The Church The Papacy Says You Should Join

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tabletalk

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Because the day upon which we worship identifies us with either the Creator or the god of this world. The Beast is the papacy and the Mark of the Beast is Sunday sacredness:

"Sunday is our Mark of authority. The church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact."

The prophecies are clear that the final issue is about WORSHIP and when laws are passed forcing us to worship, it is then that the Christian will have to choose between obedience to God's law or satanic papal law.

In the apocalyptic Psalm 94 which describes Earth's condition just before the Second Coming, we read "shall the throne of iniquity (lawlessness) have fellowship with Thee; he (the one who sits on that throne) that frameth mischief by a LAW?"

In the third of Revelation's Three Angels Messages, those who take the Mark of the Beast are CONTRASTED with those who do not by the words, "Here is the patience of the saints. Here are they who KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD and have the faith of Jesus." It stands to reason that if those who DO NOT get the Mark of the Beast are obeying God's law...those who take the Mark are BREAKING God's law.

A satanic religious law caused Daniel to be thrown to the lions.
A satanic religious law caused the Three Hebrew Worthies to be thrown into the fiery furnace.
A satanic religious law caused Esther and Israel at large to be threatened with extermination.

And in the last days, the ONE AND ONLY OF GOD'S TEN COMMANDMENTS which begins with the word "Remember" Satan has led everyone to believe it is the one that we are at liberty to forget. Make no mistake, Sunday's coming!

"The Beast is the papacy and the Mark of the Beast is Sunday sacredness:"

Are you saying that Protestants teach Sunday is a sacred day? Or, Catholics teach that?
Is Saturday a sacred day for SDA?

 

BreadOfLife

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Your religious "EPIGNOSIS" hypocrisy is showing. You can't even explain your misunderstanding without blundering the first sentence.

By definition, you error:

By calling them "them", you prove them not to be born again. For if they were born again, by definition, they would be "Him" ("Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me").
That’s absolute rubbish.

I didn’t refer to anybody as “them”.
I simply quoted Peter and the author of Hebrews who were writing under the inspiration of the HOLY SPIRIT. And having EPIGNOSIS of Christ means that they were born again believers.

If YOU have a problem with Epignosis – take it up with GodHE’S the author . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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Uh...LOL

Perhaps you are unaware that a fallacy is an UNTRUTH, and an UNTRUTH is a lie.

In this VERY post you say...
Yes you have repeatedly preached your erroneous Belief.

NO, SALVATION is NOT A PROCESS.

The MAN PREPARING "TO RECEIVE" Salvation IS THE MANS "PROCESS of Preparation".

We do NOT RECEIVE "SALVATION" in "INCREMENTS"!!! .

THE man puts INSELF in the POSITION to BECOME PREPARED and FOLLOWS THOUGH WITH HIS PREPARATION.

IT IS Thee Lord GOD who GIVES "INCREMENTS" of FAITH to the man....NOT "INCREMENTS" of SALVATION!!

LEADING UP TO....BECOMING PREPARED TO...Receive SALVATION...IS A PROCESS..

It's CALLED....HEARING...(BY the man)
which is the BEGINNING of Preparation.
Rom 10:17 ... HEARING

It's CALLED ....FOLLOWING.....(BY the man) which is a STAGE of Preparation.
Matt 4:19 .... FOLLOW JESUS

It is CALLED....TRUST....(By the man)
Which is a STAGE of Preparation.
2 Cor 3:4 ....TRUST THROUGHT JESUS

It is CALLED.....BELIEF....(BY the man)
Which is a STAGE of Preparation.
John 14:1 ......BELIEVE IN God and IN JESUS

Is is CALLED....FAITH....(A gift Forward FROM the Lord TO the Man WHO PREPARES, according to the Lords Design.
Which FAITH is an on going GIFT that INCREASES forward to the man DURING his Preparation.

AND the LAST STEP ....(BY the man)....
IS his WILLING CHOICE to "COMMIT" to Receiving the GIft of the Lords "SALVATION"

And the LAST STEP.....(By the Lord)....
IS Thee Lord "CONVERTING" the man.
Yes it is....however per your usual, you do not distnguish the True FACTS and Verifying Scripture.

YOU TEACH....you RECEIVED the HOLY SPIRIT...as a BABY, without your Knowledge...

AND the FACT is your claiming to have received the HOLY SPIRIT...

IS ALSO WITHOUT;
Hearing,
Following,
Trusting,
Believing,
Having received Faith

In Direct Contrast to Scripture.

Receiving the HOLY SPIRIT....IS PART of a Mans CONVERSION, that deals with the WHOLE of a MAN....body, soul, spirit.

You have this weird teaching....that you received the HOLY SPIRIT, without your knowledge, without Faith...
AND that you THEN have some drawn out process to receive Salvation...

That is not a Biblical Teaching that Applies to a man IN Christ.

You often appear to be oblivious the Jews were teaching Jews, and Jews WERE under the familiarity of THEIR LAWS...and that MANY of the Jews elected to REMAIN UNDER their LAW, (their law....not a Gentiles Law! ) "THER LAWS" HAS Zero application to a man RECEIVING SALVATION and QUICKENING....THROUGH Jesus...while still ALIVE in their flesh.

As you OFTEN BRAG about "your" church being so ANCIENT....it is obvious...by the things you say and scriptures you reference...you have zero sense of ability to determine proper applicability.

LOL...
People like me LISTEN when the Word of God is SPEAKING TO US ABOUT US.

Unlike you....WHO thumbs through Scripture, picking this one and that one....and then standing on your self-proclaimed teaching soapbox, Wagging your tongue, Dictating with vile endeavors WHAT APPLIES TO OTHER PEOPLE, when they themselves have made no such claims.

