Why do so many oppose imputed righteousness?

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VictoryinJesus

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No that is not the answer.
for where there is no law there is no transgression.
No Law! No Law! That system of sin was removed for those in the New Covenant. We we were purchased out of that system. Justified by faith. And righteous before a God that can only tolerate perfection, righteous before Him with a white clock of Grace.
But we still sin. But what or who do we sin against?

that which is born of flesh is flesh. That born of Spirit is Spirit. 1 Peter 3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
Entangling the two: where one is: “greater” is He that is in you, than he that is in the world. 1 John 4:4
[4] Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
The significance of come out “Walk Not after the flesh but after the Spirit.” that which is outward and corruption...greater is He in you ...than that which is outward. Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
 
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Enoch111

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One could also say some people love imputed righteousness since they want God to accept them no matter how wretched they are and don't want to allow God to change them. "Yeah, I still want to steal and do other things; but God will still call me righteous. It's okay."
Why do you make such absurd statements? You can either believe God and what He says or you can keep believing your own ideas.
 

Ernest T. Bass

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I don't see where anyone is saying someone sits idle and receives the perfect righteousness of God.

But either that non-idleness is faith, or it is works. By which do we receive the righteousness of Christ? By our faith, or by our works?

Much love!
By a faith that works God's righteousness. THose who "worketh righteousness" are those who are accepted with God Acts 10:35. Faith only therefore cannot make one righteous. Faith only does not justify, James 2.
 
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Grailhunter

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that which is born of flesh is flesh. That born of Spirit is Spirit. 1 Peter 3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
Entangling the two: where one is: “greater” is He that is in you, than he that is in the world. 1 John 4:4
[4] Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
The significance of come out “Walk Not after the flesh but after the Spirit.” that which is outward and corruption...greater is He in you ...than that which is outward. Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

No that is not the answer.
for where there is no law there is no transgression.
No Law! No Law! That system of sin was removed for those in the New Covenant. We we were purchased out of that system. Justified by faith. And righteous before a God that can only tolerate perfection, righteous before Him with a white clock of Grace.
But we still sin. But what or who do we sin against?

VictoryinJesus..But we still sin. But what or who do we sin against? This is not a trick question.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Who is forgiving us? Who are we transgressing against?
 

Ernest T. Bass

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People oppose imputed righteousness because it makes them feel good to be accepted by God for their good works. They want to earn it. They want to deserve it.

God has no problem dealing with your sins. He has no provision for your righteousness. Does any really want to stand before God and Christ in their own righteousness?

Stranger
As pointed out earlier in this thread it is faith onlyist who are trying to figure out a way to get a man to be seen as righteous by God without that man DOING any obedience at all. No verse teaches that righteous is imputed or transferred to the sinner while the sinner continues in unrighteousness, disobedience to God's will.

Psalms 119:172 all of Gods commandments are righteousness Therefore obeying God's commands is doing God's righteousness and how one becomes righteous before God. Nowhere in the Bible is obedience to the will of God said to earn the free gift of salvation. Doing God's righteousness is a condition one must meet to receive the gift of salvation. There is a difference between working to earn some thing and meeting the conditions place upon a free gift.

Romans 10:3 shows the difference between one doing his OWN righteousness in trying to earn salvation and submitting to the righteous commands of God that does save.
 
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Ernest T. Bass

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Ok guys! Thinking caps on! Full power!
Question one; Can you sin! I am expecting you to say yes.


Yes, 1 John 1:7-10


1 Jn 3:9 "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

"Cannot sin" is present tense meaning the Christian cannot continue in sin. Therefore when a Christian sins he cannot continue in that sin, he must repent of that sin or be lost (Luke 13:3) the impenitent will be lost (Romans 2:4-5). Therefore 'cannot' does not mean 'impossible'. Law makers pass laws and put up signs that mean you cannot drive over 55mph. That does not mean it is impossible for you to drive over 55mph.
 

Grailhunter

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Yes, 1 John 1:7-10


1 Jn 3:9 "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

"Cannot sin" is present tense meaning the Christian cannot continue in sin. Therefore when a Christian sins he cannot continue in that sin, he must repent of that sin or be lost (Luke 13:3) the impenitent will be lost (Romans 2:4-5). Therefore 'cannot' does not mean 'impossible'. Law makers pass laws and put up signs that mean you cannot drive over 55mph. That does not mean it is impossible for you to drive over 55mph.

Who do you sin against?
 

Grailhunter

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Ultimately God....."Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight" Psalms 51:4.

Therefore the idea sin is ok if it does not hurt anyone is not true.

No..You are blameless before God the Father. Who are you praying to for forgiveness?
 

Ernest T. Bass

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No..You are blameless before God the Father. Who are you praying to for forgiveness?

Anyone, (Christian or not), who sins before God and will not repent of that sin but instead continues in that sin is not blameless before God.

A Christian is to pray to God for forgiveness (Acts of the Apostles 8:22) for it is God Who was sinned against and God only Who can forgive.

