What Do The Book of Daniel DECEIVERS Present?!?

Bobby Jo said:

Yeah, fun -- as in stuff that tickles ears, which isn't my cup of tea. So I think I'll leave the conversation.

Thanks,
Bobby Jo

Click to expand...

To be frank, I really didn't grasp what you believe. Can you put it in your own words? Are you pre-trib, or what. I'm post trib. All those quotes from other folks didn't make any sense to me.

You all are dancing around your own self inflicted fiction stories.
.
Don't you yet know that Blind people cannot read Braille with their eyes??
Please see Isaiah 55:8-9 and John 16:13, and then take the challenge I posed on page 1.

Better yet, I reposted my challenge, found below:
"There can always be more than one lie, but there can never be more than one truth"- Earburner.

Please be sure to read and digest "by His Holy Spirit" KJV- Isaiah 55:8-9 and John 16:13, for if you DON'T, then you will never understand how John 5:39 applies to the 70 weeks.
[39] Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
.
Unfortunately, for all of the vain labor and wasted time in mathematics, the answer is clearly shown of howand when the 70 week WAS fulfilled.
.
It's really only one math function, of adding 69+1=70.
Are you ready for this?
Here it is: add verse 25 to 27, specifically-
[25]...unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks [69]:...
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one [1] week:...
Did your answer add up to 70?
Of course it did!
.
Ok, we are not done yet!!
Now, here is your clue to finally understanding the 70 Week prophecy, and it is solely relative to Jesus' firstappearance:
.
In Daniel 9[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week heshall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
.
Challenge:
There are only two (2) people of which the word "he" is being spoken of, in reference to verse 26. You must determine which is which!
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiahbe cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Question:
Who is that word "he" referencing?
1. Jesus?
2. The prince?
.
If you have selected the correct answer, your "religious" understanding will be turned upside down, because Histruth is stranger than all their religious FICTION!
.
Can you handle it, or will you walk away?
But, before you do, please read John 5:39 again!!

Bobby Jo said:

Yeah, fun -- as in stuff that tickles ears, which isn't my cup of tea. So I think I'll leave the conversation.

Thanks,
Bobby Jo

Click to expand...

Tickles ears? That implies falsehoods regarding sin. From the first post I still have no idea what you believe, and yet you are just going to leave? Your post was like a 1000 piece puzzle and we are suppose to see the whole picture out of a dozen pieces. Fill in the holes.

Earburner said:

"There can always be more than one lie, but there can never be more than one truth"- Earburner.

Please be sure to read and digest "by His Holy Spirit" KJV- Isaiah 55:8-9 and John 16:13, for if you DON'T, then you will never understand how John 5:39 applies to the 70 weeks.
[39] Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
.
Unfortunately, for all of the vain labor and wasted time in mathematics, the answer is clearly shown of how and when the 70 week WAS fulfilled.
.
It's really only one math function, of adding 69+1=70.
Are you ready for this?
Here it is: add verse 25 to 27, specifically-
[25]...unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks [69]:...
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one [1] week:...
Did your answer add up to 70?
Of course it did!
.
Ok, we are not done yet!!
Now, here is your clue to finally understanding the 70 Week prophecy, and it is solely relative to Jesus' first appearance:
.
In Daniel 9[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
.
Challenge:
There are only two (2) people of which the word "he" is being spoken of, in reference to verse 26. You must determine which is which!
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Question:
Who is that word "he" referencing?
1. Jesus?
2. The prince?
.
If you have selected the correct answer, your "religious" understanding will be turned upside down, because His truth is stranger than all their religious FICTION!
.
Can you handle it, or will you walk away?
But, before you do, please read John 5:39 again!!

Click to expand...

This sounds like Preterism. So you are saying that the Great Tribulation was 70 AD. Then where is Jesus?

Matthew 24:
29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

CharismaticLady said:

This sounds like Preterism. So you are saying that the Great Tribulation was 70 AD. Then where is Jesus?

Matthew 24:
29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Click to expand...