OSAS is a NOT a Lie, Untruth, of fallacy...as you say, which all mean the same thing.

IF YOU have ADOPTED Jewish Law, that your Salvation is Received AT THE END of OF your Physical existance....AFTER faithfully executing the Juridsictional LAW of the JEWS, accomplishing WORKS "according to JEWISH LAWS", and AT the END of your physical existance BEING FOUND ACCEPTABLE TO the "GOD" to Receive the GIFT of SALVATION...

Then WHY PRETEND, you have ACCEPTED Jesus as the Christ Messiah and HIS gift of Salvation IS GIVEN A MAN "WHILE the man is STILL ALIVE IN HIS FLESH, YET Spiritualy DEAD, having been Crucified BODILY WITH Christ, and thus LIVES IN HIS HOLY risen Body?

Dude....I am NOT Jewish! I don't DO WORKS according to JEWISH LAW...with the HOPE I "WILL" receive Approval of God and receive His GIFT of SALVATION!

I am a Gentile....WHO Heard, Followed, Believed, and Willingly SUBMITTED to God...
THROUGH Christ the Lord Jesus.... AND FOR THAT Belief, I was Given Faith, and with that FAITH, I was PrEPARED TO COMMIT, and with that Preparation, I WILLINGLY Committed,
AND Because of MY Willing Commitment...
I was "ONCE and Forever given the GIFT of SALVATION"...BY and THROUGH Christ thee Lord Jesus.

Apparently YOU are Oblivious....MANY MANY Jews DO NOT BELIEVE JESUS IS THEIR CHRIST MESSIAH....and MUST THROUGH obedience to their LAW "during their physical LIFETIME" continually FOLLOW their law IN OBEDIENCE.

Jesus' JEWISH disciples were TEACHING Jews ABOUT Jesus the Christ....that THEY may trust to believe THEY COULD RECEIVE THEIR SALVATION>>>>THEN..BY GOING THROUGH Jesus INSTEAD of THROUGH their Jewish Law.

You teach like you the ENTIRE New Testament is all about YOU... a Gentile, and your Chruch.....

It isn't!! MUCH of the New Testament is DIRECTED TO JEWS, ABOUT JEWS, BY JEWS....Learning TO stop talking and LISTEN...TO the GOOD NEWS...OF PRESENT SALVATION is COME to THEM.

You are a Gentile...a SIDE LINE of the prominence of the New Testament....but you act like you ARE the center stage...you aren't.

There is much wisdom in listening and learning HOW TO RIGHTFULLY DIVIDE THE WORD OF TRUTH....<--- and THAT when accomplished reveals TRUE Applicability....
Which you have repeatedly proven is NOT an accomplishment you have mastered.

Glory to God,
Taken
And with your usual insane verbose ranting style – you miss the point again . . .

Anyway - OSAS IS a fallacy - a complete untruth.
As I stated before – the Bible is CLEAR that salvation is a lifelong process o NOT a one-time event.

a) FIRST, we are given the grace to come to belief and have faith as were ARE SAVED (Rom. 5:1, 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8).

b) THEN
we live a life of faith as we are BEING SAVED. (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, 7:1, Phil. 2:12, Heb 12:14).

c) FINALLY, we die and enter into the glory of the Lord forever and gain FINAL SALVATION because we were faithful to the end (Matt. 24:13, Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15).

Paul states emphatically that we have HOPE as Christians.

Rom. 8:24-25
But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently.


OSAS is the false, man-made 16th century invention that arrogantly posits that we are so perfect that there is nothing we can do to fall away from Go – even though the Word of God itself repeatedly warns us that we CAN (Rom.11:22, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-22, Matt. 5:13, 1 Cor. 9:27, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).
 

BreadOfLife

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Eh how to communicate with your person...flesh....human....Terrestrial....part of you about Spiritual things....shen you have fail to reveal you comprehend the difference.

LOL....having a hard time sticking to a relevant point?

I have never claimed to be anti-Catholic.
If you are anti-Protestant, why not stick to claims about yourself and not worry about others?

Mary's body is rotting in a tomb....that's your idea of sinless perfection? LOL

I could care less WHOM you ask to pray for you....Personally it would probably benefit you to ASK everyone you speak to, since you seem to be in Great need of God to know you are in Great need of an intervention.

I on the other hand, different than you, have a DIRECT LINE of Communication TO GOD. That is MY Gift For having GONE "THROUGH" Christ Jesus.

I NEVER challenge Scripture, You ignorant man.

It is YOU, "through your" ignorance, that IS the whole crux of dispute between YOU and every person on this forum.
You mistakenly believe you are everyone's APPOINTED TEACHER....DICTATOR of OTHERS Beliefs....when you are incorrect on both accounts.

Glory to God,
Taken
After reading this latest rant of yours – it is blindingly-clear that I overestimated your ability to follow a simple chain of logic. I was trying to illustrate the fact that James is telling his readers that the prayers of a righteous person are very powerful (James 5:16) – yet, according to Protestantism, NOBODY is righteous because of your perversion of Rom. 3:10.

Pretty simple lesson that took my 3rd grade catechism students about 15 seconds to comprehend . . .

As for Mary – ummmm where is her body?? The Early Church was very big on keeping not only relics of the dead – but markers of where they were buried. They were very big on Tradition – and there is NO Tradition of Mary’s grave. Besides – it’s the SOULS of the saints in Heaven are who are praying for us.

Finally – it’s a shame that you don’t want others to pray for you. James, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit commands his readers to pray for one another. That’s wat we in the Body of Christ do.

Not sure what you on the outside do . . .
 
