What Mormons Believe--according to a Former BYU Professor

Willie T said:

Augustine had an interesting view of this:
Ben Crenshaw: Read Time: 3 min

If you search Google for “love God and do what you want” (or some variant thereof) you will instantly get a slew of pages telling you that this is a quote from St. Augustine of Hippo, an early church theologian and pillar of the Christian faith. Supposedly the whole quote goes like this:

Love God and do whatever you please: for the soul trained in love to God will do nothing to offend the One who is Beloved.

I’m not sure Augustine actually said that last part. I’m always wary about internet quotations as these are often either erroneous or are falsely attributed to an individual. So I did a little digging to make sure Augustine really did say this. It turns out that he did more or less say the first bit about loving and doing what we please. It’s found in his Seventh Homily on 1 John 4:4-12 (#8) where he says,

Once for all, then, a short precept is given thee: Love, and do what thou wilt: whether thou hold thy peace, through love hold thy peace; whether thou cry out, through love cry out; whether thou correct, through love correct; whether thou spare, through love do thou spare: let the root of love be within, of this root can nothing spring but what is good.

There is some debate about what exactly Augustine meant by this. Notice he doesn’t say “Love God,” but just “Love”; and he doesn’t say “and do whatever you please,” but “and do what you will.” In any case, since he is commenting on 1 John 4:8, it’s clear that the love God seeks from us is love that comes from God and would love God and others.

Now, I believe this little epigram has much truth to it. As Jesus said when summing up the Law, the greatest commandment is to love God with all our heart, soul, and mind (Mt. 22:37). Love is a priority for Christians as it should characterize all we do. It is much too easy to get caught up in doing (obedience) before loving. But Jesus made it explicitly clear that love comes before obedience, even as obedience must necessarily follow from love (John 14:15, 21, 24):

If you love me, you will keep my commandments…whoever has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me…whoever does not love me does not keep my words.

In one sense, Augustine is correct: if we truly love God and have been transformed by his unconditional and abundant love for us, then we will obey him through the filling of the Holy Spirit and live a life pleasing to God. Of course, this is a general description of the transformation of believers that manifests itself in both belief and behavior. It is not an absolute promise since we continue to live with and struggle with our sin nature.

But notice that Augustine did not say, “Because God loves you, you can do whatever you please: for love covers a multitude of sins,” or something similar. It’s not true that God’s love is a license to sin or confers a blessing upon whatever we do (see Rom. 5-6). Unfortunately, many people of my generation (millennials) have adopted this latter approach and attributed it as somehow being biblical. This is tragic. Yes, God loves us unconditionally, but that doesn’t mean he is indifferent toward what we believe and how we act (beliefs and behavior are inextricably linked since the former dictates the latter). Let us not be deceived into thinking that just because God loves us or because we have a gospel of grace and mercy, therefore our behavior doesn’t have to conform to a biblical ethic.

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aspen said:

Both are 19th century revelations
All the fingerprints of post-Protestantism
Latter Day prophets
Food restrictions
Contortions of the doctrine of the Trinity...

Birds of a feather.....

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Prayer Warrior said:

So, how do you know that what you hear is actually from God? IOW, how do you test it?

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Prayer Warrior said:

I think you misunderstood my question. HOW do you know that you are actually hearing from God?

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Willie T said:

Augustine had an interesting view of this:
Ben Crenshaw: Read Time: 3 min

If you search Google for “love God and do what you want” (or some variant thereof) you will instantly get a slew of pages telling you that this is a quote from St. Augustine of Hippo, an early church theologian and pillar of the Christian faith. Supposedly the whole quote goes like this:

Love God and do whatever you please: for the soul trained in love to God will do nothing to offend the One who is Beloved.

I’m not sure Augustine actually said that last part. I’m always wary about internet quotations as these are often either erroneous or are falsely attributed to an individual. So I did a little digging to make sure Augustine really did say this. It turns out that he did more or less say the first bit about loving and doing what we please. It’s found in his Seventh Homily on 1 John 4:4-12 (#8) where he says,

Once for all, then, a short precept is given thee: Love, and do what thou wilt: whether thou hold thy peace, through love hold thy peace; whether thou cry out, through love cry out; whether thou correct, through love correct; whether thou spare, through love do thou spare: let the root of love be within, of this root can nothing spring but what is good.

There is some debate about what exactly Augustine meant by this. Notice he doesn’t say “Love God,” but just “Love”; and he doesn’t say “and do whatever you please,” but “and do what you will.” In any case, since he is commenting on 1 John 4:8, it’s clear that the love God seeks from us is love that comes from God and would love God and others.

Now, I believe this little epigram has much truth to it. As Jesus said when summing up the Law, the greatest commandment is to love God with all our heart, soul, and mind (Mt. 22:37). Love is a priority for Christians as it should characterize all we do. It is much too easy to get caught up in doing (obedience) before loving. But Jesus made it explicitly clear that love comes before obedience, even as obedience must necessarily follow from love (John 14:15, 21, 24):

If you love me, you will keep my commandments…whoever has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me…whoever does not love me does not keep my words.

In one sense, Augustine is correct: if we truly love God and have been transformed by his unconditional and abundant love for us, then we will obey him through the filling of the Holy Spirit and live a life pleasing to God. Of course, this is a general description of the transformation of believers that manifests itself in both belief and behavior. It is not an absolute promise since we continue to live with and struggle with our sin nature.

But notice that Augustine did not say, “Because God loves you, you can do whatever you please: for love covers a multitude of sins,” or something similar. It’s not true that God’s love is a license to sin or confers a blessing upon whatever we do (see Rom. 5-6). Unfortunately, many people of my generation (millennials) have adopted this latter approach and attributed it as somehow being biblical. This is tragic. Yes, God loves us unconditionally, but that doesn’t mean he is indifferent toward what we believe and how we act (beliefs and behavior are inextricably linked since the former dictates the latter). Let us not be deceived into thinking that just because God loves us or because we have a gospel of grace and mercy, therefore our behavior doesn’t have to conform to a biblical ethic.

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Jane_Doe22 said:

Clarifications on the Trinity subject: LDS Christians believe that the Father, Son, and Spirit are three person in one God. That's all the same. The three are believed to be one through unity, versus through consubstantiality as stated in the Athanasian Creed.

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aspen said:

True
I appreciate that LDS no longer practice Holy lying
In the past, it was policy for missionaries to only acknowledge similarities
Now, they usually fully explain differences as well

The ends never justify the means

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Prayer Warrior said:

So, you compare everything you "hear" with the Bible, specifically? I mean, when you say "scripture study," do you mean only the Bible, or what LDS considers other scriptures, as well.

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aspen said:

I have no problem with people posting here, who do not accept the Nicene Creed,as long as they are open about it.

Since this is a Protestant site, I let people know I am Catholic - I think it is important

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Prayer Warrior said:

I see. So, not exclusively the Bible.

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