By way of numerous false doctrines of misunderstanding, you and many here, are are mixing NT prophecy up with the FULFILLED OT prophecy of the 70 weeks.
.
I provided the challenge, for one to understand the concept of His truth, which is contrary to the many lies that are currently being fabricated among the churches. All of those fabrications are derived from the logical and analytical minds (thoughts and ways) of men, through their "religious scholarly learning/training".
.
In John 16:13, Jesus is emphatically telling us that by Him alone, we must learn to think outside of that religious box, and begin to hear His "thoughts and ways". Isaiah 55:8-9.
.
So then, in my previous post, I asked all the question of WHO is the "he", that is being referenced in Daniel 9:27, in relation to verse 26.
.
Is that word "he" in reference to the Messiah Jesus, or is it in reference to the prince, who was to come?
But, before you can answer that, you must come to grips with the factual truth, that "the prince" who was to come, WAS the Roman Commander Titus in 70AD. To think anything else is sheer fantasy!!
If you don't see and agree, then there is no hope of you or anyone being able to escape the religious quagmire of their religious indoctrination, through false thinking.

So again, who is the "he", that is being referenced?
Is it Jesus, or is it Titus?
One answer is completely wrong, while the other answer is completely correct!
Iows, there are no other answers to be had, or fabricated!

Bobby Jo said:

1948

Click to expand...

you just have to, right

Earburner said:

Is that word "he" in reference to the Messiah Jesus, or is it in reference to the prince, who was to come?

Click to expand...

Since the prophecy clearly says that "Messiah shall be cut off" (crucified) "the prince that shall come" cannot be Christ, neither can he be Titus or anyone in that time frame. "The prince that shall come" is the future Antichrist.

CharismaticLady said:

The decree of Artaxerxes mentioned in Nehemiah chapters 1 and 2.

Click to expand...

Artaxerxes was not the one who issued the decree. He simply ensured that the decree of Cyrus was carried out: Moreover I said unto the king [Artaxerxes], If it please the king, let letters be given me to the governors beyond the river, that they may convey me over till I come into Judah (Neh 2:5).

This decree is mentioned several times in Ezra.
But in the first year of Cyrus the king of Babylon the same king Cyrus made a decree to build this house of God.(Ezra 5:13)...
Then Darius the king made a decree, and search was made in the house of the rolls, where the treasures were laid up in Babylon. And there was found at Achmetha, in the palace that is in the province of the Medes, a roll, and therein was a record thus written: In the first year of Cyrus the king the same Cyrus the king made a decree concerning the house of God at Jerusalem, Let the house be builded, the place where they offered sacrifices, and let the foundations thereof be strongly laid; the height thereof threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof threescore cubits; (Ezra 6:1-3)

Earburner said:

By way of numerous false doctrines of misunderstanding, you and many here, are are mixing NT prophecy up with the FULFILLED OT prophecy of the 70 weeks.
.
I provided the challenge, for one to understand the concept of His truth, which is contrary to the many lies that are currently being fabricated among the churches. All of those fabrications are derived from the logical and analytical minds (thoughts and ways) of men, through their "religious scholarly learning/training".
.
In John 16:13, Jesus is emphatically telling us that by Him alone, we must learn to think outside of that religious box, and begin to hear His "thoughts and ways". Isaiah 55:8-9.
.
So then, in my previous post, I asked all the question of WHO is the "he", that is being referenced in Daniel 9:27, in relation to verse 26.
.
Is that word "he" in reference to the Messiah Jesus, or is it in reference to the prince, who was to come?
But, before you can answer that, you must come to grips with the factual truth, that "the prince" who was to come, WAS the Roman Commander Titus in 70AD. To think anything else is sheer fantasy!!
If you don't see and agree, then there is no hope of you or anyone being able to escape the religious quagmire of their religious indoctrination, through false thinking.

So again, who is the "he", that is being referenced?
Is it Jesus, or is it Titus?
One answer is completely wrong, while the other answer is completely correct!
Iows, there are no other answers to be had, or fabricated!

Click to expand...

Explain the Book of Revelation being written after 73 AD during the reign of Domitian (81 AD to 96 AD)

Enoch111 said:

Since the prophecy clearly says that "Messiah shall be cut off" (crucified) "the prince that shall come" cannot be Christ, neither can he be Titus or anyone in that time frame. "The prince that shall come" is the future Antichrist.

Click to expand...

