The Restrainer

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friend of

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Are you the restrainer?

There are a few interpretations of who the Restrainer is. In some translations the "He" is capitalized, indicating that the restrainer is the Holy Spirit. The restrainer being taken out of the way could hint at rapture. All those with the Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth and the Antichrist will have full reign to accomplish his plans unopposed by God's people.

Another interpretation is that the Restrainer is perhaps Michael the archangel who has been given power to engage the evil one, and at the proper time he will be directed to release him.
 
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Waiting on him

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There are a few interpretations of who the Restrainer is. In some translations the "He" is capitalized, indicating that the restrainer is the Holy Spirit. The restrainer being taken out of the way could hint at rapture. All those with the Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth and the Antichrist will have full reign to accomplish his plans unopposed by God's people.

Another interpretation is that the Restrainer is perhaps Michael the archangel who has been given power to engage the evil one, and at the proper time he will be directed to release him.
So what your saying is one interpretation is false, and possibly both?
 

Waiting on him

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I’ll get back to this post, trying to find some scripture that testifies of God as a restrainer
 

Naomi25

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Do a bible search for references of "this age" and "the age to come". There is a clear teaching of a distinction. And while Christ teaches the Kingdom has come now, in this age, the 'age to come' is also clearly of things eternal, things sinless and perfected.
 

VictoryinJesus

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The Restrainer...
consider what prevents?
What prevents sight?
What prevents man from seeing God?

Isaiah 25:7-8
[7] And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. [8] He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it .

The vail that is spread over ...all nations.
Following right after “He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord will wipe away tears from off all faces...”

Again: 2 Corinthians 3:14-16
[14] But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. [15] But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. [16] Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.


2 Corinthians 4:3-4
[3] But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: [4] In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
 
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Naomi25

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It’s so weird what I quoted above, I’ve never read this translation before.
Who opposes and exalts himself against every so called god and object of worship?
Just a question has Jesus done this?
And also NT says the law is not for a righteous man, is Jesus lawless?

This is an interesting thought, I suppose because in a way Christ has, in a true way, done exactly that. It is his right, after all, as the only true way, true God.
However, we can see in the context of the passage that Paul is NOT speaking of Jesus here. The 'man of lawlessness' comes in opposition to Christ, and Christ will 'kill him'. This man also comes by the activity of Satan. Definitely not Jesus!


And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, -2 Thessalonians 2:8–9
 

Waiting on him

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This is an interesting thought, I suppose because in a way Christ has, in a true way, done exactly that. It is his right, after all, as the only true way, true God.
However, we can see in the context of the passage that Paul is NOT speaking of Jesus here. The 'man of lawlessness' comes in opposition to Christ, and Christ will 'kill him'. This man also comes by the activity of Satan. Definitely not Jesus!


And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, -2 Thessalonians 2:8–9
Though he slay me.
 

Naomi25

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Should we call that a leap of illogic or a leap of faith?

If the Millennial Kingdom is now why are the evildoers having a heyday while Christians are being killed and persecuted?

Why are seducers waxing worse and worse?

Why is there a great falling away within Christendom?

We could go on and on about world conditions and arrive at one conclusion: believing that the Millennium is now is PURE FANTASY.

Okay, sure. In the effort to have a civil debate, let me ask you some questions:
*why do you think all 3 of those passages mention restraint of evil in effort of something (the pursuit of the gospel and to deceive the nations no longer), and conversely the release of evil to pursue deception? Are you saying it is coincedence that these ideas are found in these three passages? That they have nothing to do with each other?

*Does Revelation 20 say that Satan and his demons will be bound against 'evildoers' increasing persecution against Christians? In fact, does it say that sinful people themselves are bound against doing these acts? Do you think Satan needs to be behind all such acts?

*Does Rev 20 say that Satan is bound against making seducers worse?

