Age of Earth/Mankind Bible Study Thread - Sacred Chronology

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ReChoired

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@ReChoired

Have you ever seen an earthquake in the oceans around the island that you live on. I assume that you live on this island: -
View attachment 8130
Yes, I live on that Island, in town of IliIli, directly across from Iakina Academy, Iakina SDA Church. Yes, especially upon the Tongan and Fijian fault lines (Ring of Fire), and had several within 2019, one even causing the place I dwelt in to sway for about 15-20 seconds. - Today's Earthquakes in American Samoa

Yet, those quakes are merely the prophesied, "earthquakes, in divers places" (Matthew 24:7; Mark 13:8; Luke 21:11).

The Great Lisbon Earthquake (Revelation 6:12) (AD 1755, November 1) literally shook the world, and within the timeframe spoken of by prophecy of the 1,260 day/years (Daniel & Revelation) which terminated in A.D. 1798. This earthquake (anti-type) follows the first earthquake in Jesus' death (Matthew 27:51-54), with following events in between (now repeating globally), to be ended with the appearing of Jesus (Revelation 16:18), just as the second earthquake in Jesus' day in His resurrection (Matthew 28:2). Thus the pattern (type to anti-type):

Earthquake
Silence in Heaven
Events, such as Temple Service cease, etc
Disciples go through period of trouble in that they appear to be forsaken of Heaven
Earthquake
Angels appear with Jesus and return to Heaven with trophies of the specially resurrected​

Much more detail may be given, but rest assured, Ecclesiastes 1:9, 3:15, etc are true to every word.

Revelation 6:12 is dealing with literal, natural physical events. For instance, see vs, 16, the "the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together". That is no figure of speech, but the real destruction of the atmosphere when Jesus returns, see for instance, Matthew 24:35; Mark 13:31; Luke 21:33; 2 Peter 3:10; Psalms 102:26; Isaiah 51:6, etc. The other events are tied to the same language, and even to the timeframe given by Daniel previously and also found in Revelation (11-13).

in the American Samoan Islands group.
Yes, I know them by experience. I am on it right now, and have been for some time. Malo!

The Greek word is used in Matthew 28:2 is the same Greek word found in Matthew 8:24 which describes the turmoil in the sea as Jesus was asleep in the boat and the disciples feared for their lives because of the standing waves etc., that could swamp their boat and sink it.

This same Greek word as found in the Matthew 8:24 is also found in the following passages: - Matthew 28:2, Acts 16:26, Revelation 6:12, 11:13, 11:19, 16:18, 16:18, all of them with the meaning of "turmoil."
Yes, the word carries the meaning of 'upheaval', which is what an 'earthquake' is, whether naturally or spiritually. Yet, context always dictates the meaning, of whether it is natural or spiritual. We do not get to pick and choose which is which, for God determines; Genesis 40:8; 2 Peter 1:20, etc. For instance in Matthew 8, consider the difference between it and Revelation 6:12.

Open your Bibles to Matthew 8:23-27; Mark 4:35-41; Luke 8:22-25 KJB; more specifically the Mark passages, and consider them in the light of Ecclesiastes 1:9; 3:15 and 1 Corinthians 15:44-46 KJB, in that history is to repeat, and the natural explains the spiritual, and that Antichrist will counterfeit everything that Jesus did.

In those passages we see Jesus get into a boat, a ship, with his disciples and set sail across the Sea of Galilee [Tiberius, etc], and while Jesus is asleep a massive storm, with terrific winds, sweeps over them suddenly, and the disciples do all in their own power and strength to bail out the incoming waters, and to forcefully row through it. They are about to sink, when they turn to Jesus and wake him up, and Jesus stands in the midst and says to the raging winds and sea, waters, PEACE, BE STILL, and there follows calm, tranquility, peace and stability, even then, they are suddenly safe, and in awe, and the disciples worship him, for they see that Jesus controls these things by his very word.

Now, Antichrist is about to counterfeit this miracle. Watch and see:

The "sea", being a bowl or basin, in which "water" accumulates [Genesis 1:9,10,22; Isaiah 11:9; Jeremiah 52:17,20; Revelation 4:6, 15:2 KJB], which "water" is representative of peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues [Isaiah 57:20; Revelation 17:15; Psalms 65:7; Isaiah 17:12,13; Jeremiah 51:42 KJB, etc]. It can also represent the bowl or basin (Laver) of the Sanctuary [Psalms 77:13,19 KJB and 1 Kings 7:23-25,39,44; 2 Kings 25:13,16; 1 Chronicles 18:8; 2 Chronicles 4:2-4,6,19 KJB].

In the days of Joseph, money failed in the land of Egypt (represents the secular world and worldliness, the contrast to Canaan, promised land), and money failed in the land of Canaan (the religious world, populated by God's peoples, the heavenly minded), see Genesis 47:15,16 KJB.

History is repeating itself, and we, who are truly Joseph's, will know what needs to be done, even as Daniel in Babylon. Yet, the world will seek the miracles of Antichrist, not desiring to give up their sinful ways.

Just as Jesus was in the boat, so too now Antichrist.

The "boat", or "ship", represents the 'houses' which carry cargo, driven by winds, even the fierce winds of war, strife, competition, etc (which merchants cause wars, that they may play both sided to always win, and reap rewards, the Hegelian, Jesuitical principle, Ordo ab Chao (Order comes through Chaos/Revolution)), and the ship trades upon the "seas", the "waters", and is thus the ECONOMIC and FINANCIAL entities, dealing in trade, commerce, money markets, stock markets, banks, monopolies (like the Federal Reserve System, Central Banks, the mint cartels), business operations, merchants of the earth, the masters of the Gold, Silver, Brass, Iron, Tin, and precious metals, ores, things, and even all valuable commodities, even animals, people as slaves, and weather control, for profit (1 Kings 9:26-28; 2 Chronicles 8:18, 9:20,21; Psalms 104:25,26, 107:23; Proverbs 31:14; Isaiah 60:9; Ezekiel 27:9,12-36; Daniel 11:30; Jeremiah 50:37; Luke 5:7 ("partners", ie. in business); James 3:4 ("winds"); Revelation 18:3,11-19,23 KJB, etc.)

Yet, right now the money markets are going up and down as the tempest tossed waves, and water is coming in, and though the persons in the boat are struggling with all their might, the whole system is about to go under and drown.

What will those in the boat do, seeing no hope in sight, and men's knowledge and strength fail? They will turn to a spiritual leader, whom they think can deliver them, one that they think is Christ-like. They will turn to the Antichrist, because they are deceived.

Antichrist will arise and pronounce over the system of things, PEACE, BE STILL (and SAFETY, CALM, TRANQUILITY, STABILITY), and it will appear to work ... for a season ... but scripture says, sudden destruction will follow this Nation Sunday Law and market, climate change legislation.

They are actually fighting against the true God of Heaven, even the Lamb.

"... The world is no more ready to credit the message for this time than were the Jews to receive the Saviour's warning concerning Jerusalem. Come when it may, the day of God will come unawares to the ungodly. When life is going on in its unvarying round; when men are absorbed in pleasure, in business, in traffic, in money-making; when religious leaders are magnifying the world's progress and enlightenment, and the people are lulled in a false security--then, as the midnight thief steals within the unguarded dwelling, so shall sudden destruction come upon the careless and ungodly, "and they shall not escape." 1 Thessalonians 5:3 KJB ..." - The Great Controversy (1911), page 38.1

Look up Luke 21:25 KJB, see "perplexity", as it means, 'no way out', 'no human solution will solve', 'confounded', 'all things tried and failed, not knowing what to do'.

There is only one Way out. Jesus (John 14:6,15; Exodus 20:6 KJB), see John 14:1-3 KJB.

Consider carefully what the disciples were doing in that storm-tossed boat? They were taking on water, and desperately, and hopelessly bailing out water, but it miserably fails.

What do you call a business or government that is financially failing?

That which is about to GO UNDER.

What do you call the financial aide to such entities?

