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VictoryinJesus

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In 1 Corinthians 3, it is God who gives the increase; however in the same passage He also uses labourers to accomplish His purposes. Some plant the seeds, and others water them; but God gives the increase.

I will say that the office of planting and watering are important; for without them, there will be no plants sprouting up. It is written somewhere in the Psalms that God's people "limited the holy one of Israel." It might be that they did this by their disobedience, in that they did not plant and water the seeds. The seeds will not return void if they are planted and watered: God makes them grow. But if they are never planted; or are never watered: how can they grow?

Would agree on the planting but even this God has done: Isaiah 61:3
To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the Lord, that he might be glorified.

Does the Father speak to the Son who abides forever...with the same voice spoken over the moneychangers and usury? Is this the Father to a Son? Romans 8:1-2 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [2] For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
 

justbyfaith

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We are instructed to put off the former conversation...yet time and time again return to those parables and turn them into “works” with the same condemnation He came to triumph over...having spoiled ...He made a show of the openly overcoming the ministration of Death.

We evangelize people out of love for them and out of the obedience of faith.

Such works are not salvational (to us) by any means....but they are salvational to the people being evangelized, who will receive gospel salvation as a free gift. We put in the work because we have been saved and desire that others might partake of the same blessing that we have...and also dwell with us in heaven for all of eternity as brothers and sisters adopted and begotten into the family.
 
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justbyfaith

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Does the Father speak to the Son who abodes forever...with the same voice spoken over the moneychangers and usury?
Jesus speaks it over those slothful and disobedient servants who claim to have Him in their hearts but have not lived according to His love.
 

VictoryinJesus

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Jesus speaks it over those slothful and disobedient servants who claim to have Him in their hearts but have not lived according to His love.

Disobedience unto death
OR obedience unto righteousness...two different ministrations...you can’t take “obedience unto righteousness” in Philippians 1:11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.
And put it under the voice of condemnation “disobedience unto death”...in you cannot take Life and put it under the same voice of condemnation and death. Death does not rule over Life. It looks good in changing the moneychangers to gift-exchangers ...but the voice is not the same one of death and condemnation. Performance based.

2 Corinthians 9:9-11 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever. [10] Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness [11] Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.
^Not beat the servants...
 

VictoryinJesus

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Obviously, those who are obedient cannot also be disobedient.

Neglecting the parable was spoken to condemn an action ...but it suits the ego to keep the same voice of performance based over spiritual gifts rather than God based over that which is Spirit and of Him. The evil and bondage of vanity and corruption He came to overthrow as those overthrown selling and exchanging of money who turned His House of prayer into a den of thieves. Natural man or Spirit ...their Lord is not the same. You can not serve two masters. In the parable man has made himself Lord ...does Life bow to man as master and Lord or to God as LORD over all things ...even the seed sown, the bread, and the increase given. Natural man hates the one who didn’t increase but instead hid it: laid up in a napkin or buried it in the ground...God increases this man so that no man can say the power is of man but the Power has to be of God. That is offensive to “performance based.” Of the Pharisees. Man loves the performance based notion of the parables ...Hates that it comes only from God when He chooses to give the increase. First we are told...it must be buried...in take up your cross and follow Me and a seed must die and go into the ground and die or it abides alone ...it cannot yield fruit until it dies.
 
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justbyfaith

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Natural man hates the one who didn’t increase but instead hid it: laid up in a napkin or buried it in the ground...God increases this man so that no man can say the power is of man but the Power has to be of God.

In the parable the man who lays up his talent in a napkin and buries it is cast into outer darkness.

That is offensive to “performance based.” Of the Pharisees. Man loves the performance based notion of the parables ...Hates that it comes only from God when He chooses to give the increase. First we are told...it must be buried...in take up your cross and follow Me and a seed must die and go into the ground and die or it abides alone ...it cannot yield fruit until it dies.

A seed is not the same thing as a talent laid up in a napkin. A piece of money is not going to turn into a plant if you bury it.
 

VictoryinJesus

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In the parable the man who lays up his talent in a napkin and buries it is cast into outer darkness.

A seed is not the same thing as a talent laid up in a napkin. A piece of money is not going to turn into a plant if you bury it.

