Interpretation Methods

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Anthony D'Arienzo

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Tony,
I spent 12 years being taught in the CoC that The Holy Spirit resided, and still resides, ONLY as words written (printed) on the pages of the Bible. I finally opened my eyes to God's everyday working in our lives through The Holy Spirit, and eventually started becoming of some use to God. Frankly, what you espouse is frighteningly close to what those "Modern Day Pharisees" peddled.
Willie

It is not about guided into truth.
It is about guided into ALL TRUTH.

JESUS PROMISED THAT THEY THE APOSTLES WOULD BGH E GUIDED INTO.ALL TRUTH.
 

Willie T

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Willie

It is not about guided into truth.
It is about guided into ALL TRUTH.

JESUS PROMISED THAT THEY THE APOSTLES WOULD BGH E GUIDED INTO.ALL TRUTH.
Oh Brother!
John,
My hat is off to you for how Christian-like you have dealt with this person for so long.
He is trying his pitiful best to preach at me for not including the word, "all", and he can't even spell "be" correctly.
Sir, you are indeed a Saint.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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Oh Brother!
John,
My hat is off to you for how Christian-like you have dealt with this person for so long.
He is trying his pitiful best to preach at me for not including the word, "all", and he can't even spell "be" correctly.
Sir, you are indeed a Saint.
If you could understand that the word all ,as.in all truth defines the issue.
You cannot grasp the concept evidently.
That explains why you hold the errors you do.
You are the kind of naive person JonC needs to believe his lies.
This phone adds letters when my fingers drag across the screen sometimes genius. You have a bias to begin with so I will leave you to your error.
JonC will continue to like your error so no need to worry.
 
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John Caldwell

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There are many things we need to move from.

Ad hominem, unsubstantiated accusations, accusi g the brethern, bringing the BB here....But the most important is disobedience to God.

We are commanded not to hold grudges, not to keep records of wrongs (real or imagined), to forgive....that is the issue here.

Even if I hated Calvinists (which I don't) I would never post it on a public forum. I think most realize this and see his claim for what it is.

@Anthony D'Arienzo invented that. I do not hold it against him, I just ask that he evidence the claim. He lied about his warnings and the comment about post 40 on the BB (both have been proven). Rather than providing anything to support his accusation he just beings additional disagreements from the BB here to cover his false accusation.

He is like the DNC right now - mahe an accusation and then try to prove it, shifting the narrative when proven false. That is dishonest.

But I forgive him. Like I said before, Christ died for me and I was a sinner. God commands me to forgive as I have forgiven. This us a mark of a Christian.

That said, @Anthony D'Arienzo seems bound in his hatred. He has followed me across this board continuing to accuse me of wrongs he believes I have done. I have tried being kind. I have tried ignoring him. I have tried simply asking that he evidence his accusation.

His sin is not against me but against God. I do not hold any ill feelings towards him for his abusive posts toards me. I have not slandered him (I have not posted @Anthony D'Arienzo inappropriate conduct from the BB here) and I will not. He and I are both stubborn but we are very different on this account - I believe God's commands are to be obeyed not only as commands but as marks of a believer.
 
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OzSpen

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I find a conceptual study of the Bible is important. In understanding "The Spiritual," there are layers to the Spiritual like layers in the Atmosphere. In interpreting the Bible, and understanding allegories, someone may need a Conceptual Study of the Bible. Without the Spirit of God, and a more conceptual study, someone may have a hard time understanding The Prophets and God for example.



Man is made in the image and Glory of God. That may be a particular concept with cause and effect to it. Given someone studied someone like Saint Patrick, Saint Patrick went into pagan Ireland. What were the pagans there doing and why, and how did Saint Patrick counter them? In answering these question, someone may need to understand the concept of "Man is made in the image and Glory of God." The Pagans would do things to put a man in a dishonorable or sexually submissive position in a way to bring shame and dishonor "man made in the image and glory of God." That would be demonic.

News Article: Hofstra Fraternity Accused of Sickening Hazing Rituals.

In the news article, what is going on, and why would someone do that to another man? With an understanding of the concept of "Man is made in the image and Glory of God" without knowing anything other than what was provided in the article, I would postulate with God that there were, or have been Satanists and demonically possessed people associated with said fraternity, and am probably right. They seemed to be doing very specific things to "shame and dishonor" man made in the image and Glory of God.

Eye of the Needle.

What does it mean to go through the Eye of the Needle? Joseph and Daniel were both made slaves, and lost everything they had. They had nothing. They had to learn to lean on God. Joseph and Daniel had nothing, they learn to lean on God, and God built them back up. We read the New Testament from an Old Testament Understanding. An understanding of The Prophets is important.

Prophets and God and Allegories

The Question: Dwelling on The Law of the Lord, why did the Prophets do some of the things they did?

Related: "Applying Allegorical Interpretation of The Bible - Living Dead"

The Prophets in the Old Testament, working for God, did somethings that their contemporaries may have seen as odd.