A BAIL OUT

Brothers and sisters, the bail outs will fail soon. They will then turn to Antichrist and the New New Deal, which is tied to the environment and weather.

I have told you beforehand that when it does come to pass you might believe ...

You are looking for "earthquakes" in the Book of Revelation
No. I am simply "read[ing]" (Revelation 1:3) it.

whereas I am looking for
Yes, this is the issue. I am reading it, and you are, by your own admission, "looking for". I am not "looking for" therein, but "read[ing]" what it says. Yours is eisegesis.

description of turmoil occurring among the people, which are often associated with battles and wars.
Spiritual earthquakes deal with more than 'battles and wars' as I showed above.

Perhaps your letters represent a person who has been brainwashed into accepting what you know. Not something that you have discovered.

Shalom
I am quite aware of what others make the scripture to say, as well as what the scripture actually reads.
 
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Jay Ross

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The question I asked was: -
Have you ever seen an earthquake in the oceans around the island that you live on.
The answer you provided was: -
Yes, I live on that Island, in town of IliIli, directly across from Iakina Academy, Iakina SDA Church. Yes, especially upon the Tongan and Fijian fault lines (Ring of Fire), and had several within 2019, one even causing the place I dwelt in to sway for about 15-20 seconds.
Now earthquakes can only occur in solid materials, and yes, you felt the earth shaking from a fault dislocation in the rocks at a depth of 10 kms, below the surface, some distant from your island, that moved. You cannot get an "earthquake" in a "liquid" or a "gas" which is the point in the Matthew 8:24 account: -

Matt 8:24: - 24 And suddenly a great tempest/turmoil arose on the sea, so that the boat was covered with the waves.​

which is confirmed also in the following passages: -

Mark 4:37: - 37 And a great windstorm arose, and the waves beat into the boat, so that it was already filling.

Luke 8:23: - 23 But as they sailed He fell asleep. And a windstorm came down on the lake, and they were filling with water, and were in jeopardy.
Now if the understanding of G:4578, seismós is to be consistent with all of its occurrences in the NT in the following references, Matthew 8:24, 28:2, Acts 16:26, Revelation 6:12, 11:13, 11:19, 16:18, 16:18, then in all of the above references it should be understood to have been translated using the English word "turmoil" rather than the English word "earthquake".

Let us consider Matt 27:54 where seismós is also found

Matt 27:51-54: - 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.

54 So when the centurion and those with him, who were guarding Jesus, saw the earthquake/turmoil and the things that had happened, they feared greatly, saying, "Truly this was the Son of God!"
The centurion comment was not based on the single event of the earth quaking but on a whole observation of what had and was happening around them.

The same is also true in Matt 28:2 where the question we should be considering is, "How can an Angel, coming down out of heaven cause an earthquake?" From the brief account provided in the Gospels, those that saw the Angel who came down to roll the stone away from the entrance to the tomb, were in turmoil and ran away from guarding the tomb.

It is for these very logical reasons that I do not believe that there will be "earthquakes" associated with the End Time Prophecies as give in the Book of Revelation. What I believe is being described is the turmoil that will be associated with the events described in those respective passages. The turmoil can be wars, or simply people running amuck and killing 7,000 people in Jerusalem when the two witnesses come back to life.

Our understanding has come a long way from what was considered to be the truth from over 100 years ago.

Shalom
 

ReChoired

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The question I asked was: -

The answer you provided was: -

Now earthquakes can only occur in solid materials, and yes, you felt the earth shaking from a fault dislocation in the rocks at a depth of 10 kms, below the surface, some distant from your island, that moved. You cannot get an "earthquake" in a "liquid" or a "gas" which is the point in the Matthew 8:24 account: -

Matt 8:24: - 24 And suddenly a great tempest/turmoil arose on the sea, so that the boat was covered with the waves.​

which is confirmed also in the following passages: -

Mark 4:37: - 37 And a great windstorm arose, and the waves beat into the boat, so that it was already filling.

Luke 8:23: - 23 But as they sailed He fell asleep. And a windstorm came down on the lake, and they were filling with water, and were in jeopardy.
Now if the understanding of G:4578, seismós is to be consistent with all of its occurrences in the NT in the following references, Matthew 8:24, 28:2, Acts 16:26, Revelation 6:12, 11:13, 11:19, 16:18, 16:18, then in all of the above references it should be understood to have been translated using the English word "turmoil" rather than the English word "earthquake".

Let us consider Matt 27:54 where seismós is also found

Matt 27:51-54: - 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.

54 So when the centurion and those with him, who were guarding Jesus, saw the earthquake/turmoil and the things that had happened, they feared greatly, saying, "Truly this was the Son of God!"
The centurion comment was not based on the single event of the earth quaking but on a whole observation of what had and was happening around them.

The same is also true in Matt 28:2 where the question we should be considering is, "How can an Angel, coming down out of heaven cause an earthquake?" From the brief account provided in the Gospels, those that saw the Angel who came down to roll the stone away from the entrance to the tomb, were in turmoil and ran away from guarding the tomb.

It is for these very logical reasons that I do not believe that there will be "earthquakes" associated with the End Time Prophecies as give in the Book of Revelation. What I believe is being described is the turmoil that will be associated with the events described in those respective passages. The turmoil can be wars, or simply people running amuck and killing 7,000 people in Jerusalem when the two witnesses come back to life.

Our understanding has come a long way from what was considered to be the truth from over 100 years ago.

Shalom
Again, you do not know language, neither scripture, nor even simple context; but make up what you want.

The word, G4578, "σεισμός", "seismos",

as for Matthew 8:24, "tempest", it means that the sea was in an uproar, rocking, swaying violently, in upheaval, in great swelling waves, splashings, so that the waves of water came into the boat. It is literally shaking water.

in Matthew 13:7-8, we see the delineation between [1] "wars" already described, the turbulence among people, and [2] "earthquakes", the turbulence of landmasses. The two are separately identified and are not the same events, and so also in Luke 21:10-11, first the [1] "nation shall rise against, and kingdom against kingdom", and then it afterward mentions [2] the shaking of the landmasses. Therefore, [1] signs among people, and [2] signs among the earth itself, for Paul even states that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth (Romans 8:22).​

related to G4579, "σείω", "seio" (meaning to "shake; the body as with fear"; see Matthew 28:4, "shake; the world, as with an earthquake"; see Hebrews 12:26; "shake, or move; as in a people stirred up", see Matthew 21:10; "shake, as in earthquake", see Matthew 27:51; "shake, as in the heavens, things fall to the ground, as 'stars'"; see Revelation 6:13).

Matthew 27:51, in the context of the first earthquake when Jesus died, reads:

Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.​

The very earthquake, from God's own presence on earth (see also Mt. Sinai events; Exodus 19:18), whose hand tore the veil in the temple from Top to Bottom, caused the rocks to split, and the graves to be opened. A real 'earth'-'quake'.

The same goes for the 'earthquake' when Jesus was resurrected and the Angel (Gabriel) came down. The earthquake takes place first, then the men 'shake' with fear' after seeing the Angel. That is two events, [1] shaking of earth, [2] shaking of the men, from fear.

This is the same as when Angels came down to hear the singing in the prison, with Paul:

Act 16:26 And suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that the foundations of the prison were shaken: and immediately all the doors were opened, and every one's bands were loosed.​

The whole area of ground shook.

The final earthquake (Revelation 16:18; whose context is that Mountains and Island flee away, cities are brought low), is foretold also in Isaiah:

Isa_2:19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.​

Isa_2:21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.​

Isa_13:13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.​

So also in Ezekiel:

Eze_38:20 So that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence, and the mountains shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.​

So also Joel:

Joe_3:16 The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.​

So also Haggai:

Hag_2:6 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; Yet once, it is a little while, and I will shake the heavens, and the earth, and the sea, and the dry land;

Hag_2:21 Speak to Zerubbabel, governor of Judah, saying, I will shake the heavens and the earth;​

So also Paul, citing OT:

Heb_12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.
Only two things are possible then in your eisegesis.