I see that you have stumbled upon the correct answer, but with doubt, because of religion's preconceived ideas attempting to make soup out of your brain.
Be humble and trust in God only for your understanding!!
Let all of that religious nonsense go, and God will show you "His thoughts and ways" about HIS OWN WORDS. Isaiah 55:8-9.
.
At the moment, you are not following the context of the prophecy, but instead are getting snagged and derailed by the details of the peripheral situations.
.
Your guidance for understanding the entirety of the 70 Week prophecy, is explained in John 5:39. Surely you have not lost sight of that already?
I am giving you room to learn God's truth on this, without adding any scripture to support it, as of yet.
.
Now do yourself a favor, and go back to Daniel 9:24 and listen to God's "thoughts and ways" from the perspective of John 5:39.
Is not Dan. 9:24 "scripture"?
Is not the Messiah the MAIN Character?
Since that is so, Who then is being "testified" of (KJV)???
Be brave, and dare to think it and SAY IT!!
He WILL confirm it TO YOU!

Enoch111 said:

Since the prophecy clearly says that "Messiah shall be cut off" (crucified) "the prince that shall come" cannot be Christ, neither can he be Titus or anyone in that time frame. "The prince that shall come" is the future Antichrist.

Artaxerxes was not the one who issued the decree. He simply ensured that the decree of Cyrus was carried out: Moreover I said unto the king [Artaxerxes], If it please the king, let letters be given me to the governors beyond the river, that they may convey me over till I come into Judah (Neh 2:5).

This decree is mentioned several times in Ezra.
But in the first year of Cyrus the king of Babylon the same king Cyrus made a decree to build this house of God.(Ezra 5:13)...
Then Darius the king made a decree, and search was made in the house of the rolls, where the treasures were laid up in Babylon. And there was found at Achmetha, in the palace that is in the province of the Medes, a roll, and therein was a record thus written: In the first year of Cyrus the king the same Cyrus the king made a decree concerning the house of God at Jerusalem, Let the house be builded, the place where they offered sacrifices, and let the foundations thereof be strongly laid; the height thereof threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof threescore cubits; (Ezra 6:1-3)

Click to expand...

I've never had a problem with Titus being the prince, but I always believed that verse 27 was the future Antichrist. But I just got the shock of my life, and now have to do more study. Did you know that the Jewish revolt started in 66 AD and ended in 73 AD (7 years!), with 70 AD in the middle? But the Book of Revelation was written during the reign of Domitian 81 AD to 96 AD, so Revelation was written after the Revolt. How's that for a mixed up can of worms to now have to go through and make sense of?

CharismaticLady said:

Explain the Book of Revelation being written after 73 AD during the reign of Domitian (81 AD to 96 AD)

Click to expand...

The issue here is about the 70 week prophecy of Daniel.
Who (or what denomination) told you to add Revelations in with it? They should be ashamed, and you also for believing it!
.
Why do you assume that which is not written, in the fulfilled prophecy of the 70 weeks??
Please examine more closely (listen) to what
Daniel 9:24 says, before the preconceived ideas of "religion" enter in and take you over!!
Now, be truthful, who fulfilled Dan. 9:24 (KJV)

Earburner said:

I see that you have stumbled upon the correct answer, but with doubt, because of religion's preconceived ideas attempting to make soup out of your brain.

Click to expand...

I have no interest in religion's preconceived ideas -- which claim that the Papacy is the Antichrist. The Reformers were followed by the Protestant churches and the SDA in holding on to this idea. And the Preterists believed that everything in Revelation was fulfilled in AD 70.

Getting back to the prophecies of Daniel, we should not limit ourselves to just the 9th chapter of Daniel to see how "the prince that shall come" is the Antichrist (also called the Little Horn and many other names and titles). And I will not go into the details since that would be quite extensive.

So what we find in Daniel 9:24-27 is an overview of all that will impact on Jerusalem from the time of Daniel until the coming of the Antichrist, but there are many other passages which tell us that this Man of Sin will be destroyed, and Christ will then establish His literal Kingdom on earth after that. What we do not see is the gap between the crucifixion of Christ and the established of the Antichrist. And because we are not told EXPLICITLY that "there will be a gap" many people refuse to believe that this is true.

What happened when Titus destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD is not related to this prophecy for the simple reason that the Abomination of Desolation was not set up by the Antichrist within the Holy Place at that time. This is a future event (see Revelation 13) and the third temple must be built in order for that prophecy to be fulfilled (see Matthew 24 and 2 Thessalonians).

