Wormwood

Stan B said:

Who he is, is very simply stated in the passage. He is the anti-christ, the prince of the people who destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD.

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So, you don't see any other player on stage, WHO was the MAIN CHARACTER of that prophecy???

Might I remind you of Whom the OT scriptures were written about?
John 5[39] Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
I am giving you a chance to reconsider, even though in YOUR mind you are opossed to it, but you don't know why.

Correction:
the MAIN CHARACTER of that 70 week prophecy

Earburner said:

So, you don't see any other player on stage, WHO was the MAIN CHARACTER of that prophecy???

Might I remind you of Whom the OT scriptures were written about?
John 5[39] Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
I am giving you a chance to reconsider, even though in YOUR mind you are opossed to it, but you don't know why.

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Another attempt to misunderstand and misapply Scripture. While the OT certainly testifies of Christ, it also includes prophecies regarding the Antichrist. And even though Daniel's prophecy of seventy weeks of years points to the ultimate victory of God and Christ, it very clearly shows the reign of the Antichrist during the future 70th week of Daniel.

Enoch111 said:

Another attempt to misunderstand and misapply Scripture. While the OT certainly testifies of Christ, it also includes prophecies regarding the Antichrist. And even though Daniel's prophecy of seventy weeks of years points to the ultimate victory of God and Christ, it very clearly shows the reign of the Antichrist during the future 70th week of Daniel.

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Nope! It does not show the reign of that religiously concocted fabrication, of a fictional one man band, miracle man, that "churchianity" loves to call "THE Antichrist" . In the KJV, you will never find those words. However, in most all of the corrupted new modern versions (Westcott & Hort), the words have been manipulated to describe their pet theory.
Why??
Ans. The 70th week was fulfilled by Jesus!!
Therefore, there is nothing of a week left over, to attach onto the end days.
You all have no idea how far off track you really are.

But, since none of you are convinced of what I say, lets go to KJV-Daniel 9:24 and understand WHY there was even a 70 week prophecy in the first place, and the 6 items of what God wanted to accomplish.
[24] Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,
1. to finish the transgression, and
2. to make an end of sins, and
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity, and
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness, and
5. to seal up the vision and prophecy, and
6. to anoint the most Holy.
Hmmm... were the 6 items above accomplished by Jesus?
YES, they were!
But some how, you all want to make the Roman Titus and/or some future, ficticious "THE Antichrist"
the main character? Really? You all should be ashamed for following and believing false teachers!!

Now, from the KJV only, here is a simple question that all of you should be able to answer, that is if you can be honest with yourself:
Who really caused the temple sacrifices and oblation to cease?
1. Titus of Rome
2. Some future "THE" Antichrist.
3. The sacrificial Blood of Jesus.
Dan. 9[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,..
.
Before you answer, did you forget this scripture:
Mark 15[37] And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
[38] And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.
Why was there a veil in the temple?

Bobby Jo said:

Hi Stan B
A LOT of people are satisfied with their "comfort zone". It doesn't make it correct, -- but they are "satisfied".

Now to be CORRECT, one might ask a SIMPLE question:

What Scriptural precedent or Society purchases a pair of shoes for "seven and sixty-two" dollars?
Sixty-nine? -- Certainly! Four score and ten; a mile and a quarter; a dozen and a half? -- Yep! But there is NO Scriptural precedent or any Society which accounts numbers typical of "seven and sixty-two".​

Sir Isaac Newton’s DANIEL AND THE APOCALYPSE
by Sir William Whitla, London, 1922, Chapt. X, p. 281
Daniel and the Apocalypse

We avoid also the doing violence to the language of Daniel, by taking the seven weeks and sixty two weeks for one number. Had that been Daniel’s meaning, he would have said sixty and nine weeks, and not seven weeks and sixty two weeks, a way of numbering used by no nation.​

Now the RSV and a handful of other translations get it right, but I'll bet your translation has a False "JESUS FULFILLMENT" agenda in which Scripture is twisted to achieve their "FULFILLMENT".

Dan. 9:25 Know therefore and understand that from the going forth of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off, and shall have nothing ...​

... for what you see in TRUTH is TWO anointed ones/messiahs (small "a"/"m") versus the ONE Jesus.


But don't worry about the TRUTH, because it's more important to be "satisfied" ...
Bobby Jo


PS
It's not just the "seven and sixty-two", it's a HOST of departures (maybe a dozen) from Scripture and History.

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I don't have the remotest clue as to what you are talking about.

Stan B said:

I don't have the remotest clue as to what you are talking about.

