The Doctrine of Purgatory in Catholic Biblical Perspective

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BreadOfLife

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I am saying that if you cannot question your pastor's interpretation that is a problem.

I CAN.

My pastor may NOT have a completely accurate interpretation – and I am free to interpret a passage as long as it does not deviate from Church teaching.

The problem with Protestantism is that ANYBODY is allowed to interpret Scripture ANY way they want – to the tune of tens of thousands of disjointed and perpeturally-splintering denominations that ALL teach different doctrines based on different interpretations.

The Unity that Christ Himself prayed so fervently for0 at the Last Supper (John 17:21-23) goes right OUT the window . . .
 

Ezra

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We must be 100% holy and perfect without even the slightest hint of a shadow of a spot or wrinkle if we are to be united with an all holy God. Pretence (covering up) will not do. We must be totally purified, full of grace.
it can never happen in our walk down here ..the finial stage of sanctification is when we get our glorified body . 3 steps of sanctification
Positional sanctification – justification. At salvation, believers are justified, declared righteous in conformity to the image of Jesus Christ. “For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the first-born among many brethren” (Rom. 8: 29). This is entirely a work of God.

Experiential sanctification – spiritual maturity. The goal is Christlikeness, the result of the ministry of the Holy Spirit in producing godliness in the life of the believer. In essence, progressive sanctification is becoming in experience what we already are positionally in Christ. The Holy Spirit operates in believers to free them experientially from the power of sin and death. “And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect” (Rom. 12:2).

The progress of sanctification, or spiritual maturity, is marked by conflict, spiritual warfare, because our new life in Christ is on a collision course with the world, is opposed by Satan, and fought by the sinful nature within us. It is the presence of the Holy Spirit that produces the tension or conflict in our life. This conflict in the life of a believer, rather than being proof sanctification’s absence, is evidence of its work.

Progressive sanctification is accomplished by the Holy Spirit as the believer is filled with the Holy Spirit as a result of having no unconfessed sin in his or her life. It is an act entirely of God so that the righteous man lives by faith and not by works. However, it involves a choice: “Be ye holy for I am holy” (1 Pet. 1:14-16).

Ultimate sanctification – glorification. . The final stage in the salvation process is the ultimate sanctification of the believer—the future glorification of the believer. It is realized at resurrection when the believer will be transformed into the likeness of Christ and presented to the Lord as holy. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit in the life of a believer is both the promise of and the agency for this future glorification, which includes 1) the redemption of the body, 2) an inheritance undefiled and eternal, and 3) deliverance from the future wrath of God.

“In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory” (Eph. 1:13-14; cf. 1 Cor. 1:22).
 

reformed1689

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My pastor may NOT have a completely accurate interpretation – and I am free to interpret a passage as long as it does not deviate from Church teaching.
And what if the church is wrong?
The problem with Protestantism is that ANYBODY is allowed to interpret Scripture ANY way they want
No that is not correct. There is only one proper interpretation of any passage.
 

Ezra

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Yet, not only has he NOT used Scripture - he hasn't mounted a case at ALL except for his own opinions.

STILL waiting for a Scriptural refutation . . .
keep watching fantasy island... the plane the plane here enjoy
is that you in the white suit the short guy ?
 

Ezra

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BreadOfLife said:
My pastor may NOT have a completely accurate interpretation – and I am free to interpret a passage as long as it does not deviate from Church teaching.
i love it this saith the church and as paul harvey would say and know you ( we ) know the rest of the story :eek::rolleyes:o_O
 

BreadOfLife

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And what if the church is wrong?
The Church CAN’T be wrong on matters of doctrine.

ALL truth, son. Christ guaranteed that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church to ALL TRUTH (John 16:12-15) – and that even the gates of Hell would NOT prevail against it (Matt. 16:18).

Shame on your lack of faith . . .
No that is not correct. There is only one proper interpretation of any passage.
Then why are there tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering sects – ALL teaching different doctrines and ALL claiming to have been “led” by the Holy Spirit??
 

BreadOfLife

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i love it this saith the church and as paul harvey would say and know you ( we ) know the rest of the story
keep watching fantasy island... the plane the plane is that you in the white suit the short guy ?
TRANSLATION:
"I don't have a Scritural refutation of any of your points, either."