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Phoneman777

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"The Beast is the papacy and the Mark of the Beast is Sunday sacredness:"

Are you saying that Protestants teach Sunday is a sacred day? Or, Catholics teach that?
Is Saturday a sacred day for SDA?
Hi, TT, when it comes to the fourth commandment, the papacy boasts that it has the authority to change God's law because it claims to have changed the sacred day of rest and worship from the seventh day to the first day which is Sunday.

Protestants who recognize that the truth that the Ten Commandments will exist for all eternity but do not keep holy the seventh day aka "the Sabbath" have sought to make Sunday the object of that commandment as a "sacred holy day".

Psalm 111:7-8 is proof positive that what God wrote with His own finger in stone on Sinai will "stand fast forever and ever" and Isaiah is clear that we'll keep the Sabbath for all eternity in the kingdom.

So, isn't it curious that the Sabbath day was created in Eden, was all but certain to have existed among the other commandments kept by the faithful, such as Abraham (Genesis 26:5 KLV) and the others of the OT, was kept by Christ and the NT Church, and will be kept for all eternity...but for some odd reason, many many Christians think the period between the First Coming and the Second Coming is set aside for us to hold SUNDAY as the special holy rest day to go to church, etc.
 
B

brakelite

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Do YOU know any perfect people?
I didn't think so.
Okay, first off, the perfect person is not going to claim perfection. So without his own testimony, we would have to resort to knowing what God thinks of him. And we don't. So your question there is simply a stupid childish empty response designed to obscure your difficulty in accepting that it is indeed possible for people to attain perfection...otherwise Jesus would not have required it. And if Jesus has already removed the condemnation and guilt, and we have repented and turned way from every known sin, and God has finished revealing every secret sin, then purgatory becomes moot. But even we won't know if we have reached that standard, and would be guilty of pride and arrogance if we ever claimed it. Which is why Paul said,
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 ¶ And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
15 ¶ Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

Paul isn't saying perfection is impossible, and he isn't claiming it for himself. But from the way I read this, perfection is found in those who are walking in the right direction, regardless of how far along the road they may have travelled. A rose bud is as perfect as the full bloom. Like I said to MM, it is in this life, today, right now, that we must strive to attain to perfection, and it is in that striving, our perfection is realised. They that hunger and thirst after righteousness shall be filled.
 

BreadOfLife

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Okay, first off, the perfect person is not going to claim perfection. So without his own testimony, we would have to resort to knowing what God thinks of him. And we don't. So your question there is simply a stupid childish empty response designed to obscure your difficulty in accepting that it is indeed possible for people to attain perfection...otherwise Jesus would not have required it. And if Jesus has already removed the condemnation and guilt, and we have repented and turned way from every known sin, and God has finished revealing every secret sin, then purgatory becomes moot. But even we won't know if we have reached that standard, and would be guilty of pride and arrogance if we ever claimed it. Which is why Paul said,
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 ¶ And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
15 ¶ Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

Paul isn't saying perfection is impossible, and he isn't claiming it for himself. But from the way I read this, perfection is found in those who are walking in the right direction, regardless of how far along the road they may have travelled. A rose bud is as perfect as the full bloom. Like I said to MM, it is in this life, today, right now, that we must strive to attain to perfection, and it is in that striving, our perfection is realised. They that hunger and thirst after righteousness shall be filled.
And yet, you couldn't simply answer the question.
Do YOU know any perfect people?

And, IF you do - are they the only ones going to Heaven?
 

BreadOfLife

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I KNOW, thee perfect Lord God Almighty.
I KNOW, people PERFECTED IN thee Lord God Almighty.
I Don't find you accounted among them.
LOL...why would you think your thoughts, matter, without your question yet having Been answered? LOL

Glory to God,
Taken
In other words - you DON'T know any perfect people.
That's pretty much what I figured . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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Purgatory ~
in Roman Catholic doctrine) a place or state of suffering inhabited by the souls of sinners who are expiating their sins before going to heaven.

Where IS this place?

Glory to God,
Taken
Actually - that's not a bad question - for a change.
However - Purgatory or Final Purification isn't necessarily a place - but a state of being.

1 Cor. 3:10-15
According to the grace of God given to me, like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another is building upon it. But each one must be careful how he builds upon it, for no one can lay a foundation other than the one that is there, namely, Jesus Christ.
If anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, or straw, the work of each will come to light, for the Day will disclose it. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire [itself] will test the quality of each one’s work.
If the work stands that someone built upon the foundation, that person will receive a wage.
But if someone’s work is burned up,
that one will SUFFER loss; the person will be SAVED, but only as through fire.

It CAN'T be in in Heaven because it says that the person will SUFFER - and there is NO suffering in Heaven (Rev. 21:4).
It CAN'T be in Hell because the person will be SAVED - and there is NO salvation in Hell (2 Thess. 1:9).

This is describing a THIRD state which is not Heaven OR Hell.
 

BreadOfLife

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So....You are sharing how all these Scriptures APPLY TO YOU....BECAUSE:

You have given a wishy washy account of how the gift of Salvation relates to YOU...
Sort of like MAYBE you have Received SALVATION....MAYBE not...you are Unclear.

But then "IF" you have received Salvation, you could LOSE it at ANY TIME...
BECAUSE By your own testimony...YOU "CONTINUE" to SIN.

And then the matter of BEING BORN AGAIN which deals with the spirit.

You have clearly testified, YOU DID RECEIVE, a born again spirit....
Without repentance.
Without a confession of belief.
Without your knowledge.


So what is YOUR point with this list of Scriptures?

"YOU" Can RECEIVE "SALVATION"...
.......AND RECEIVE "A BORN AGAIN SPIRIT"...

