some others made for dishonor (Romans 9:20-22, Isaiah 10:15, Isaiah 45:9, Jeremiah 18:6).

There is great relief, wonderful rest (Matthew 11:28) in Christ Jesus for the love of Christ controls us believers (2 Corinthians 5:14)!
You choose to believe that we do not have any choice in the matter; however, I choose to believe that we do.

If we don't have any choice in the matter, then we can rightly blame God if we find ourselves condemned on that day. If we do have a choice, we have no one to blame but ourselves.

Therefore your belief system does not contribute to the glory of the Lord but rather, it indicts the Lord for condemning people arbitrarily. You say, He condemns them because they are sinners; and He ought to be commended for saving anyone. But if He chooses out certain people for salvation by playing eenie-meenie-mynie-moe, and puts the rest into the lake of fire, then He is arbitrarily condemning those whom He does not choose: He is in effect singling them out for damnation based on the luck of the draw.

The Bible teaches that the death of Jesus was a ransom for all; that He died for the sins of all men. A God who could not do that is not infinite or all-powerful. And yet you say that in teaching these things you are defending the glory of the Lord...:confused:o_O:rolleyes:
 
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Kermos

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First of all faith is not works, and works is not faith. Then you are trying to take one Scripture and distort the truth. So here are the words of Christ to confirm that it is not God who does the believing but men who must believe in order to be saved:

JOHN 3
16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.


What is the Lord saying here? If all would believe, all would be saved. But some will believe and some will not. Nowhere will you find that God does the believing. THAT WOULD BE ABSURD.
You are still not listening to the robust response of the Lord Jesus Christ. He said:

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
(John 6:29)

These words of Jesus do not say that it is works of man to believe, so your argument on that front is moot; on the other hand, these words are Jesus do say that a person believing in Jesus whom the Father has sent is a work of God. It sounds to me that you are saying that the words of Jesus are not good enough for you because you try to diminish the words of the Lord Jesus Christ by your apparent attempt at trivializing His words recorded in John 6:29 when you write "you are trying to take one Scripture and distort the truth". You seem to have forgotten or you ignored the many quotes of the Lord Jesus in "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post"!

Here is another quote of the Lord Jesus Christ saying something similar to His recorded words in John 6:29:

"But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God." (John 3:21)

Jesus the Lord says that a person in the Light's deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God! That is God manifesting Himself through the deeds of the child of God. This is similar to John 6:29.

By the way, here are two more verses in which the Christ says that a person can not choose the Lord Jesus as well as a believer can do nothing - which includes believing/faith - without the Lord Jesus:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you" (John 15:16)

"apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5)

I repeat this because you seem to be missing it, the Lord Jesus said that a person believing in Jesus whom the Father has sent is a work of God. This is what the Lord Jesus said in John 6:29.

You mention John 3:16 and John 3:17 and John 3:18, and not a single one of those verses mentions "choose to believe" nor indicate free will nor do any use the word "all".

You continue rejecting the words of the Lord Jesus when he said:

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
(John 6:29)
 
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Kermos

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You choose to believe that we do not have any choice in the matter; however, I choose to believe that we do.
...snip
In the moment that you wrote that you claim to have a choice in the matter, you rejected the words of the Lord Jesus Christ when He said:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you" (John 15:16)

Then you proceed to give doctrine of men in your post to justify your self-glorification in claiming you have made a choice in favor of the Lord Jesus. I repeat, you reject the Lord Jesus Christ's words as recorded by the Apostle John (John 15:16) when you write or say or believe that you chose Jesus.

God is almighty. The glory of salvation is His and His alone. Have you read of God's power: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHWH do all these things" (Isaiah 45:7)

Please read "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post" because in it is Truth because as the Lord Jesus Christ said He is the Way (your will to choose is NOT the way) and He is the Truth and He is the Life (John 14:6).
 

Enoch111

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"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."(John 6:29)
You are falsely suggesting that God does the believing. But the believing is always on the part of man, under the influence of the Holy Spirit through the Gospel.

The well-known commentator John Gill was of the Reformed persuasion, but he was honest, unlike your dishonest interpretation:

"This, as a principle, is purely God's work; as it is an act, or as it is exercised under the influence of divine grace, it is man's act: "that ye believe"; the object of it is Christ, as sent by the Father, as the Mediator between God and men, as appointed by him to be the Saviour and Redeemer; and believing in Christ, is believing in God that sent him."
 

Enoch111

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Then you proceed to give doctrine of men in your post to justify your self-glorification in claiming you have made a choice in favor of the Lord Jesus.
Another dishonest allegation. Those who reject Calvinism are not indulging in self-glorification. They are simply not buying into spiritual nonsense. The command to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ is repeated over and over again in the New Testament. And that is indeed a choice. "Choose you this day whom ye will serve". "Choose life". Those are the words of God.

