The KJV and the modern bible versions

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stone

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The main problem with the validity of the modern versions is that they are translated from what is called an eclectic. [pick and mix]The majority text of both the old and new testament, which was traditionally accepted by bible believing Christians [the reformed protestants] for centuries has been altered in these modern eclectics.Two manuscripts from Alexandria Egypt, vaticannus and sinaiticus, which show certain evidence of corruption by gnostic heretics, are mixed in with the majority text to form the modern ecclectic texts from which most modern versions are translated. For a detailed analysis of the evidence of gnostic corruption in the vaticannus and sinaiticus manuscripts go to this website:http://www.studytoanswer.net/bibleversions/gnostic.htmlIn the places where the traditionally accepted text disagrees with the corrupted vaticannus and sinaiticus, the words of the corrupted manuscripts are chosen and used. This causes that most of the modern versions, like rsv, nasb, niv to be different from the King James version in about 5% of important places that pertain to Christian doctrine.The ecclectic texts are a pick and mix invention of the people that produce it. They choose what words to throw out of the traditional text and what words to add from the Alexandrian text. The NIV for example as well as other versions is translated from what is called the nestle-aland eclectic; it is in its 27th edition for the niv. Those people that produce these eclectics are literally changing the Word of God according to their own choosing. This is something that the bible says you may not do and serious punishments will be on those that do it.Note this warning from the book of Revelation:Revelation 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: Revelation 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.Changes attacking the deity of Christ:KJV from the byzantine majority text1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. Nasb16By common confession, great is (AF)the mystery of godliness:He who was (AG)revealed in the flesh,Was (AH)vindicated in the Spirit,(AI)Seen by angels,(AJ)Proclaimed among the nations,(AK)Believed on in the world,(AL)Taken up in glory. The real Word of God, from the KJV says God was manifest in the flesh. The NASB has removed that.--a deceitful sly changeThey take out the fact that Jesus is God.From the KJV majority textRomans 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. Romans 14:11 For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.Romans 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God. That shows that Christ is God.From the Nasb10But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you (P)regard your brother with contempt? For (Q)we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. 11For it is written,"®AS I LIVE, SAYS THE LORD, (S)EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW TO ME,AND EVERY TONGUE SHALL GIVE PRAISE TO GOD." 12So then (T)each one of us will give an account of himself to God.The word Christ is removed so that there is no proof Christ is God in those scriptures.From the KJV majority textActs 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.The RSV hasActs 20:28Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God which he obtained with the blood of his own son.KJV has God's church was purchased by God's blood; therefore Christ is God. RSV separates Christ from God so it has eliminated the deity of Christ from the verse and does not show that Jesus is God. other examples attacking deity of Christ you look it upJohn 9:35 kjv compared to John 9:35 nasbMatthew 9:18 kjv compared to Matt.9:18 nasb removes the worship of Jesus.Jesus accepted Worship because He is God. [Peter refused to accept worship from cornelius because Peter is not God.Matt. 20:20, Mark 5:6, Luke 24:52 does the same thing in the Nasb, removes the worship of Jesus and therefore the nasb changes attack the doctrine of the deity of Christ.from the KJVMicah 5:2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah,yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. Micah 5:2 from rsv...ruler in Israel, whose origin is from old, from ancient days.God has no origin. Christ had no origin because He is God.Saying Christ had an origin, the rsv is denying the deity of Christ.Vese attacking salvation by faithfrom Kjv1 Peter 2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: from rsvLike new born babes, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up to salvation.the rsv has salvation by works, not faith.Salvation is a free gift of grace; by grace you are saved through faith; it is not of works like it says in ephesians. It is impossible to grow up to salvation, salvation is a free gift, you don't grow up to it, you don't work for it, you don't gradually obtain it. I could go on to add verse changes attacking the atonement, second coming of Christ, the Word of God, virgin birth.There are many of those changes that attack important Chritian doctrines in the modern versions. See Let's weigh the evidence, by Barry Burton.
 

Jordan

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The popular, modern Bible versions leave no question that Jesus is God.
Popular modern version CAST DOUBT of Jesus Christ being God... in number of places.
 

Follower

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Let's consdier this complaint, "The word Christ is removed [Romans 14:10] so that there is no proof Christ is God in those scriptures." Romans 14:10, KJV, "But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ." No Christ in the NASB, "But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. "The word Christ is removed from the NASB? The NASB uses the word Christ over 500 times! In spite of all the nuttiness that comes from the minds of people, I've yet to see someone argue that Jesus isn't God because one verse in the NASB doesn't say "Christ" where the KJV does. Philemon 1:20, NASB, "Yes, brother, let me benefit from you in the Lord; refresh my heart in Christ." No Christ in the KJV, "Yea, brother, let me have joy of thee in the Lord: refresh my bowels in the Lord."Jude 1:25, NASB, "To the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen." No Christ in the KJV, "To the only wise God our Saviour, [be] glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen." 1Peter 3:15, NASB, "But sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence." No Christ in the KJV, "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear." Looks like the KJV denies that Christ is God. Actually, I would never accuse the KJV of that. There are real dragons to fight.
 