AND STILL CONTINUE TO SIN?
and
Choose TO REJECT thee Lord God?
And
That...SINNING and REJECTION, WILL CAUSE YOU TO LOSE your SALVATION..?

What about YOUR "supposed" born again spirit.....DO YOU LOSE THAT TOO?

Glory To God,
Taken
Funny how Paul admitted his shortcomings and his ongoing struggle with sin (1 Tim. 1:15) - and John admitted that he still had sin in his life (1 John 1:8) - yet YOU are far too arrogant to admit these things.

Rant on all you want - but I'll stick with the BIBLICAL definition of God's love and mercy - and not the arrogant cartoon that you've created for yourself . . .
 
B

brakelite

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And yet, you couldn't simply answer the question.
Do YOU know any perfect people?

And, IF you do - are they the only ones going to Heaven?
I don't know if I know any perfect people or not. I may... But I won't know it. You said only perfect people get to heaven right? So how does the Bible describe these perfect people?
Those who aren't these guys???....
KJV Revelation 21
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
... Nor these.....
KJV Revelation 22
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
So I guess that leaves us with these guys...

KJV Revelation 14
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

KJV Revelation 22
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Guess what, as far as I am aware right at this moment, I am one of those. And I do know others, as far as I can tell, who are the same. But that does not preclude God informing me tomorrow of an area in my life where I fall short. But I cannot repent now of somethng I know nothing about. So if I were to run my bus off a cliff this afternoon, I am confident that come resurrection time, I will be raised along with the prophets and Saints from past and present ages and go directly to be with my Lord.

KJV Isaiah 25
God's Victorious Salvation
9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

If God reveals to me something now hidden in my heart... Discontent... Murmuring... Pride.... Lust... And I did not immediate repent, he would give me time... But if I hardened my heart and refused, I would be as Sodom and the contemporaries of Noah. No second chance. No purgatory. Today is the day of salvation.
KJV Isaiah 55
Seek the Lord
6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
 
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Taken

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a) FIRST...ARE SAVED

b) THEN
...we are BEING SAVED.

c) FINALLY, we die and enter into the glory of the Lord forever and gain FINAL SALVATION ....
because we were faithful to the end

Got it...Catholic LOGICAL teaching:

1) First are saved.
2) THEN being saved.
3) Lastly DEPENDS on a persons ABILITY to REMAIN Faithful.

LOL

OSAS is the false, man-made 16th century invention arrogantly posits that we are so perfect that there is nothing we can do to fall away from God-

1) natural born person ARE AGAINST God,
SIN Against God;
BECAUSE...they DO NOT BELIEVE IN HIM, or His WORD, Christ the Lord Jesus.

2) By Gods GRACE, natural born persons ARE Give:
His Knowledge, His WORD.

3) Natural born persons WHO CHOOSE to Hear His WORD, BEGIN receiving FAITH, FROM God.

4) Natural born persons WHO CONTINUE receiving the ENLIGHTMENT of His KNOWLEDGE, CONTINUE receiving measures of FAITH from God.

THIS IS A CROSSROAD POINT...

5) Natural born persons INDIVIDUALLY CHOOSE;
A) to CONTINUE receiving Gods Enlightening Knowledge....AND FAITH.
OR
B) STOP receiving Gods Enlightening Knowledge...AND FAITH.

6) Natural born persons from Group A)
Continue Receiving Gods Knowledge AND Faith.

7) Natural born persons from Group B)
FALL AWAY...
From Gods WORD/KNOWLEDGE
From Receiving FAITH from God
From BEING PREPARED To RECEIVE SALVATION.

THIS is the APOSTALS WARNING...

CONTINUE In the Lords Knowledge, Word...
CONTINUE Receiving Faith from God...
CONTINUE Hearing...
CONTINUE Believing...

CONTINUE ... SO THAT....you ARE PREPARED
IN FAITH, TO RECEIVE, YOUR SALVATION....
THAT thee Lord God HAS PREPARED FOR YOU!

IF, you FALL AWAY...YOU LOSE YOUR OFFERING of SALVATION...YOU WILL DIE "IN YOUR SIN AGAINST GOD!

IN THE END OF DAYS...WHEN God GATHERS ALL....MEN...
The GATHERING GOD Gathers "UNTO" HIMSELF...ARE "IN STANDING WITH HIM"
AND
The GATHERING GOD GATHERS "WITHOUT" HIMSELF...ARE "IN STANDING WITHOUT HIM".

YOU TEACH and PREACH...Catholics are LIKE, OT JEWS, and NT JEWS, and TODAYS JEWS,
WHO...
DO NOT "KNOW" JESUS the CHRIST.
DO NOT "BELIEVE IN" JESUS IS THE CHRIST.
DO NOT "FOLLOW CHRIST JESUS"...

BUT RATHER..."REMAIN" ...
UNDER MOSAIC LAW...
Continue to Believe IN God,
Continue to SIN,
Continue to Repeatedly ASK God to forgive them FOR their Repeated Sins.

WITH the ADDED "LIP SERVICE"...
OF "CLAIMING TO BELIEVE" IN CHRIST JESUS...WHILE "FAILING" to TRUST TO BELIEVE...

ONCE a man "HEARTFULLY" Submits TO CHRIST JESUS...THAT MAN HAS RECEIVED Christ Jesus, ONCE, and FOREVER.

OSAS, BELIEVES...CHRIST JESUS "IS" their SALVATION...THEIR SAVIOR...
AND ONCE, a MAN RECEIVIES the "INDWELLING" OF THEIR SAVIOR, THEIR SALVATION "IS" Received, FOREVER!