“A piece of money is not going to turn into a plant if you bury it” exactly. But a body buried and dead ...plucked up and planted of God... passing from death into resurrected Life ...can turn into a plant “planted” of the Lord in “My sheep hear My voice” and “follow” to death unto resurrection Life.

Luke 6:33-34 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. [34] And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.

Matthew 25:27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.

Psalm 15:5 He that putteth not out his money to usury, nor taketh reward against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

Would comment on the outer darkness but why ...when it is believed the Lord who commanded the money be put to usury and increased for gain, the Lord over mammon and its increase is the same over Spiritual gifts and Is performance based? Man will believe whatever His heart desires...
 
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Giuliano

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And the Lord takes from those who have not and gives to those who have?
I think it's because those who have have shown they know the value of what they were given. Those who were given a little and didn't do anything with it lose what little they had.
 

Mal'ak

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Sadly,*Insert sarcasm* your conclusion here is untenable.
You are conflating salvation with rewards and that isn't supportable, either by scripture or logic.
When a person runs a race, they win by crossing the line first. That is the thing or event that 'wins' the race for them. The reward for it is often a medal, or money or acclaim.
Likewise, salvation, we are told, is when our souls are reunited to God, rescued from the dominion of darkness. And it is a race that is won for us by grace; by Christ's work alone. It is not us who crossed the finish line.
However, Paul tells us that while Christ imputes that victorious win to us, through grace, there are certain rewards coming to us if we walk in faith and righteousness. What might these be and how do we view them? These are things granted to us in heaven, or probably more accuately the new earth. The Parable of the Talents in Matt 25 is a good example; good and faithful servants of Christ will be granted rewards in the new age. Rewards that will likely involve stewardship over God's new creation. It is these things that we strive for in our Christian lives. To please our heavenly father and earn rewards that will satisfy us and glorify him.
However, there is absolutely nothing in scripture that tells us that these 'works' can earn us what grace freely gives. In fact the opposite is true. Paul tells us that should we attempt to earn salvation via works, we had better make sure ALL our works are 100% perfect, because those are the only works God will accept. That is WHY it had to be Christ and his work on the cross. That is why grace has to be free...because we can never earn it, our works are as filthy rags in his eyes. It's only 'in Christ' that his work becomes ours and we are saved.
That is the gospel and any other is preaching salvation by works and is a false one of heresy.

Entire point of what Paul was saying, is that we should not boast, that we need God's grace to be saved as we are only human and can not do it alone. Because as Jesus said with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible. But you use the talents of Matthew 25, but ignore the last half of the parable that talks about the servant that does no works with the 1 talent and the Master returns and takes his talent away and tosses him into outer darkness. James tells us faith without works is dead. You should also read the parable of the sower, of people that hear the truth with the gift of faith but reject it because they chose this life over God. There are many examples of works earn salvation but it is ignored with all the defending of a tradition of man out of fear because Christians rather live a lie of "once saved always saved even if I rape and murder 5 million people", because they do not trust God or believe in themselves that they can get to Heaven without a free lazy pass.

If someone knows they lack works and are not living righteously to the point the create a false doctrine to ease their fears of what awaits them, then they already know their fate and where they are going but God will not intervene. This life is a test, a trial of our faith, and narrow is the way. There is no test to be given a free gift, then sit watch tv until you die. Nonsense born of people knowing the fate that awaits them and it scares them.
 

VictoryinJesus

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last half of the parable that talks about the servant that does no works

Hebrews 4:10-12 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. [12] For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.


He who is entered in has ceased from his own works...labour therefore (work out your own Salvation and entering in with trembling) lest you fall short of entering into “ceased from his own works” ...read on another thread ceasing from works is not yet...but man is to work...then no cross has been lifted and no following of Him ...into that Rest God said one MUST enter into ...do you recommend not entering into God’s rest and “he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from His.”??
 

VictoryinJesus

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Entire point of what Paul was saying, is that we should not boast, that we need God's grace to be saved as we are only human and can not do it alone. Because as Jesus said with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible. But you use the talents of Matthew 25, but ignore the last half of the parable that talks about the servant that does no works with the 1 talent and the Master returns and takes his talent away and tosses him into outer darkness. James tells us faith without works is dead. You should also read the parable of the sower, of people that hear the truth with the gift of faith but reject it because they chose this life over God. There are many examples of works earn salvation but it is ignored with all the defending of a tradition of man out of fear because Christians rather live a lie of "once saved always saved even if I rape and murder 5 million people", because they do not trust God or believe in themselves that they can get to Heaven without a free lazy pass.