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Stan, this should be a Yes or No answer:

Earburner said:

[24] Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,
1. to finish the transgression, and
2. to make an end of sins, and
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity, and
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness, and
5. to seal up the vision and prophecy, and
6. to anoint the most Holy.
Hmmm... were the 6 items above accomplished by Jesus?

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...If your answer is Yes, good, because Jesus has indeed accomplished all that. Moreover, it means that those who do not believe that Jesus accomplished all that...have made up their own doctrine that says He did not and will do it in the future. These are those of unbelief.

Did Jesus accomplish it all, Yes, or No?

ScottA said:

Stan, this should be a Yes or No answer:


...If your answer is Yes, good, because Jesus has indeed accomplished all that. Moreover, it means that those who do not believe that Jesus accomplished all that...have made up their own doctrine that says He did not and will do it in the future. These are those of unbelief.

Did Jesus accomplish it all, Yes, or No?

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No!

Stan B said:

No!

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So...explain yourself. Which of these 6 things did Jesus not accomplish already?

1. to finish the transgression, and
2. to make an end of sins, and
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity, and
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness, and
5. to seal up the vision and prophecy, and
6. to anoint the most Holy.

ScottA said:

Stan, this should be a Yes or No answer:


...If your answer is Yes, good, because Jesus has indeed accomplished all that. Moreover, it means that those who do not believe that Jesus accomplished all that...have made up their own doctrine that says He did not and will do it in the future. These are those of unbelief.

Did Jesus accomplish it all, Yes, or No?

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Yes! Of course He did!!
The purpose of my questions about the 70 weeks, is to reveal the Main Character, who is Jesus, and not Titus the Roman or some futuristic, fictitious wannabe, that churchianity loves to call "THE Antichrist to come.

Stan is confused! He only knows what his Religion tells him.

ScottA said:

So...explain yourself. Which of these 6 things did Jesus not accomplish already?

1. to finish the transgression, and
2. to make an end of sins, and
3. to make reconciliation for iniquity, and
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness, and
5. to seal up the vision and prophecy, and
6. to anoint the most Holy.

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Sadly, Jesus was not responsible to complete the first two on the list above, as Jerusalem and Daniels' people where given 490 years to stop their idolatrous behaviour. When Christ was asked how many times should a man forgive his brother, He responded 490 times. After the 490 years had passed, then Christ completed the list from 3 to 6. In completing this list the process for the reconciliation for iniquity was changed forever such that everlasting righteousness was then possible.

We do love lists, but we tend to run lists together as ScottA has done above and therefore create confusion in what is being conveyed in the scripture.

Shalom

Stan B said:

... the Book of Revelation which reiterates the 7 years if the Tribulation over and over.

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Stan B said:

I don't have the remotest clue as to what you are talking about.

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Understandable! What's happening is that you've accepted the lies from the pulpit, specifically that there's a 7-year-tribulation. This premise is founded from a misinterpretation of the Daniel 9 seventy-weeks seventieth-week, as I've partially expounded on as being FALSE.

Furthermore, what you ascribe to multiple citations of a 7-year tribulation in Revelation is just the opposite. Certainly there are:

... however Rev. 13:5 specifically describes the duration of the a/c as 42 MONTHS.

If you can cite a 7-year tribulation reference from the Book of Revelation, please provide it.

Note: As provided previously, the purported "seventieth week" of Daniel 9 has NOTHING to do with the Tribulation, except that the destroyer "shall come" after the seventieth week, -- some 18 years after the seventieth week ...

Bobby Jo

Bobby Jo said:

Understandable! What's happening is that you've accepted the lies from the pulpit, specifically that there's a 7-year-tribulation.

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Whether one calls it a *7-year-tribulation* or a period of seven years which includes the Tribulation and Great Tribulation, there is absolutely no question that there will be a future seven-year period which will include 3 1/2 years of the reign of the Antichrist. Revelation 13 fits right into this period, since 42 months are assigned to Satan and the Antichrist to take absolute control of the world's inhabitants. This can only happen in the future when the Holy Spirit is *taken out of the way* as the Restrainer of Satan.

And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.(Rev 13:5)

So in this case you are the one promoting the lie that there is no such future period.

Enoch111 said:

... even though Daniel's prophecy of seventy weeks of years ...

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9:2 says "years"; 9:24-27 are NOT WEEKS.

The "year" is analogous to a "car"
YOU cite the "week", which we'll call analogous to a "truck"
The SCRIPTURES render the "week" as actually a "vehicle".

Thus in analogy, there are seventy "vehicles", 69 of which are "cars"/(years) and one of which is a "truck"(a week of years):




Because the evidence contradicts all the lies we've been told, and believed, -- DON'T BELIEVE THE TRUTH. Simply continue to believe the lies so that you don't become confused.
Bobby Jo

Bobby Jo said:

9:2 says "years"; 9:24-27 are NOT WEEKS.