[1] you are simply ignorant of scripture, context, language, and thus need to accept correction,

[2] you are willingly choosing to ignore facts of context, language and scripture, and thus need to humble yourself, and accept what God says, rather that what you want God to have said.
Even in the so-called lxx, the word "seismos" means earthquake, a shaking, and may be applied, contextually either naturally or spiritually. - Kata Biblon Wiki Lexicon - σεισμός - earthquake (n.)

For instance see, Amos 1:1; Zechariah 14:5

Amo 1:1 The words of Amos, who was among the herdmen of Tekoa, which he saw concerning Israel in the days of Uzziah king of Judah, and in the days of Jeroboam the son of Joash king of Israel, two years before the earthquake.

Amo 1:1 Λόγοι Αμως, οἳ ἐγένοντο ἐν νακκαριμ ἐκ Θεκουε, οὓς εἶδεν ὑπὲρ Ιερουσαλημ ἐν ἡμέραις Οζιου βασιλέως Ιουδα καὶ ἐν ἡμέραις Ιεροβοαμ τοῦ Ιωας βασιλέως Ισραηλ πρὸ δύο ἐτῶν τοῦ σεισμοῦ.

Zec 14:5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

Zec 14:5 καὶ ἐμφραχθήσεται φάραγξ ὀρέων μου, καὶ ἐγκολληθήσεται φάραγξ ὀρέων ἕως Ιασολ καὶ ἐμφραχθήσεται καθὼς ἐνεφράγη ἐν ταῖς ἡμέραις τοῦ σεισμοῦ ἐν ἡμέραις Οζιου βασιλέως Ιουδα· καὶ ἥξει κύριος ὁ θεός μου καὶ πάντες οἱ ἅγιοι μετ᾿ αὐτοῦ.​
 

Jay Ross

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Again, you do not know language, neither scripture, nor even simple context; but make up what you want.

Why is it that you have to put others down? Particularly when you express the same pictures as that person in another way. For example, when you wrote: -

The word, G4578, "σεισμός", "seismos",

as for Matthew 8:24, "tempest", it means that the sea was in an uproar, rocking, swaying violently, in upheaval, in great swelling waves, splashings, so that the waves of water came into the boat. It is literally shaking water.

you described the same events that I had used with the word turmoil. By claiming that there was a tempest, that caused the sea to be in uproar. Now wind on open waters does not cause uproar or turmoil in the water, but in a closed water situation like Lake Galilee the reflected waves from the shoreline would cause standing waves to occur that would stand up and swamp a boat quickly if the boat was in the wrong location relative to wave patterns generated by the wind and the reflected waves.

in Matthew 13/24:7-8, we see the delineation between [1] "wars" already described, the turbulence among people, and [2] "earthquakes", the turbulence of landmasses. The two are separately identified and are not the same events,
Matt 24:7-8: - 7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes/turmoil in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

and so also in Luke 21:10-11, first the [1] "nation shall rise against, and kingdom against kingdom", and then it afterward mentions [2] the shaking of the landmasses. Therefore, [1] signs among people, and [2] signs among the earth itself,
Luke 21:10-11: - 10 Then He said to them, "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 11 And there will be great earthquakes/turmoil in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.

for Paul even states that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth (Romans 8:22).

related to G4579, "σείω", "seio" (meaning to "shake; the body as with fear"; see Matthew 28:4, "shake; the world, as with an earthquake"; see Hebrews 12:26; "shake, or move; as in a people stirred up", see Matthew 21:10; "shake, as in earthquake", see Matthew 27:51; "shake, as in the heavens, things fall to the ground, as 'stars'"; see Revelation 6:13).

Matthew 27:51, in the context of the first earthquake when Jesus died, reads:

Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

The very earthquake, from God's own presence on earth (see also Mt. Sinai events; Exodus 19:18), whose hand tore the veil in the temple from Top to Bottom, caused the rocks to split, and the graves to be opened. A real 'earth'-'quake'.

I have not issue with the above, but when we read the next verse I do: -

Matt 27:54: - 54 So when the centurion and those with him, who were guarding Jesus, saw the earthquake/turmoil and the things that had happened, they feared greatly, saying, "Truly this was the Son of God!"

The same goes for the 'earthquake' when Jesus was resurrected and the Angel (Gabriel) came down. The earthquake takes place first, then the men 'shake' with fear' after seeing the Angel. That is two events, [1] shaking of earth, [2] shaking of the men, from fear.

This is your spin on the facts. Another way of considering the verse is this that when the angel came down from heave, the soldiers guarding the tomb were in great turmoil when they saw the angel descending, it was something that they had not experienced before.

This is the same as when Angels came down to hear the singing in the prison, with Paul:

Act 16:26 And suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that the foundations of the prison were shaken: and immediately all the doors were opened, and every one's bands were loosed.

The whole area of ground shook.

It is my view that this verse is poorly translated and would read better and be more understandable if it had been translated in the following manner.

Acts 16:26: - And suddenly there was great turmoil as the foundations of the prison were shaken such that the door of the prison were opened and the prisoner’s shackles were loosened suddenly

The final earthquake (Revelation 16:18; whose context is that Mountains and Island flee away, cities are brought low), is foretold also in Isaiah:

Isa_2:19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.

Isa_2:21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.

Isa_13:13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

So also in Ezekiel:

Eze_38:20 So that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence, and the mountains shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.

So also Joel:

Joe_3:16 The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.

So also Haggai:

Hag_2:6 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; Yet once, it is a little while, and I will shake the heavens, and the earth, and the sea, and the dry land;

Hag_2:21 Speak to Zerubbabel, governor of Judah, saying, I will shake the heavens and the earth;

So also Paul, citing OT:

Heb_12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

That is you way of explaining the scriptures but you have looked at the prophecies from a literal perspective and not from a metaphorical perspective where for example the mountains is a reference to the “religion” of the people described in the respective verses.

Only two things are possible then in your eisegesis.

[1] you are simply ignorant of scripture, context, language, and thus need to accept correction,

[2] you are willingly choosing to ignore facts of context, language and scripture, and thus need to humble yourself, and accept what God says, rather that what you want God to have said.


Even in the so-called lxx, the word "seismos" means earthquake, a shaking, and may be applied, contextually either naturally or spiritually. - Kata Biblon Wiki Lexicon - σεισμός - earthquake (n.)
. . . .

So, you then revert back to your false argument of attacking the person rather than the content of their post with false claims against the person.

You believe that your understanding is beyond correction and as such you can bring correction to others based on your POVs even when they are questioned by others outside of your click that you have immersed yourself in.

It is my view that my understanding of the scriptures accurately reflects what is recorded in the scriptures, and I have yet to read any argument that would justify my changing of my POV.

You can believe that your understanding is above reproach, and as far as I am concerned, you can be stubborn in your defence, but when your defence borders on personal attack of the other poster, your justification goes out the window.

Shalom
 

ReChoired

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It is my view that this verse is poorly translated and would read better and be more understandable if it had been translated in the following manner.

Acts 16:26: - And suddenly there was great turmoil as the foundations of the prison were shaken such that the door of the prison were opened and the prisoner’s shackles were loosened suddenly
You are willingly blind (and desire to be so), and only you can take your hands off your eyes, and see the highlighted red portion of your own private translation (interpretation), which refutes your own translation, and not a single translation (listed) does so as you do - Acts 16:26 - Bible Gateway
 

ReChoired

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Why is it that you have to put others down? ...
Shalom
You assume truth is a put down, when all it does is put into perspective, and even place, the error you continually spout.
 
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ReChoired

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Where???

Allow me to continue some more.