That's what I thought . . .
 

reformed1689

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The Church CAN’T be wrong on matters of doctrine.
Scripture doesn't say that.
ALL truth, son. Christ guaranteed that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church to ALL TRUTH (John 16:12-15) – and that even the gates of Hell would NOT prevail against it (Matt. 16:18).
Yes, the church, not some organization that says it is the one true church. Not the Pope and Bishops alone, but the body of believers. These are verses taken out of context.
Then why are there tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering sects – ALL teaching different doctrines and ALL claiming to have been “led” by the Holy Spirit??
How is that relevant?
 

BreadOfLife

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Scripture doesn't say that.

Yes, the church, not some organization that says it is the one true church. Not the Pope and Bishops alone, but the body of believers. These are verses taken out of context.
Jesus built ONE Church.
Rhe Catholic Church ias an unbroken line of Apostolic Succession.
NONE of your Protestant sects can go back ANY further than the 16th century . . .
How is that relevant?
How is it NOT relevant??

The total confused mess that is Protestantism was born of ecclesiastical divorce and personal interpretation of Scripture.
It’s the HALLMARK of Protestantism . . .
 

reformed1689

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Rhe Catholic Church ias an unbroken line of Apostolic Succession.
Which of course cannot be substantiated. There is no such thing as apostolic succession.

NONE of your Protestant sects can go back ANY further than the 16th century . . .
The church goes back to Christ and it is not an organization. It is the body of believers.

It’s the HALLMARK of Protestantism . . .
No, the hallmark of protestantism is to actually base faith and practice on Scripture.
 
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Ezra

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How sad that you think that.
we can not be totally perfect
WE CAN STRIVE BUT IT HAS TO BE DON BY AND THROUGH TH hOLY SPIRIT paul wrote in romans 7 the war with in even in galatians paul wrote about the war of spirit and flesh
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

19For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

20Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

21I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

23But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

24O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
you need to read this even jesus said in me you have pace in this world you will have tribulation but n of good cheer i have overcome the world . sanctification set apart being made holy is a progress .one could say made righteous . sin will always be there.. we will fail this is here GRACE comes in . in scripture it reads My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: i john 2:1 were being made complete in in.. we are c lean through the word by the Blood .

to be perfectly honest with you.. its just about a waste of time. trying to communicate with you.. your so indoctrinated into thinking in the catholic church and in the pope this is no error . whats sad is just like many other members of denoms.. the put on a good act but inside are dead men bones
 

Philip James

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.. your so indoctrinated into thinking in the catholic church and in the pope this is no error

Indoctrinated, no , faith and reason both believe and affirm our Lord's words: 'the gates of hell will not prevail against it'

you need to read this even jesus said in me you have pace in this world you will have tribulation but n of good cheer i have overcome the world . sanctification set apart being made holy is a progress .one could say made righteous . sin will always be there.. we will fail this is here GRACE comes in . in scripture it reads My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: i john 2:1 were being made complete in in.. we are c lean through the word by the Blood

So much here that I agree with but sin will not always 'be there'. When we are baptised ALL sin is washed away, and we are made anew, holy and pure, and thus we CAN 'approach the throne of grace, through the veil that is His flesh'

And we can be intimately united with our Most Holy Husband.

Should we stumble or fall, Jesus Himself will cleanse us if we ask Him, washing our gowns and our feet...

That we might once more approach Him pure and holy and without blemish!

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Peace be with you!
 

Ezra

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When we are baptised ALL sin is washed away, and we are made anew, holy and pure, and thus we CAN 'approach the throne of grace, through the veil that is His flesh'
baptism does NOT take our sins away ..you are so wrong the Blood read 1 john 1:9 the blood covers are sins.. yet we will sin all the more reason we can approach the throne of Grace . you have took scripture and twisted them into what you want them to say.
 

Taken

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As I have shown you about a DOZED times now – Scripture implies that Mary was sinless.

So from a supposed "Implication" Catholic men have "Stretched" what they view as an "Implication" To A "Fact"...

Finally an Admission of HOW the Catholic Teaching of Mary Being SINLESS was conjoured up in the minds of Catholic men, based on their opinion of an Implication

Glory to God,
Taken