10 different NT warning-types against eternal security

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Davy

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You didn't answer my question. Why? Are you righteous?

Stranger

When I repent to Jesus, asking Him forgiveness of my slip ups, yes, I'm counted perfect through His Blood.

If I instead sin and go about my business as if I was already covered by my first believing on Jesus Christ, then no, I instead would be 'lawless', meaning subject to God's laws as a result of being haughty against repenting and asking Him forgiveness. This is what men's OSAS doctrines are designed to do, i.e., to bring the believer into lawlessness and unrepentance, becoming a reprobate.
 

justbyfaith

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When I repent to Jesus, asking Him forgiveness of my slip ups, yes, I'm counted perfect through His Blood.

If I instead sin and go about my business as if I was already covered by my first believing on Jesus Christ, then no, I instead would be 'lawless', meaning subject to God's laws as a result of being haughty against repenting and asking Him forgiveness. This is what men's OSAS doctrines are designed to do, i.e., to bring the believer into lawlessness and unrepentance, becoming a reprobate.
John 5:24, John 6:47, and John 10:27-30 are specific scriptures spoken by the Lord that speak to me of OSAS (more specifically, POTS).

So, you are saying that Jesus' words are designed to turn people into reprobates?
 

Stranger

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When I repent to Jesus, asking Him forgiveness of my slip ups, yes, I'm counted perfect through His Blood.

If I instead sin and go about my business as if I was already covered by my first believing on Jesus Christ, then no, I instead would be 'lawless', meaning subject to God's laws as a result of being haughty against repenting and asking Him forgiveness. This is what men's OSAS doctrines are designed to do, i.e., to bring the believer into lawlessness and unrepentance, becoming a reprobate.

You still avoided the question. Why are you righteous?

Stranger
 

Stranger

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It is Christ's---first imputed and then imparted to me, so that I own it personally.

If it is Christ's, then how is it yours. That you have been covered by it, yes. That it is yours...why?

What is your righteousness really look like?

Stranger
 

justbyfaith

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If it is Christ's, then how is it yours. That you have been covered by it, yes. That it is yours...why?

What is your righteousness really look like?

Stranger
Because I have received it and live by it.

See

1 John 3:7

1 John 3:3

1 John 2:6.
 

Stranger

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Because I have received it and live by it.

See

1 John 3:7

1 John 3:3

1 John 2:6.

That you have received it, that it is imputed to you, means it is not yours. It is yours by declaration, by imputation. It doesn't originate with you. Does that bother you?....that God does not find your righteousness good enough? I asked you what your righteousness really looks like and you avoided saying. But you know. It is as filthy rags. (Is. 64:6)

That is not your sins. That is your righteousness. Does that bother you?

Because we have been declared righteous by God through the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ, then we seek to walk by the Spirit of God. But we do not improve on the declared righteousness that was imputed to us. Neither do we take away from the imputed righteousness that was given us. It is not ours to maintain.

(1 John) is written to encourage fellowship with God and with the people of God. (1 John 1:3) It is written to believers. John draws stark divisions between sin and righteousness throughout the epistle. All for the purpose of encouraging abiding in Christ. (1 John 2:6, 3:6) He can say in one place that all believers sin. (1 John 1:8) Then in another place the believer does not sin. (1 John 3:9)

So, concerning (1 John 3:7) when the believer acts upon who He is as a child of God, his actions are a product of being declared righteous by God. That doesn't mean the believer evidences his own righteousness. He is evidencing that he has been declared righteous by God.

Your righteousness is as filthy rags. But you have been declared righteous by God. This imputed righteousness was not through any work, but through faith in Christ. You never measured up, and you never will measure up. Does that bother you? How about when you get to Heaven? You will be sinless. In the presence of God and Christ. Will all the good works you do throughout eternity, add anything to the imputed righteousness of Christ? Will you still need the imputed righteousness of Christ once in Heaven?

(Philippians 3:9) "And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith."

Stranger
 

Stranger

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When I repent to Jesus, asking Him forgiveness of my slip ups, yes, I'm counted perfect through His Blood.

If I instead sin and go about my business as if I was already covered by my first believing on Jesus Christ, then no, I instead would be 'lawless', meaning subject to God's laws as a result of being haughty against repenting and asking Him forgiveness. This is what men's OSAS doctrines are designed to do, i.e., to bring the believer into lawlessness and unrepentance, becoming a reprobate.

You still haven't answered my question. Why are you righteous?

Stranger
 

justbyfaith

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That you have received it, that it is imputed to you, means it is not yours. It is yours by declaration, by imputation. It doesn't originate with you. Does that bother you?....that God does not find your righteousness good enough?

That God has given it to me means that it belongs to me. I have received it; it is therefore mine. It has also not ceased from being His. Righteousness is not only imputed, it is also imparted (Matthew 5:6, Romans 5:19, 1 John 3:7).

