Please explain this.

stunnedbygrace said:

Okay, now tie it in with the verses GG gave. If you can tie them together, we will listen.

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farouk said:

So you mean that really, ultimately, we rely upon our own efforts supposedly to remain saved? I cannot believe that. It has to be all of grace, or not at all.

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stunnedbygrace said:

There is one thing that can nullify by grace through faith. That one thing is to not continue and grow in that trust.

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stunnedbygrace said:

There is one thing that can nullify by grace through faith. That one thing is to not continue and grow in that trust.

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justbyfaith said:

What is the nature of everlasting life? Is it not life that will never end?

If my salvation is life everlasting, but I lose that salvation, then my everlasting life came to an end, and therefore it was not everlasting.

Therefore, the fact that it is everlasting life means that by nature I cannot lose it as salvation.

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stunnedbygrace said:

Shouldn't you rather say: it has to be all of grace, through faith, or not at all?

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farouk said:

As mentioned, if ppl fall away, if they do not continue, they never had a true work of grace.

"Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ" (Philippians 1.6).

We are going round in circles. It's not profitable.

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farouk said:

John's First Epistle has very strong content about assurance of faith. Romans 8.38-39 is hard to argue against.

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farouk said:

...then it was never true faith in the first place.

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GodsGrace said:

This is done ... I know it for sure because I used to work for a really big corporation.
Really big. Many good comments about each other...it seems to be the way to go.

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justbyfaith said:

They may have had faith; but that faith would be defined as nominal, shallow and lukewarm (mere mental assent to the tenets of the gospel).

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• “Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much.” ...
• “Do I not destroy my enemies when I make them my friends?” ...
• “The man of knowledge must be able not only to love his enemies but also to hate his friends.” ...
• “Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.”

GodsGrace said:

NO THEY'RE NOT FAROUK.

Unfortunately, I just don't feel like it right now.
But I'll give you this one: (and I've got pages of 'em)
Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

And since you're in the letter to the Romans,
let me post this verse:

Romans 11:21-22
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

Paul speaks of those who fell....
So I'd say it's possible to fall.

He speak of CONTINUING in God's kindness...
So I'd say it's possble to NOT continue in His kindness.

Perhaps you'd like to read something JESUS said:

Mathew 23:13 and
Mathew 25:45-46
45“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’
46“These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Now, so far you've never replied to my verses posted special for you.
Give it a try now...perhaps @Lady Crosstalk would like to give it a try.

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bbyrd009 said:

The art of war is simple enough. Find out where your enemy is. Get at him as soon as you can. Strike him as hard as you can, and keep moving on. Ulysses S. Grant
Read more at: Enemy Quotes - BrainyQuote

guess ol U never Read that one about who his real enemies are huh

The art of war teaches us to rely not on the likelihood of the enemy's not coming, but on our own readiness to receive him; not on the chance of his not attacking, but rather on the fact that we have made our position unassailable. Sun Tzu War
Read more at: Enemy Quotes - BrainyQuote

ha them eastern guys, i tell ya what

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farouk said:

If they fall and are lost, they were never believers in the first place, Biblically speaking.

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justbyfaith said:

It's in the Bible. 2 Corinthians 3 I think.

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stunnedbygrace said:

But you do think we should read the bible.

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We should just not think we have ever met God or received the Holy Spirit? We should assume we have only mistakenly thought that we were born from above? We should assume we have only been fooled that He knocked and we opened the door when really it was just our own emotions producing the experience?

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bbyrd009 said:

sbg, "The best cure for Christianity is to read the Bible?" Yes, even a Two-Eyed, Literal Reading of the Scriptures--almost zero, iow, almost no info being imparted at all--that i would be offering for consideration will plainly guide anyone who Reads them, and riddles be damned imo, the riddles can be puzzled out like they are sposed to as you go. Now if you still "believe" that you might go up to heaven after you have literally died then bam right, the other bam, you have a prob or issue or really an opp right there. This is an opportunity for you, right there in the Book, see. Bc you already know the v about that one, surely. My opinion about the v really doesnt matter, your opinion is the only one that matters. No reason that you cannot inform and then continue to inform that opinion as you go, right, at least until you form a "belief" anyway and then youre screwed lol, sorry, there just is no better way to put someone who says that they know into a cat, than that. imo.
ah, sbg you got me answering now and i dont really like to answer, answers i'm just flopping around now too see, bc i dont know, so that said i at least do not assume that i have done much more than um touched the hem at this point, stopped the bleeding a little maybe. I yoyo between being completely at peace with nothing and even momentarily suicidal surrounded by everything one could possibly want, and i'm talking like up to pjs here lol. matter of fact getting on a jet makes me really depressed now, nevermind.

Anyway, i would look for the signs that will determine if and where (you) are on that path up there you describe, with the understanding that we look for the stuff we want to find, and ignore the other stuff or worse. Imo you should not think you have ever met God. Imo we each get a measure of the Spirit, and you might define "each" diff than me, or God. "We should assume we have only mistakenly thought that we were born from above?" You posit an instantaneous birth in your yesterday that i do recall, and yes you should only mistakenly assume that imo, mostly bc of the way you have chosen to define "born again" imo, as this instantaneous thing that happens just like we imagine as we are reading that passage, "do this and do that, and get baptized, and voila." see but i read of a...hmm, an impregnation and a carrying and a labor and then a birth. Do i also have rest right now? yes, i do, but suicide might also cross my mind later lol, which btw mostly makes me smile now, its more like a joke to me, Abba is asking me if my widdle feewings are hurt or what lol. Knowledge brings sorrow, suck it up buttercup, all that. yikes, a book.

"We should assume we have only been fooled that He knocked and we opened the door when really it was just our own emotions producing the experience?" at least until you have verified otherwise, of course! the heart is deceitful above all, and what is...quite carefully and artfully masked is, um, there are no male and female in the kingdom so we should not be reading that way, and female in the bible...will lead one to that, um lets see the progression is more or less her desire will be for her man which most any guy whos been married more than a month can verify lol, then two men in a field, in a bed, and...voila, lol, your chick is running your dude, youre old lady is blabbing in church, and you are singing WHEN WE ALL GET TO oops heaven.

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stunnedbygrace said:

And those quotes take on a zing factor when we consider that a mans enemies are in his OWN house/self...

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