Earthquake – Lisbon, AD November 1, 1755 (to be followed up, there was an earthquake at Jesus death, and there was an earthquake at His resurrection (both of which involved Angels, including Gabriel), interesting is the fact that there are endtime events which parallel those in the events of Jesus in AD 31, sandwiched between two earthquakes, like a special resurrection, etc, see details in the Desire of Ages and Great Controversy)

Dark Day (Sun/Moon) – AD May 19, 1780

Stars – AD November 13, 1833

Heaven Departed as a scroll (not Yet, still Future) (like as a veil)​

...
Additional dates of note:

457 BC [begins the 2,300, and thus the portion of it, the 70 weeks [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24]

AD 26 [begins John the Baptist, the forerunner of Jesus' first Advent]

AD 27 [ends the 7 + 62 [69] weeks of KJB Daniel 9:25-26; Mark 1:15, and begins the final week, KJB Daniel 9:27]

AD 31 [ends the midst of [3 ½] the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27, begins the 5 anti-typical months of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 from Pentecost, until 1833/34 with warning of Judgment to come by William Miller in AD 1833/34]

AD 34 [ends the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27]

AD 70 [end of the “generation”, within 40 years of Jesus' prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem by Rome under Titus; KJB Matthew 23:36, 24:2; Mark 13:2; Luke 19:44, 21:6]

AD 303 [begins the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]

AD 313 [ends the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]

AD 508 [begins the 1,290 of KJB Daniel 12:11 and 1,335 of KJB Daniel 12:12]

AD 538 [begins the 1,260, forty and two months, time, times and dividing of time, of KJB Daniel 7:25, 12:7; Revelation 11:2,3, 12:6,14, 13:5; Luke 21:24]

AD 1755 [November 1, earthquake that shook the world; KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]

AD 1776 [Beast out of the earth with two horns like a Lamb [Church without a pope, and State without a King, Protestantism, Republicanism], begins to arise with the aide of France, to become the USA, KJB Revelation 13:11]

AD 1780 [May 19, dark day, sun and moon, KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]

AD 1793 [begins the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France]

AD 1797 [ends the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France, see also Revelation 11:13, in the political upheaval of France, 1/10 of the 10 horns of KJB Daniel 7:7]

AD 1798 [ends the 1,290 and 1,260, ending in the beginning of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], and France removed from helping USA]

AD 1833 [November 13th, stars falling; KJB Luke 21:25; Revelation 6:13, time of the 6th Seal; 40 day/years anti-type from 1793-1833, just as Jesus was 40 days with the disciples before Pentecost]

AD 1833/4 [ends the 5th Trumpet of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 in the Feast of Trumpets, 5 anti-typical months from Pentecost in AD 31.]

AD 1842-1844 [First and Second Angels messages go forward, KJB Revelation 14:6-8 and Midnight Cry of Matthew 25:6, in first phase; 1843; the 50th year from 1793, Jubilee, 10 day/years from 1833]

AD 1844 [ends the 1,335 and 2,300, ending in the ending of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], the “daily” becomes the “yearly”, and 10 years after Feast of Trumpets [1833/34] is now October 22 1844, the Day of Atonement begins; Leviticus 16 & 23; Revelation 14:7, thus given also as the hour [of His judgment, KJB Revelation 14:6-7], day [10th day, Day of Atonement; KJB Leviticus 23:26-32], month [7th month, Ethanim; KJB Leviticus 23:27; 1 Kings 8:2], year [KJB Daniel 8:14, 12:12] in Revelation 9's the sixth Trumpet introduction [KJB Revelation 9:13-15]]

AD 1844 [Third Angels Message goes forward; KJB Revelation 14:9-12]

AD 1880's-1888 [first siege, as in the days of Cestius of Rome, Sunday laws begin to be passed and persecution was happening, Blair Bill almost goes through, but is suddenly halted]

AD 1989 [Holy Alliance - USA [2nd Beast of KJB Revelation 13] teams with Vatican/Papacy [First Beast of KJB Revelation 13] to help bring down USSR]

AD 1990 [the USA, the sole remaining Super-power, “all the power”, “power over” the nations, as per KJB Revelation 13:2,3,7,12,16]

AD 1995 [Christian coalition seeking to gain Roman support]

AD 1999 [Catholics/Lutherans reach agreement]

AD 2001 [tower fell 9/11, just as type foretold, KJB Luke 13:4]

AD 2004 [3rd Event; Sunday being promoted more and more; Roman Catholicism joins Christian Coalition]

AD 2005 [4th Event; Leading Protestant Churches unite on common doctrines; KJB Revelation 13:11,12,14 “they should make an image to the beast” - Catholic Universal, One World Church; see KJB Revelation 13:7,8, “war” [state], “worship” [church]]

AD 2008 [5th Event; National/International money crisis truly begins, KJB Luke 12:25, “with perplexity”, which will become worldwide and in the church, KJB Genesis 47:13,15; effecting a new economic system to come, and buying and selling effected eventually, KJB Revelation 13:7; Daniel 11:43]

AD 2013 [July 4th; Francis I [the Jesuit], Benedict XVI [Master of the Office of the Inquisition] invoke the weapon of war, just as type foretold, Caiaphas and Annas, KJB Luke 3:2, about to finish the King of the South off [6th Head, the Beast from the bottomless pit of KJB Revelation 11], Secular Humanism/Atheism as ruling power, and the false reliance of Israel, to turn over into the Healing of the deadly wound of the First Beast of Revelation 13:1, when persecution arises in the USA]

AD 2015 [Sept. 22-27th, Francis I [the Jesuit] speaks at Washington D.C., which sits between Mary-land and Virgin-ia]

AD 2016-2017 [Donald Trump is elected President of the USA, and is "prayed" over by the Evangelical apostasy, and begins to give power back to churches to speak about political matters in pulpit; repeals the Johnson Amendment, church and state re-uniting more closely]​

Everything is happening according to the prophetic times/events foretold, in their proper order.

History is repeating itself even now [KJB Ecclesiastes 1:9, 3:15], but whereas in the past it was natural/typical, now we deal with spiritual/anti-typical, as per KJB 1 Corinthians 15:44-46; Hebrews, etc. Christ Jesus was and is fulfilling those feasts given in Leviticus 23, and this anti-typical day, is the Day of Atonement, since October 22, 1844, which was begun at the end of the 2,300, end of the 1,335, and given as the hour [of His judgment, KJB Revelation 14:6-7], day [10th day, Day of Atonement; KJB Leviticus 23:26-32], month [7th month, Ethanim; KJB Leviticus 23:27; 1 Kings 8:2], year [KJB Daniel 8:14, 12:12] in Revelation 9's the sixth Trumpet introduction [KJB Revelation 9:13-15].
 

marksman

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God knows, and so told us, "In the beginning ...", which was in the first "day", which was followed by Day 2, and so on unto the pattern of 7, found from Genesis to Revelation. The only difficulty is in rejecting the false ideology of uniformitarian geology and great ages of the 'principles of geology' which is eisegetically read back into the text.

The first day of what?
 

Jay Ross

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Acts 16:26: - And suddenly there was great turmoil as the foundations of the prison were shaken such that the doors of the prison were opened and the prisoner’s shackles were loosened suddenly.

You are willingly blind (and desire to be so), and only you can take your hands off your eyes, and see the highlighted red portion of your own private translation (interpretation), which refutes your own translation, and not a single translation (listed) does so as you do - Acts 16:26 - Bible Gateway

It seems to me that you are the one who cannot get their laughing matter around things and because of this you blind yourself to the obvious understanding of what occurred.

You assume truth is a put down, when all it does is put into perspective, and even place, the error you continually spout.

You are assuming that you know the truth and so can bring right correction.

So far you have not demonstrated that you know the truth at all. You know the scriptures, but that does not mean that you also know the truth of the matter.