If someone knows they lack works and are not living righteously to the point the create a false doctrine to ease their fears of what awaits them, then they already know their fate and where they are going but God will not intervene. This life is a test, a trial of our faith, and narrow is the way. There is no test to be given a free gift, then sit watch tv until you die. Nonsense born of people knowing the fate that awaits them and it scares them.

Fruit of the Spirit...Whose works are they?? Whose attributes are they?
Galatians 5:22-26 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. [24] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. [25] If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. [26] Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Discern ...What is born of man’s work and what is born of the work of God? James 3:14-18 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. [15] This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish. [16] For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work. [17] But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. [18] And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
 

justbyfaith

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There is no test to be given a free gift, then sit watch tv until you die.

According to Romans 5:15-19, esp. v. 17 and v.19, the free gift being offered is righteousness.

Real righteousness, by nature, is practical and imparted (1 John 3:7, Matthew 5:6, Romans 5:19).

So then, if someone has been given righteousness as a free gift, they are not going to watch tv until they die (although watching television is not necessarily the sin unto death).

Salvation is defined by the following verses:

Eze 36:25, Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26, A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27, And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
 
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Mal'ak

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Hebrews 4:10-12 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. [12] For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Hebrews 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

The problem with "just believe" doctrine is you need to cherry pick, if you read the context of the verses you would see verse one starts off with "A promise left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it...let us labour therefore to enter into that rest". I do not see the confusion, there is no works in "his rest", but that is the promise left us which is eternal life not being Christians. When we are in eternity there is no works, but as Paul says here "fear, lest...any of you should seem to come short of it". If you can fall short because you did not labour to enter rest, then it is not a free gift of grace but earned by your "LABOUR"

Fruit of the Spirit...Whose works are they?? Whose attributes are they?
Galatians 5:22-26 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. [24] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. [25] If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. [26] Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Discern ...What is born of man’s work and what is born of the work of God? James 3:14-18 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. [15] This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish. [16] For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work. [17] But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. [18] And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

1 Corinthians 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

Fruits of the spirit is our works, as you stated in the scripture you posted "let us also walk in the Spirit". No where does it say "God puppet controls us to walk in the Spirit", we are being told in Galatians to act righteously and that is a free will choice of us to do good or do evil. Even as Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13, we can do all the works in the world but if it is not done with love then it is void. Not that works are void, but works done with an evil heart or selfish intentions. You are reading scripture but your flesh mind is blocking the Holy Spirit to allow your eyes be opened to the truth, because you are so obsessed about being right and making sure your tradition of man is true. Read the Scripture and see anywhere if it is said "God will force you to be filled with love so you can go to Heaven", you will not find it, as Galatians and every where else is giving warnings of how we need to act so we can go to Heaven.

According to Romans 5:15-19, esp. v. 17 and v.19, the free gift being offered is righteousness.

Real righteousness, by nature, is practical and imparted (1 John 3:7, Matthew 5:6, Romans 5:19).

So then, if someone has been given righteousness as a free gift, they are not going to watch tv until they die (although watching television is not necessarily the sin unto death).

Salvation is defined by the following verses:

Eze 36:25, Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26, A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27, And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Again, not reading the context and cherry picking without knowledge of the Word of God, as the subject of Romans 5 was the gift of forgiveness not of righteousness. We are made Righteous by the gift of Jesus' sacrifice because our sins are cleaned, but we still need to do the work to "repent" and even after we repent there are conditions.

"Repent" Greek/G3340- to think differently or afterwards, i.e. reconsider

Which means for us to be forgiven we need to change our ways and think differently after we repent; if you steal then repent, but ten minutes later you steal again did you really repent or say some words to ease your conscious?

