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Bobby Jo

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The statement that I "REFUSED to answer", is simply untrue, and thus I distinctly cited Albert Barnes who addressed it, as others also did as even Keil and Kliefoth mention among their own peers in their own commentary (though they simply dismiss such), and I also gave you specific texts on it, which you did not reply specifically to (Genesis, Matthew):

Yep, and then you THREW IT OUT THE WINDOW.

Perhaps you missed the analogy previously provided in Post #215:

So using the analogy of a "car" (versus "vehicle"), which is a CONCISE (Feminine) term, we can recognize that there are 14 uses of this term throughout Scripture. But there are 6 uses of what would be an INCONCISE "vehicle" (Masculine) diction found ONLY in the 9th Chapter of Daniel.

The problem is, do you drive a CAR, -- or a BICYCLE, MOTORCYCLE, TRUCK, BUS, etc.? If you drive a "TRUCK", then it isn't a "CAR", -- it's a vehicle. And there IS A DIFFERENCE. Maybe you drive BOTH. Thus you have TWO VEHICLES, one's a CAR and the other's a TRUCK.

And THAT's EXACTLY what Daniel is attempting to depict. He's citing the 9:2 single "year" duration; and the 9:27 seven-year "week" duration, under one general term -- the INCONCISE Masculine Gender "week".


It is also tempered by the following divisions of the 70 7's or weeks, by the 7, 62 and 1 'weeks'. Have you considered their gender and form, as they are all a part of the whole 70 7's itself?

Yep, and they agree with with themselves, with other Scriptures, and with end-time History!


Bobby Jo
 

ReChoired

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Yep, and the LIARS have capitalized what THEY thought should be "capitalized", BECAUSE THEY HAD A "JESUS AGENDA". ...

And I'm not holding my breath,
Bobby Jo
I see your hatred of "JESUS" and for 'context'. It is clear. Thank you for your time.
 

ReChoired

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...

And your "Papal Rome" is foolishness on it's face. The fact is, you can't get through the identification of Darius, and the three more and fourth in 11:1-2, but you can "arrive" to 11:31? -- Balderdash.

Dan. 11:1 And as for me, in the first year of Darius the Mede, I stood up to confirm and strengthen him. 2 “And now I will show you the truth. Behold, three more kings shall arise in Persia; and a fourth shall be far richer than all of them; and when he has become strong through his riches, he shall stir up all against the kingdom of Greece.

Give me concrete HISTORICAL EVIDENCE of Darius the Mede in the Medo/Persian Empire (not some supposition of "Gobryas"), and also identify the "three more" and the "fourth".


And I'm not holding my breath,
Bobby Jo
The context of Daniel 11:1-2, is in the context of Daniel 10:1, in the third year of Cyrus II the Great, and it was he who was then ruling during the time as the angel Gabriel was speaking to Daniel. Daniel's 10-12 is really one long chapter. Therefore:

[0] Cyrus II the great (the then ruling king of Persia, in the third yea, Daniel 10:1

[1] Ahasuerus (Cambyses II, son of Cyrus II) of Ezra 4:6

[2] 'false' Artaxerxes (false Smerdis) of Ezra 4:7

[3] Darius I Hystaspes the Persian of Ezra 4:4,24, and chapters 5-6

[4] Ahasuerus, aka: Xerxes I the Great, husband of Queen Esther [Hadassah, Esther 2:7], the son of Darius I Hystaspes the Persian, had massive wealth, inheriting from the wealth of Cyrus [II] in the conquering of Babylon & Lydia [King Croesus] [Isaiah 45:3; Daniel 7:5, 8:4], from inheriting from the wealth of Ahasuerus / Cambyses [II] in the conquering of Egypt [Daniel 7:5, 8:4], from the wealth obtained falsely by [False] Artaxerxes / False Smerdis [Ezra 4:13,14,16,22], and through the wealth of Darius I Hystaspes [Ezra 6:1], even having a feast for 180 days and 7 more! [Esther 1:3-5], and laid a tribute upon the “Isles” [Greeks, Javan] [Esther 10:1] 486 BC - 465 BC


More detail:

Darius The Mede[ian] [son of 'Ahasuerus'; Daniel 9:1, not the 'Ahasuerus' [aka Cambyses II] of Ezra 4:6, nor the 'Ahasuerus' [aka Xerxes I The Great] of Esther 1:1-2,9,10,15,16,17,19, 2:1,12,16,21, 3:1,7,8,12, 6:2, 7:5, 8:1,7,10,12, 9:2,20,30, 10:1,3] - 539 BC – 538/7 BC (about 2 years; AM 3689 – AM 3690/1); see Daniel 5:31, 6:1,6,9,25,28, 9:1, 11:1