*If my implication is true , that these passages ARE connected and we have been in the Millennium and are approaching the end, then why would you think that the "great falling away within Christendom" is not part of 2 Thess 2 where, when Satan is released and authorized his 'man of lawlessness' to go out, there accompanies with it a great 'falling away'..or, 'apostasy'? Why could these not be the same thing/time?

* We could go on and on about it (isn't that what threads are for!), and decide it is unreasonable to think the Millennium is now. But, could we not also consider the idea that a future Millennium is also unreasonable? Could we not look at all the passages in scripture that teach on Christ's return and see that there is no space left for a time period after that but before etenity? Especially considering that death, sin and rebellion and at least 'some' natural bodies will be present in this 'millennial' time period?
 
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Naomi25

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The Early Church Fathers wrote that the early church was taught by Paul that the Restrainer was the ROMAN EMPIRE, which after it fell, the the "Man of Sin" Antichrist system would arise. When Pagan Rome fell, the Antichrist Papal Rome arose.

Early Church Fathers Were Historicist – H. Grattan Guinness

Early church writings and histories are certainly interesting. But they are not canon. Thus, I think we need to be very careful assigning to doctrine that which does not come out of scripture directly.
And don't mistake me...I'm not attempting to insist that my theory presented here is 100% accurate and therefore am standing dogmatically behind it. I am more interested in having a conversation over the possibilities of it, and where scripture passages lead us to be more certain of some things, and less certain of others.
 

farouk

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Early church writings and histories are certainly interesting. But they are not canon. Thus, I think we need to be very careful assigning to doctrine that which does not come out of scripture directly.
And don't mistake me...I'm not attempting to insist that my theory presented here is 100% accurate and therefore am standing dogmatically behind it. I am more interested in having a conversation over the possibilities of it, and where scripture passages lead us to be more certain of some things, and less certain of others.
After all, John's First Epistle says that 'many antichrists' shall come (in the plural)...
 
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Naomi25

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Hi Naomi25. I know you're in a different eschatological camp and so we're probably going to disagree a bit. Here are a few of my thoughts. I'll get back later.

They do seem to have similar content yeah.
Thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate them. And no, I don't mind that you're in a different 'camp'. I'm hoping we can have a good chat, regardless.

I think the fact that this persecution is so prevalent can be interpreted as evidence that Satan and his forces have not yet been bound in the way these scriptures suggest. I believe there is ample evidence that the nations of the world today are deceived by forces rulers principalities in high places, and if Satan were truly bound at this time, antichristianity would not be as widespread as it is now.
I remember when I was being convicted that the Amillennial interpretation was the most biblically faithful....I struggled with this also. Because, sure...there's so much bad stuff in the world, right? How can we possibly think that Satan is bound? If he was locked away, surely things would be much better?
The problem with that, as I came to see, is that that's not exactly what Rev 20 says. We see that it is Satan, and him alone, that is bound, only in regards to 'deceiving the nations'.
Does this mean we are to assume his demons are also locked away from influencing people? That Satan himself cannot use his powers in any way? Well...it doesn't say that. It just says that he cannot deceive the nations. We know that Satan is the "father of lies", that he has been a lier from the very beginning. We knows that lies are the opposite of truth, and that the truth is who God is, what his Son did for us, and how people can be free: the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
So...perhaps let me ask you this: since Jesus Christ came to earth on his mission to save a people of his own...his Church...has Satan, despite being the 'prince of the world', managed to wipe us out? And really consider this: considering that we are the most persecuted people group on the face of the planet; that even 'Christian' nations such as America, Australia, Britian etc, are now becoming openly hostile to us and rarely see people of faith in government...why hasn't Satan managed to pull of more "Hitler" type situations that have just once and for good gotten rid of us? They hate us enough to do it.
It's because, as Jesus told his Disciples in Matt 12, Satan has been bound for a specific purpose: the gospel will go forth; Christ WILL build his church.

As to the growing hostility we see even in our own Countries...well, as per my OP...the question then becomes (to my mind), has Satan been released? Is he now free to unite the whole world against Christians? If there is no America to object to the attrocities of North Korea, Syria or Iran against Christians, would it stop? Would there be any left alive?
Which brings us to the verse where Christ says, "but for the sake of the elect, I will cut those days short".