I asked you what your righteousness really looks like and you avoided saying. But you know. It is as filthy rags. (Is. 64:6)

The righteousness which is of the Lord by faith (which is not only imputed but imparted) is defined as fine linen, clean and white, in Revelation 19:8.

That is not your sins. That is your righteousness. Does that bother you?

If your righteousness is as filthy rags then it ought to bother you, Romans 7:24.

He can say in one place that all believers sin. (1 John 1:8)

I contend that that is not the meaning of 1 John 1:8. For it declares that we all have sin (not that we all commit it). Sin is rendered dead within out mortal flesh when we are sanctified (Galatians 5:24, Romans 6:6, Romans 7:8); so that it no longer has any say over what we might do. We therefore can indeed walk in complete victory and freedom.

Your righteousness is as filthy rags.

If it were mine to begin with, you might have a point. But it began as Christ's.

You never measured up, and you never will measure up. Does that bother you?

It doesn't bother me because it simply isn't true of me; neither of anyone who surrenders to the work of sanctification in their lives (1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6; 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 (kjv), Hebrews 10:14, 1 John 3:9; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10).

It ought to bother you if it is true in your life. Paul taught that it ought to bother you (Romans 7:24).
 

Davy

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You still avoided the question. Why are you righteous?

Stranger

Sorry, I don't play games with Scripture. If you want to play 20 questions with God's Word, go find someone else, because I have given more than enough Scripture evidence to explain the subject we've been discussing. The "filthy rags" idea from Isaiah doesn't apply to what you're trying to establish, because that idea involves the fact that we can never... be perfect like Jesus Christ, and I established that fact early on. So all you're wanting to do now is preach around the bush instead of recognizing that for us to stay in Christ's grace we must still repent and ask forgiveness of future sin, just as Apostle John showed in 1 John 1.
 

justbyfaith

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because that idea involves the fact that we can never... be perfect like Jesus Christ, and I established that fact early on.

That is not an established fact; see 1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6; Hebrews 10:14, 1 John 3:9, 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10.
 

Stranger

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Sorry, I don't play games with Scripture. If you want to play 20 questions with God's Word, go find someone else, because I have given more than enough Scripture evidence to explain the subject we've been discussing. The "filthy rags" idea from Isaiah doesn't apply to what you're trying to establish, because that idea involves the fact that we can never... be perfect like Jesus Christ, and I established that fact early on. So all you're wanting to do now is preach around the bush instead of recognizing that for us to stay in Christ's grace we must still repent and ask forgiveness of future sin, just as Apostle John showed in 1 John 1.

Avoiding my question is playing games. You fear the answer.

Stranger
 

Stranger

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I answered your question very well in the above posts. You're just not willing to come to the truth in those Scriptures.

If you are alluding to your response in post #(303), as to why you are righteous, then you have the righteousness of the pharisee. Because that is all you have described. It is only obtained through your work.

If you obtained righteousness by faith, then you are declared righteous by God. (Imputation) If you obtained your righteousness by doing, then you exhibit your righteousness and not that which is imputed to you.

So why you are righteous? Because of your work? Or, because of your faith?

Stranger
 

justbyfaith

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If you obtained righteousness by faith, then you are declared righteous by God. (Imputation) If you obtained your righteousness by doing, then you exhibit your righteousness and not that which is imputed to you.

We obtain our righteousness by faith and it normally results in doing.

So why you are righteous? Because of your work? Or, because of your faith?

Because of my faith; and it results in work (James 2:14-26, Ephesians 2:8-10, Titus 3:14)
 

Stranger

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That God has given it to me means that it belongs to me. I have received it; it is therefore mine. It has also not ceased from being His. Righteousness is not only imputed, it is also imparted (Matthew 5:6, Romans 5:19, 1 John 3:7).



The righteousness which is of the Lord by faith (which is not only imputed but imparted) is defined as fine linen, clean and white, in Revelation 19:8.



If your righteousness is as filthy rags then it ought to bother you, Romans 7:24.



I contend that that is not the meaning of 1 John 1:8. For it declares that we all have sin (not that we all commit it). Sin is rendered dead within out mortal flesh when we are sanctified (Galatians 5:24, Romans 6:6, Romans 7:8); so that it no longer has any say over what we might do. We therefore can indeed walk in complete victory and freedom.



If it were mine to begin with, you might have a point. But it began as Christ's.



It doesn't bother me because it simply isn't true of me; neither of anyone who surrenders to the work of sanctification in their lives (1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6; 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 (kjv), Hebrews 10:14, 1 John 3:9; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10).

It ought to bother you if it is true in your life. Paul taught that it ought to bother you (Romans 7:24).

