Apostles, teachers and other offices
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I think these questions paint a picture of how far things drifted from the teachings of the apostles and Christ.
Yes, there is a lot of that but much of problem lies in quenching the Holy Spirit of God. Church [excuse the usage of that word] service are frequently and probably always in greater or lesser measure structured [programmed] ahead of time allowing no, or almost no, leading in the service by the Holy Spirit working in or through persons present who have no specific authority from men. From God they may, but with a programmed service, how many in the "picked" [as opposed to called] leadership are paying attention to God? How many not within that leadership are willing to "buck" the leaders because they believe God wants to use them?
Some people who have received the Holy Spirit have practiced quenching that Spirit so often for so long they have become deluded and refuse to admit the possibility that they themselves are limiting God.
101G
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1 Corinthians 12:28 "And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues".
this word "set" is also translated as "ORDAIN". it's the Greek word,
G5087 τίθημι tithemi (tiy'-thee-miy) v.
θέω theo (the'-ō) [an alternate in certain tenses]
1. to place.
2. (properly) to lay in a passive or horizontal posture.
{in the widest application, literally and figuratively; differs from G2476, which properly denotes an upright and active position, while G2749 is properly reflexive and utterly prostrate}
[a prolonged form of a primary theo theh'-o (which is used only as alternate in certain tenses)]
KJV: + advise, appoint, bow, commit, conceive, give, X kneel down, lay (aside, down, up), make, ordain, purpose, put, set (forth), settle, sink down
as used here in 1 Timothy 2:7 "Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, [and] lie not
a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity".
here, Paul wear three titles, or have three functions in the body of Christ. and in 1 Corinthians 13:1 & 2 three more functions in the body comes into view. "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become [as] sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
1 Corinthians 13:2 "And though I have [the gift of] prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing".
for the pastoral gift is the Bishop, or Overseer, which is an Elder.
Our Lord and Saviour hold all the ordained functions in his Church. for it is he whom is the head of the church. and it is he who gives the gifts.
PICJAG.
this word "set" is also translated as "ORDAIN". it's the Greek word,
G5087 τίθημι tithemi (tiy'-thee-miy) v.
θέω theo (the'-ō) [an alternate in certain tenses]
1. to place.
2. (properly) to lay in a passive or horizontal posture.
{in the widest application, literally and figuratively; differs from G2476, which properly denotes an upright and active position, while G2749 is properly reflexive and utterly prostrate}
[a prolonged form of a primary theo theh'-o (which is used only as alternate in certain tenses)]
KJV: + advise, appoint, bow, commit, conceive, give, X kneel down, lay (aside, down, up), make, ordain, purpose, put, set (forth), settle, sink down
as used here in 1 Timothy 2:7 "Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, [and] lie not
a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity".here, Paul wear three titles, or have three functions in the body of Christ. and in 1 Corinthians 13:1 & 2 three more functions in the body comes into view. "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become [as] sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
1 Corinthians 13:2 "And though I have [the gift of] prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing".
for the pastoral gift is the Bishop, or Overseer, which is an Elder.
Our Lord and Saviour hold all the ordained functions in his Church. for it is he whom is the head of the church. and it is he who gives the gifts.
PICJAG.
ScottA
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No, but to even mention it when the verse does not say one way or the other, shows you wrongly inferring that the verse says something it does not.
ScottA
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The term "apostle' was not used by Jesus in sending out the twelve. It was first used by Paul who was "sent" by Christ, which is the meaning of the word. Thus, the twelve were "sent", as was Paul, as are any whom the Lord "sends."
Apostle or disciple. Word used does not matter, the meaning does.
Love them spoke English so your argument is moot.
ScottA
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No, the twelve also referred to themselves as "apostles." The point is, they too were "sent ones." That is the biblical definition.
ScottA
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ScottA
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Oh, yeah, you not only paraphrased the scriptures, you didn't even use quotation marks or chapter and verse. Be careful now, people might think you are a flaming Gnostic heretic.
That was not a cheap shot, and there was no need to quote the rest of your post, since you said you don't know for sure, and that Paul was not called an apostle.
Paul repeatedly said that he was an apostle called by God and Christ. He also tells that Corinthians that even though he was seemingly the least of the apostles, he confirmed his apostleship through signs, wonders, and mighty deeds -- the signs of an apostle. He personally met the risen Lord not once but many times. He confirms that he was the chosen apostle to the Gentiles, whereas Peter was the chosen apostle to the Jews.
Mathias was a temporarily fill-in for the twelve until Paul was commissioned and personally sent by Christ. Since there are only "twelve apostles of the Lamb", Paul replaced Judas, and in fact became the leading apostle as we see in his travels and also that over half the New Testament was written by Paul.
Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God...(Rom 1:1)
Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead)...(Gal 1:1)
(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles) (Gal 2:8)
I am become a fool in glorying; ye have compelled me: for I ought to have been commended of you: for in nothing am I behind the very chiefest apostles, though I be nothing. Truly the signs of an apostle were wrought among you in all patience, in signs, and wonders, and mighty deeds. (2 Cor 12:11,12)