Shalom
 

Jay Ross

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Additional dates of note:

457 BC [begins the 2,300, and thus the portion of it, the 70 weeks [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24]

AD 26 [begins John the Baptist, the forerunner of Jesus' first Advent]

AD 27 [ends the 7 + 62 [69] weeks of KJB Daniel 9:25-26; Mark 1:15, and begins the final week, KJB Daniel 9:27]

AD 31 [ends the midst of [3 ½] the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27, begins the 5 anti-typical months of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 from Pentecost, until 1833/34 with warning of Judgment to come by William Miller in AD 1833/34]

AD 34 [ends the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27]

AD 70 [end of the “generation”, within 40 years of Jesus' prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem by Rome under Titus; KJB Matthew 23:36, 24:2; Mark 13:2; Luke 19:44, 21:6]

AD 303 [begins the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]

AD 313 [ends the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]

AD 508 [begins the 1,290 of KJB Daniel 12:11 and 1,335 of KJB Daniel 12:12]

AD 538 [begins the 1,260, forty and two months, time, times and dividing of time, of KJB Daniel 7:25, 12:7; Revelation 11:2,3, 12:6,14, 13:5; Luke 21:24]

AD 1755 [November 1, earthquake that shook the world; KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]

AD 1776 [Beast out of the earth with two horns like a Lamb [Church without a pope, and State without a King, Protestantism, Republicanism], begins to arise with the aide of France, to become the USA, KJB Revelation 13:11]

AD 1780 [May 19, dark day, sun and moon, KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]

AD 1793 [begins the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France]

AD 1797 [ends the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France, see also Revelation 11:13, in the political upheaval of France, 1/10 of the 10 horns of KJB Daniel 7:7]

AD 1798 [ends the 1,290 and 1,260, ending in the beginning of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], and France removed from helping USA]

AD 1833 [November 13th, stars falling; KJB Luke 21:25; Revelation 6:13, time of the 6th Seal; 40 day/years anti-type from 1793-1833, just as Jesus was 40 days with the disciples before Pentecost]

AD 1833/4 [ends the 5th Trumpet of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 in the Feast of Trumpets, 5 anti-typical months from Pentecost in AD 31.]

AD 1842-1844 [First and Second Angels messages go forward, KJB Revelation 14:6-8 and Midnight Cry of Matthew 25:6, in first phase; 1843; the 50th year from 1793, Jubilee, 10 day/years from 1833]

AD 1844 [ends the 1,335 and 2,300, ending in the ending of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], the “daily” becomes the “yearly”, and 10 years after Feast of Trumpets [1833/34] is now October 22 1844, the Day of Atonement begins; Leviticus 16 & 23; Revelation 14:7, thus given also as the hour [of His judgment, KJB Revelation 14:6-7], day [10th day, Day of Atonement; KJB Leviticus 23:26-32], month [7th month, Ethanim; KJB Leviticus 23:27; 1 Kings 8:2], year [KJB Daniel 8:14, 12:12] in Revelation 9's the sixth Trumpet introduction [KJB Revelation 9:13-15]]

AD 1844 [Third Angels Message goes forward; KJB Revelation 14:9-12]

AD 1880's-1888 [first siege, as in the days of Cestius of Rome, Sunday laws begin to be passed and persecution was happening, Blair Bill almost goes through, but is suddenly halted]

AD 1989 [Holy Alliance - USA [2nd Beast of KJB Revelation 13] teams with Vatican/Papacy [First Beast of KJB Revelation 13] to help bring down USSR]

AD 1990 [the USA, the sole remaining Super-power, “all the power”, “power over” the nations, as per KJB Revelation 13:2,3,7,12,16]

AD 1995 [Christian coalition seeking to gain Roman support]

AD 1999 [Catholics/Lutherans reach agreement]

AD 2001 [tower fell 9/11, just as type foretold, KJB Luke 13:4]

AD 2004 [3rd Event; Sunday being promoted more and more; Roman Catholicism joins Christian Coalition]

AD 2005 [4th Event; Leading Protestant Churches unite on common doctrines; KJB Revelation 13:11,12,14 “they should make an image to the beast” - Catholic Universal, One World Church; see KJB Revelation 13:7,8, “war” [state], “worship” [church]]

AD 2008 [5th Event; National/International money crisis truly begins, KJB Luke 12:25, “with perplexity”, which will become worldwide and in the church, KJB Genesis 47:13,15; effecting a new economic system to come, and buying and selling effected eventually, KJB Revelation 13:7; Daniel 11:43]

AD 2013 [July 4th; Francis I [the Jesuit], Benedict XVI [Master of the Office of the Inquisition] invoke the weapon of war, just as type foretold, Caiaphas and Annas, KJB Luke 3:2, about to finish the King of the South off [6th Head, the Beast from the bottomless pit of KJB Revelation 11], Secular Humanism/Atheism as ruling power, and the false reliance of Israel, to turn over into the Healing of the deadly wound of the First Beast of Revelation 13:1, when persecution arises in the USA]

AD 2015 [Sept. 22-27th, Francis I [the Jesuit] speaks at Washington D.C., which sits between Mary-land and Virgin-ia]

AD 2016-2017 [Donald Trump is elected President of the USA, and is "prayed" over by the Evangelical apostasy, and begins to give power back to churches to speak about political matters in pulpit; repeals the Johnson Amendment, church and state re-uniting more closely]​

Everything is happening according to the prophetic times/events foretold, in their proper order.

History is repeating itself even now [KJB Ecclesiastes 1:9, 3:15], but whereas in the past it was natural/typical, now we deal with spiritual/anti-typical, as per KJB 1 Corinthians 15:44-46; Hebrews, etc. Christ Jesus was and is fulfilling those feasts given in Leviticus 23, and this anti-typical day, is the Day of Atonement, since October 22, 1844, which was begun at the end of the 2,300, end of the 1,335, and given as the hour [of His judgment, KJB Revelation 14:6-7], day [10th day, Day of Atonement; KJB Leviticus 23:26-32], month [7th month, Ethanim; KJB Leviticus 23:27; 1 Kings 8:2], year [KJB Daniel 8:14, 12:12] in Revelation 9's the sixth Trumpet introduction [KJB Revelation 9:13-15].

The above is SDA teaching which is all out on its own as far as the other denominations are concerned and as such it is not accepted by the other denominations.

Shalom
 

ReChoired

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The above is SDA teaching which is all out on its own as far as the other denominations are concerned and as such it is not accepted by the other denominations.

Shalom
Actually I could cite several persons on the 2,300 years prophecy which is in agreement with the Seventh-day Adventist position, which existed before the official formation of the Seventh-day Adventist body.

Likewise for the other portions, like AD 1798 as the 'deadly wound' etc.
 

Jay Ross

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Actually I could cite several persons on the 2,300 years prophecy which is in agreement with the Seventh-day Adventist position, which existed before the official formation of the Seventh-day Adventist body.

Likewise for the other portions, like AD 1798 as the 'deadly wound' etc.

The dates are based on wrong assumptions. It is my understanding that the end of the 2,300 years will occur in our near future, possibly within 25 years when the end of this present age occurs with the throwing out of Satan and his other cohorts being thrown out of heaven and immediately imprisoned for many days before their final punishment. At the same time the kings of the earth will also be judged and imprisoned in the same pit as the heavenly hosts. Isa 24:21-22. Matt 24:32 gives an indication of when this present age will be and based on when the Fig tree, i.e. Israel, budded in 1948, the length of the spring season is around 91 days and using the rule of a years for a day, the 91 years plus after 1948, the end of this age will occur and with Rom 11:25-26 tells us when Israel will be redeemed when the end of the trampling of God's Sanctuary and hosts occurs after the end of the determined period of time allocated to the gentiles trampling the sanctuary and hosts.

The timing of the Great tribulation will be not for another 1,000 plus years.

Shalom
 

ReChoired

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with the throwing out of Satan and his other cohorts being thrown out of heaven
AD 31. Already took place.

Joh_12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Rom 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.​
 

Jay Ross

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AD 31. Already took place.

Joh_12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Rom 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.​

Well then, the above is your "private" interpretation of Joh_12:31, that this took place in 31 AD, but it can be understood that it is confirming that the Prince of this world shall be cast out of heaven, but the actual timing of when Satan and his cohorts will be thrown out of heaven, is not stated and you have assumed that Christ was referring to the time of his death. However, the Bible also tells us that the heavenly hosts and the King of the Earth will be judged at the same time and that they will be gathered together and imprisoned in a pit for many days [Isa 24:21-22] and since the kings of the earth were not gathered together in 31 AD to be judged, then the heavenly hosts have also not been judged in heaven and cast down to the earth to be imprisoned.