Cyrus II, The Great, King of the Medes [and later Persians] [King of the East] [son of Cambyses I; nephew of Darius The Mede] - 600 BC [kinged backwards through tradition] or 576 BC–530 and in Babylon 537/6 BC (AM 3691/2); see 2 Chronicles 36:22,23; Ezra 1:1,2,7,8, 3:7, 4:3,5, 5:13,14,17, 6:3,14; Isaiah 44:28, 45:1; Daniel 1:21, 6:28, 10:1 and Daniel 11:2 [the currently reigning King of Babylon, after which were to follow 3 kings [Cambyses II, False Smerdis, Darius I of Hystaspes The Persian] and then a 4th Richer king [Xerxes I The Great, aka "Ahasuerus" of Esther]]

He Reigned ca. 559 BC – 530 BC [co-ruling Media/Persia until ca. 549 BC, then overruling the Medes, then later Babylonia]

Cambyses II [Cyrus II son] the “Ahasuerus” of Ezra 4:6 [not the Ahasuerus, the 'father' of Darius the Mede of Daniel 9:1, and neither the Ahasuerus of Esther [Xerxes I, The Great], “...which reigned, from India even unto Ethiopia, [over] an hundred and seven and twenty provinces...”] see also "Prophets and Kings", Page 572-572 [342-343]; see also Daniel 11:2 [the 1st of the 4 kings that had “yet” to Reign in Persia after Cyrus II The Great] and see also See also Ezra 4:5 “...all the days of Cyrus king of Persia, even until the reign of Darius king of Persia.” for context and period of between...

He Reigned 530 BC – 522 BC [Babylon] (AM 3697 - AM 3705) reigned about 7 1/2 years (rounded to 8)
He Reigned 525 BC – 522 BC [Egypt]


False Smerdis [aka Pseudo Bardiya [or Gaumata the Usurper/sorceror] aka [false] “Artaxerxes” of Ezra 4:7-23 [4:7,8,23]] - 522 BC (AM 3705), about 6 months to 1 year or so, before being killed, found as an impostor - [Haggai [the LORD's Messenger] and Zechariah [the son of Berechiah, the son of Iddo the Prophet] the Prophets begin during the reign of this Usurper; Ezra 5:1, 6:14] Prophets and Kings Page 573 [343] [“...During the reign of Cambyses the work on the temple progressed slowly. And during the reign of the false Smerdis (called Artaxerxes in Ezra 4:7) the Samaritans induced the unscrupulous impostor to issue a decree forbidding the Jews to rebuild their temple and city. ...” [Prophets and Kings, page 572-573]]; see also Daniel 11:2 [the 2nd of the 4 kings that had “yet” to Reign in Persia after Cyrus II The Great] and Ezra 4:7; “Artaxerxes” [reigned in between Cyrus II The Great and Darius I Hystaspes The Persian The Great, see Ezra 4:5 “...all the days of Cyrus king of Persia, even until the reign of Darius king of Persia.” for the two 'bookend' kings] and see Ezra 4:7-24 [[false] Artaxerxes decree to cease building, which went against the Law of the Medes/Persians which changes not] and see Ezra 6:8-12 [Darius I Hystaspes The Persian The Great, after eliminating False Smerdis, has to re-issue the Decree of Cyrus II]

Darius I The Persian, [of] Hystaspes, The Great - 522 BC – 486 BC (AM 3705 - AM 3741) [Ezra 4:5,24, 5:5; Haggai 1:1; Zechariah 1:1; wife was Atossa [daughter of Cyrus II, The Great] [not to be confused with Darius The Mede of Daniel]] [Haggai [the LORD's Messenger] and Zechariah [the son of Berechiah, the son of Iddo the Prophet] the Prophets continue during the reign of this King; Haggai 1:1 [even unto the 2nd year; Haggai 1:15]; Zechariah 1:1 [even unto the 4th year; Zechariah 7:1]; etc]; see also Daniel 11:2 [the 3rd of the 4 kings that had “yet” to Reign in Persia after Cyrus II The Great]

Xerxes I, The Great - 486 BC - 465 BC (AM 3741 - AM 3762) [aka; Persian: Ḫšayāršā; Hebrew: 'Achashverowsh; Bible: “Ahasuerus” [“I will be silent and poor”, or “lion-king” [Gesenius's Lexicon]] [son of Darius I Hystaspes The Persian The Great; aka "Ahasuerus" [Husband] of Esther [Hadassah] of 127 Provinces; Esther 1:1] of Esther 1:1-2,9,10,15,16,17,19, 2:1,12,16,21, 3:1,7,8,12, 6:2, 7:5, 8:1,7,10,12, 9:2,20,30, 10:1,3 [not to be confused with the father of Darius the Mede in Daniel 9:1], but rather, “Now it came to pass in the days of Ahasuerus, (this [is] Ahasuerus which reigned, from India even unto Ethiopia, [over] an hundred and seven and twenty provinces” Esther 1:1; Queen was Vashti, and then Queen was [Hadassah] Esther [whose uncle was Mordecai the Jew]; Xerxes was the son of Darius The Persian and Atossa] [Esther, the Book of happens during the reign of this King], [“...Xerxes,—the Ahasuerus of the book of Esther...” [Prophets and Kings, page 598.2]] [“...Darius Hystaspes, under whose reign the Jews had been shown marked favor, was succeeded by Xerxes the Great. ...” [Prophets and Kings, page 600.1]]; see also Daniel 11:2 [the 4th of the 4 kings that had “yet” to Reign in Persia after Cyrus II The Great]; [“...the fourth shall be far richer than [they] all: and by his strength through his riches he shall stir up all against the realm of Grecia.”]