Now While YOU TEACH,

OSAS is the false, man-made 16th century invention arrogantly posits that we are so perfect that there is nothing we can do to fall away from God-

MEN...continue to SIN against God...and TRUSTING the "INDWELLING" Spirit of Christ IN a man IS "NOT SUFFICIENT" TO KEEP A MAN SAVED ....
BY your own teaching, that a man MUST..
BY HIS "OWN POWER" remain Faithful to the end....

IS hogwash...!

It is the SPIRIT of God WITHIN a man ...
Thee Highest POWER of STRENGTH...
INDWeLLING "WITHIN" a man ...
THAT KEEPS a mans SALVATION...
THAT KEEPS a man IN STANDING WITH thee Lord God Almighty.
That KEEPS a man FROM EVER Falling AWAY!
That KEEPS a man FROM EVER "AGAIN" Committing SIN AGAINST GOD...
THAT bestows A glorious Title to such man...
Being CALLED "a son of God".

I ALREADY HAVE, the POWER of thee Lord God Almighty WITHIN ME...
I don't HOPE to Receive His Power within me..
I ALREADY HAVE IT!

I ALREADY KNOW, His SPIRIT IS WITH ME FOREVER!

I ALREADY KNOW, He will NEVER LEAVE ME!

I ALREADY KNOW, HE CAN NEVER STAND AGAINST HIMSELF.

I ALREADY KNOW, WITH Him IN ME, I CAN NEVER "AGAIN" STAND AGAINT HIM.

I ALREADY KNOW, my being naturally born IN SIN, "WAS" of past tense, ME BEING AGAINST God..

I ALREADY KNOW, The Lord Jesus "ONCE" offered HIS BODY, HIS BLOOD, for ME...

I ALREADY KNOW, "I" Accepted His OFFERING, "ONCE"...

I ALREADY KNOW, He Fulfilled HIS PROMISE, Giving me HIS SEED....which birthed me a NEW spirit...
That can NEVER AGAIN COMMINT SIN AGAINST GOD!

He Offered...I Accepted HIS OFFERING...
I TRUST He IS Faithful and TRUE...
And I am BORN of Gods SEED.

1 John 1:
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Jesus Came to REVEAL KNOWLEDGE.
I LISTENED.
I FOLLOWED.
I TRUST.
I BELIEVE.
I SUBMITTED.
I GAINED What thee Lord God OFFERED.
I am IN STANDING WITH thee Lord God Almighty FOREVER.
I AM Forgiven, Soul SAVED, spirit REBORN..
AND
I am PREPARED to be BODILY raised in Glory on the DAY my Lord CALLS me UP TO HIM.

So good luck with RELYING on your LOGICAL CARNAL MIND, and teaching the SAME to others...WHEN...

Philosophies, traditions of men, Logic of the carnal mind.......HAVE ZERO TO DO with Spiritual things.

Col 2
[8] Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Rom 8
[7] Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

See... I have Scriptural WARNINGS about men LIKE you and what you peddle...and Because I have the TRUTH IN ME, it is SO EASY to Recognize your faulty teaching...
And Because I have the POWER of GOD IN ME, it is SO EASY to Reject your fairy teaching.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

Taken

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.... I overestimated your ability to follow a simple chain of logic.

LOGIC is conclusions the Carnal Mind settles on After weighting Between Options.

It is Obvious you you RELY ON "your" LOGIC and "LOGIC" of your church leaders, to reach YOUR understanding of Scripture.

Gods WORD, IS TRUTH...LOGIC NOT REQUIRED! Either you Believe it or you Don't!


according to Protestantism, NOBODY is righteous

LOL...are you a Protestant...that you think yourself QUALIFIED to "SPEAK FOR" a Protestant? YOU FAIL!

Pretty simple lesson that took my 3rd grade catechism students about 15 seconds to comprehend . . .

I have heard a priority of Catholics is to INDOCTRINATE young children...

Teaching is about ALL the OPTIONS Gods Knowlede Reveals and SHOWING HOW TO DESIRE HIS WAY.

Catechism is about ONE OPTION, your Church Dictates WITH FEAR.

As for Mary – ummmm where is her body??

Returning or already accomplished in having returned to DUST.
I don't know, or care WHERE on Earth her Body is...I was never APPOINTED to be her Rotting Body Keeper.

The Early Church was very big on keeping not only relics of the dead – but markers of where they were buried.

They were? WHY? Where IN Scripture is it TAUGHT for men to be very big on keeping relics of the Dead?
Something your Church Learrned from the Egyptians?

They were very big on Tradition – and there is NO Tradition of Mary’s grave.

Guess your Early Chruch Failed in that respect.
Nor was there ANY mention of Mary's Gravesite in Scripture...since it is NOT significant.

Finally – it’s a shame that you don’t want others to pray for you.

Not ALL OTHERS, are Converted... I am. I HAVE a DIRECT communication line TO THEE Lord God Almighty.

James, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit commands his readers to pray for one another.

Pray for WHO "one another" for WHAT?
WHO...the "POOR IN SPIRIT"... without the Indwelling Spirit of God.
WHAT...that the "POOR IN SPIRIT"...WILL HEAR the WORD of God, WILL Be INTERESTED, WILL seek the Lord, WILL Become Converted, and WILL RECEIVE CONVERSION of Christ Jesus...as a Converted man HAS himself Received...
Forgiveness, Faith-FULLNESS, Salvation of his SOUL and QUICKENING of his SPIRIT and JUSTIFICATION to BE RISEN UP in a Glorified BODY.

That’s wat we in the Body of Christ do.

You teach a BABY IS QUICKENED in his spirit...
WITHOUT the Baby's repentance, confession of belief, or receiving of a Saved soul.