And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD. (Josh 24:15)

Deuteronomy 30:19 - I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

God does NOT do the believing, neither does He selectively give faith to some so-called *elect*, who are then subjected to *irresistible grace*. These are all man-made doctrines, which you and others cling to more than Scripture.
 

justbyfaith

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In the moment that you wrote that you claim to have a choice in the matter, you rejected the words of the Lord Jesus Christ when He said:

No, I couldn't have possibly rejected the words of Jesus because that would be a choice.
 

Kermos

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No, I couldn't have possibly rejected the words of Jesus because that would be a choice.
The default condition of men rejects the Lord Jesus Christ for it is written:

"The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
(John 1:5)

And the Lord Jesus said:

"He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day."
(John 12:48)

A person can not choose FOR nor TOWARD the Lord Jesus Christ:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you"
(John 15:16)

"apart from Me you can do nothing"
(John 15:5)

It is God that brings Life and Faith. Jesus said:

"I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me."
(John 14:6)

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
(John 6:29)

Please see "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post".
 
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Kermos

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Another dishonest allegation. Those who reject Calvinism are not indulging in self-glorification. They are simply not buying into spiritual nonsense. The command to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ is repeated over and over again in the New Testament. And that is indeed a choice. "Choose you this day whom ye will serve". "Choose life". Those are the words of God.

And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD. (Josh 24:15)

Deuteronomy 30:19 - I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

God does NOT do the believing, neither does He selectively give faith to some so-called *elect*, who are then subjected to *irresistible grace*. These are all man-made doctrines, which you and others cling to more than Scripture.
First, you are pulling from the Old Covenant for those two verses.

Dueteronomy 30:19 has context which is much of the Old Covenant, but we can focus in on Dueteronomy 30:15-20 for a moment. The Israelites are presented information about blessing versus a curse. Now, expanding to the history we can see the results of curse being imposed on the Israelites, and here are a few: (1) the Assyrians ravage Israel, (2) Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon ravage Judah, and (3) the Romans ravage Jerusalem (and the Jewish Temple is not there to this day). You mentioned "choose life", see John 1:5 quoted below.

Joshua 24:15 does NOT include choosing the God of Abraham, the God of Issac, and the God of Jacob.

Second, we believers are in the New Covenant for Jesus said:

"This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood."
(Luke 22:20)

"When He said, 'A new [covenant],' He has made the first obsolete."
(Hebrews 8:13)

And the Apostle John wrote:

"The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
(John 1:5)

Thus demonstrating the default condition of men.

A person can not choose FOR nor TOWARD the Lord Jesus Christ for He said:

"You did not choose Me but I chose you"
(John 15:16)

"apart from Me you can do nothing"
(John 15:5)

Part of free will is self-glorification because it claims to choose the Lord Jesus Christ despite the Lord Jesus say "You did not choose Me".

Again, you are still not listening to the Lord Jesus when He said:

?This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.?
(John 6:29)

The work of God is that a person believe in the Lord Jesus Christ whom the Father has sent.

It is the words of the Lord Jesus that matter for He said:

?He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.?
(John 12:48)

Please see "The Lord Jesus Says That Belief/Faith and Choosing Are All God Post".
 

justbyfaith

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Here's the thing: if salvation comes before confession, it is no skin off my back. Since I have confessed the Lord Jesus, that means that I was already saved before I made my confession.

But if salvation doesn't come without confession, then those who have not confessed the Lord Jesus aren't saved/born again.

So then, what is the safer doctrine, as concerning eternal life?

If we believe what I believe about this, and obey, then we will be saved without a doubt.

But if you believe what you believe, and bank on it being true; and as a result never confess the Lord Jesus Christ, then you will be eternally lost.

If there is even a doubt in your mind that a faith confession is the catalyst for salvation, which is taught in such scriptures as John 1:12, Romans 10:9-13, and Romans 5:1-2, then if you still do not ever confess the Lord Jesus, you have no one to blame but yourself on your day of judgment when you are condemned over the fact that you denied the Holy One and the Just. Because, as certain evangelists have said, "To not confess Him is to deny Him."

Therefore, in holding on to Calvinistic teaching, you may indeed even be able to fortify yourself against the need to receive Jesus as your Lord and Saviour;

But I would simply ask you the question: Where will this get you in eternity?

Because in another thread (Without unconditional Election,no one would be saved.), I even asked someone if they have confessed the Lord Jesus and they could give no answer as of yet (granted, it has only been one day since I asked them the question). That question was prodded by their statement that they have done nothing in their life that would motivate the Lord to save them.