History has repeated itself as shown here - Study Notes – Appendix 7 – Daniel 11.1-20 KJB, 3 Angels Messages, a work in progress (PDF)
 

Bobby Jo

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I see your hatred of "JESUS" and for 'context'. It is clear. Thank you for your time.

Your love for lies exceeds your love for Scripture. -- The religious leaders in Jesus time had their ideas of how the Messiah would appear, but it wasn't SCRIPTURAL, and neither are your ideas. START with Scripture and then arrive to your doctrines. Not the other way around! :)

Bobby Jo
 

Bobby Jo

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The context of Daniel 11:1-2, is in the context of Daniel 10:1, in the third year of Cyrus II the Great, and it was he who was then ruling during the time as the angel Gabriel was speaking to Daniel. ...

Ummmmmm, have you FIRST considered that 1:21 "contradicts" 10:1?



Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but this is by no means in accordance with the history. Their opinion is right who say that Daniel continued to the first year of the reign of Cyrus in the discharge of the prophetic office, although expositors do not openly say so; but I state openly what they say obscurely. For since he afterwards set out into Media, they say this change is denoted here. But we may understand the words better in the sense of Daniel’s flourishing among the Chaldeans and Assyrians, and being acknowledged as a celebrated Prophet; because he is known to have interpreted King Belshszzar’s vision, on the very night on which he was slain. The word here is simple and complete — he was — but it depends on the succeeding ones, since he always obtained the confidence and authority of a Prophet with the kings of Babylon. This, then, is the true sense.

According to Calvin's expositors, Daniel DIED (was "broken") in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus. So can you explain how he was alive in the "third year of Cyrus"?

Now be careful because the Scriptures which you disdain in deference to your doctrines, are PERFECTLY CORRECT as WRITTEN. Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus. -- Same Daniel, same Cyrus. -- And BOTH Verses are PERFECTLY CORRECT as Written.


Conundrum / sticky-wicket, take your pick. And good luck.
Bobby Jo
 
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ReChoired

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According to Calvin's expositors, Daniel DIED (was "broken") in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus. So can you explain how he was alive in the "third year of Cyrus"? ...
... um, because scripture says so? He being 18 years of age in his captivity, 70 years in Babylon, and 2 years into Cyrus reign, he would be about the same age as John on the Isle of Patmos, 90 years-ish, and the two beloved, the prophecy and the revelation.

Calvin? as in Jean Calvin? What on earth are you talking about? (my link actually works)

Jean Calvin states in commentary on Daniel 10:1: "We observe the Prophet [context in Calvin, Daniel] by no means content with the usual method of address, for the purpose of stirring up the attention of the pious, and of assuring them how worthy of special notice are the prophecies which follow. He marks the time, the third year of King Cyrus ..." - Daniel 10:1 - In the third year... - Verse-by-Verse Commentary

Daniel 1:21 simply states that Daniel made it into the next kingdom, as a type unto the eternal kingdom, Cyrus II being a type of Jesus Christ, as my study showed (which you obviously had not read in any relevant part). It doesn't use the word for died, or broken, but uses the word for to continue, to remain, endured unto, lasted unto (in that position of office) etc. In other words Daniel accomplished his own 70 years (from 18 - 88) of captivity and was freed, and was even still alive in that freedom, even in the third year of Cyrus (two years later), no longer in a position in Babylon, no longer captive.
 
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Bobby Jo

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... um, because scripture says so? ...

Hahahaha, -- YOU ARE A FUNNY GUY!

You couldn't solve a riddle if the answer was given to you: What has four tires and flies? -- A garbage truck.

Garbage trucks can FLY?!?

Don't be stupid. Solve the riddle.
Bobby Jo
 
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Davy

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No way will the Jewish people of the State of Israel, build a new Temple. Many reasons they can't, but the Bible doesn't say it will be a Jewish Temple.

I don't know what your source is, but it isn't God's Word...

Rev 11:1-2
11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
KJV

Rev 13:4-5
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
KJV

That "forty and two months" is for the end of this world. It is the "time and times and the dividing of time" in the Book of Daniel. The Rev.11:8 shows that is about Jerusalem, and it is within the 6th trumpet - 2nd woe timing (Jesus comes on the 7th trumpet - 3rd woe of Rev.11:14-18). That is the "temple of God" that Apostle Paul was speaking of in 2 Thessalonians 2:4 that he warned the "man of sin" will come to sit in and proclaim himself as God. It's about a literal standing Jewish temple in Jerusalem for the end.