1 John 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

If men can live perfectly sinless, no need for Christ to die on the cross shedding His blood to remit sins that men cannot commit.
 

VictoryinJesus

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No that is not the answer.
for where there is no law there is no transgression.
No Law! No Law! That system of sin was removed for those in the New Covenant. We we were purchased out of that system. Justified by faith. And righteous before a God that can only tolerate perfection, righteous before Him with a white clock of Grace.
But we still sin. But what or who do we sin against?

VictoryinJesus..But we still sin. But what or who do we sin against? This is not a trick question.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Who is forgiving us? Who are we transgressing against?

against God.
James 5:15-20 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him. [16] Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much. [17] Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are, and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain: and it rained not on the earth by the space of three years and six months. [18] And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth brought forth her fruit. [19] Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; [20] Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

How many times can one be converted? “The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.”
Galatians 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
Ephesians 6:18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


Still that born of flesh is flesh. That born of Spirit is Spirit. Yes, God is able to subdue all unto Him. But still you can’t call the hidden man of the heart “corruptible” when God said it Is incorruptible. Taking every thought captive to Christ, yes. But you can’t call what He has cleansed within the body of His temple ...a habitation for God “unclean”. There ...in His kingdom within..there is no law for no law is needed where God is for there IS no sin in what He cleansed by His all-consuming presence.
 

Grailhunter

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Anyone, (Christian or not), who sins before God and will not repent of that sin but instead continues in that sin is not blameless before God.

A Christian is to pray to God for forgiveness (Acts of the Apostles 8:22) for it is God Who was sinned against and God only Who can forgive.

1 John 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

If men can live perfectly sinless, no need for Christ to die on the cross shedding His blood to remit sins that men cannot commit.

We sin...no doubt. But who paid for your sins? Who bought you out of that system? Who is the judge? Who forgives you? Does God the Father even see your sins?
 

Grailhunter

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against God.
James 5:15-20 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him. [16] Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much. [17] Elias was a man subject to like passions as we are, and he prayed earnestly that it might not rain: and it rained not on the earth by the space of three years and six months. [18] And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth brought forth her fruit. [19] Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; [20] Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

How many times can one be converted? “The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.”
Galatians 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
Ephesians 6:18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


Still that born of flesh is flesh. That born of Spirit is Spirit. Yes, God is able to subdue all unto Him. But still you can’t call the hidden man of the heart “corruptible” when God said it Is incorruptible. Taking every thought captive to Christ, yes. But you can’t call what He has cleansed within the body of His temple ...a habitation for God “unclean”. There ...in His kingdom within..there is no law for no law is needed where God is for there IS no sin in what He cleansed by His all-consuming presence. We saw Him cleanse the body of His temple as He said He would.

You sin against Christ. He is the judge. Because of the Grace of Christ, God the Father never sees your sins. You are presented to the Father, righteous and justified.
 

Ernest T. Bass

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We sin...no doubt. But who paid for your sins? Who bought you out of that system? Who is the judge? Who forgives you? Does God the Father even see your sins?

God is the One who forgives, BUT He only forgives those that repent. THis is why the Christian cannot continue in sin and expect to still be saved anyway..

God's perfect justice, perfect Holiness, perfect righteousness does not allow Him to ignore the sins one commits.
 

Grailhunter

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God is the One who forgives, BUT He only forgives those that repent. THis is why the Christian cannot continue in sin and expect to still be saved anyway..

God's perfect justice, perfect Holiness, perfect righteousness does not allow Him to ignore the sins one commits.

You sin against Christ. He is the judge. Because of the Grace of Christ, God the Father never sees your sins. You are presented to the Father, righteous and justified. Our sins are between us and Christ. He was given all authority. That is why the scriptures can say...for where there is no law there is no transgression and those that abide in Christ cannot sin.
 

Nondenom40

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As we study Hebrews 11 we notice in this"faith chapter" that all the heroes of scripture were saved because by faith Noah did something... By faith Moses did something... By faith Enoch did something... By faith they all did stuff... Every one of them
acted on their faith, and they were saved as a result. If Noah had faith but didn't obey, we wouldn't be here. If Abraham had faith but didn't obey, the Messiah wouldn't have come. If Moses had faith but had stayed in Egypt, the Bible wouldn't have been written.

Obedience was a condition of their salvation, and because they believed God... They had faith... And then exercised that faith and were saved.
It is no different for us. They are our examples. We will all be judged... Not according to our faith... But according to our works. Obedience is a condition of salvation. Not a means to salvation, but absolutely a stipulated requisite.
The born again experience is justification by faith. And justification by faith is more than being declared righteous... It is being made righteous. There is no place for sin in God's kingdom. The death of the Son of God forever destroyed any idea that God could tolerate sin and disobedience among His children... What parent raises his child without expectation of obedience?
In Heb 11 nowhere does it say 'obedience was a condition of their salvation'. By faith.....What the o.t. men and women of God did by faith was a proof of their faith, it didn't give them faith or salvation. This is the book of James all over again. You say youre a christian? Great, prove it. Thats James in a nutshell. And this is exactly what Heb 11 is demonstrating. 2 Thess 1:8-9 speak of obedience, but to what? The law? No, the gospel. And unless youre assuming no one sins after being born again, you'd be wrong. My certificate of debt is gone, yet i still sin. God lives in me, yet i still sin. Sin is a part of every believers life until they leave this life. When we do sin, we confess and move on; 1 Jn 1:9
 

justbyfaith

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No Law! No Law!