Jordan

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Let's consdier this complaint, "The word Christ is removed [Romans 14:10] so that there is no proof Christ is God in those scriptures." Romans 14:10, KJV, "But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ." No Christ in the NASB, "But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. "The word Christ is removed from the NASB? The NASB uses the word Christ over 500 times! In spite of all the nuttiness that comes from the minds of people, I've yet to see someone argue that Jesus isn't God because one verse in the NASB doesn't say "Christ" where the KJV does. Philemon 1:20, NASB, "Yes, brother, let me benefit from you in the Lord; refresh my heart in Christ." No Christ in the KJV, "Yea, brother, let me have joy of thee in the Lord: refresh my bowels in the Lord."Jude 1:25, NASB, "To the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen." No Christ in the KJV, "To the only wise God our Saviour, [be] glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen." 1Peter 3:15, NASB, "But sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence." No Christ in the KJV, "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear." Looks like the KJV denies that Christ is God. Actually, I would never accuse the KJV of that. There are real dragons to fight.
Those are minor... but still. How about this little 3 verses?John 7:8-10 KJV - Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast: for my time is not yet full come. When he had said these words unto them, he abode still in Galilee. But when his brethren were gone up, then went he also up unto the feast, not openly, but as it were in secret....John 7:8-10 NASB - "Go up to the feast yourselves; I do not go up to this feast because My time has not yet fully come." Having said these things to them, He stayed in Galilee. But when His brothers had gone up to the feast, then He Himself also went up, not publicly, but as if, in secret....John 7:8-10 NLT - You go on. I’m not going to this festival, because my time has not yet come.” After saying these things, Jesus remained in Galilee. But after his brothers left for the festival, Jesus also went, though secretly, staying out of public view.Just to name a couple. Now what was it that the bible says?Romans 3:4 - God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.Revelation 20:18-19 - For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.P.S. This is only an example of my work, I got so much more to show, but I rather let you find it on another topic.
 

Follower

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Those are minor... but still. How about this little 3 verses?
All three verses appear to say essentually the same thing.
 

Super Kal

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the thing that gets to me is why do they downplay the capitalization of the word "he" when speaking of Christ in the 2nd person perspective... God is always spelled with an upper case manner: God, Lord, Jesus Christ, Messiah, Holy Spirit, Holy Ghost... and we all know Jesus Christ is God the Son... When I see a name or place in upper case in the Bible that's not in front of a period, I see that as a form of importance, or something that has great value in the God's Word. In my mind, when describing Jesus Christ with a lower case implies that Christ was something less than God... the Bible says otherwise: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.that is something that has bothered me for a long time
 

SoldierforChrist

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The new bibles not only attack the trinity, but also many other foundational truths and doctrines that we believe as christians.
 

Jordan

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Those are minor... but still. How about this little 3 verses?
All three verses appear to say essentually the same thing.Except sometimes taking away one word makes a big change of meaning. How can you not see that they are making Christ a liar?(Super Kal;60242)
the thing that gets to me is why do they downplay the capitalization of the word "he" when speaking of Christ in the 2nd person perspective... God is always spelled with an upper case manner: God, Lord, Jesus Christ, Messiah, Holy Spirit, Holy Ghost... and we all know Jesus Christ is God the Son... When I see a name or place in upper case in the Bible that's not in front of a period, I see that as a form of importance, or something that has great value in the God's Word. In my mind, when describing Jesus Christ with a lower case implies that Christ was something less than God... the Bible says otherwise: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.that is something that has bothered me for a long time
It doesn't bother me since the KJV was around in the year 1600's. To be more specific, it's 1611.The reason the word he is even lowercase for Christ is because there were no Captialization rule on pronoun, I guess. Again, although, it doesn't bother me at all, but I do see your point.
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Follower

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Except sometimes taking away one word makes a big change of meaning. How can you not see that they are making Christ a liar?
Re: John 7:8-10:Neither version makes Jesus a liar. Because you're vague, I can only guess at what you think the problem is. In the KJV, you think Jesus is just saying he's not ready to go yet, but the NASB says Jesus is not going at all. But, then Jesus goes.The NASB also says "not yet". It's in verse 6 and again near the the end of 8 and it means exactly the same as the KJV's inclusion of the word near the start of 8. Both versions have identical meanings, Jesus is not yet ready.Aside from there being no real difference, if this is the problem you're seeing, then you're missing the point of the passage. Jesus is not saying he needs more time before going to the feast. It's because it's not yet his time that he goes incognito, after the others had left. Even after he goes to the feast, it's still not yet his time.When Jesus says it's not yet time, he means it's not yet time to let the Jews kill him.
 