Matt 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

KJV

Matt 24:21
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV


My Lord Jesus in His Olivet discourse (Matthew 24) warned about the "abomination of desolation" event from the Book of Daniel for the very end, in Jerusalem, and that is for the generation that will see all those signs He gave there come to pass (Matthew 24:32-34). The last sign He gave there is that of His 2nd coming and gathering of His saints. He also linked that abomination of desolation event with that "holy place", which is the sanctuary mentioned in Daniel 8:11-13, Daniel 9:27, and Daniel 11:31. That also confirms that the 2 Thess.2:4 "temple of God" is about a literal standing Jewish temple for the end in Jerusalem, and not some idea that it's about the spiritual temple instead, which the true spiritual temple with Christ as its Cornerstone is impossible for any man to corrupt.

Zechariah 6:15 says it will be men from far away.

Zech 6:12-13
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:


13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.
KJV


That Zech.6 Scripture was initially for the time after Judah's return from Babylon to build the 2nd temple, but included some parameters than can only be meant for the end of this world. Just Who is that "man whose name is The BRANCH"? That is a symbolic name for our Lord Jesus Christ, He is The Branch of Isaiah 11:1, i.e., Jesus Christ.

Isa 11:1-2
11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
KJV



Thus you have your timing terribly wrong, because the Antichrist comes FIRST, and that is who is to sit in a stone temple in Jerusalem at the end proclaiming himself as God.

Jesus returns to Jerusalem to defeat the coming Antichrist and his army, and destroy this new temple the Antichrist is going to build for the Jews in our time; but the temple Jesus will build when He comes will be the final temple of Zech.6, which is the same temple layout of Ezekiel 40 thru 47. That is for Christ's future "thousand years" on earth with His elect, not for the very end of this world prior... to His return. You are all mixed up!
 
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brakelite

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I don't know what your source is, but it isn't God's Word...

Rev 11:1-2
11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
KJV

Rev 13:4-5
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
KJV

That "forty and two months" is for the end of this world. It is the "time and times and the dividing of time" in the Book of Daniel. The Rev.11:8 shows that is about Jerusalem, and it is within the 6th trumpet - 2nd woe timing (Jesus comes on the 7th trumpet - 3rd woe of Rev.11:14-18). That is the "temple of God" that Apostle Paul was speaking of in 2 Thessalonians 2:4 that he warned the "man of sin" will come to sit in and proclaim himself as God. It's about a literal standing Jewish temple in Jerusalem for the end.

Matt 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

KJV

Matt 24:21
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV


My Lord Jesus in His Olivet discourse (Matthew 24) warned about the "abomination of desolation" event from the Book of Daniel for the very end, in Jerusalem, and that is for the generation that will see all those signs He gave there come to pass (Matthew 24:32-34). The last sign He gave there is that of His 2nd coming and gathering of His saints. He also linked that abomination of desolation event with that "holy place", which is the sanctuary mentioned in Daniel 8:11-13, Daniel 9:27, and Daniel 11:31. That also confirms that the 2 Thess.2:4 "temple of God" is about a literal standing Jewish temple for the end in Jerusalem, and not some idea that it's about the spiritual temple instead, which the true spiritual temple with Christ as its Cornerstone is impossible for any man to corrupt.



Zech 6:12-13
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:


13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.
KJV


That Zech.6 Scripture was initially for the time after Judah's return from Babylon to build the 2nd temple, but included some parameters than can only be meant for the end of this world. Just Who is that "man whose name is The BRANCH"? That is a symbolic name for our Lord Jesus Christ, He is The Branch of Isaiah 11:1, i.e., Jesus Christ.

Isa 11:1-2
11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
KJV



Thus you have your timing terribly wrong, because the Antichrist comes FIRST, and that is who is to sit in a stone temple in Jerusalem at the end proclaiming himself as God.

Jesus returns to Jerusalem to defeat the coming Antichrist and his army, and destroy this new temple the Antichrist is going to build for the Jews in our time; but the temple Jesus will build when He comes will be the final temple of Zech.6, which is the same temple layout of Ezekiel 40 thru 47. That is for Christ's future "thousand years" on earth with His elect, not for the very end of this world prior... to His return. You are all mixed up!
So you claim the temple spoken of by Paul to the Thessalonians being the temple of God...you also claim that no man can corrupt God's temple...yet claim that Antichrist does just that...and then Jesus arrives to destroy God's temple? Surely you see how inconsistent, self contradictory, and desperate this scenario is? You are so determined to protect the papacy any old tired theory will do right so long as people don't read it right?
 
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Enoch111

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So you claim the temple spoken of by Paul to the Thessalonians being the temple of God...
That is not a claim made by anyone. That is exactly what Paul said about the Man of Sin, the Son of Perdition: Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that Man of Sin be revealed, yhe Son of Perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Paul was filling out the prophecy of the Abomination of Desolation and providing insight into the blasphemous Little Horn of Daniel (who has many other titles and designations).

