Leopard's Spots

Webers_Home · Dec 28, 2019

.
● Jer 13:23a . . Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard its spots?

The answer to both those questions is of course "no" because if an h.sapiens
is born with black skin, it stays black; and if a cat is born with spotted fur,
its stays spotted. In other words: the color of an Ethiopian's skin, and the
spots on a leopard's fur, are indelible; they're permanent.

● Jer 13:23b . . Neither can you do good who are accustomed to doing evil.

The apostle Paul said something similar in Rom 7:7-24; which is pretty much
summed up in verse 18, which reads thus:

"I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh"

The Greek word for "flesh" is sarx (sarx); which basically indicates the
meaty parts of either man or beast; i.e. the body. The meaty parts of course
consist of not only muscle and fat; but also the organs and the brain and the
nervous system along with the eyes, the ears, and the tongue. Those are all
"meaty" parts.

What Paul is saying in Rom 7:7-24 is that the human body has a will of its
own, and it quite naturally, and quite intrinsically, has a predilection for evil
instead of good. In other words; any man who would be 100% righteous is
in for a fight against nature, i.e. a fight against his own self-- an inner
conflict that (speaking from experience) can lead to a mental disorder or a
nervous breakdown.

Ironically, should someone manage to succeed in a war with themselves, in
the long run it will be for naught because all they will have done is suppress
their body's natural predilection for evil rather than get rid it.
_

justbyfaith · Dec 28, 2019

I consider that Romans 6:6 and Colossians 2:11 speak of a destruction of and then a putting away of the body of sin/ the body of the sins of the flesh.

Romans 8:23 speaks of the redemption of the body, being defined as the adoption. This is said to be in past tense for the Galatians in Galatians 4:5-7; and therefore very likely does not speak of receiving a glorified body but of something that takes place while we are still on the earth.

In 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 we are told that entire sanctification takes place in spirit and soul and body.

In Ephesians 5:30-32 we find that we are of His flesh and of His bones. In being married to Christ, we become one flesh with Him.

In 1 John 3:5 we find that there is no sin in Christ.

In Romans 8:24-25 we find that the adoption is both not seen and hoped for.

In Hebrews 11:1 we find the following words:

Heb 11:1, Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Therefore, while the redemption of the body has not happened yet, the evidence of it and the substance of it can be seen in our lives. We can live as though we have already received the redemption of the body, is what this is saying. By faith, the reality of our body's redemption is manifested in the way that we live.

What this means is that we can live as though the flesh is entirely put to death.

Rom 8:10, And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Rom 8:13, For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

We can live as though our body is entirely redeemed; as though the flesh has no control in our lives.

This is because the body of the sins of the flesh is both destroyed (Romans 6:6) and put off from (Colossians 2:11) the person who is sanctified (see 2 Corinthians 1:15; 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24, Hebrews 10:14, 1 John 3:9; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 2 John 1:10; 1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6).

Webers_Home · Dec 29, 2019

.
It's not all that difficult to show that Jesus Christ is Adam's biological
progeny; which of course attests that he's a genuine h.sapiens rather than
an imitation, i.e. a look-alike rather than the real thing; viz: a counterfeit.

Yet according to John 8:29, 2Cor 5:21, Heb 4:15, and 1Pet 2:22; Jesus
Christ never committed one single solitary sin in his entire life, which is quite
remarkable considering that his crucified body was no different than
anybody else's body in all respects.

● Heb 2:13-18 . . "Here am I, and the children God has given me."

. . . Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity
so that by his death he might destroy him who holds the power of death
that is, the devil-- and free those who all their lives were held in slavery by
their fear of death. For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham's
descendants.

. . . For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in
order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to
God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people. Because
he himself suffered when he was tempted, he is able to help those who are
being tempted.

According to that; in order for priests to be effective, one of their
qualifications is that they have to be able to empathize with their
constituents. So; in order for Jesus to satisfy that requirement, he had to be
a genuine h.sapiens; which entails having a genuine h.sapiens body.

So my question is: How does someone with a body made of genuine
h.sapiens flesh-- a body made of the sarx spoken of in post No.1 --manage
to get thru life without committing a single, solitary sin?
_

justbyfaith · Dec 29, 2019

By the power of the Holy Spirit.