More false doctrine of your 'imparted' righteousness. I have explained your verses several times already. Even in the verse you use, (Rom. 5:19), Paul is clear as to whose obedience is required that results in the imputation of righteousness. "By the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." But of course you say differently. You say by Christ and your obedience are you made righteous.

Yes, the Lords righteousness is clean and pure. That is our righteousness by declaration and imputation. It does not originate with us. Our righteousness is filthy rags.

See, you won't admit that your righteousness is as filthy rags. You ask me instead does it bother me that my righteousness is as filthy rags. It bothers me. But it doesn't make me lie about my righteousness. It makes me more appreciate the grace of God in calling me righteous, though I have none of myself. It makes me rejoice that righteousness is imputed to me and based upon another's obedience. Just like with Paul in (Rom. 7:24-25). It doesn't make me lie about me being a sinner.

Oh, you don't like (1 John 1:8). How about (1:9)? How about (2:1)?

You give me (Rom. 7:24) as some sort of proof, and it is against you. Look now at (7:25)? You say sin is dead in our flesh. Paul says otherwise.

Your righteousness is filthy rags. It was and is yours to begin with. It is yours now. Christ's imputed righteousness to you is not your righteousness. That righteousness which comes from you is filthy. That which you are declared to be is Christ's by imputation. It began as Christ's and remains as Christ's. The believer is fortunate to be covered by it.

Will you need the imputed righteousness of Christ to cover you in Heaven? Why?

Stranger
 

justbyfaith

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I have explained your verses several times already.

Not accurately.

"By the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." But of course you say differently. You say by Christ and your obedience are you made righteous.

Jesus was obedient in going to the Cross. On the Cross, He cried out, Father, into thy hands I commend my Spirit. The same Spirit was then poured out on the early church on the day of Pentecost. It is by this Spirit that we can walk in victory over sin, not according to the flesh. Therefore, Christ's obedience in going to the Cross results in our being made righteous in a very practical sense.

Yes, the Lords righteousness is clean and pure. That is our righteousness by declaration and imputation. It does not originate with us. Our righteousness is filthy rags.

No doubt.

See, you won't admit that your righteousness is as filthy rags.

My own righteousness, before I received the righteousness of Christ, was indeed as filthy rags (Isaiah 64:6). That was the righteousness of the law (see Philippians 3:9). Now I have the righteousness of faith; which is fine linen, clean and white before our Father (Revelation 19:8).

Now in 1 John 3:7, it is written, Little children, let no man deceive you, he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

There is a practical aspect to it; it is not only imputed.

You give me (Rom. 7:24) as some sort of proof, and it is against you. Look now at (7:25)? You say sin is dead in our flesh. Paul says otherwise.

Paul, in Romans 7:14-25, is using a literary tactic called IDENTIFICATION to define carnality; and therefore his statements in the passage are by definition things that are spoken by the carnal man. There are two types of believer in holy scripture: carnal and spiritual (1 Corinthians 3:1). Is Paul himself carnal, or is he simply identifying himself as carnal in order to define carnality? In 1 Corinthians 9:22, he says that he uses the tactic of becoming as weak that he might win those who are weak. And if he were truly carnal, how can he be a penner of holy scripture? 2 Peter 1:21 shows that those who authored scripture were all "holy men of God".

Therefore, if Paul says, "Sin is not rendered dead within me" in Romans 7:25 (which he doesn't; but even if he did), he is saying it as a representative of those who are carnal as he is defining carnality in the passage.

Your righteousness is filthy rags.

Depends on how you look at it. My righteousness, before receiving Christ, was indeed as filthy rags; and if I walk according to it I am filthy. However, there is a righteousness that Christ has given to me, and He has even filled me with it (see Matthew 5:6); and it is first His righteousness which He has given to me so that I own it. And it is defined thus:

Rev 19:8, And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

It was and is yours to begin with. It is yours now. Christ's imputed righteousness to you is not your righteousness. That righteousness which comes from you is filthy. That which you are declared to be is Christ's by imputation. It began as Christ's and remains as Christ's. The believer is fortunate to be covered by it.

Christ's righteousness can be imparted to us. Not only are we made righteous (Romans 5:19); but we are filled with it (Matthew 5:6). And also, it is a practical righteousness according to 1 John 3:7...it is a righteousness that we do.

Will you need the imputed righteousness of Christ to cover you in Heaven? Why?

I will also ask you one question, and I will answer you: is there sin in heaven?
 
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Stranger

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I will also ask you one question, and I will answer you: is there sin in heaven?

At present there is sin as satan is allowed to come before God. Sin having it's origin in Heaven is why God must create a 'new Heaven and Earth'. But there was a time prior to the fall of satan, that there was no sin in Heaven or the Earth. satan was perfect...yet fell. Adam and Eve were perfect...yet fell.

So, when you get to Heaven, do you still need the imputed Righteousness of Jesus Christ to cover you?

Stranger