Let's face it. The interpretation of prophecy held by the Seventh Day Adventists is TOTALLY INCORRECT. So between Daniel, Paul, Jesus, and John the Revelator what we see is that:

1. Before the 70th week of Daniel there will literally be a third temple in Jerusalem, erected by unbelieving Jews (and current preparations for this are well documented as we speak).

2. As far as unbelieving Jews are concerned it will indeed be "the temple of God" since it will be located on the Temple Mount.

3. The Antichrist -- a charismatic renegade Jew who is also a world leader (and manipulator) -- will sign a fake seven-year covenant with the Orthodox Jews in Israel, that they will be free to resume their sacrifices and oblations in this temple. They already have red heifers in Israel.

4. After 3 1/2 years he will break this phony covenant, demand that the sacrifices cease, erect an animated image within the Holy Place, and then sit within that temple claiming that he is God (while blaspheming the true God and Christ).

5. This Man of Sin would have already presented himself to Orthodox Jews as their *true* Messiah, so they will be compliant to his wishes. He will *prove* that he is the *true Christ* by the amazing signs and lying wonders which he and the False Prophet will perform:
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders...

6. After setting up the Abomination of Desolation, he will demand that the whole world worship him, worship Satan, and worship that image within the temple (see Revelation 13). He will decree the Mark of the Beast on the inhabitants of the world, and those who refuse it will be beheaded. Those are the Tribulation Saints (Rev 20).

As you can see I have just touched on the subject without going into all the related Scripture. Those 2,300 days of Daniel are 6 years, 4 months, and 21 days during which that temple in Jerusalem will be desecrated and polluted. That is almost the 7 years of the 70th week of Daniel.

 

Bobby Jo

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... Let's face it. The interpretation of prophecy held by ...
... everyone that I'm familiar with -- DEFIES THE ANGEL'S GUIDANCE IN 12:4 & 9. Therefore, THEY'RE ALL LIARS.


That is, unless you accuse the angel of LYING, and everyone else is telling the TRUTH:

Romans 3:4 ... Let God be true though every man be false ...
Bobby Jo
 

ReChoired

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I don't know what your source is, but it isn't God's Word...

Rev 11:1-2
11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
KJV

Rev 13:4-5
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
KJV

That "forty and two months" is for the end of this world. It is the "time and times and the dividing of time" in the Book of Daniel. The Rev.11:8 shows that is about Jerusalem, and it is within the 6th trumpet - 2nd woe timing (Jesus comes on the 7th trumpet - 3rd woe of Rev.11:14-18). That is the "temple of God" that Apostle Paul was speaking of in 2 Thessalonians 2:4 that he warned the "man of sin" will come to sit in and proclaim himself as God. It's about a literal standing Jewish temple in Jerusalem for the end.
The "temple of God" is not a stone and mortar building somewhere in physical Judea, as Jesus said:

Mat_23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luk_13:35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.
The true Temple of God is the body of Christ:

Joh_2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

Joh 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.​

The body of Christ is the natural, while the Body of Christ (the Head) is the spiritual, the peoples:

Amo 9:11 In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old:
Amo 9:12 That they may possess the remnant of Edom, and of all the heathen, which are called by my name, saith the LORD that doeth this.

Zec 6:12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:
Zec 6:13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both

Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

1Co_3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

1Co_3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

1Co_6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

2Co_6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Eph_2:21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

2Th_2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. (connect to Acts 20:28-31; there would be corrupt overseers sitting in the temple of God, and one in particular, claiming to take the place of God on earth, and placing himself as head, even as the 'same tribunal' as Christ)

Roman-Catholicism-Counterfeit-Sanctuary-Anti-Christ-02-With-Notation.jpg


1Pe_2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Rev_11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

Rev_11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Rev_21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.​

The 42 months is the same timeframe as spoken throughout the scripture in 7 places, it is the 1,260 years, from AD 538 unto AD 1798:

forty and two months” [42], being “one thousand, two hundred and threescore days” [1,260], or “time, times, and the dividing of time” [3 1/2], given minimally 7 times in scripture [KJB], Daniel 7:25, 12:7; Revelation 11:2,3, 12:6,14, 13:5; see also Luke 21:24 KJB, compared to Revelation 11:2 KJB, all being the exact same 1,260 years [AD 538 - AD 1798], as per Daniel, Revelation, Ezekiel 4:6; Numbers 14:34 KJB, and many other references.​
 
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ReChoired

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I don't know what your source is, but it isn't God's Word...
This is witnessed by many others., notice, a non-Seventh-day Adventist:

Methodist: Adam Clarke (AD 1760 or AD 1762 – AD 1832) Commentary, on Numbers 14:34; Ezekiel 4:4,6; Daniel 7:25, 8:14,26, 9:24,25,27; Revelation 12:14, quoted in relevant part:

Numbers 14:34:

“... After the number of the days - The spies were forty days in searching the land, and the people who rebelled on their evil report are condemned to wander forty years in the wilderness! ...” - http://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/numbers/14.htm