Jordan

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Except sometimes taking away one word makes a big change of meaning. How can you not see that they are making Christ a liar?
Re: John 7:8-10:Neither version makes Jesus a liar. Because you're vague, I can only guess at what you think the problem is. In the KJV, you think Jesus is just saying he's not ready to go yet, but the NASB says Jesus is not going at all. But, then Jesus goes.The NASB also says "not yet". It's in verse 6 and again near the the end of 8 and it means exactly the same as the KJV's inclusion of the word near the start of 8. Both versions have identical meanings, Jesus is not yet ready.Aside from there being no real difference, if this is the problem you're seeing, then you're missing the point of the passage. Jesus is not saying he needs more time before going to the feast. It's because it's not yet his time that he goes incognito, after the others had left. Even after he goes to the feast, it's still not yet his time.When Jesus says it's not yet time, he means it's not yet time to let the Jews kill him.Verse 6 has nothing to do with going to the feast. And I'm not being vague to be honest. And I'm not even missing the point of the meaning.And you said there is no real difference? Says who? Men?
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Follower

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Verse 6 has nothing to do with going to the feast. And I'm not being vague to be honest. And I'm not even missing the point of the meaning.And you said there is no real difference? Says who? Men?
I think at this point, someone else needs to step in.
 

Jordan

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Verse 6 has nothing to do with going to the feast. And I'm not being vague to be honest. And I'm not even missing the point of the meaning.And you said there is no real difference? Says who? Men?
I think at this point, someone else needs to step in.That's fine and dandy.
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How about go check my thread that's been sitting in the signature for a while. Even if you did read it. I would assume that you won't be able to understand my point anyway.But you can disagree.
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Follower

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That's fine and dandy.
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How about go check my thread that's been sitting in the signature for a while. Even if you did read it. I would assume that you won't be able to understand my point anyway.
I read it. Wow, it's a long thread. Translators do have the task of selecting from different Greek and Hebrew documents. The Received Text, which the KJV is based on, in John 7:8 says, "go not up yet unto this feast" The Greek texts which most modern versions use leaves out the "yet". But, as I have observed, I don't see that it makes the smallest difference in the meaning of the passage. (The NASB is very clear that Jesus means "yet", if you read the context.)Jesus might be called Christ one place but not another, but he's still called Christ. The Greek and Hebrew texts used by all popular translations are incredibly reliable, with differences being insignificant. You might see a difference and call it significant, but where are the consequences that something significant would produce?
 

Jordan

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its just easier to stick with the KJV. its the closest and most accurate translation to the original.
That's the whole point I was trying to make... and make them think.
 

cemab4y

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The KJV is 400 (four hundred) years old. It is a pioneering translation, to be sure. It was assembled and translated by a committee (a first for the English language). The source document was the Textus Receptus, which was the first time that the New Testament was published in its entirety in Greek. The Old testament, was translated from the available source documents, primarily the septuagint.In the intervening 400 years, several things occured:-Our understanding of ancient (Koine) Greek has expanded greatly. We can now understand the ancient language much better, and render translation into English with more preciseness.- More detailed and reliable manuscripts of the ancient scriptures have become available (the Dead Sea Scrolls, etc).-the English language has changed markedly from the Elizabethan English of the KJV. We no longer use "thee and thou". God's word is unchanging, but the language of man is changing constantly. I believe that the new technology, and the more reliable manuscripts that have become available, are blessings. As for myself, I will continue to use modern translations (I prefer "the Promise").
 

tomwebster

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The KJV is 400 (four hundred) years old. It is a pioneering translation, to be sure. It was assembled and translated by a committee (a first for the English language). The source document was the Textus Receptus, which was the first time that the New Testament was published in its entirety in Greek. The Old testament, was translated from the available source documents, primarily the septuagint.....As for myself, I will continue to use modern translations (I prefer "the Promise").
To each his own. I will stay with the KJV
 

cemab4y

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I once knew a man in Jackson, Tennessee, who used the KJV only. He told me he was sticking with the KJV, because that was the version that Jesus used. I believe that God worked a miracle, in preserving the Dead Sea Scrolls (the KJV translators had no access to them, they were discovered in 1948). I also believe that the KJV translators would have been delighted to have had the manuscripts and translation tools and computer software, that were unavailable in the 16th century. God never stands still. He has provided mankind, with new tools and methods of understanding the revealed word.
 

Follower

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-Our understanding of ancient (Koine) Greek has expanded greatly. We can now understand the ancient language much better, and render translation into English with more preciseness.
Conversely, our willingness to create an honest translation has decreased. Consider some of the modern translations that deliberately make some verses gender neutral.
- More detailed and reliable manuscripts of the ancient scriptures have become available (the Dead Sea Scrolls, etc).
Which sources are more reliable is a matter of debate.
As for myself, I will continue to use modern translations (I prefer "the Promise").
Paraphrases are okay if you prefer to read a commentary over the real deal. Do you also attend a mega-church?