Earburner said:

The issue here is about the 70 week prophecy of Daniel.
Who (or what denomination) told you to add Revelations in with it? They should be ashamed, and you also for believing it!
.
Why do you assume that which is not written, in the fulfilled prophecy of the 70 weeks??
Please examine more closely (listen) to what
Daniel 9:24 says, before the preconceived ideas of "religion" enter in and take you over!!
Now, be truthful, who fulfilled Dan. 9:24 (KJV)

Click to expand...

Bobby Jo said:

To all,

Believe EVERYTHING that's been posted by all the "contributors". It's all TRUE, except for what they say, -- ignore that part because it's not Scriptural or Historical. But it's still TRUE, -- until they start typing ...


Whew,
Bobby Jo

Click to expand...

Bobby Jo, come on now, contribute. Personally, I just had a shock but my heart is not here to mock others or to be mocked, but to be convinced. And @Earburner, I don't know if you are a Christian or not, but a true Christian has the Holy Spirit and the fruit of the Spirit. Please take out 100% of the menacing mocking, and show more dates and actual history. I'm learning some things, in spite of the demonic attitudes.

Earburner said:

The issue here is about the 70 week prophecy of Daniel.
Who (or what denomination) told you to add Revelations in with it? They should be ashamed, and you also for believing it!
.
Why do you assume that which is not written, in the fulfilled prophecy of the 70 weeks??
Please examine more closely (listen) to what
Daniel 9:24 says, before the preconceived ideas of "religion" enter in and take you over!!
Now, be truthful, who fulfilled Dan. 9:24 (KJV)

Click to expand...

Knock it off and tell me what you believe is the message of Revelation. I don't know why you can't see the same symbolism.

CharismaticLady said:

I've never had a problem with Titus being the prince, but I always believed that verse 27 was the future Antichrist. But I just got the shock of my life, and now have to do more study. Did you know that the Jewish revolt started in 66 AD and ended in 73 AD (7 years!), with 70 AD in the middle? But the Book of Revelation was written during the reign of Domitian 81 AD to 96 AD, so Revelation was written after the Revolt. How's that for a mixed up can of worms to now have to go through and make sense of?

Click to expand...

I have already provided the shock of your life, of how the simple math of God works, and not the falsified, long drawn out process, of made up equations by
"church-ianity".
Here it is, in His "simplest" form: 69+1=70.
Shocking, isn't it??
But, will YOU believe it? Probably not, because there are way too many preconceived ideas floating around in your head, which is "garbage in, garbage out".
Now here are the mechanics of God's complicated math: Add verse 25 and 27 together

CharismaticLady said:

Knock it off and tell me what you believe is the message of Revelation. I don't know why you can't see the same symbolism.

Click to expand...

Symbolism? Yes, but not chronologically, which is how "our thoughts" understand words, that describe events that have taken place, and for those that are to come.
.
Words are thoughts made visible. But, according to Isaiah 55:8-9, God's thoughts ARE NOT our thoughts.
Therefore our words (human language) cannot convey to us "His thoughts".
But, by His Holy Spirit only, He does reveal His thoughts to us, even though He must use our limited words of language to do so.
.
So do our words of language fully express God's thoughts and ways (of His going, doing)?
If they did, then why the NEED for us to give HEED to
John 16:13??[13] Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

I did explain it to you and all, but you just can't believe it, because of the preconceived ideas of "church-ianity" that fill your mind.
The 70 Week prophecy is completely FULFILLED,...according to "His thoughts", and not what we want to make out of it by "our thoughts".

Earburner said:

I have already provided the shock of your life, of how the simple math of God works, and not the falsified, long drawn out process, of made up equations by
"church-ianity".
Here it is, in His "simplest" form: 69+1=70.
Shocking, isn't it??
But, will YOU believe it? Probably not, because there are way too many preconceived ideas floating around in your head, which is "garbage in, garbage out".
Now here are the mechanics of God's complicated math: Add verse 25 and 27 together

Click to expand...

Everyone is aware that 69 + 1 = 70. But you had absolutely nothing to do with what shocked me. You never mentioned the dates of 66 AD to 73 AD (7 years!!!). Do you know what they represent? There has been debate whether there is a 2000 year span in between 70 AD and the second coming. And whether verse 27 is Jesus, Titus or the future Antichrist, which I now believe is Titus. Your attitude is very arrogant, which makes you unrecognizable as a teacher of any kind of Truth. There is much you need to learn, such as verse 24.