And the fact is, the Lord will save anyone and everyone who calls on His name (Romans 10:13). It is absolutely promised by the use of the word shall.

Therefore if anyone banks on Calvinistic teaching and does not ever call on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth (see also Acts of the Apostles 4:10-12), they are on a par with the man who says there is no God (see Psalms 14:1, Psalms 53:1).
 

Enoch111

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First, you are pulling from the Old Covenant for those two verses.
And the point is that God demands that men CHOOSE.

So under the New Covenant the same principle applies: He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. (John 3:36)

To believe or not believe is indeed a choice: But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him (John 12:37). They CHOSE not to believe in spite of all the evidence provided that they should believe. According to Calvinists God compelled them not to believe so that they would be damned. According to Scripture, they CHOSE to be enemies of Christ and condemned themselves.

But Calvinists always deny what God affirms. Yet you claim that you are glorifying God while denying everything that God says about salvation!
 

Jun2u

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That is a serious misinterpretation of that passage. The Jews generally believed at that time that the works (or deeds) of the Law -- obedience to the Law of Moses -- could justify them before God. This is very clear from the New Testament. Therefore they asked this question (in all sincerity):"What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"

Note how Scripture carefully words the question. They said, “What shall we do? The word “do” refers to work, doesn’t it? “That we might work the works of God? Again speaking of work is it not?

But since faith is NOT a work but simply believing and trusting God and Christ, Jesus answered "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."

According to your theology faith is not a work but simply believing, however God says otherwise. Jesus said, “this is the work of God” or it could be rendered this way, “this is the work of Enoch111” and the meaning will still be the same… faith or belief is a work!!

This same idea is consistent with Acts 16:30-31!! Believe is a verb and faith is a noun.

To God Be The Glory
 

justbyfaith

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John 6:28-29 is God's way of telling us that if you are going to insist that you are saved by your works, that the only "work" that will save you would be to simply believe on Jesus Christ and what He did for you on the Cross.

It is not saying that faith is a work; but rather it is a literary tactic that the Lord is using to show that works do not save; but that salvation is only through faith in Jesus Christ. If anyone ever succeeded at proving in scripture that salvation is of works, this is located in scripture as proof that salvation is, even still, by faith alone in Jesus Christ.
 
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Dave L

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John 6:28-29 is God's way of telling us that if you are going to insist that you are saved by your works, that the only "work" that will save you would be to simply believe on Jesus Christ and what He did for you on the Cross.

It is not saying that faith is a work; but rather it is a literary tactic that the Lord is using to show that works do not save; but that salvation is only through faith in Jesus Christ. If anyone ever succeeded at proving in scripture that salvation is of works, this is located in scripture as proof that salvation is, even still, by faith alone in Jesus Christ.
Grace saves those who cannot believe or repent. Turning them into repentant believers who love God and hate sin.

“And the Lord thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” (Deuteronomy 30:6)
 
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Jun2u

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And the point is that God demands that men CHOOSE.
But Calvinists always deny what God affirms. Yet you claim that you are glorifying God while denying everything that God says about salvation!
I think it is time to lay a bomb to the “free-willers” and those that believe “faith in Jesus precedes salvation/born again.”

God spoke in parables and without a parable He did not speak (Mark 4:34).

WHY?


12) So that seeing they may see, and not perceive, and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them (Mark 4:10-12).

A parable is an earthly story with a heavenly meaning. This makes the whole Bible a parable!

THE BOMB: “SALVATION AS SEEN IN THE ILLUSTRATION OF THE RAISING OF LAZARUS.

Before Jesus went to the tomb, He told Martha, “I am the resurrection and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live” John 11:25.

When Jesus arrived at the tomb He cried with a loud voice, “Lazarus come forth!” Did Lazarus hear that command? Of course not he was very dead, in fact for four days. But Lazarus did come forth. What had to have happened? Well, Jesus had to go into the tomb, qualify Lazarus and give him life!!

1) As Lazarus was physically dead, so are we spiritually dead.
2) As Lazarus did not have physical ears to hear Jesus’ command to come forth, so are we spiritually deaf to hear the Gospel call.
3) As Lazarus did not have physical eyes to see, so are we spiritually blind to see the truths of the Bible.
4) As Lazarus did not have a physical tongue to speak, so are we spiritually dumb to declare the truth of God.

Now tell me, what part did Lazarus play in his resurrection? NONE… NADA… ZILCH. Did Lazarus have a free will to come forth?

Jesus did not come to make bad people good. He came to make dead people LIVE!

To God Be The Glory
 
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