You teach thereafter, the baby grows and continually Sins and continually begins repenting over and over and must prove himself worthy of his soul becoming SAV-ED.
And at his physical Death, IF the persons soul is WORTHY, it becomes Sav-ED.

How do you PROVE your "worth" to HAVE your soul SAV-ED at the end of your physical life....... BY your life long WORKS?

Not sure what you on the outside do . . .

LOL...no, you are unsure what I do...Because I am ALREADY WITH the Lord....and you...

Were taught you received A Quickened spirit;
WITHOUT repenting, belief, Conversion or your knowledge;
And you are still WAITING for your souls salvation.

While YOU WAIT....I am ALREADY MADE:
Dead,
Washed,
Cleansed,
Sanctified,
Covered,
Saved,
Quickened,
WHOLE...
And FREE from Sin.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

Taken

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In other words - you DON'T know any perfect people.

"In other words"...GAG YOURSELF..."your words are NEVER applicable to me"...

That's pretty much what I figured . . .

Ofcourse that is what "YOU FIGURED"...

It is a Catholic Teaching....to open your YAP, SPEAK "OTHER" words FOR "OTHER" people, then go off an a Tangent "AS IF"....what flew out of your YAP, is what other people have SAID....when it is simply JUST MADE UP LIES, you drum up....and use YOUR LIES...as accusations toward others...

Good Grief BOL.... Do you REALLY think yourself so Clever, having Mastered Satan's cunningness, that you do not NOITCE, Converted men See right THROUGH Your deceit and REJECT your psychobabble you endlessly Promote as your Church's Position and your Adherence.

Dude Noone is scrambling to JOIN what you are Peddling...You are best to stick with your 3rd graders BEFORE they realize YOU are NOT THE TRUTH!

Glory to God,
Taken
 

BreadOfLife

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I don't know if I know any perfect people or not. I may... But I won't know it. You said only perfect people get to heaven right? So how does the Bible describe these perfect people?
Those who aren't these guys???....
KJV Revelation 21
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
... Nor these.....
KJV Revelation 22
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
So I guess that leaves us with these guys...

KJV Revelation 14
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

KJV Revelation 22
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Guess what, as far as I am aware right at this moment, I am one of those. And I do know others, as far as I can tell, who are the same. But that does not preclude God informing me tomorrow of an area in my life where I fall short. But I cannot repent now of somethng I know nothing about. So if I were to run my bus off a cliff this afternoon, I am confident that come resurrection time, I will be raised along with the prophets and Saints from past and present ages and go directly to be with my Lord.

KJV Isaiah 25
God's Victorious Salvation
9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

If God reveals to me something now hidden in my heart... Discontent... Murmuring... Pride.... Lust... And I did not immediate repent, he would give me time... But if I hardened my heart and refused, I would be as Sodom and the contemporaries of Noah. No second chance. No purgatory. Today is the day of salvation.
KJV Isaiah 55
Seek the Lord
6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
And regardless of your self-congratulatory diatribe – you’re not perfect.
As I stated earlier – Rev. 21:27 says that NOTHING impure or imperfect can enter Heaven.

So, unless you are MADE pure and perfect (1 Cor. 3:10-15) – you’re not getting in . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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Got it...Catholic LOGICAL teaching:

1) First are saved.
2) THEN being saved.
3) Lastly DEPENDS on a persons ABILITY to REMAIN Faithful.

LOL
1) natural born person ARE AGAINST God,
SIN Against God;
BECAUSE...they DO NOT BELIEVE IN HIM, or His WORD, Christ the Lord Jesus.

2) By Gods GRACE, natural born persons ARE Give:
His Knowledge, His WORD.
3) Natural born persons WHO CHOOSE to Hear His WORD, BEGIN receiving FAITH, FROM God.

4) Natural born persons WHO CONTINUE receiving the ENLIGHTMENT of His KNOWLEDGE, CONTINUE receiving measures of FAITH from God.

THIS IS A CROSSROAD POINT...

5) Natural born persons INDIVIDUALLY CHOOSE;
A) to CONTINUE receiving Gods Enlightening Knowledge....AND FAITH.
OR
B) STOP receiving Gods Enlightening Knowledge...AND FAITH.

6) Natural born persons from Group A)
Continue Receiving Gods Knowledge AND Faith.

7) Natural born persons from Group B)
FALL AWAY...
From Gods WORD/KNOWLEDGE
From Receiving FAITH from God
From BEING PREPARED To RECEIVE SALVATION.

THIS is the APOSTALS WARNING...

CONTINUE In the Lords Knowledge, Word...
CONTINUE Receiving Faith from God...
CONTINUE Hearing...
CONTINUE Believing...

CONTINUE ... SO THAT....you ARE PREPARED
IN FAITH, TO RECEIVE, YOUR SALVATION....
THAT thee Lord God HAS PREPARED FOR YOU!

IF, you FALL AWAY...YOU LOSE YOUR OFFERING of SALVATION...YOU WILL DIE "IN YOUR SIN AGAINST GOD!

IN THE END OF DAYS...WHEN God GATHERS ALL....MEN...
The GATHERING GOD Gathers "UNTO" HIMSELF...ARE "IN STANDING WITH HIM"
AND
The GATHERING GOD GATHERS "WITHOUT" HIMSELF...ARE "IN STANDING WITHOUT HIM".

YOU TEACH and PREACH...Catholics are LIKE, OT JEWS, and NT JEWS, and TODAYS JEWS,
WHO...
DO NOT "KNOW" JESUS the CHRIST.
DO NOT "BELIEVE IN" JESUS IS THE CHRIST.
DO NOT "FOLLOW CHRIST JESUS"...