Now the power of Christ has as yet not been given to Christ as He has not received from God His dominion, that all of the people of the earth should worship Him, which only happens after the heavenly hosts, i.e. the four winds of heaven, have been judged, [Dan 7:9-12]. Also, God has not yet established yet his Everlasting Kingdom here on the earth which we are told in Dan 2:44 will occur during the time of the kings of the fifth segment of the statue prophecy.

Now your understanding of 1844 being the end of the 2,300 year prophecy of the Gentiles ending, is based on a the wrong starting point for this prophecy. The starting point for this prophecy, is after the establishment of the manifestation of the four head beast that has the distinctive characteristic of "dominion"/power over other nations. From my research, I have concluded that the start of the 2,300 year prophecy began around 250 BC, around 200 year later than the starting point that you have stated in your posts above for it to occur.

Now if your dates are out by around 200 years, then your understanding of the events of the End times is also out and that make the understanding that you are espousing flawed. But, do not feel badly done by, as, many other End Time Theories are also flawed in the same manner because many people have assumed a flawed timeline to explain their understanding of how the End Times will play out.

Shalom
 

ReChoired

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...the Bible also tells us that the heavenly hosts and the King of the Earth will be judged at the same time and that they will be gathered together and imprisoned in a pit for many days [Isa 24:21-22] ...
The events you just spoke about take place in the near coming future, aka the 1,000 years:

The literal 1,000 years and the two reigns:

Here are the texts of Revelation 20:1-7-

Revelation 20:1 - And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

Revelation 20:2 - And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

Revelation 20:3 - And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Revelation 20:4 - And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Revelation 20:5 - But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Revelation 20:6 - Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Revelation 20:7 - And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,​

Please notice, that in these texts [Revelation 20:1-7], there is no where written that either Jesus, or the “saints” (or “satan” for that matter), shall “reign upon the earth” for 1,000 years, but simply says [vss. 4,6] that Jesus and the saints reigned “a thousand years”. The location of this 1,000 reign is nowhere stated to be “upon the earth” in these, or any passages of scripture [KJB]. Revelation 20:1 refers to Jesus coming “down” from Heaven but not touching the sin polluted earth, which connects to 1 Thessalonians 4:16 in its “descend from Heaven”. Revelation 20:6 speaks of the “first resurrection”, which is connected to 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, in its “the dead in Christ shall rise first” and “Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”, which ties into John 14:1-4. One should very carefully look for themselves. It also is very clearly written that “satan” himself was not reigning during this “thousand years”, but is “bound” and “shut … up” with a “seal” placed “upon him”.

The phrase “the day of the Lord” [Isaiah 2:12, 13:6,9, 34:8; Jeremiah 46:10; Lamentations 2:22; Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3; Joel 1:15, 2:1,11,31, 3:14; Amos 5:18,20; Obadiah 1:15; Zephaniah 1:7,8,14,18, 2:2,3; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi 4:5; Acts 2:20; 1 Corinthians 5:5; 2 Corinthians 1:14; 1 Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Peter 3:10], is a direct reference to the “thousand years” [Revelation 20:2,3,4,5,6,7, see also Isaiah 24:22, “many days”], which is the final “day”, the 7th day – the great Sabbath, of the great week “with the Lord” [2 Peter 3:8].

The second Advent of Jesus Christ, wherein the “saints” are “caught up together … in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air” [1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; Revelation 20:1-6] is but the beginning of the “thousand years” or “the day of the Lord”, while the third Advent of Jesus Christ [Zechariah 14:1-21; Revelation 20:7-10] is the ending of the “thousand years” or “the day of the Lord”, after which the finally impenitent shall be utterly destroyed in the second death, and finally the “New Heavens” and the “New Earth” are recreated [Isaiah 65:17, 66:22; 2 Peter 3:13; Revelation 21:1] which the “meek shall inherit”.

Revelation 19-22, is parallel to Isaiah 24, and so also connected to Leviticus 16:1-34, 23:26-32.

Armageddon, the gathering to war against the Lamb (and his body)

Psalms 37:14,12,35
Isaiah 24:21-22
Zechariah 14:1-3
Revelation 16:16​

The Day of the LORD, the final thousand years, beginning, middle and ending


Psalms 37:13
Isaiah 24:22
Zechariah 14:1-3
Revelation 20:2,3​

Final Destruction of the Wicked


Psalms 37:1,2,9a,10,20,22b,28b,34b,36,38
Isaiah 24:18
Zechariah 14:12-13
Revelation 20:10,11-15​

Heavens & Earth Made New, saints reign upon the earth made new, forever


Psalms 37:3,9b,11,18,22a,28b,29,34a,37
Isaiah 24:33
Zechariah 14:4,9,21
Revelation 21:1-4​

Isaiah 24 and Revelation 19-22 parallelism-

World Destroyed - Isaiah 24:1-20
High Ones on High - Isaiah 24:21
Kings of the Earth - Isaiah 24:21
Prisonsers in the Pit - Isaiah 24:22
Many Days - Isaiah 24:22
New Jeruslam/Zion - Isaiah 24:23
Reign Gloriously - Isaiah 24:23
Sun and Moon Ashamed - Isaiah 24:23
Remnant - Isaiah 4:3
Ancients - Isaiah 24:23​

World Destroyed - Revelation 19:11-21; 16:18-21
Satan - Revelation 20:1-2
Kings - Revelation 19:19
Prison/Pit - Revelation 20:1-2
The Thousand Years - Revelation 20:1,2,3,4,5,6,7
New Jerusalem/Zion - Revelation 21:2
King of Kings - Revelation 19:11,16
No Need of Sun or Moon - Revelation 21:23
Remnant - Revelation 22:14
Heavenly Elders Council - Job 1-2; Revelation 4:4,10, 5:5,6,8,11,14, 7:11,13, 11:16,14:3, 19:4​

It also parallels to Psalms 37.

Armageddon, the gathering to war against the Lamb (and his body) - Psalms 37:14,12,35
The Day of the LORD, the final thousand years, beginning, middle and ending - Psalms 37:13
Final Destruction of the Wicked - Psalms 37:1,2,9a,10,20,22b,28b,34b,36,38
Heavens & Earth Made New, saints reign upon the earth made new, forever - Psalms 37:3,9b,11,18,22a,28b,29,34a,37​
 

ReChoired

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...the Bible also tells us that the heavenly hosts and the King of the Earth will be judged at the same time and that they will be gathered together and imprisoned in a pit for many days [Isa 24:21-22] ...
The events you just spoke about take place in the near coming future, aka the 1,000 years:

It is dealing with normal earth time between the 2nd (John 14:1-3; 1 Thessalonians 4:16, etc) and 3rd Advents (Zechariah 14:1~; Revelation 20:7-11~) of Jesus Christ, known as "the Day of the LORD" (Isaiah 2:12, 13:6,9, 34:8; Jeremiah 46:10; Lamentations 2:22; Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3; Joel 1:15, 2:1,11,31, 3:14; Amos 5:18,20; Obadiah 1:15; Zephaniah 1:7,8,14,18, 2:2,3; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi 4:5; Acts 2:20; 1 Corinthians 5:5; 2 Corinthians 1:14; 1 Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Peter 3:10 -- 2 Peter 3:10, tied in context to 2 Peter 3:8, which is citing Psalms 90:4) or "the last day" (John 6:39,40,44,54, 11:24, 12:48) throughout scripture, and ties into 2 Peter 3:8; Psalms 90:4; Hosea 6:2; Ecclesiastes 6:6; John 11:6.