- Ezekiel laid on his side for 390 days to simulate the siege of Jerusalem. (Ezekiel 4)

- Isaiah walked three years naked. (Isaiah 20)

- Jeremiah walked with an Ox Yoke. (Jeremiah 27)

- Breaks staffs over knees. (Zechariah 11)

In studying the Old Testament Prophets, God was instructing them to give allegories, and do specific things in front of people to be seen. Why?

Man is made in the image of God. What man does reflects. A man working in obedience to God, may be giving God authority on Earth to act, and/or setting something in the principalities.

In the Principalities or Spiritual there may have been specific things set. There may be laws. There are concepts, ideas, or things. Slavery, for example, may be a concept in the principalities. Slavery may be like a coin or it may have some Angel or being associated with it. This concept can be turned different ways. It doesn't matter how someone views the concept in terms of liking it or hating it. The concept is part of creation. Someone could be a slave to sin and their passions. There is Freedom in the Lord. Someone may be like a slave to a man as a private property. Someone on Probation, in Jail, on Welfare or unemployment, may be a slave to the State. Communism is a form of Slavery where man has no personal property, and whose person is owned by the State. Feminists used to call Christian marriage like Slavery. "50 Shades of Grey" came out with the lead male character named Christian. A man's heart may be chained to past loves in some sort of bondage. There is the song "Unchain my Heart." The concepts and ideas in the principalities are tied together or related. A man experiences Freedom in The Lord.

In the Principalities their are concepts or ideas. God may have a specific definition for a variety of things. God gives Ezekiel specific instructions in Ezekiel 4. Everything Ezekiel did may of had specific allegorical meaning as related to something in the spiritual. Man is made in the image of God or "our image." What man does may reflect.

Mankind as God's Vineyard
The Allegory of Mankind as God's Vineyard is used a number of times in the Bible. This is tied to the Ritual of Communion. Man would be like grapes in a vineyard. They are attached by The Spirit of God or vine. Christians are a Body of Christ. They are attached through the blood or the vine. Jesus is the vine, The Father the gardener.

(Isaiah 63:1-6)

(Luke 20:9-19)

(John 15:1-17)

God has had me use songs to display certain things for him. There is a song "Heard it Through the Grapevine." What does "Heard it Through the Grapevine" mean? On a physical level, it may mean that gossip is going up or down the grapevine and people are talking. On a Spiritual Level, someone may be standing in the Council of the Lord. It may mean he has ears to hear, and he is hearing what the Spirit is saying to the Churches. (Mark 4:9)(Revelation 2:29) God has had me give two songs for this. We have:

"Heard it Through The Grapevine"

and

"Private Eyes"

Somewhere I heard once that "The Eyes are mirrors into the soul." Working for God, that concept suddenly went off like a light in my head. Someone sees a prophet break a staff over his knee? He sees Jeremiah walking around with an Ox Yoke. The eyes have said to be mirrors into the soul. That is going down the grapevine? The last King of Judah had his children killed before him. He was blinded. (2 Kings 25:7)

I don't that the following song is right, but it did display the concept of Eyes being Mirrors into the soul towards some purpose.

"In and out of Love."

Theological or Spiritual Concepts that we went over:

Man is made in the image of God.

What man does is a reflection.

Man working in obedience to God giving authority to act.

Mankind as God's Vineyard.

Eyes are mirrors into the soul.



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John Caldwell

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Oh Brother!
John,
My hat is off to you for how Christian-like you have dealt with this person for so long.
He is trying his pitiful best to preach at me for not including the word, "all", and he can't even spell "be" correctly.
Sir, you are indeed a Saint.
Thanks. I think God have me Anthony to help me develop patience :) . I have dealt with him here far better than I have in the past.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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Can't we all just let it go... ? o_O
.
Open rebuke, is better than secret love.
It can be let go, but then it will continue to take place.
It needs to be resolved more than let go.
I forgave JonC 3 or 4 times for this same issue.
He thanked me for forgiving him, and yet he continues to work to undermine myself and others
 
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John Caldwell

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Oh ,you are so wonderful JonC. Anthony and all those Calvinist pastors you slandered have been such a trial .
No. I am not wonderful, Anthony. It is Christ in me. The "old man" in me would start posting links to abusive content you've offered. But Christ commands otherwise.

What pastor do you believe I slandered? (This is a new claim, btw).

I do not hate anyone regardless of their philosophy.

In fact, you did not invent the charge that I posted I hate Calvinists until your complaint that I identified with Calvinists was unproductive.

I hope this helps clarify things for you and perhaps loosen the hatred that seems to surround your interactions.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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No. I am not wonderful, Anthony. It is Christ in me. The "old man" in me would start posting links to abusive content you've offered. But Christ commands otherwise.

What pastor do you believe I slandered? (This is a new claim, btw).

I do not hate anyone regardless of their philosophy.

In fact, you did not invent the charge that I posted I hate Calvinists until your complaint that I identified with Calvinists was unproductive.