Ezekiel 4:4:

“... 4. The days signify years, a day for a year; during which they were to bear their iniquity, or the temporal punishment due to their sins. ...” - Ezekiel 4 Clarke's Commentary

Ezekiel 4:6:

Forty days - Reckon, says Archbishop Newcome, near fifteen years and six months in the reign of Manasseh, two years in that of Amon, three months in that of Jehoahaz, eleven years in that of Jehoiakim, three months and ten days in that of Jehoiachin, and eleven years in that of Zedekiah; and there arises a period of forty years, during which gross idolatry was practiced in the kingdom of Judah. ...” - Ezekiel 4 Clarke's Commentary

Daniel 7:25:

“... Until a time and times and the dividing of time - In prophetic language a time signifies a year; and a prophetic year has a year for each day. Three years and a half (a day standing for a year, … ) will amount to one thousand two hundred and sixty years, if we reckon thirty days to each month, as the Jews do.

If we knew precisely when the papal power began to exert itself in the antichristian way, then we could at once fix the time of its destruction. The end is probably not very distant; it has already been grievously shaken by the French. In 1798 the French republican army under General Berthier took possession of the city of Rome, and entirely superseded the whole papal power. This was a deadly wound, though at present it appears to be healed; but it is but skinned over, and a dreadful cicatrice remains. The Jesuits, not Jesus, are now the Church's doctors. ...” - Daniel 7 Clarke's Commentary

Daniel 8:14:

"Unto two thousand and three hundred days - Though literally it be two thousand three hundred evenings and mornings. Yet I think the prophetic day should be understood here, as in other parts of this prophet, and must signify so many years. …" - Daniel 8 Clarke's Commentary

Daniel 8:26:

“... The vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true - That mentioned in Daniel 8:14.

For it shall be for many days - Not less than two thousand three hundred years! ...” - Daniel 8 Clarke's Commentary

Daniel 9:24,25,27:

“... When thus supplicating God in behalf of Israel, the angel Gabriel is sent to inform him of the seventy prophetic weeks, or four hundred and ninety natural years ...

... [vs 24] Seventy weeks are determined - The Jews had Sabbatic years, Leviticus 25:8, by which their years were divided into weeks of years, as in this important prophecy, each week containing seven years. The seventy weeks therefore here spoken of amount to four hundred and ninety years. ...

... [vs 25] And if we reckon back four hundred and ninety years, we shall find the time of the going forth of this command. ...

... Four hundred and ninety years, reckoned back ... the very month and year in which Ezra had his commission from Artaxerxes Longimanus, king of Persia, (see Ezra 7:9), to restore and rebuild Jerusalem. See the commission in Ezra 7:11-26 (note), and Prideaux's Connexions, vol. 2 p.

The above seventy weeks, or four hundred and ninety years, are divided ...

I. Seven weeks, that is, forty-nine years.

II.-Sixty-two weeks, that is, four hundred and thirty-four years.

III. One week, that is, seven years. ...

... the first period of seven weeks ... forty-nine years ...

From the above seven weeks the second period of sixty-two weeks, or four hundred and thirty-four years more, commences, at the end of which the prophecy says, Messiah the Prince should come, that is, seven weeks, or forty-nine years, should be allowed for the restoration of the Jewish state; from which time till the public entrance of the Messiah on the work of the ministry should be sixty-two weeks, or four hundred and thirty-four years, in all four hundred and eighty-three years.

From the coming of our Lord, the third period is to be dated, viz., "He shall confirm the covenant with many for one week," that is seven years, Daniel 9:27. ...

... These seven years, added to the four hundred and eighty-three, complete the four hundred and ninety years, or seventy prophetic weeks ...

... [vs 27] I have only to add that this mode of reckoning years and periods by weeks is not solely Jewish. Macrobius, in his book on Scipio's dream, has these remarkable words: Sed a sexta usque ad septimam septimanam fit quidem diminutio, sed occulta, et quae detrimentum suum aperta defectione non prodat: ideo nonnullarum rerumpublicarum hic mos est, ut post sextam ad militiam nemo cogatur; Somn. Scip., lib. 1 c. , in fine. "From the sixth to the seventh week, there is a diminution of strength; but it is hidden, and does not manifest itself by any outward defect. Hence it was the custom in some republics not to oblige a man to go to the wars after the sixth week, i.e., after forty-two years of age." ...” - Daniel 9 Clarke's Commentary

Revelation 12:14:

"... It is said here that the period for which the woman should be nourished in the wilderness would be a time, times, and a half; consequently this period is the same with the twelve hundred and sixty days of Rev_12:6. ...