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You have no clue about this matter. It would be safer for you to drop it.

Enoch111 said:

You have no clue about this matter. It would be safer for you to drop it.

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Why do you prove me right? I warned you not to believe Scripture. Stick with the lies you're comfortable with. It'll keep your head from hurting.

Bobby Jo

Jay Ross said:

Sadly, Jesus was not responsible to complete the first two on the list above, as Jerusalem and Daniels' people where given 490 years to stop their idolatrous behaviour. When Christ was asked how many times should a man forgive his brother, He responded 490 times. After the 490 years had passed, then Christ completed the list from 3 to 6. In completing this list the process for the reconciliation for iniquity was changed forever such that everlasting righteousness was then possible.

We do love lists, but we tend to run lists together as ScottA has done above and therefore create confusion in what is being conveyed in the scripture.

Shalom

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Hmmm... that may sound to be so for item #1, because that is what Daniel and the 2300 days was all about, being that prophecy for the end of the transgression and when the transgressors were to become full. Dan. 8:14-23
However, that final transgression against the "temple building of God" did not take place until Antiochus Epiphanes, in approx. 160-163 BC.
"In the latter time of their kingdom" of Greece (the 3rd beast), in type, Antiochus E. committed the act of "abomination of desolation" against the "temple building of God", but was cleansed and restored by Judas Maccabeus.

So now, I place before you that which will really test your spiritual understanding, if you can endure it:
In anti-type, Is that not what happened to Jesus and the "temple of His body"? Wasn't His temple body filled with the fulness of God, being himself "the Living temple of God", and was desolated/destroyed on the Cross, but then was restored/resurrected? John 2:19-22.
I do believe it was! Therefore His sacrifice made an end of all transgressions against God- He took away the sins of the world!!

As for #2, I disagree with your conclusion.
Jesus did "make an end of sins".
The Holy Spirit through John the Baptist, said this about Jesus: "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away (removes) the sin of the world". John 1:29
In God the Father's Eyes, through the sacrifice of Jesus, all who of faith in Christ Jesus, God the Father cannot see their sins.

Earburner said:

Hmmm... that may sound to be so for item #1, because that is what Daniel and the 2300 days was all about, being that prophecy for the end of the transgression and when the transgressors were to become full. Dan. 8:14-23
However, that final transgression against the "temple building of God" did not take place until Antiochus Epiphanes, in approx. 160-163 BC.
"In the latter time of their kingdom" of Greece (the 3rd beast), in type, Antiochus E. committed the act of "abomination of desolation" against the "temple building of God", but was cleansed and restored by Judas Maccabeus.

So now, I place before you that which will really test your spiritual understanding, if you can endure it:
In anti-type, Is that not what happened to Jesus and the "temple of His body"? Wasn't His temple body filled with the fulness of God, being himself "the Living temple of God", and was desolated/destroyed on the Cross, but then was restored/resurrected? John 2:19-22.
I do believe it was! Therefore His sacrifice made an end of all transgressions against God- He took away the sins of the world!!

As for #2, I disagree with your conclusion.
Jesus did "make an end of sins".
The Holy Spirit through John the Baptist, said this about Jesus: "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away (removes) the sin of the world". John 1:29
In God the Father's Eyes, through the sacrifice of Jesus, all who of faith in Christ Jesus, God the Father cannot see their sins.

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I will get back to you when you demonstrate a little more understanding.

Shalom

Jay Ross said:

Sadly, Jesus was not responsible to complete the first two on the list above, as Jerusalem and Daniels' people where given 490 years to stop their idolatrous behaviour. When Christ was asked how many times should a man forgive his brother, He responded 490 times. After the 490 years had passed, then Christ completed the list from 3 to 6. In completing this list the process for the reconciliation for iniquity was changed forever such that everlasting righteousness was then possible.

We do love lists, but we tend to run lists together as ScottA has done above and therefore create confusion in what is being conveyed in the scripture.

Shalom

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"Run lists together?" "Confusion?" Wishing to mock me, you mock the Word of God. The words were all directly from the scriptures, all fulfilled:

Daniel 9:24
"Seventy weeks are determined For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression, (fulfilled: Isaiah 53:8)
To make an end of sins, (fulfilled: Hebrews 9:26)
To make reconciliation for iniquity, (fulfilled: Romans 5:11)
To bring in everlasting righteousness, (fulfilled: 1 Corinthians 1:30)
To seal up vision and prophecy, (fulfilled: Luke 24:44)
And to anoint the Most Holy." (fulfilled: Acts 4:27)

No confusion, except in those who do not believe.