The location of this “reign” of Jesus and the saints, for “a thousand years” is never said to be on the plague wracked, utterly sin polluted and totally cursed and devastated “earth”, wherein even the upper heaven [atmosphere] is burned away by the second Advent [Genesis 3:17, 5:29, 8:21; Isaiah 34:4; 2 Peter 3:10-12; Revelation 6:14; 11:19, 15:1,6,8, 16:9,17-21, 18:4,8 21:9, 22:18]. So likewise for the passages of “Isaiah 2, 11, 65; Amos 9; Zechariah 14”. Read prayerfully and carefully for oneself. Where then is the “thousand year” reign of Jesus and the saints to be? It is to be in Heaven, the “third” [2 Corinthians 12:2].

Notice Isaiah 2:4 in which it speaks of, “... they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.” That is the earth “made new”, wherein it is said in Revelation 21:4, “And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.” The earth is not “made new” until after the 1,000 years, not before.

Notice Isaiah 11:4-10, in which the complete destruction of the wicked takes place first (as in Revelation 20:9-10, 11-15), and then follows the statements about the New Heaven and New Earth, which comes after the 1,000 years, see Isaiah 11:9, “They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.” See Isaiah 11:6-8 and compare to Isaiah 65:20-25, 66:22-23. See that Isaiah 66:16 and its events, the destruction of the wicked in entirety, come before those other events, which take place in the earth “made new”.

Notice Amos 9:14-15 in which the events, “... they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them.”, and of the planting and building are in the earth “made new”, after the events of the destruction of the wicked in Amos 9:8, which does not take place until after the 1,000 years as Isaiah 24 and Revelation 20 (and other places) show.

Notice Zechariah 14 carefully, and see that this is not referring to the Second Advent (the beginning of the 1,000 years), wherein the “saints” are “caught up” to “meet the Lord in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17), as also John 14:3 says, “... I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.”, but refers to the Third Advent, wherein the Lord Jesus comes “down” and touches the sin polluted earth, along with the saints and New Jerusalem on the Mount of Olives, as in Revelation 20, at the ending of the 1,000 years, and thus metes out judgment, executing all the wicked, and recreating the heavens and earth. See Zechariah 14:12-13,21 in connection to Revelation 20:9-10,11-15.

The “reign upon the earth” comes after 1,000 years [Revelation 20:2,3,4,5,6,7], for the “saints” must be both resurrected and/or translated, glorified, and brought back to Heaven [John 14:1-4; 1 Thessalonians 4:17, etc] at the Second Advent and First Great Resurrection, to “reign” in Heaven, for 1,000 years [Revelation 20:4,5a,6] going over the record books of the lost [1 Corinthians 6:2,3; Psalms 149:1-9]:

[1] The “thousand years” reign “in Heaven” [Psalms 50:5; Matthew 5:3,8,10,12, 6:20, 13:30, 24:31; Mark 10:21, 13:27; Luke 6:23, 18:22, 23:43; John 14:2-3, 17:24; Colossians 1:5; Hebrews 10:34; 1 Peter 1:4; Revelation 7:9, 14:3, 19:1; “Paradise”, Luke 23:43; 2 Corinthians 12:4; Revelation 2:7] with Christ Jesus [1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; Revelation 20:6] and

[2] The “reign on earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth; 2 Peter 3:13; Isaiah 65:17, 66:22; Revelation 21:1] that lasts “forever and ever” [Revelation 5:10; “meek inherit earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth], Psalms 37:9,11,34; Proverbs 11:31; Isaiah 25:8, 65:21; Daniel 7:27; Matthew 5:5; Revelation 5:10].​
 

ReChoired

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Well then, the above is your "private" interpretation of Joh_12:31, that this took place in 31 AD...
Not at all, I interpreted nothing, and simply quoted the texts in what it says:

AD 31. Already took place.

Joh_12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Rom 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.​
"Now" (present tense, not future as you 'privately interpreted'), and is even given twice in the same sentence by Jesus.

The same word is used in Revelation 12:10, "Now" and speaks of "salvation" and "strength", which is exactly what Romans 5:6 (by Paul, inspired of the Holy Ghost/Spirit) refers to, saying, "strength", "in due time" (prophecy of Daniel 9, fulfilled in Christ Jesus), "Christ died" (AD 31) "for the ungodly".

Jesus Christ, at Calvary, through his shed blood and sacrifice bought everything, and reclaimed "dominion", which was usurped by the devil in Eden (serpent), from Adam the first, and is now back into the hands of Adam the Last. Satan cannot access the gates of Heaven any more, and is the reason for the following texts:

1Pe_5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:​

Notice, the "devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about" (that is on this earth), "seeking whom he may devour".

Rev_12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.​

When Jesus died, resurrected and later ascended, Heaven rejoiced.

Luk_15:6 And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.

Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Gal 4:27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.​

Psalms 24 is the triumphal song even in Jesus ascension to go back "home", to that "far country", even "the end of Heaven" (Isaiah 13:5).
 

Jay Ross

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The events you just spoke about take place in the near coming future, aka the 1,000 years:

The literal 1,000 years and the two reigns:

Here are the texts of Revelation 20:1-7

That is your and therefore possibly the SDA position which is probably based on a flawed understanding/interpretation of scripture.

My understanding is that Satan and his cohorts will be judged in heaven at the same time that the kings of the earth and their armies are assembled at Armageddon to be judged is in our near future, around 24 or so years into our present future. The 1,000 years of the imprisonment of Satan begin immediately after the judgement of the kings of the earth at Armageddon.

Now if you are inferring that Satan is imprisoned at the beginning of the 1,000 years, then I would agree with you, as this event is the beginning of the Millennium Age, which is longer than 1,000 year because we must add the little while period to the 1,000 years for the length of the Millennium Age to be determined.

Please notice, that in these texts [Revelation 20:1-7], there is nowhere written that either Jesus, or the “saints” (or “Satan” for that matter), shall “reign upon the earth” for 1,000 years, but simply says [vss. 4,6] that Jesus and the saints reigned “a thousand years”. The location of this 1,000 reign is nowhere stated to be “upon the earth” in these, or any passages of scripture [KJB]. Revelation 20:1 refers to Jesus coming “down” from Heaven but not touching the sin polluted earth, which connects to 1 Thessalonians 4:16 in its “descend from Heaven”. Revelation 20:6 speaks of the “first resurrection”, which is connected to 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, in its “the dead in Christ shall rise first” and “Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”, which ties into John 14:1-4. One should very carefully look for themselves. It also is very clearly written that “satan” himself was not reigning during this “thousand years”, but is “bound” and “shut … up” with a “seal” placed “upon him”.

No where in my post, did I touch on the subject matter of the above quoted paragraph. I will comment though, that Rev 20:1 makes no reference to Jesus as you have suggested above that it will be Jesus who will come down to the earth and lock Satan up in the Bottomless pit.. Rev 20:1 only states that an angel will come down from heaven and imprison Satan.

I will also make the observation that I agree with your statement that Satan has no direct influence over the peoples of the earth during his imprisonment in the Bottomless Pit.

The phrase “the day of the Lord” [Isaiah 2:12, 13:6,9, 34:8; Jeremiah 46:10; Lamentations 2:22; Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3; Joel 1:15, 2:1,11,31, 3:14; Amos 5:18,20; Obadiah 1:15; Zephaniah 1:7,8,14,18, 2:2,3; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi 4:5; Acts 2:20; 1 Corinthians 5:5; 2 Corinthians 1:14; 1 Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Peter 3:10], is a direct reference to the “thousand years” [Revelation 20:2,3,4,5,6,7, see also Isaiah 24:22, “many days”], which is the final “day”, the 7th day – the great Sabbath, of the great week “with the Lord” [2 Peter 3:8].

The second Advent of Jesus Christ, wherein the “saints” are “caught up together … in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air” [1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; Revelation 20:1-6] is but the beginning of the “thousand years” or “the day of the Lord”, while the third Advent of Jesus Christ [Zechariah 14:1-21; Revelation 20:7-10] is the ending of the “thousand years” or “the day of the Lord”, after which the finally impenitent shall be utterly destroyed in the second death, and finally the “New Heavens” and the “New Earth” are recreated [Isaiah 65:17, 66:22; 2 Peter 3:13; Revelation 21:1] which the “meek shall inherit”.

