Please explain this.

bbyrd009 · Jul 4, 2019

GodsGrace said:
Hey.
Cheer up bb.
You been in a bad mood ....

ha, well ty. Tbh that was all a show ok, all for effect, i dont expect it to stop or anything

GodsGrace · Jul 4, 2019

bbyrd009 said:
lol. Better discern when them others are just commending themselves to each other, too, i do that for a pretty nice living right now lol. Y'all would not believe that me irl is the same guy in these forums ok, i am basically like Stroker Ace irl lol.

This is done ... I know it for sure because I used to work for a really big corporation.
Really big. Many good comments about each other...it seems to be the way to go.

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

bbyrd009 said:
sure, emotions are powerful things, and the heart is deceptive above all things. Definitely. Well put.

But you do think we should read the bible. We should just not think we have ever met God or received the Holy Spirit? We should assume we have only mistakenly thought that we were born from above? We should assume we have only been fooled that He knocked and we opened the door when really it was just our own emotions producing the experience?

GodsGrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
John's First Epistle has very strong content about assurance of faith. Romans 8.38-39 is hard to argue against.

NO THEY'RE NOT FAROUK.

Unfortunately, I just don't feel like it right now.
But I'll give you this one: (and I've got pages of 'em)
Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

And since you're in the letter to the Romans,
let me post this verse:

Romans 11:21-22
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

Paul speaks of those who fell....
So I'd say it's possible to fall.

He speak of CONTINUING in God's kindness...
So I'd say it's possble to NOT continue in His kindness.

Perhaps you'd like to read something JESUS said:

Mathew 23:13 and
Mathew 25:45-46
45“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’
46“These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Now, so far you've never replied to my verses posted special for you.
Give it a try now...perhaps @Lady Crosstalk would like to give it a try.

Nancy · Jul 4, 2019

stunnedbygrace said:
But you do think we should read the bible. We should just not think we have ever met God or received the Holy Spirit? We should assume we have only mistakenly thought that we were born from above? We should assume we have only been fooled that He knocked and we opened the door when really it was just our own emotions producing the experience?

The proof is in the pudding, and He proves faithful, over and over and over and over....IMHO, it all bottoms out to total surrender and faith. Again, JMHO.
You and I know different Jen

.

farouk · Jul 4, 2019

GodsGrace said:
NO THEY'RE NOT FAROUK.

Unfortunately, I just don't feel like it right now.
But I'll give you this one: (and I've got pages of 'em)
Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

And since you're in the letter to the Romans,
let me post this verse:

Romans 11:21-22
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

Paul speaks of those who fell....
So I'd say it's possible to fall.

He speak of CONTINUING in God's kindness...
So I'd say it's possble to NOT continue in His kindness.

Perhaps you'd like to read something JESUS said:

Mathew 23:13 and
Mathew 25:45-46
45“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’
46“These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Now, so far you've never replied to my verses posted special for you.
Give it a try now...perhaps @Lady Crosstalk would like to give it a try.

If they fall and are lost, they were never believers in the first place, Biblically speaking.

GodsGrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
If they fall and are lost, they were never believers in the first place, Biblically speaking.

Farouk,,,,I could blow that one down in one flat minute.
Must I remind you of Luke 13:8?

You make it too easy my man. It's not up to YOU to determine if someone is saved or not. We all know persons that believed and then FELL AWAY. IF the N.T. says it's possible then IT IS.

What EXACTLY do you suppose they were FALLING AWAY from?

PLEASE EXEGETE THE VERSES I GAVE YOU...
and quit running away from them.

THANKS.

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
If they fall and are lost, they were never believers in the first place, Biblically speaking.

This does not always prove out. No one would have stepped out under that wall of water at the Red Sea UNLESS they believed and trusted God.

farouk · Jul 4, 2019

stunnedbygrace said:
This does not always prove out. No one would have stepped out under that wall of water at the Red Sea UNLESS they believed and trusted God.