... by understanding a time to signify a year; times, two years; and half a time, half a year; i.e., three years and a half. And as each prophetic year contains three hundred and sixty days, so three years and a half will contain precisely twelve hundred and sixty days. The Apocalypse being highly symbolical, it is reasonable to expect that its periods of time will also be represented symbolically, that the prophecy may be homogeneous in all its parts. The Holy Spirit, when speaking of years symbolically, has invariably represented them by days, commanding, e. gr., the Prophet Ezekiel to lie upon his left side three hundred and ninety days, that it might be a sign or symbol of the house of Israel bearing their iniquity as many years; and forty days upon his right side, to represent to the house of Judah in a symbolical manner, that they should bear their iniquity forty years, The one thousand two hundred and threescore days, therefore, that the woman is fed in the wilderness, must be understood symbolically, and consequently denote as many natural years. ...

... The woman is nourished for one thousand two hundred and threescore years from the face of the serpent, …" - Revelation 12 Clarke's Commentary
 

ReChoired

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... Zech 6:12-13
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:


13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.
KJV


That Zech.6 Scripture was initially for the time after Judah's return from Babylon to build the 2nd temple, but included some parameters than can only be meant for the end of this world. Just Who is that "man whose name is The BRANCH"? That is a symbolic name for our Lord Jesus Christ, He is The Branch of Isaiah 11:1, i.e., Jesus Christ.

Isa 11:1-2
11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
KJV
Jesus states that He already is the Branch, not will become (future) the Branch:

Jer_33:15 In those days, and at that time, will I cause the Branch of righteousness to grow up unto David; and he shall execute judgment and righteousness in the land.

Rom_15:12 And again, Esaias saith, There shall be a root of Jesse, and he that shall rise to reign over the Gentiles; in him shall the Gentiles trust.

Rev_5:5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

Rev_22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.​

As the prophecy of Zechariah speaks of the First Advent wherein Jesus began building the Third Temple (Ezekiel) in Himself, as He laid the Foundation at Calvary, saying, "It is finished.", and thus the remaining "lively stones" (Christians) were to be built upon Him:

1Co 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

Eph 2:21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Luk_6:48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

Luk 14:29 Lest haply, after he hath laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him,
For the Temple of God is one not built by human hands, but by God Himself.

Thus you have your timing terribly wrong, because the Antichrist comes FIRST, and that is who is to sit in a stone temple in Jerusalem at the end proclaiming himself as God.
Unfortunately you are doing what the Pharisees, Sadducees and scribes did in Jesus' day, only in reverse. While they confused the texts of the second advent with the first, you confuse the first advent with the second. You are repeating history in history's chiasm.

Jesus returns to Jerusalem to defeat the coming Antichrist and his army, and destroy this new temple the Antichrist is going to build for the Jews in our time; but the temple Jesus will build when He comes will be the final temple of Zech.6, which is the same temple layout of Ezekiel 40 thru 47. That is for Christ's future "thousand years" on earth with His elect, not for the very end of this world prior... to His return. You are all mixed up!
Revelation 20, in the third advent sees Jesus defeat the armies which surround New Jerusalem, which settles on the Mount of Olives to the east (not Moriah, where old Jerusalem was), which is also seen in Zechariah 14.
 

ReChoired

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...1. Before the 70th week of Daniel there will literally be a third temple in Jerusalem, erected by unbelieving Jews. ...
Daniel 9:25, speaks of the second Temple, built after Solomon's temple was destroyed by the Babylonians, which would be built after the captivity and ending of the 70 years of exile. This was fulfilled in Ezra (see Ezra 6:14 and connect to Daniel 9:25, "the commandment") and Nehemiah and Esther. Jesus even refers to this Second Temple, and Himself as the greater Temple (Third):

Mat_12:6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.

Joh_2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
A 'temple' erected by 'unbelieving Jews' would not be a Temple of God.

The Temple Build by God (even Jesus) is the Temple of the Living God, made not with human hands, but rather by the Arm of the LORD.
 
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ReChoired

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...As you can see I have just touched on the subject without going into all the related Scripture. Those 2,300 days of Daniel are 6 years, 4 months, and 21 days during which that temple in Jerusalem will be desecrated and polluted. That is almost the 7 years of the 70th week of Daniel.
Yep, an 'almost' prophecy of the vain imagination, with a sliding time scale (as if God, the wonderful numberer (Dan. 8:13), just couldn't quite get the math to work out right, and needed to borrow from 'Common Core' and fudged the decimal places). It is simply amazing how people have to mess with the 2,300 of Daniel 8:14, and either alter it directly (saying it means 1150 :rolleyes:), or alters its position in relation to 70 7's (saying it is a part of the 70th 7, rather than the 70 7's being a part, "determined" (cut off, section, apportioned) from the 2,300 as the text clearly states. The whole of Daniel 8:13 in which the question was asked, "How long the vision ..." and they somehow ignore Medo-Persia (which began the "vision"), Greece, Rome, etc in the timeframe, and place it at some unknown time in the future. Jesuit futurism is truly confused, and self-refuting. They speak about a temple being rebuilt in future, when that was in the beginning of the 70 weeks, in the first 7 7's, not the last 'week' of 7 days of the 70.