Eph 3:16, That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;

Col 1:11, Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness;

ReChoired · Dec 29, 2019

Webers_Home said:
.
● Jer 13:23a . . Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard its spots?

The answer to both those questions is of course "no" ..
_

And notice the 'leopard-bodied' Beast of Revelation 13:2. Papal Rome. It cannot change its character, nor desires to give up its humanistic philosophy, nor immortal-soul theology (all Greecian). And it gets even deeper when considering the nature of the leopard in the scripture, in its cunning, sly stalking, watching, pouncing, etc:

Webers_Home · Dec 29, 2019

.
FAQ: If it's true that Jesus Christ is Adam's biological progeny, then
wouldn't he have been born with a "body of death" just like everybody else?
(Rom 7:24)

A: Yes, and in point of fact the Bible says that Jesus came in the likeness of
sinful flesh rather than in the likeness of righteous flesh. (Rom 8:3)

The Bible also says of Jesus that he was "made like his brothers in every
way". (Heb 2:13-18)

The Bible also says that Jesus was made of the seed of David according to the
flesh, viz: made of David's body. (Rom 1:3)
_

justbyfaith · Dec 30, 2019

Notice that Jesus did not come in sinful flesh (as ours is) but in "the likeness of" sinful flesh.

ReChoired · Dec 30, 2019

justbyfaith said:
Notice that Jesus did not come in sinful flesh (as ours is) but in "the likeness of" sinful flesh.

You misunderstand the word "likeness", and define it by modern def, not scriptural:

Romans 8:3 KJB - For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [for "likeness" see Philippians 2:7; Romans 6:5]

Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

"Likeness" is the outward nature, as seen from Genesis 1. Scripture is clear.

Heb_2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels [unfallen]; but he took on him the seed [fallen] of Abraham.

Jesus had the same fallen flesh as we do, made flesh according to the law of fleshy heredity (The lineage of Jesus given in both Matthew [Matthew 1:1-18; "son of David, the son of Abraham"] and Luke [Luke 3:23-38; "[son of] Adam", etc] is easily seen in the lives and history of Jesus' ancestors, of which He Himself inherited of their fleshly nature when He was made of a woman.), and thus could "condemn sin in the flesh" which he bore, even nailing it to His cross.

Hebrews 2:17 KJB - Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

"made of the seed of David according to the flesh" [Romans 1:3]

"...of the fruit of his [David's] loins, according to the flesh..." [Acts 2:30]

of the "seed of Abraham" [Hebrews 2:16]

"as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same" [Hebrews 2:14]

Galatians 4:4 KJB - But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

Webers_Home · Dec 30, 2019

.
● Acts 2:29-30 . . Men and brethren, let me speak freely to you of the
patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to
this day. Therefore, being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with
an oath to him that of the fruit of his body, according to the flesh, He would
raise up the Christ to sit on his throne

I'm a bit chagrined for having missed that one in my research.

Seeing as how Jesus' flesh was David's flesh, and David's flesh was Adam's
flesh, then it's a foregone conclusion that Jesus Christ's flesh was Adam's
flesh too.

My thanks to ReChoired for their excellent scriptural defense of Jesus
Christ's true biological heritage.
_

Webers_Home · Dec 30, 2019

.
● 1Pet 1:18-19 . .You know that you were ransomed from the futile ways
inherited from your fathers, not with perishable things such as silver or gold,
but with the precious blood of Christ, like that of a lamb without blemish or
spot.

FAQ: If human flesh has a will of its own, and it quite naturally, and quite
intrinsically, has a predilection for evil instead of good; and if there is
no good thing in human flesh; and if the human body is a "body of this
death"; and if Jesus Christ was Adam's biological progeny; and if Jesus was
made in the likeness of sinful flesh rather than righteous flesh; and if he was
made of the seed of David according to the flesh; and if he was made like
his brothers in every way; then how can the blood in Jesus Christ's flesh be
compared to the blood in the flesh of a lamb without spot or blemish?

One of the goofiest responses to that question that I've yet to encounter is
that Jesus' blood wasn't normal blood, it was God's blood.