Lawlessness.

But we still sin.

Not necessarily; for the one who abideth in him sinneth not (1 John 3:6); and he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever (1 John 2:17).

Faith only therefore cannot make one righteous. Faith only does not justify,

God imputes righteousness without works (Romans 4:6); that is, He declares a man righteous through his faith. It is impossible for God to lie (Titus 1:2, Hebrews 6:18). Therefore, when He declares a man righteous, He calls those things which be not as though they are (Romans 4:17); thus creating a new reality, that the man is truly righteous in His sight. And if in His sight, then in reality; for it is written,

Heb 4:13, Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Doing God's righteousness is a condition one must meet to receive the gift of salvation.

Living faith in Jesus Christ is the only condition for salvation; which will normally lead to the doing of righteousness.

If men can live perfectly sinless, no need for Christ to die on the cross shedding His blood to remit sins that men cannot commit.

I think that I must disagree with you there. For there are many verses that teach that a man can walk in total freedom and victory (among them: 1 John 3:5-9, Hebrews 10:10-14, 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10; and 1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6). Also, compare 1 John 3:6 with 1 John 2:17.
 

VictoryinJesus

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You sin against Christ. He is the judge. Because of the Grace of Christ, God the Father never sees your sins. You are presented to the Father, righteous and justified.

you didn’t answer the question: how many times can one be converted?

You said God never sees your sin...that “I will remember their sins no more” is the New creature. So are saying you saying the New creature sins? who God said the former is passed away (dead in sin) and forgotten ...Behold I make all things new. Philippians 3:13-14 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, [14] I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
 

Doug

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It would appear that large numbers of Christians are opposed to the Gospel truth of imputed righteousness, and sincerely believe that they must add their own righteousness to the righteousness of Christ (or apart from the righteousness of Christ) in order to be accepted into Heaven. Many even falsely believe that water baptism saves them.

Imputed righteousness is so foreign to human experience that if we did not have the Word of God to show us that God literally credits the righteousness of Christ to every believer’s spiritual account, none of us would believe it.

But imputed righteousness cannot be isolated from justification by grace through faith. Therefore if we believe that God justifies the ungodly because they have trusted wholly in Christ and His finished work of redemption, then we must also believe that at that very moment God places the *robe* of the righteousness of Christ upon the one who repents and believes God.

We first read of imputed righteousness in the Old Testament, but it is brought out clearly in the New Testament in the account of Abel, who was murdered by his brother Cain:
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.(Heb 11:4) In the same way Noah was deemed righteous because he believed, trusted, and obeyed God, his obedience being the outcome of his faith: But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. (Gen 6:8) We see here that grace and faith are connected.

But the Holy Spirit uses the example of Abraham as the man who was justified by grace through faith, and to whom God imputed righteousness when he believed God:
And, behold, the Word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.And He brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and He said unto him, So shall thy seed be. And he [Abraham] believed in the LORD; and He [the LORD] counted it to him for righteousness.

Thus the Holy Spirit also inspired Paul to take Abraham’s example and apply it to every believer in Romans 4. While the New Testament speaks of this critical matter in several places, it is in the fourth chapter of the epistle to the Romans that Paul – under the divine inspiration of the Holy Spirit – explains the meaning of imputed righteousness.

ROMANS 4

JUSTIFICATION BY WORKS WOULD GLORIFY MAN

1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND WAS DEEMED RIGHTEOUS

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

GRACE IS EXCLUDED WHEN MEN BRING THEIR OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS TO GOD

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.


WORKS ARE EXCLUDED WHEN GOD JUSTIFIES THE UNGODLY
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

CIRCUMCISION DOES NOT GUARANTEE ANYTHING

9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

CIRCUMCISION SHOULD ONLY BE A SIGN OF FAITH

11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

TORAH OBSERVANCE DOES NOT MAKE ANYONE RIGHTEOUS

13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

JUSTIFICATION IS PURELY BY GOD'S GRACE THROUGH FAITH

16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all, 17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were. 18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be.

ABRAHAM’S FAITH WAS STRONG AND GAVE GLORY TO GOD

19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sara's womb: 20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.

ABRAHAM’S FAITH WAS IMPUTED TO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

EVERY BELIEVER’S FAITH IN CHRIST IS ALSO IMPUTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Good post, well said.
Entirely in line with Biblical truth and doctrine.
 
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