I hope this helps clarify things for you and perhaps loosen the hatred that seems to surtound your interactions.
JonC
Your shameful lies continue. You followed me to this board with an evil agenda. It is obvious .
You have come after me,and now you have my full attention.
Others know what I know about you. I am just more vocal.
Your insulting , condescending posts are going to stop.
Your abuse of the position of moderator is horrendous.
Several pastors have requested you step down.
We can see why. I did not create this mess, but intend to see it through.
Your online sins are not restricted to one board.
This is a pattern of sinful communication that you have.
It is not healthy. The things you accuse me of,are exactly what many have already spoke of as being true of you JonC.
Saying I do this does not change that many have seen these things in your conduct.
For this to go away you need to own it,and repent.
 
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DoveSpirit05

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I look at 1st in the bible weather the different styles of text are, historical narrative, commandments, poems psalms etc. I also look at the historical context, I look at both Hebrew and greek translations. I look at text commentary's and cross references, I look at wat other members of the body are saying, pastors, preachers. I then use induction, then logic given 2 me by God, then I listern 2 wat the holy spirit is saying!! then I come 2 my conclusion!!
 
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charity

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Paul said to Timothy:-
'But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose,
.. faith, longsuffering, charity, patience, persecutions, afflictions,
.... which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra;
...... what persecutions I endured:
........ but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
.......... Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
............ But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of,
.. knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
.... And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures,
...... which are able to make thee wise unto salvation
........ through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable
.. for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
.... That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.'

(2 Timothy 3:1-170)

Hello there,

The Bible is the most abused book in the world. In the hands of both scholars and laymen it has suffered the indignity of being used to support all manner of dogmas, beliefs and fancies.

Correct interpretation and Divine understanding is the need of all of us, isn't it? Is there some way of interpreting the Word of God so that human opinion is ruled out and Divine understanding given?’ I believe there is, I believe that God means what He says and has a meaning for everything He says in His Word. If this is not so, then all search is useless and we can never be sure of what He wishes to convey to us.

So, I believe that the Word of God should be taken literally: but that does not mean that figures of speech, symbols, allegory and type are to be ignored or taken literally. These are a study in themselves and need to be considered separately. However behind all figures of speech is 'literality', otherwise they could convey no certain meaning to us at all. The literal meaning of a word is the basic, customary meaning of that word, and therefore to interpret literally is nothing more or less than interpreting words in their normal customary and proper manner, and only in this way can divergences of opinion be eliminated, and the authority of Scripture honoured.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris
 

Jay Ross

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Hello

Have the two combatants above considered that God does not need us to defend His truth about the Mountains of Israel, i.e. Christ, and that any arguing about our understanding of what the Mountains of Israel represents, only muddies the waters for others who happen to stumble upon your questionable debate.

I have now gone into ignore mood with respect to either of your posts because of the hostility and face saving aspects of your respective posts.

Shalom

PS: As far as I am concerned, both of you need not post further because your respective witness in your posts is not backed up with your respective interactions between you both.
 

Preacher4Truth

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Yes brother you are posting direct truth here as you do.
It is very sad and almost unbelievable to see the lengths someone will go to cover sin.
I was re reading the wicked response in that thread. He had to work hard to make up the false scenarios saying I did not believe in the work of the Holy Spirit, and was probably not saved. The responses are typical of what he does post after post.
Many of the Cals protested, but the non cals shamefully turned a blind eye to it.
Rejoice brother that you've been appointed to such treatment!
 

John Caldwell

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I look at 1st in the bible weather the different styles of text are, historical narrative, commandments, poems psalms etc. I also look at the historical context, I look at both Hebrew and greek translations. I look at text commentary's and cross references, I look at wat other members of the body are saying, pastors, preachers. I then use induction, then logic given 2 me by God, then I listern 2 wat the holy spirit is saying!! then I come 2 my conclusion!!
I agree. We have to realize that Scripture is written in many forms.

When I teach I usually begin by asking people to read Scripture and form an opinion without commentary. Just read and pray. Then read to evaluate your conclusions. If you have cone up with a new interpretation that's a good sign it may be wrong. :)
 

John Caldwell

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Hello

Have the two combatants above considered that God does not need us to defend His truth about the Mountains of Israel, i.e. Christ, and that any arguing about our understanding of what the Mountains of Israel represents, only muddies the waters for others who happen to stumble upon your questionable debate.

I have now gone into ignore mood with respect to either of your posts because of the hostility and face saving aspects of your respective posts.

Shalom

PS: As far as I am concerned, both of you need not post further because your respective witness in your posts is not backed up with your respective interactions between you both.
I know what you mean, Jay.

Quite a few threads do not interest me. I just don't post on them. Others do interest me but I want to ignore a member. I like the ignore feature. But I have found, depending on the replies, it can leave a gap in the flow of the conversation. I have also responded to someone because I did not realize they were addressing a member I ignore.

But overall I think it is a good feature. I think I may start using it again.

My best advice, however, is to simply not respond to threads unless it is to address the OP. I think that eliminates many issues and helps not to contribute to the "problem".

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

Blessings