Well; that sounds reasonable but according to Acts 17:26, God has made all
men of one blood. So if Jesus Christ is fully man, then his blood was just as
much the one blood that's in all the rest of us; which of course is Adam's.
_

justbyfaith · Dec 30, 2019

It should be clear that Jesus was and is without sin (2 Corinthians 5:21, Hebrews 4:15, 1 Peter 2:22, 1 John 3:5).

justbyfaith · Dec 30, 2019

ReChoired said:
Hebrews 2:17 KJB - Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Jesus' brethren are those who have been born again of His Holy Spirit. Such have been made into new creatures in Christ.

justbyfaith · Dec 30, 2019

sin DNA is passed down through the father.

Jesus did not have a human Father.

CovenantPromise · Dec 30, 2019

justbyfaith said:
I consider that Romans 6:6 and Colossians 2:11 speak of a destruction of and then a putting away of the body of sin/ the body of the sins of the flesh.

Romans 8:23 speaks of the redemption of the body, being defined as the adoption. This is said to be in past tense for the Galatians in Galatians 4:5-7; and therefore very likely does not speak of receiving a glorified body but of something that takes place while we are still on the earth.

In 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 we are told that entire sanctification takes place in spirit and soul and body.

In Ephesians 5:30-32 we find that we are of His flesh and of His bones. In being married to Christ, we become one flesh with Him.

In 1 John 3:5 we find that there is no sin in Christ.

In Romans 8:24-25 we find that the adoption is both not seen and hoped for.

In Hebrews 11:1 we find the following words:

Heb 11:1, Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Therefore, while the redemption of the body has not happened yet, the evidence of it and the substance of it can be seen in our lives. We can live as though we have already received the redemption of the body, is what this is saying. By faith, the reality of our body's redemption is manifested in the way that we live.

What this means is that we can live as though the flesh is entirely put to death.

Rom 8:10, And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Rom 8:13, For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

We can live as though our body is entirely redeemed; as though the flesh has no control in our lives.

This is because the body of the sins of the flesh is both destroyed (Romans 6:6) and put off from (Colossians 2:11) the person who is sanctified (see 2 Corinthians 1:15; 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24, Hebrews 10:14, 1 John 3:9; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 2 John 1:10; 1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6).

Genesis 4:7
Cain and Abel
…6“Why are you angry,” said the LORD to Cain, “and why has your countenance fallen? 7If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you refuse to do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; you are its object of desire, but you must master it.”
The door is the flesh , by way satan enters.
MASTERING THE FLESH: this precedent was set early on and DESIRE to please God in obeying His ordinances to their fullness -Christ, is the means by which we put to death sin in the flesh.
Those who are transformed in a moment , in a twinkling of an eye at the last Trumpet , Christ has completed that work instantaneously in them because they walked by faith through the valley of the shadow death (Tribulation). They mortified their flesh through the fire by obedience, to the end.
They are instantly transformed, not falling asleep to the earth but have an instant death and resurrection.

Webers_Home · Dec 30, 2019

.
FAQ: I have heard that ancestral blood is inherited via the father rather than
the mother. Seeing as how Jesus didn't have a father, then how could he
possibly inherit Adam's blood?

A: In the beginning, God made the first woman with human material taken
from the first man's body. (Gen 2:21-22)

As a result, Eve was Adam just as much as Adam was Adam. (Gen 5:2)

"Adam said: This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh" (Gen
2:23)

Therefore, all biological offspring produced from Eve's flesh-- whether
normally conceived or virgin conceived --comes into the world with flesh of
Adam's flesh, and bone of Adam's bones.

Now; unless someone can prove beyond any shadow of sensible doubt that
Mary and Eve were not biologically related, then we must conclude that any
progeny produced from Mary's flesh, no matter how, would be bone of
Adam's bones and flesh of Adam's flesh; viz: Adam was just as much Jesus
Christ's father as he is everyone else's father.

In point of fact, God predicted that Eve's progeny would one day destroy the
serpent (Gen 3:15). So then, if Jesus Christ were not Eve's progeny, then he
could not be the one predicted to destroy the serpent. But if Jesus is the
predicted progeny, then Eve is his mother and Adam is his father.