Matthew 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Again another condition for the gift of forgiveness, we need to DO something to get forgiven, which is forgiving others for their sins against us. If we do not do the WORK of forgiving others by OUR free will choice then God will NOT forgive us and without forgiveness we will go to Hell as corruption can not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

As to your Eze 36 that was taken out of context of the entire Bible, as we are told by John we all sin and if you say you are not a sinner then you are calling God a liar. If God will literally "cause you to walk in [his] statutes", then how is it we still sin, why do we need to repent, and why was Jesus' death needed to forgive us? You really think God wants to spend eternity with some robots he needs to mind control for them to be good? He could just make spiritual beings with no free will to spend eternity with him, if he was lonely and just wanted a robot friend to keep him company. God opens our eyes to HOW to be righteous by his Word, but it is our choice as we have free will.

Revelation 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Revelation 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

"...hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God"

Job 1:8 And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

Job 1:9 Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?

Job 1:10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.

Job 1:11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.

Job 1:12 And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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When we are in eternity there is no works,

Eternal Life begins today! John 8:51-52
[51] Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. [52] Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.

John 11:25-26 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: [26] And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

So there is no entering in until when?

Fruits of the spirit is our works, as you stated in the scripture you posted "let us also walk in the Spirit"

Fruit of the Spirit IS not the works of the natural man. But that which is born of the Spirit of God. Walk in the flesh...our own works=death.

Walk in the Spirit...bear Spiritual fruit (given from above)unto God=Life. Where the Spirit of God is ...there is Life. Where there is no Spirit of God ...there is no Life.


ven as Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13, we can do all the works in the world but if it is not done with love then it is void. Not that works are void, but works done with an evil heart or selfish intentions.
without the Spirit of God ...it is void...vain...unprofitable...comes to nothing. He is charity. Even says this in James. James 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works (of God)is dead also.
Vain faith. Faith minus the resurrection power of the Spirit.

As far as entering into His Rest...then what did Jesus Christ mean when He said to take up the cross and follow Him?
To enter in? Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Ceased from his own works...he who looses his life will find Life. Luke 17:32-33 Remember Lot's wife. [33] Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

Ceased from his own works: 2 Corinthians 5:14-15 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: [15] And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Enter into His rest and ceased from his own (dead)works unto death...to serve the living God and bear spiritual fruit unto Life. Hebrews 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

How do you pull out of the Word that Spiritual fruit is man’s works???? And not God’s work? Prepared before the foundation of the world that we should walk in the good works of walking in the Spirit of God....even going as far as in the OT saying God sets the children in the resurrection power of His steps...
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

^sure sounds like Paul entered into God’s Rest and ceased from his own works...to live from there forth, not unto himself but unto Him which died and rose again.
 
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Nancy

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So, some think that those who do not believe in a Pre-Trib Rapture will be punished?? Wow..that's so off base I cannot even believe those who DO expect this to happen think they are special in some way. Do you not trust God to protect His own during these terrible times?? I can go only so far as Mid-Trib if any at all. I believed this for decades and learned different from much study. What happens if the pre trib rapture does NOT take place? Anyone you might have told about this pre trib rapture will think your God is a liar and will take the mark. Not to mention the Christians who have believed and waited for something that might not happen, what will happen to their faith?? Can we not understand that we need to be PREPARED if it does NOT happen? Are you that SURE? I was, but then there was definitely an aspect of WANTING to believe it...oh yay, I don't have to trust God through these terrible times as, I will just be whisked away into heaven. If you are wrong and are teaching this to everybody who will listen, you will be held accountable. Our beliefs do not get us to heaven...it is faith and trust and obedience to the Living God that will do that.
I am not criticizing your beliefs but, don't be so set in stone with it! Why can we not leave it open and be prepared either way?
 

justbyfaith

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If you can fall short because you did not labour to enter rest, then it is not a free gift of grace but earned by your "LABOUR"

Scripture is clear that salvation is a free gift (Romans 5:15-19). The labour involved would be the work that you have to put in to understanding the gospel and sifting out the truth away from false doctrines that compete with the truth of the gospel. In some cases, all the labour is done by the minister (if the minister is faithful); but as those who are hearing the gospel, we are also called to be Bereans (Acts of the Apostles 17:10-11). Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of the Lord (Romans 10:17). Sometimes, in order to hear the message properly, we need to study to show ourselves approved: this does not only apply to the minister but to the hearer as we take up the Berean call.

Read the Scripture and see anywhere if it is said "God will force you to be filled with love so you can go to Heaven", you will not find it, as Galatians and every where else is giving warnings of how we need to act so we can go to Heaven.