Jude declares that despite abounding apostasy He is able to keep (Jude 24).

farouk · Jul 4, 2019

GodsGrace said:
Farouk,,,,I could blow that one down in one flat minute.
Must I remind you of Luke 13:8?

You make it too easy my man. It's not up to YOU to determine if someone is saved or not. We all know persons that believed and then FELL AWAY. IF the N.T. says it's possible then IT IS.

What EXACTLY do you suppose they were FALLING AWAY from?

PLEASE EXEGETE THE VERSES I GAVE YOU...
and quit running away from them.

THANKS.

John's First Epistle speaks of the mighty assurance available to the true believer.

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
Jude declares that despite abounding apostasy He is able to keep (Jude 24).

You have half of the dialectic here. Its a good start.

GodsGrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
John's First Epistle speaks of the mighty assurance available to the true believer.

PLEASE EXEGETE THE VERSE I POSTED.

just like I do to yours.
What's the problem?
You can't?

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

stunnedbygrace said:
You have half of the dialectic here. Its a good start.

Yes, He is able to keep you from falling. It is through trust. But also there is this: I can't make you stand firm if you won't stand firm.

Lady Crosstalk · Jul 4, 2019

GodsGrace said:
Do you have a problem with the word of JESUS?
WHY can't I just read and trust the words of Jesus in MATHEW 5:20?

Why do I need to INTERPRET them with Galatians and Philippians?

Is JESUS not trustworthy?

(see Acts 20:27) If Paul thought it wise to teach the "whole counsel of God" shouldn't we? He warns the Ephesians in Acts 20:30.

farouk · Jul 4, 2019

GodsGrace said:
NO THEY'RE NOT FAROUK.

Unfortunately, I just don't feel like it right now.
But I'll give you this one: (and I've got pages of 'em)
Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

And since you're in the letter to the Romans,
let me post this verse:

Romans 11:21-22
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

Paul speaks of those who fell....
So I'd say it's possible to fall.

He speak of CONTINUING in God's kindness...
So I'd say it's possble to NOT continue in His kindness.

Perhaps you'd like to read something JESUS said:

Mathew 23:13 and
Mathew 25:45-46
45“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’
46“These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Now, so far you've never replied to my verses posted special for you.
Give it a try now...perhaps @Lady Crosstalk would like to give it a try.

Those who do not continue in the faith were never in it.

We don't rely on us 'keeping it up', but it's God's grace working in us

He is "able to save" (Hebrews 7.25).

He is "able to keep" (Jude 24).

farouk · Jul 4, 2019

stunnedbygrace said:
Yes, He is able to keep you from falling. It is through trust. But also there is this: I can't make you stand firm if you won't stand firm.

So you mean that really, ultimately, we rely upon our own efforts supposedly to remain saved? I cannot believe that. It has to be all of grace, or not at all.

justbyfaith · Jul 4, 2019

What is the nature of everlasting life? Is it not life that will never end?

If my salvation is life everlasting, but I lose that salvation, then my everlasting life came to an end, and therefore it was not everlasting.

Therefore, the fact that it is everlasting life means that by nature I cannot lose it as salvation.

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
Those who do not continue in the faith were never in it.

Okay, now tie it in with the verses GG gave. If you can tie them together, we will listen.

justbyfaith · Jul 4, 2019

farouk said:
Those who do not continue in the faith were never in it.

They may have had faith; but that faith would be defined as nominal, shallow and lukewarm (mere mental assent to the tenets of the gospel).

stunnedbygrace · Jul 4, 2019

justbyfaith said:
What is the nature of everlasting life? Is it not life that will never end?

If my salvation is life everlasting, but I lose that salvation, then my everlasting life came to an end, and therefore it was not everlasting.

Therefore, the fact that it is everlasting life means that by nature I cannot lose it as salvation.

There is one thing that can nullify by grace through faith. That one thing is to not continue and grow in that trust.

Please explain this.

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