The 2,300 Day/Years is exact, and already completed, even to the very "hour", "day", "month" and "year", see Revelation 9:13-15. 457 BC (Dan. 9:25, "the commandment"; Ezra 6:14; chap. 7) unto AD 1844, see also "hour" Revelation 14:6-7; "day" & "month" Leviticus 16 and 23:26-32; 1 Kings 8:2; and "year" (Daniel 8:13-14,26; 9:24-27, etc)
 
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ReChoired

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So you claim the temple spoken of by Paul to the Thessalonians being the temple of God...you also claim that no man can corrupt God's temple...yet claim that Antichrist does just that...and then Jesus arrives to destroy God's temple? Surely you see how inconsistent, self contradictory, and desperate this scenario is? You are so determined to protect the papacy any old tired theory will do right so long as people don't read it right?
They cannot acknowledge the people of God, Christians, as the third Temple, lest they agree that their position is in error.

Truth:

[1] Solomon's Temple; 1 Kings 8

[2] 2nd Temple (Ezra, Nehemiah, etc); Matthew 12:6

[3] Body of Christ (Ezekiel)


Joh 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Joh 2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Joh 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.​

Yet, what they (futurists of Jesuitism) see is this:

[1] Solomon's Temple; 1 Kings 8

[2] 2nd Temple (Ezra, Nehemiah, etc); Matthew 12:6

[intercalation of Christians, as a temple, but not really the third, but a third, but not really, no really ...]
[3] some imaginary unbelieving jew built structure in modern day Judea.​

This means that the people of God, have been without a temple for the last 2000 years., and what Paul said about "we have an altar" was wrong:

Heb_13:10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.​
 
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ReChoired

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...That is for Christ's future "thousand years" on earth with His elect...
The “reign upon the earth” comes after 1,000 years [Revelation 20:2,3,4,5,6,7], for the “saints” must be both resurrected and/or translated, glorified, and brought back to Heaven [John 14:1-4; 1 Thessalonians 4:17, etc] at the Second Advent and First Great Resurrection, to “reign” in Heaven, for 1,000 years [Revelation 20:4,5a,6] going over the record books of the lost [1 Corinthians 6:2,3; Psalms 149:1-9]:

[1] The thousand years reign “in Heaven” [Psalms 50:5; Matthew 5:3,8,10,12, 6:20, 13:30, 24:31; Mark 10:21, 13:27; Luke 6:23, 18:22, 23:43; John 14:2-3, 17:24; Colossians 1:5; Hebrews 10:34; 1 Peter 1:4; Revelation 7:9, 14:3, 19:1; “Paradise”, Luke 23:43; 2 Corinthians 12:4; Revelation 2:7] with Christ Jesus [1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; Revelation 20:6] and

[2] The “reign on earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth; 2 Peter 3:13; Isaiah 65:17, 66:22; Revelation 21:1] that lasts forever and ever [Revelation 5:10; “meek inherit earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth], Psalms 37:9,11,34; Proverbs 11:31; Isaiah 25:8, 65:21; Daniel 7:27; Matthew 5:5; Revelation 5:10].​
 

Bobby Jo

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ReChoired said:
The context of Daniel 11:1-2, is in the context of Daniel 10:1, in the third year of Cyrus II the Great, and it was he who was then ruling during the time as the angel Gabriel was speaking to Daniel. ...


Bobby Jo said:
Ummmmmm, have you FIRST considered that 1:21 "contradicts" 10:1?

http://m.ccel.org/ccel/calvin/calcom24.vii.xx.html?bcb=right


Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but this is by no means in accordance with the history. Their opinion is right who say that Daniel continued to the first year of the reign of Cyrus in the discharge of the prophetic office, although expositors do not openly say so; but I state openly what they say obscurely. For since he afterwards set out into Media, they say this change is denoted here. But we may understand the words better in the sense of Daniel’s flourishing among the Chaldeans and Assyrians, and being acknowledged as a celebrated Prophet; because he is known to have interpreted King Belshszzar’s vision, on the very night on which he was slain. The word here is simple and complete — he was — but it depends on the succeeding ones, since he always obtained the confidence and authority of a Prophet with the kings of Babylon. This, then, is the true sense.
According to Calvin's expositors, Daniel DIED (was "broken") in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus. So can you explain how he was alive in the "third year of Cyrus"?

Now be careful because the Scriptures which you disdain in deference to your doctrines, are PERFECTLY CORRECT as WRITTEN. Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus. -- Same Daniel, same Cyrus. -- And BOTH Verses are PERFECTLY CORRECT as Written.



ReChoired said:
... um, because scripture says so? ...



Bobby Jo said:
Hahahaha, -- YOU ARE A FUNNY GUY!

You couldn't solve a riddle if the answer was given to you: What has four tires and flies? -- A garbage truck.

Garbage trucks can FLY?!?
Don't be stupid. Solve the riddle.
Bobby Jo


I guess @ReChoired has no answer for this simple concept, but insists he can "teach" you the DIFFICULT CONCEPTS.


If someone can't get the easy stuff, they shouldn't attempt the complex,
Bobby Jo