BUT RATHER..."REMAIN" ...
UNDER MOSAIC LAW...
Continue to Believe IN God,
Continue to SIN,
Continue to Repeatedly ASK God to forgive them FOR their Repeated Sins.

WITH the ADDED "LIP SERVICE"...
OF "CLAIMING TO BELIEVE" IN CHRIST JESUS...WHILE "FAILING" to TRUST TO BELIEVE...

ONCE a man "HEARTFULLY" Submits TO CHRIST JESUS...THAT MAN HAS RECEIVED Christ Jesus, ONCE, and FOREVER.

OSAS, BELIEVES...CHRIST JESUS "IS" their SALVATION...THEIR SAVIOR...
AND ONCE, a MAN RECEIVIES the "INDWELLING" OF THEIR SAVIOR, THEIR SALVATION "IS" Received, FOREVER!

Now While YOU TEACH,
MEN...continue to SIN against God...and TRUSTING the "INDWELLING" Spirit of Christ IN a man IS "NOT SUFFICIENT" TO KEEP A MAN SAVED ....
BY your own teaching, that a man MUST..
BY HIS "OWN POWER" remain Faithful to the end....
IS hogwash...!
It is the SPIRIT of God WITHIN a man ...
Thee Highest POWER of STRENGTH...
INDWeLLING "WITHIN" a man ...
THAT KEEPS a mans SALVATION...
THAT KEEPS a man IN STANDING WITH thee Lord God Almighty.
That KEEPS a man FROM EVER Falling AWAY!
That KEEPS a man FROM EVER "AGAIN" Committing SIN AGAINST GOD...
THAT bestows A glorious Title to such man...
Being CALLED "a son of God".

I ALREADY HAVE, the POWER of thee Lord God Almighty WITHIN ME...
I don't HOPE to Receive His Power within me..
I ALREADY HAVE IT!

I ALREADY KNOW, His SPIRIT IS WITH ME FOREVER!
I ALREADY KNOW, He will NEVER LEAVE ME!
I ALREADY KNOW, HE CAN NEVER STAND AGAINST HIMSELF.

I ALREADY KNOW, WITH Him IN ME, I CAN NEVER "AGAIN" STAND AGAINT HIM.

I ALREADY KNOW, my being naturally born IN SIN, "WAS" of past tense, ME BEING AGAINST God..

I ALREADY KNOW, The Lord Jesus "ONCE" offered HIS BODY, HIS BLOOD, for ME...

I ALREADY KNOW, "I" Accepted His OFFERING, "ONCE"...

I ALREADY KNOW, He Fulfilled HIS PROMISE, Giving me HIS SEED....which birthed me a NEW spirit...
That can NEVER AGAIN COMMINT SIN AGAINST GOD!

He Offered...I Accepted HIS OFFERING...
I TRUST He IS Faithful and TRUE...
And I am BORN of Gods SEED.

1 John 1:
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Jesus Came to REVEAL KNOWLEDGE.
I LISTENED.
I FOLLOWED.
I TRUST.
I BELIEVE.
I SUBMITTED.
I GAINED What thee Lord God OFFERED.
I am IN STANDING WITH thee Lord God Almighty FOREVER.
I AM Forgiven, Soul SAVED, spirit REBORN..
AND
I am PREPARED to be BODILY raised in Glory on the DAY my Lord CALLS me UP TO HIM.

So good luck with RELYING on your LOGICAL CARNAL MIND, and teaching the SAME to others...WHEN...

Philosophies, traditions of men, Logic of the carnal mind.......HAVE ZERO TO DO with Spiritual things.

Col 2
[8] Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Rom 8
[7] Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

See... I have Scriptural WARNINGS about men LIKE you and what you peddle...and Because I have the TRUTH IN ME, it is SO EASY to Recognize your faulty teaching...
And Because I have the POWER of GOD IN ME, it is SO EASY to Reject your fairy teaching.

Glory to God,
Taken
And yet, you cannot refute the overwhelming number of warnings to the born-again faithful to REMAIN faithful so as not to LOSE their security (Rom.11:22, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-22, Matt. 5:13, 1 Cor. 9:27, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

His Spirit is only with you as long as YOU allow it.

The choice is ALWAYS yours.
 

BreadOfLife

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"In other words"...GAG YOURSELF..."your words are NEVER applicable to me"...

Ofcourse that is what "YOU FIGURED"...
It is a Catholic Teaching....to open your YAP, SPEAK "OTHER" words FOR "OTHER" people, then go off an a Tangent "AS IF"....what flew out of your YAP, is what other people have SAID....when it is simply JUST MADE UP LIES, you drum up....and use YOUR LIES...as accusations toward others...

Good Grief BOL.... Do you REALLY think yourself so Clever, having Mastered Satan's cunningness, that you do not NOITCE, Converted men See right THROUGH Your deceit and REJECT your psychobabble you endlessly Promote as your Church's Position and your Adherence.

Dude Noone is scrambling to JOIN what you are Peddling...You are best to stick with your 3rd graders BEFORE they realize YOU are NOT THE TRUTH!

Glory to God,
Taken
In other words - you DON'T know any perfect people.

That's what I thought . . .
 

Taken

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Funny how Paul admitted his shortcomings and his ongoing struggle with sin (1 Tim. 1:15) - and John admitted that he still had sin in his life (1 John 1:8) - yet YOU are far too arrogant to admit these things.

I find nothing FUNNY about Paul using himself as an EXAMPLE....of WHAT HE "DID" as painful to him....and WHAT HE "Received" FROM THE Lord..."Despite" WHAT HE "DID".

It is Well KNOWN Paul...at one time DID NOT Believe in Christ Jesus...........
...............AND FURTHER, because of Pauls DISBELIEF.......he SET OUT TO PERSECUTE those who DID BELIEVE....