It is certainly not done by force; but when you put your faith in Him, you will receive the Spirit (Galatians 3:14); and the love of God will be shed abroad in your heart via the Spirit (Romans 5:5).

Again, not reading the context and cherry picking without knowledge of the Word of God,

There is certainly a seed capable of sprouting into a plant, inside of every cherry.

as the subject of Romans 5 was the gift of forgiveness not of righteousness.

See Romans 5:17. It is the gift of righteousness that is given.

Matthew 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Again another condition for the gift of forgiveness, we need to DO something to get forgiven, which is forgiving others for their sins against us. If we do not do the WORK of forgiving others by OUR free will choice then God will NOT forgive us and without forgiveness we will go to Hell as corruption can not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

Forgiving other people is not a work but an attitude produced by the Holy Spirit.

As to your Eze 36 that was taken out of context of the entire Bible,

Now every Bible passage stands on its own as a bastion of biblical truth. You cannot just discount it saying that it is out of context. Context never nullifies the plain message of any singular Bible passage; and this is a sound principle of Bible hermeneutics.

as we are told by John we all sin and if you say you are not a sinner then you are calling God a liar.

I gather you are speaking of 1 John 1:8? No, it does not say that. It says, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

This is referring to the element of indwelling sin. It is not saying that we are calling God a liar if we say that we don't practice sin; otherwise 1 John 3:5-9 is invalid as scriptural truth. We all have the element of sin dwelling within us; but this element can be rendered dead (Galatians 5:24, Romans 6:6, Romans 7:8) so that it has no authority over our behaviour. Therefore, we can walk in freedom and victory over sin; and Ezekiel 36:25-27 is therefore not as invalid as you think it is.

Eternal Life begins today!

Yes; John 5:24 teaches us that when we hear Jesus' words and believe on Him who sent Him, we have passed from death into everlasting life; and also shall not come into condemnation.

How do you pull out of the Word that Spiritual fruit is man’s works????

The fruit of the Spirit is love (Galatians 5:22-23) and love is not in word or in tongue only, but in deed and in truth (1 John 3:17-18).

See also Titus 3:14.

oh yay, I don't have to trust God through these terrible times as, I will just be whisked away into heaven. If you are wrong and are teaching this to everybody who will listen, you will be held accountable.

It has been said that we ought to pray for pre- and prepare for post-.

It seems to me that at the very least our Lord Jesus exhorts us to pray for pre- in Luke 21:36.

And He also promises a pre-tribulation rapture to those who overcome in Philadlephia (Revelation 3:10); while He warns that those who mess up in Thyatira will definitely go through the Great Trib (Revelation 2:22).
 
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VictoryinJesus

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The fruit of the Spirit is love (Galatians 5:22-23) and love is not in word or in tongue only, but in deed and in truth (1 John 3:17-18).

See also Titus 3:14.

Agree. Never meant to imply there are no deeds in Love. Only meant less of us and more of Him. Considering Saul and Paul...(imo) through the power of Spirit given for edification and not destruction; he did more, not less. In: “For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. [20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.” Galatians 2:19-20
 

Naomi25

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Sounds as if you have it all worked out,one of many problems I find with this being the Lord I know is would the Christ advise me to gain usury for what He’s given me

Deuteronomy 23:19 KJV
[19] Thou shalt not lend upon usury to thy brother; usury of money, usury of victuals, usury of any thing that is lent upon usury:


Tecarta Bible

That might be your problem. The parables are not about loaning money at high rates. The 'talents' or 'minas' are symbols for the gifts or abilities God has given us (1 Cor 12:4-7). The circumstances he has places us in (Eph 2:10). The parable discusses how different people work within those parameters; some take these things and work for the Kingdom, and others take what they have been given and squander them for greedy or selfish reasons.
So, it's got nothing to do with usury.
 

Naomi25

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Glad to hear you say so. Some people worry me. I had a sister with that attitude. A few years later, she had changed her mind; and I was so happy.
I just came across a quote I thought perfect for this topic!
"Genuine freedom liberates believers to do what is good. Those who use freedom as license for evil reveal that they are not truly free since a life of wickedness is the very definition of slavery" - Dr Tom Schreiner on 1 Pet 2:16
 
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