With the above comment are you confirming that you believe in the Pre-Rapture Theory?

Revelation 19-22, is parallel to Isaiah 24, and so also connected to Leviticus 16:1-34, 23:26-32.

Armageddon, the gathering to war against the Lamb (and his body)

Psalms 37:14,12,35
Isaiah 24:21-22
Zechariah 14:1-3
Revelation 16:16

The Day of the LORD, the final thousand years, beginning, middle and ending

Psalms 37:13
Isaiah 24:22
Zechariah 14:1-3
Revelation 20:2,3

Final Destruction of the Wicked

Psalms 37:1,2,9a,10,20,22b,28b,34b,36,38
Isaiah 24:18
Zechariah 14:12-13
Revelation 20:10,11-15

Heavens & Earth Made New, saints reign upon the earth made new, forever

Psalms 37:3,9b,11,18,22a,28b,29,34a,37
Isaiah 24:33
Zechariah 14:4,9,21
Revelation 21:1-4

Isaiah 24 and Revelation 19-22 parallelism-

World Destroyed - Isaiah 24:1-20
High Ones on High - Isaiah 24:21
Kings of the Earth - Isaiah 24:21
Prisonsers in the Pit - Isaiah 24:22
Many Days - Isaiah 24:22
New Jeruslam/Zion - Isaiah 24:23
Reign Gloriously - Isaiah 24:23

Sun and Moon Ashamed - Isaiah 24:23
Remnant - Isaiah 4:3
Ancients - Isaiah 24:23


World Destroyed - Revelation 19:11-21; 16:18-21
Satan - Revelation 20:1-2
Kings - Revelation 19:19
Prison/Pit - Revelation 20:1-2
The Thousand Years - Revelation 20:1,2,3,4,5,6,7
New Jerusalem/Zion - Revelation 21:2
King of Kings - Revelation 19:11,16

No Need of Sun or Moon - Revelation 21:23

Remnant - Revelation 22:14

Heavenly Elders Council - Job 1-2; Revelation 4:4,10, 5:5,6,8,11,14, 7:11,13, 11:16,14:3, 19:4

It also parallels to Psalms 37.

Armageddon, the gathering to war against the Lamb (and his body) - Psalms 37:14,12,35

The Day of the LORD, the final thousand years, beginning, middle and ending - Psalms 37:13

Final Destruction of the Wicked - Psalms 37:1,2,9a,10,20,22b,28b,34b,36,38

Heavens & Earth Made New, saints reign upon the earth made new, forever - Psalms 37:3,9b,11,18,22a,28b,29,34a,37

It seems to me that you are just using my post as a means of continuing your flawed dialog without presenting why you really disagree with what I had posted. What you had posted had nothing to do with what I had posted.

Shalom[/QUOTE]
 

Jay Ross

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The events you just spoke about take place in the near coming future, aka the 1,000 years:

It is dealing with normal earth time between the 2nd (John 14:1-3; 1 Thessalonians 4:16, etc) and 3rd Advents (Zechariah 14:1~; Revelation 20:7-11~) of Jesus Christ, known as "the Day of the LORD" (Isaiah 2:12, 13:6,9, 34:8; Jeremiah 46:10; Lamentations 2:22; Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3; Joel 1:15, 2:1,11,31, 3:14; Amos 5:18,20; Obadiah 1:15; Zephaniah 1:7,8,14,18, 2:2,3; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi 4:5; Acts 2:20; 1 Corinthians 5:5; 2 Corinthians 1:14; 1 Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Peter 3:10 -- 2 Peter 3:10, tied in context to 2 Peter 3:8, which is citing Psalms 90:4) or "the last day" (John 6:39,40,44,54, 11:24, 12:48) throughout scripture, and ties into 2 Peter 3:8; Psalms 90:4; Hosea 6:2; Ecclesiastes 6:6; John 11:6.

The location of this “reign” of Jesus and the saints, for “a thousand years” is never said to be on the plague wracked, utterly sin polluted and totally cursed and devastated “earth”, wherein even the upper heaven [atmosphere] is burned away by the second Advent [Genesis 3:17, 5:29, 8:21; Isaiah 34:4; 2 Peter 3:10-12; Revelation 6:14; 11:19, 15:1,6,8, 16:9,17-21, 18:4,8 21:9, 22:18]. So likewise for the passages of “Isaiah 2, 11, 65; Amos 9; Zechariah 14”. Read prayerfully and carefully for oneself. Where then is the “thousand year” reign of Jesus and the saints to be? It is to be in Heaven, the “third” [2 Corinthians 12:2].

Notice Isaiah 2:4 in which it speaks of, “... they shall beat their swords into ploughshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.” That is the earth “made new”, wherein it is said in Revelation 21:4, “And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.” The earth is not “made new” until after the 1,000 years, not before.

Notice Isaiah 11:4-10, in which the complete destruction of the wicked takes place first (as in Revelation 20:9-10, 11-15), and then follows the statements about the New Heaven and New Earth, which comes after the 1,000 years, see Isaiah 11:9, “They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.” See Isaiah 11:6-8 and compare to Isaiah 65:20-25, 66:22-23. See that Isaiah 66:16 and its events, the destruction of the wicked in entirety, come before those other events, which take place in the earth “made new”.

Notice Amos 9:14-15 in which the events, “... they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them.”, and of the planting and building are in the earth “made new”, after the events of the destruction of the wicked in Amos 9:8, which does not take place until after the 1,000 years as Isaiah 24 and Revelation 20 (and other places) show.

Notice Zechariah 14 carefully, and see that this is not referring to the Second Advent (the beginning of the 1,000 years), wherein the “saints” are “caught up” to “meet the Lord in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17), as also John 14:3 says, “... I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.”, but refers to the Third Advent, wherein the Lord Jesus comes “down” and touches the sin polluted earth, along with the saints and New Jerusalem on the Mount of Olives, as in Revelation 20, at the ending of the 1,000 years, and thus metes out judgment, executing all the wicked, and recreating the heavens and earth. See Zechariah 14:12-13,21 in connection to Revelation 20:9-10,11-15.

The “reign upon the earth” comes after 1,000 years [Revelation 20:2,3,4,5,6,7], for the “saints” must be both resurrected and/or translated, glorified, and brought back to Heaven [John 14:1-4; 1 Thessalonians 4:17, etc] at the Second Advent and First Great Resurrection, to “reign” in Heaven, for 1,000 years [Revelation 20:4,5a,6] going over the record books of the lost [1 Corinthians 6:2,3; Psalms 149:1-9]:

[1] The “thousand years” reign “in Heaven” [Psalms 50:5; Matthew 5:3,8,10,12, 6:20, 13:30, 24:31; Mark 10:21, 13:27; Luke 6:23, 18:22, 23:43; John 14:2-3, 17:24; Colossians 1:5; Hebrews 10:34; 1 Peter 1:4; Revelation 7:9, 14:3, 19:1; “Paradise”, Luke 23:43; 2 Corinthians 12:4; Revelation 2:7] with Christ Jesus [1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; Revelation 20:6] and

[2] The “reign on earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth; 2 Peter 3:13; Isaiah 65:17, 66:22; Revelation 21:1] that lasts “forever and ever” [Revelation 5:10; “meek inherit earth” [“made new”, not this sin polluted Earth], Psalms 37:9,11,34; Proverbs 11:31; Isaiah 25:8, 65:21; Daniel 7:27; Matthew 5:5; Revelation 5:10].

Again, you are continuing to hang your flawed theological theories on to what I had posted. You have made no effort to provide any evidence that would confirm why you believe that I am wrong. You are not having a discussion with me but rather have found an excuse to continue your without showing that you actually have any understanding of what I had posted. You are only here to promote your SDA understanding of the scriptures.

As for suggesting that there is a second and third Advent of Christ with the first before the 1000 years of imprisonment of Satan and the second after the end of the 1,000 years of Satan’s imprisonment, cannot be justified from scripture and is a heresy IMHO.


Shalom