As an aside, I agree Isaiah 65:20 describes that our longevity will be increased as much as 10x fold during the real Millenial reign.

Isaiah 65 is tricky, for both those who see the Millennium now, and for those who see it yet future. You see, while it's true it says there will be death, it also clearly says "behold, I create a new heavens and a new earth".
I think the question that must be asked is this: which is clearer and most likely: that "I make a new heavens and new earth" is symbolic for the Millennial time when he has not yet done that, or "the young man shall die a hundred years old" is a symbolic way of saying "aging will be a thing of the past".
I tend to side with the latter, clearly. I just think that its a much easier reading of the text. In my mind you just can't wiggle past the "behold, I make a new..."
 

Naomi25

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Naomi,
I truly liked how you put all that altogether by the scriptures. Only BA Christians will comprehend the time line of "a thousand years" as being symbolic in length only, being now the Age of God's Grace.
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If we would like to know that time on earth, of when satan was released from being "bound" in the "bottomless pit", mop is that when the sudden inventions of electricity, communications, trains, planes and automobiles, etc. were created.
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Prior to that, man's daily existence had barely changed, with the horse and buggy being the only means of travel for thousands of years.
In comparison, look what has been achieved in a very brief time of 150+/- years.
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I believe that the minds of men have had an extreme and sudden influx of genius, influenced by satan, who knows that he "hath but a short time" to marshal his weapons and his forces.
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Lest we forget, when the Lord does return in flaming fire, satan shall have something that is formidable, in order to wage his final battle against the Lord and His Saints.
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Rev. 19[19] And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

Can you say Nuclear Weapons?

Interesting...but...I'm not sure I'd agree. Biblically we see Satan is about deceit and destruction of humans. He hates us. Why would he, even using us as cannon fodder, build us up with 'technological truth and advancement'?
Especially when scripture tells us that it doesn't really matter if we have nuclear weapons. Christ defeats all against him with the breath of his mouth.
I would assume that Satan, a spiritual being, would also realise how...inaffecutal...something like that would be on spiritual army, but also on Christ himself.
Now...I'd buy Satan giving us Nukes in order to destroy ourselves. But....again...there's no real biblical evidence to suggest this, so it's pure speculation, wouldn't you say?
 

Naomi25

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After all, John's First Epistle says that 'many antichrists' shall come (in the plural)...
Exactly. I think we've had a march of them across history. But clearly we can expect one at the end...'the' Antichrist. The reference in 2 Thess 2 to Christ 'killing him with the breath of his mouth' takes us directly to Isaiah 11:4 and then Rev 19:15....we can expect this lawless one to be here when Christ returns.
 

Enoch111

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After all, John's First Epistle says that 'many antichrists' shall come (in the plural)...
Which means that at the end of days the final Antichrist will come. And that is definitely NOT the Pope or the papal system of Rome as we can see from Scripture. Daniel and Revelation give us tremendous insight into this Little Horn, the Man of Sin, the Son of Perdition, the Beast.
 

VictoryinJesus

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Ok...I’ll pose it as a question. Do not these two passages connect? It is said at funerals...God shall wipe away the tears from their eyes.

Isaiah 25:7-8
[7] And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. [8] He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it .

Revelation 21:2-4
[2] And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. [3] And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. [4] And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.


As in Isaiah “He will swallow up death in victory” and in Revelation “and there shall be no more death”...we quote it all the time to people as what is to come. Then right before that does the word not say God will remove the vail spread over all nations? Then comes death and sorrow and God wiping away the tears?

All I can speak from is what I’ve experienced and with Light and the knowledge of God came much sorrow. It wasn’t until God removed the vail that I had a great need of His wiping away the tears. what prevents sight until it is taken out of the way? What prevents “restrains” the knowledge of God ...Is it not the vail of flesh that prevents?
 
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