Well...I DIDN'T WALK in Pauls shoes and DO what Paul DID!

Paul called himself a CHIEF SINNER... precisely, Because he NOT ONLY REJECTED Jesus the Christ.....BUT DID set out tO SPeCIFICALLY PERSECUTE Believers "IN" Jesus the Christ!

Pauls MESSAGE IS...TO THOSE LIKE him...WHO HAVE, DID, DO....PERSECUTE BELIEVERS IN Jesus the CHRIST....

THAT LIKE PAUL...there IS hope for THEM to ALSO Repent and Become Forgiven and Converted IN Christ...BECAUSE thee Lord God IS MERCIFUL and FULL of Grace!

Thanks for sharing your utter and complete lack of understanding of Paul's message.

John admitted that he still had sin in his life (1 John 1:8)


1 John 1: 8
[8] If we say that we have no sin we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.


"Have no sin".... uh huh...SO? what is your point?

WHO? NAME ONE PERSON on this FORUM who has CLAIMED...
they "have no sin"...

LOL You CAN'T....which is Precisely WHY you have not identified ONE Person making that claim!

Per your usual...you open your yap, and say this Scripture and that Scripture APPLIES to "OTHER PEOPLE"....WITHOUT EVER ONCE quoting ANY WORDS of ANYONE making any such CLAIM.

That is CALLED, Deceit, Deception, False Accusations, Lies....

You can KEEP using your MO of FALSE accusations, and Continue to BE Observed as a FALSE ACCUSER....

OR

BACK UP YOUR CLAIMS with the OTHERS OWN WORDS ... instead of YOU SPEAKING FOR THEM what is FALSE!

^ THAT is the honorable thing to do...

So far you have failed....and repeatedly that has been pointed out to you...

How long are you going to hide under your cloak of DISHONOR as IF noone is taking notice?

Gory to God,
Taken
 

BreadOfLife

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LOGIC is conclusions the Carnal Mind settles on After weighting Between Options.

It is Obvious you you RELY ON "your" LOGIC and "LOGIC" of your church leaders, to reach YOUR understanding of Scripture.

Gods WORD, IS TRUTH...LOGIC NOT REQUIRED! Either you Believe it or you Don't!
LOL...are you a Protestant...that you think yourself QUALIFIED to "SPEAK FOR" a Protestant? YOU FAIL!
I have heard a priority of Catholics is to INDOCTRINATE young children...

Teaching is about ALL the OPTIONS Gods Knowlede Reveals and SHOWING HOW TO DESIRE HIS WAY.

Catechism is about ONE OPTION, your Church Dictates WITH FEAR.
Returning or already accomplished in having returned to DUST.
I don't know, or care WHERE on Earth her Body is...I was never APPOINTED to be her Rotting Body Keeper
They were? WHY? Where IN Scripture is it TAUGHT for men to be very big on keeping relics of the Dead?
Something your Church Learrned from the Egyptians?
Guess your Early Chruch Failed in that respect.
Nor was there ANY mention of Mary's Gravesite in Scripture...since it is NOT significant.
Not ALL OTHERS, are Converted... I am. I HAVE a DIRECT communication line TO THEE Lord God Almighty
Pray for WHO "one another" for WHAT?
WHO...the "POOR IN SPIRIT"... without the Indwelling Spirit of God.
WHAT...that the "POOR IN SPIRIT"...WILL HEAR the WORD of God, WILL Be INTERESTED, WILL seek the Lord, WILL Become Converted, and WILL RECEIVE CONVERSION of Christ Jesus...as a Converted man HAS himself Received...
Forgiveness, Faith-FULLNESS, Salvation of his SOUL and QUICKENING of his SPIRIT and JUSTIFICATION to BE RISEN UP in a Glorified BODY
You teach a BABY IS QUICKENED in his spirit...
WITHOUT the Baby's repentance, confession of belief, or receiving of a Saved soul.

You teach thereafter, the baby grows and continually Sins and continually begins repenting over and over and must prove himself worthy of his soul becoming SAV-ED.
And at his physical Death, IF the persons soul is WORTHY, it becomes Sav-ED.

How do you PROVE your "worth" to HAVE your soul SAV-ED at the end of your physical life....... BY your life long WORKS?
LOL...no, you are unsure what I do...Because I am ALREADY WITH the Lord....and you...

Were taught you received A Quickened spirit;
WITHOUT repenting, belief, Conversion or your knowledge;
And you are still WAITING for your souls salvation.

While YOU WAIT....I am ALREADY MADE:
Dead,
Washed,
Cleansed,
Sanctified,
Covered,
Saved,
Quickened,
WHOLE...
And FREE from Sin.

Glory to God,
Taken
And as usual – you rave on like a person who is totally ignorant of Scripture and history.

Early Christians were very big on relics – and that came from JEWISH culture – not from Egypt.

Your angry rants are comical because you ALWAYS shoot from the hip without doing your homework.

As for logic NOT being of God – this is an asinine proposition. God IS logical and so is His Divine Word.

What’s NOT logical is your constant rejection of His truth.

As for there being no mention of Mary’s gravesite – it’s because there wasn’t one.

In fact, the Early Church UNANIMOUSLY agreed that she was assumed into Heaven – body and soul. If you l know anything about the Early Church – you know how difficult it was for them to unanimously agree on anything other than the most basic and important tenets of the faith. Even then, they debated.

Finally – the fact that you’re arguing about the idea that Christians are SUPPOSED to intercede for one another by praying for each other (James 6:16) speaks VOLUMES about how clueless you are when it comes to Scripture . . .