There are quite a few Christians who would really like to take Adam out of
Jesus' biological genealogy, but the only way to do it is to take Mary's flesh
out of the stream, and ultimately Eve's; which is no doubt at least one of the
reasons why the surrogacy theory is so popular.

NOTE: The life of the flesh is in the blood (Lev 17:11) so I think we may
safely assume that when God took Adam's flesh to make Eve's flesh, some
of Adam's blood came with it; which means that Eve's blood was Adam's
blood; and so on and so on down the line to Mary, and thereby to Jesus.

And seeing as how Eve's bones were made of Adam's bones, then her bones
replenished Adam's blood in her flesh as its cells gradually died off like
normal blood cells do. The self-same process would've taken place in Jesus'
flesh and bones too seeing as his flesh and bones were Adam's flesh and
bones.

FAQ: How could you possibly know Adam's blood type in order to verify it
was in Jesus' flesh?

A: There are several human blood types-- A, B, AB, and O, along with the Rh
groups. However, any blood-- regardless of its type or its group --is Adam's
blood if it's human blood because Adam is the only human being that God
created from scratch. All other human beings, including his wife, are Adam's
direct biological descendants including, but not limited to, Jesus Christ and
his mother.
_

justbyfaith · Dec 30, 2019

@Webers_Home, you are contending for a false doctrine here.

The Bible is clear that Jesus was and is without sin (2 Corinthians 5:21, Hebrews 4:15, 1 Peter 2:22, 1 John 3:5).

ReChoired · Dec 30, 2019

justbyfaith said:
It should be clear that Jesus was and is without sin (2 Corinthians 5:21, Hebrews 4:15, 1 Peter 2:22, 1 John 3:5).

Not in denial, and most assuredly accepted/believed. The topic was not about "sin", but about "fallen flesh".

Notice what scripture says:

Joh_3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Jesus was not at sinner, but He did take upon Himself our fallen flesh. The latter (fallen flesh) does not make Him the former (sinner), as the definition of "sin" in scripture is "transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4), not existing with "fallen flesh". The Son of God took upon Himself the "seed" of "Abraham" (fallen), and not the "nature of angels" (unfallen), but was born of the Holy Ghost/Spirit (Luke 1:35). Notice the two things, [1] flesh, [2] Spirit.

If all will go with me to other scriptures please, where it describes this "flesh" [sarx]:

"And the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us..." [John 1:14]

"GOD manifest in the flesh" [1 Timothy 3:16],

"the LORD from Heaven" [1 Corinthians 15:47],

"made of a woman" [Galatians 4:4],

"made of the seed of David according to the flesh" [Romans 1:3],

"...to every seed his own body..." [1 Corinthians 15:38],

"...of the fruit of his [David's] loins, according to the flesh..." [Acts 2:30]

of the "seed of Abraham" [Hebrews 2:16],

even "as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same" [Hebrews 2:14] [what flesh are we born with, that He partook of then, what blood?]

and "in all things it behoved him to be made like unto [his] brethren" [Hebrews 2:17],

that we might have "...known Christ after the flesh..." [2 Corinthians 5:16],

and scripture giving us the family line and genealogy of that very flesh [sarx] and blood nature He took upon Himself [Matthew 1:1-25; Luke 3:23-38]

the "[the son] of Adam" [Luke 3:38]

as it is said, "made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men" [Philippians 2:7],

and "...in the days of His flesh..." [Hebrews 5:7],

"was in all points tempted like as [we are yet] without sin" [Hebrews 4:15],

and in His death it is written, "...my flesh shall rest in hope..." [Acts 2:26], and

"...his soul [being/person] was not left in the grave, neither his flesh did see corruption..." [Acts 2:31] because He was/is...

"holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners" [Hebrews 7:26]

that "holy thing" [Luke 1:35]

and "holy child" [Acts 4:27,30]

born of the "Holy Ghost" [Matthew 1:18; Luke 1:35],

where even though He came in the likeness [Romans 8:3; Philippians 2:7; etc] of sinful flesh, yet He was without sin:

"...lamb shall be without blemish..." [Exodus 12:5]

"… But found none: yea, though many false witnesses came, yet found they none." [Matthew 26:60]

"...the innocent blood..." [Matthew 27:4]

"...For he knew that for envy they had delivered him. ..." [Matthew 27:18]

"… Have thou nothing to do with that just man …" [Matthew 27:19]

"… Why, what evil hath he done? …" [Matthew 27:23]

"… I am innocent of the blood of this just person …" [Matthew 27:24]

"The said Pilate … I find no fault in this man.” [Luke 23:4]

"… Said unto them, Ye have brought this man unto me, as one that perverteth the people: and, behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him:" [Luke 23:14]

"… what evil hath he done? I have found no cause of death in him ..." [Luke 23:22]

"...lo, nothing worthy of death is done unto him." [Luke 23:15]

"...this man hath done nothing amiss." [Luke 23:41]

"… Now when the centurion saw what was done, he glorified God, saying, Certainly this was a righteous man." [Luke 23:47]

"...I have kept my Father's commandments..." [John 15:10]

"...I find in him no fault [at all]." [John 18:38]

"...I find no fault in him." [John 19:4]

"...I find no fault in him." [John 19:6]

"...the obedience of one..." [Romans 5:19]

"...who knew no sin..." [2 Corinthians 5:21]

"...without sin." [Hebrews 4:15]

"...[who is] holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners..." [Hebrews 7:26]

"Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:" [1 Peter 2:22]

"...in him is no sin." [1 John 3:5]

"How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God..." [Hebrews 9:4;p]

...and thereby, in the same likeness of sinful flesh as we, yet living without sin, never having sinned, never once transgressed the Holy Law of God; Jesus showed that with God there is no excuse for sin and thus "...condemned sin in the flesh." [Romans 8:3];

"...having crucified the flesh..." [Galatians 5:24],

and "...nailing it to His cross." [Colossians 2:4],

"Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh..." [1 Peter 4:1];

even "...being put to death in the flesh..." [1 Peter 3:18],

and we are to be "...crucified with Christ..." [Galatians 5:24],

"In the body of His flesh through death..." [Colossians 1:22],

become dead to the penalty of the Law, the 2nd Death, "...by the body of Christ..." [Romans 7:4],

that we might be "...members of His body, and of His flesh, and of His bones." [Ephesians 5:30],

by a "...new and living way, which He hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, His flesh;" [Hebrews 10:20]

so that we may know this, "...Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." [Romans 6:6]

"Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:" [Hebrews 10:5]

"Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed." [1 Peter 2:24]

"By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once [for all]." [Hebrews 10:10]

Therefore, we have this hope, "Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself." [Philippians 3:21]

ReChoired · Dec 30, 2019

justbyfaith said:
sin DNA is passed down through the father.

Jesus did not have a human Father.

Is Jesus the "[son of] Adam", the "son of Abraham", the "son of David", yes or no?

justbyfaith · Dec 31, 2019

ReChoired said:
Is Jesus the "[son of] Adam", the "son of Abraham", the "son of David", yes or no?

the son, not of Joseph, but of Mary and God the Father (conceived of the Holy Spirit).

Webers_Home · Dec 31, 2019

.
This comment is off-topic, but I seriously think it's something that needs saying from
time to time.

Internet forums have given many of Christ's obscure followers a convenient venue for
sharing their time-won knowledge and experience with a worldwide audience. For the
world's sake, I highly recommend making an effort to compose legible posts; neatly
arranged, sensible, coherent, and tidy.

Excessive bolding and italics, lack of adequate paragraphing, twitter spelling,
unnecessary emogies, horrible grammar, confusing mixtures of fonts and colors, and/or
shouting with caps and oversize letters, makes for tiresome clutter and annoying graffiti
that leave a bad impression.

Some people's posts resemble the obnoxious placards of worked-up protesters and
political activists; yelling, shrieking, and sometimes even spraying spittle. They are
beyond reason and objectivity in their desperation to be taken seriously. Apparently they
assume that if only they shout loud enough, and make themselves annoying enough,
maybe they'll get their point across and somebody will finally listen.

I rather suspect that some people regard forums as a canvas for painting their
comments instead of composing them. Well; that might be okay for outsiders, they can
be as messy as they want because it doesn't matter. But for those of us who honestly
believe ourselves to be representing God's son; it's unacceptable.

● Phil 1:27 . . Conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ.
_

Leopard's Spots

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads