The Truth About Hell

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Christina

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You can all believe as you chose but God has a plan so if you think you can change the nature of God and figure out his whole plan by one or two words in a verse being misunderstood be my guest ... There is no burning in hell forever just a lack of man to understand God his nature and his plan .. He says Sodom and gomorrah would burn forever is it still burning ?????????????
 

Christian Mystic

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 01:31 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70667
You can all believe as you chose but God has a plan so if you think you can change the nature of God and figure out his whole plan by one or two words in a verse being misunderstood be my guest ... There is no burning in hell forever just a lack of man to understand God his nature and his plan .. He says Sodom and gomorrah would burn forever is it still burning ?????????????
Do you ascribe to soul destruction or universal reconciliation?
 

Christian Mystic

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I've asked two questions several times and no one has answered them. First, What is the purpose of a Hell where everyone burns or is destroyed forever? Would it be to satisfy a concept of a blood thirsty God's retribution or his entertainment? Second,Why would God condemn a 16 year old Hindu girl who never heard the Gospel to burning or being destroyed forever?Thirdly,Does anyone here have any loved one's who died without knowing Jesus Christ?QUOTE (tomwebster @ Mar 12 2009, 01:19 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70666
Christian Mystic,Just wanted you to know that I completely disagree with your Theological point of view and your interpretation of select Scriptures. I do not have time right now to go into the many points of disagreement, so I'm going to leave it here for now. I will try to get back to it.
I know, you believe that sin and Satan wins and that only a select few are saved and enter into God's presence. There will be "Mission Accomplished" banners hung around the table at the Marriage Supper...even though the majority of mankind was still lost.
 

Christina

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Soul destruction or second death is what the Bible says Satan will receive to be destroyed from the inside out ...There is no sin in the New Heaven and New Earth ... And I believe whats written call it what you will .... there is a thousand years where Satan is bound ... And then he loosed yet for a little while ... Why? this to test the ones who were not part of the first resurrection ... If.... you do not pass this second testing yes you not only cease to exist (death of the soul) but you are no longer even remembered ... Thats what scripture says ... then there is a New Heaven and New earth and all the rudiments(elements) will melt and Death and Hell are destroyed
 

tomwebster

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QUOTE (Christian Mystic @ Mar 12 2009, 01:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70673
I've asked two questions several times and no one has answered them. First, What is the purpose of a Hell where everyone burns or is destroyed forever? Would it be to satisfy a concept of a blood thirsty God's retribution or his entertainment? Second,Why would God condemn a 16 year old Hindu girl who never heard the Gospel to burning or being destroyed forever?Thirdly,Does anyone here have any loved one's who died without knowing Jesus Christ?
1) We have a different view of God2) We have a different concept of God3) You are presuming to know the heart of your loved ones. I do not find anywhere in Scripture that says you are the judge.4) Our systems of Theology are different. We will not be able to agree.QUOTE (Christian Mystic @ Mar 12 2009, 01:02 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70673
...I know, you believe that sin and Satan wins and that only a select few are saved and enter into God's presence. There will be "Mission Accomplished" banners hung around the table at the Marriage Supper...even though the majority of mankind was still lost.
Gracious, now not only can you see into the heart of your loved ones, you presume you can read my mind. What did you say your name was?
 

Jordan

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 01:08 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70674
Soul destruction or second death is what the Bible says Satan will receive to be destroyed from the inside out ...There is no sin in the New Heaven and New Earth ... And I believe whats written call it what you will .... there is a thousand years where Satan is bound ... And then he loosed yet for a little while ... Why? this to test the ones who were not part of the first resurrection ... If.... you do not pass this second testing yes you not only cease to exist (death of the soul) but you are no longer even remembered ... Thats what scripture says ... then there is a New Heaven and New earth and all the rudiments(elements) will melt and Death and Hell are destroyed
Soul DestructionEzekiel 18:1 - The word of the LORD came unto me again, saying,Ezekiel 18:4 - Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.Ezekiel 18:20 - The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.Luke 13:3 - I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.Luke 13:5 - I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish...............New Heaven & New Earth created. No sin exist.Isaiah 65:17 - For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.Isaiah 66:22 - For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.II Peter 3:13 - Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.Revelation 21:1 - And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea...............Satan loosed for a little season after the 1,000 years Millennium Reign...Revelation 20:2 - And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,Revelation 20:7 - And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
 

Christian Mystic

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 02:08 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70674
Soul destruction or second death is what the Bible says Satan will receive to be destroyed from the inside out ...
Can you provide Scripture indicating that "Satan" will be destroyed from the inside out? You might be suprised as to what it's really addressing when we look at it in context. QUOTE
There is no sin in the New Heaven and New Earth ...
Amen. We agree here.QUOTE
And I believe whats written call it what you will .... there is a thousand years where Satan is bound ... And then he loosed yet for a little while ... Why? this to test the ones who were not part of the first resurrection ...
You might be suprised to find that what you're teaching isn't even biblical. Here's the text....
Revelation 20:1-151And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, 3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. 4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. 7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. 9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. 10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.​
First, Satan is a fallen angel, a spirit. He doesn't have a physical body. A physical chain isn't needed, a physical key, nor a physical pit are needed. These are all symbols. The "angel" having the key to the bottomless pit is Chris himself, Christ alone has the keys to death and hell (Revelation 1:18; compare with Revelation 10:1-2).
Revelation 1:18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.​
This passage is symbolically describing is Christ's first coming to earth with the Gospel and the binding of Satan and his power. Today during this Gospel dispensation Satan is spiritually bound by the power of the Gospel and so he works through demonic hosts. Next we see thrones. Notice something...John's seeing this in Heaven, he's not seeing this on earth, because next he specifically states that he sees "souls". Here John is seeing the Church and the souls of those who have been martyred by the spirit of the Beast ruling and reigning with Christ in Heaven. They rule and reign for "a thousand years". One thing we have to remember...numbers are symbolic. The symbolic connotation of "a thousand years" depicts a complete age or dispensation. Those who are saved and have passed on are currently ruling and reigning with Christ in Heaven during this dispensation. At the end of this Gospel dispensation (the symbolic 1000 years) the restrainer will release Satan to bring total havok upon earth. Satan will then work to unite the world and gather the armies of the world into global warfare. (We may very well be seeing this today as the Gospel age comes to a close.) But we have a promise, when the armies of this world appear to be surrounding the church and Israel (that holy city) God's judgment will fall upon the world and Christ shall return. The Heavens and the earth shall flee from his face and the dead, both small and great, shall stand before Him and all shall be judged according to the things written in the books. Satan, the spirit of the Beast, and the spirit of the False Prophet, will be cast into the lake of fire. Also, all whose names are not recorded are not in the book of life are cast into the lake of fire. Here they undergo the "kolasis" Jesus spoke of in Matthew 25:46. QUOTE
If.... you do not pass this second testing yes you not only cease to exist (death of the soul) but you are no longer even remembered ... Thats what scripture says ... then there is a New Heaven and New earth and all the rudiments(elements) will melt and Death and Hell are destroyed
There isn't a "second testing". That is a dispensationalism myth. There is only one opportunity to obey the Gospel and escape God's chastisement...and that is here and now.
 

Jordan

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You really are lacking God's wisdom Christian Mystic... Read my post which is above yours. God says we have two bodies... so therefore they are both physical bodies.I Corinthians 15:44 - It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
 

Christina

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QUOTE (Christian Mystic @ Mar 12 2009, 11:39 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70678
Can you provide Scripture indicating that "Satan" will be destroyed from the inside out? You might be suprised as to what it's really addressing when we look at it in context. Amen. We agree here.You might be suprised to find that what you're teaching isn't even biblical. Here's the text....
Revelation 20:1-151And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, 3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. 4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. 7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. 9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. 10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.​
First, Satan is a fallen angel, a spirit. He doesn't have a physical body. A physical chain isn't needed, a physical key, nor a physical pit are needed. These are all symbols. The "angel" having the key to the bottomless pit is Chris himself, Christ alone has the keys to death and hell (Revelation 1:18; compare with Revelation 10:1-2).
Revelation 1:18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.​
This passage is symbolically describing is Christ's first coming to earth with the Gospel and the binding of Satan and his power. Today during this Gospel dispensation Satan is spiritually bound by the power of the Gospel and so he works through demonic hosts. Next we see thrones. Notice something...John's seeing this in Heaven, he's not seeing this on earth, because next he specifically states that he sees "souls". Here John is seeing the Church and the souls of those who have been martyred by the spirit of the Beast ruling and reigning with Christ in Heaven. They rule and reign for "a thousand years". One thing we have to remember...numbers are symbolic. The symbolic connotation of "a thousand years" depicts a complete age or dispensation. Those who are saved and have passed on are currently ruling and reigning with Christ in Heaven during this dispensation. At the end of this Gospel dispensation (the symbolic 1000 years) the restrainer will release Satan to bring total havok upon earth. Satan will then work to unite the world and gather the armies of the world into global warfare. (We may very well be seeing this today as the Gospel age comes to a close.) But we have a promise, when the armies of this world appear to be surrounding the church and Israel (that holy city) God's judgment will fall upon the world and Christ shall return. The Heavens and the earth shall flee from his face and the dead, both small and great, shall stand before Him and all shall be judged according to the things written in the books. Satan, the spirit of the Beast, and the spirit of the False Prophet, will be cast into the lake of fire. Also, all whose names are not recorded are not in the book of life are cast into the lake of fire. Here they undergo the "kolasis" Jesus spoke of in Matthew 25:46. There isn't a "second testing". That is a dispensationalism myth. There is only one opportunity to obey the Gospel and escape God's chastisement...and that is here and now.
Well you believe as you like My Bible says different there is a testing As there is a fisrt resurrection and second time Satan is loosed and the dead are not raised all raised untill after the thousand years ... You can belive all this garbage of 1000 years not being literal if you want but you havent a scripture to prove it .... I've heard all this before its not like I just got off the truck here. Jesus said Matthew 25:41 “Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:” He also said John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life”. In the one verse it would seem that the wicked will live forever in everlasting fire and yet the other verse tells us that only those who belong to Jesus will not perish. This means that wicked will perish.The only conclusion we can come to is that the everlasting fire, is not actually fire that is everlasting, but rather fire which consumes with everlasting consequences.Are there other places in the Bible where it says forever, but the event mentioned has finished? There are actually many examples of this. Just as today people will often say things like “The show was so boring it went on forever” and “It took forever to get the house painted”. These same type of expressions were also used in the Bible for events that lasted a long time, but not actually eternally or for events that had everlasting consequences. For example the Bible describes the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrha as eternal fire. Jude 1:7 “Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire”. This fire is not still burning today. It had eternal consequences, as the cities were forever destroyed and the fire was not extinguished. This fire was allowed to burn until it had consumed everything away and then it went out.This is the same type of fire that “death and hell” will be thrown into and the same type of Fire from Heaven that will consume the wicked after the judgment. Depending on their sentence they will be either consumed quickly with little pain, or else have to suffer longer for more severe sins. The Bible shows us that they will not live forever burning in Hell, because we are told that they will be as ashes under our feet. Malachi 4:3 “And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts”.Many Christians think that Satan will be thrown into eternally burning hell fire and yet the Bible shows that he too will be consumed and will be no more. Ezekiel 28:18-19 “Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more”.The Bible further clarifies that fate of the wicked Malachi 4:1 “For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch”.Our awesome and loving God who abounds in mercy is not going to torture and torment the wicked forever and ever in the agony of an eternally burning Hell. He will justly deal with them and they will perish for their sins. For the Wages of Sin are death.
 

Christian Mystic

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 03:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70681
Well you believe as you like My Bible says different there is a testing As there is a fisrt resurrection and second time Satan is loosed and the dead are not raised all raised untill after the thousand years ... You can belive all this garbage of 1000 years not being literal if you want but you havent a scripture to prove it .... I've heard all this before its not like I just got off the truck here. Jesus said Matthew 25:41 “Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:” He also said John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life”. In the one verse it would seem that the wicked will live forever in everlasting fire and yet the other verse tells us that only those who belong to Jesus will not perish. This means that wicked will perish.The only conclusion we can come to is that the everlasting fire, is not actually fire that is everlasting, but rather fire which consumes with everlasting consequences.Are there other places in the Bible where it says forever, but the event mentioned has finished? There are actually many examples of this. Just as today people will often say things like “The show was so boring it went on forever” and “It took forever to get the house painted”. These same type of expressions were also used in the Bible for events that lasted a long time, but not actually eternally or for events that had everlasting consequences. For example the Bible describes the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrha as eternal fire. Jude 1:7 “Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire”. This fire is not still burning today. It had eternal consequences, as the cities were forever destroyed and the fire was not extinguished. This fire was allowed to burn until it had consumed everything away and then it went out.This is the same type of fire that “death and hell” will be thrown into and the same type of Fire from Heaven that will consume the wicked after the judgment. Depending on their sentence they will be either consumed quickly with little pain, or else have to suffer longer for more severe sins. The Bible shows us that they will not live forever burning in Hell, because we are told that they will be as ashes under our feet. Malachi 4:3 “And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts”.Many Christians think that Satan will be thrown into eternally burning hell fire and yet the Bible shows that he too will be consumed and will be no more. Ezekiel 28:18-19 “Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more”.The Bible further clarifies that fate of the wicked Malachi 4:1 “For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch”.Our awesome and loving God who abounds in mercy is not going to torture and torment the wicked forever and ever in the agony of an eternally burning Hell. He will justly deal with them and they will perish for their sins. For the Wages of Sin are death.
So you believe that all those who have never heard the gospel before will be resurrected at the beginning of the Millennium? Where is that in Scripture? (Assuming that there is a literal Millennium of course.)I do understand that many believe that the nations that are unsaved will enter the millennium without glorified bodies and have children. The idea is that these born during the millennium have to be tested. That doesn't have anything to do with the 16 year old Hindu girl who never heard the Gospel. I believe that the fires of Hell are eternal for the devil and his angels. However, I believe that mankind will face those flames as part of their purging or "kolasis" (Matthew 25:46). Jesus would have used an entirely different word had he meant destruction or retribution. Instead Jesus uses a word associated with pruning and correction. What an awesome God we serve! You believe he's merciful because he DESTROYS the majority of the human race...I believe he's merciful because I believe he will have mercy.
Lamentations 3:31-3231For the LORD will not cast off for ever: 32But though he cause grief, yet will he have compassion according to the multitude of his mercies.​
He punishes as would a father...not Adolf Hitler.
 

Christina

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No that's not what I believe you are putting words in my mouth ... I believe what we are told In 1 Cor. ( 1Cr 15:51-52) ALL did you get that word ALL that pretty much means ALL will be changed into their incorruptible bodies (that is not flesh and Blood) This is the second coming the 7th and last trump Only the over comers/ Elect are of the first resurrected that is not subject to the second death ( death of ones soul) Rev. 2:11 and Rev. 20:6These over comers have passed their test overcome the tribulation, Having the seal of God in their foreheads All others that are not wicked (as the wicked stay dead) are taught the truth of God by Christ and those who reign with him Then as we are told After 1000 years (Rev. 20:2 - Rev.20:7) Satan is loosed to test those who did not make the first resurrection Then comes final judgement .... All those who were mislead by men, never heard Gods Word, were good people but never accepted Christ ect ect all, these people get a chance to be tested again when Satan is loosed the second time ...If after being taught by Christ himself they still dont get it ... Yes they die the second death cease to exist .. are no more remembered ... Satan is among these God is always fair and just
 

Jordan

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 03:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70684
No that's not what I believe you are putting words in my mouth ... I believe what we are told In 1 Cor. ( 1Cr 15:51-52) ALL did you get that word ALL that pretty much means ALL will be changed into their incorruptible bodies (that is not flesh and Blood) This is the second coming the 7th and last trump Only the over comers/ Elect are of the first resurrected that is not subject to the second death ( death of ones soul) Rev. 2:11 and Rev. 20:6These over comers have passed their test overcome the tribulation, Having the seal of God in their foreheads All others that are not wicked (as the wicked stay dead) are taught the truth of God by Christ and those who reign with him Then as we are told After 1000 years (Rev. 20:2 - Rev.20:7) Satan is loosed to test those who did not make the first resurrection Then comes final judgement .... All those who were mislead by men, never heard Gods Word, were good people but never accepted Christ ect ect all, these people get a chance to be tested again when Satan is loosed the second time ...If after being taught by Christ himself they still dont get it ... Yes they die the second death cease to exist .. are no more remembered ... Satan is among these God is always fair and just
Amen Christina. That is 100% correct.
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And God is always fair and just indeed.
 

setfree

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The phrase "forever and ever" is used both of describing God's eternal worth and the duration of eternal damnation. The exact same Greek phrase is used in each of the verses in the table below.forever and everaionas ton aionon"ages of the ages" Eternal - without end Eternal Damnation "Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen," (1 Tim. 1:17). ". . . To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever" (Rev. 5:13). "And a second time they said, "Hallelujah! Her smoke rises up forever and ever" (Rev. 19:3)."And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever," (Rev. 20:10). The Greek phrase "aionas ton aionon," which is translated "forever and ever," occurs 18 times in the Greek New Testament. In 17 of them, the phrase means without end, extending into infinity. In Rev. 19:3, the phrase is used to describe the destruction of the great whore of Babylon (Rev. 17:1,4) whose smoke ascends forever and ever. It too is eternal and it signifies the beginning of the eternal judgment that comes upon her.Also worth examining is Rev. 14:11: "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; and they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."The Greek in Rev. 14:11 is only slightly different. In the table above, "forever and ever" is translated from the Greek, "aionas ton aionon," which is literally "ages of the of ages." In Rev. 14:11, the Greek is "aionas aionon" which is literally, "ages of ages." In the latter, the single Greek word "of the" is missing. But it is not necessary and does not change the meaning of the text. Therefore, the scripture teaches the smoke of their torment goes up forever, without end.
 

Christina

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Whatever you like setfree its also used as in Sodom an gomorrah(jude1:7) burning forever ect.And other verse that mean an age as we have already discussed several times. So believe men instead of your Father as usual it really makes no difference What men say God doesnt say there is no burning forever.But of course you will continue to argue continue to rehash continue to spin around what has been shown and proven because it doesnt say what you have heard men say and you always chose men over God so believe what you want .. Jesus said Matthew 25:41 “Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:” He also said John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life”. In the one verse it would seem that the wicked will live forever in everlasting fire and yet the other verse tells us that only those who belong to Jesus will not perish. This means that wicked will perish.The only conclusion we can come to is that the everlasting fire, is not actually fire that is everlasting, but rather fire which consumes with everlasting consequences.
 

Christian Mystic

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 04:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70684
All those who were mislead by men, never heard Gods Word, were good people but never accepted Christ ect ect all, these people get a chance to be tested again when Satan is loosed the second time ...If after being taught by Christ himself they still dont get it ... Yes they die the second death cease to exist .. are no more remembered ... Satan is among these God is always fair and just
Please show me were you get this idea. I have studied Dispensational theology for nearly 25 years. I'm well versed in the writings of Scofield, Larkin, Woodard, and Ryrie....none of them express this notion. The only one's who enter the Millennium (if we take it literally) are those who are with Christ and/or glorified at his coming and those still living who never took the mark of the beast. These unglorified individuals are often referred to as "the nations" and it is believed that they will have children and populate the earth during the Millennium. Those who died without Christ prior to the Tribulation and during the Tribulation (if there is a future tribulation) remain dead until the final judgment. Can you give me any solid scholarship or scholars holding this view?
 

Jordan

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QUOTE (Christian Mystic @ Mar 12 2009, 05:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70690
QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 03:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70684
...All those who were mislead by men, never heard Gods Word, were good people but never accepted Christ ect ect all, these people get a chance to be tested again when Satan is loosed the second time ...If after being taught by Christ himself they still dont get it ... Yes they die the second death cease to exist .. are no more remembered ... Satan is among these God is always fair and just
Please show me were you get this idea. I have studied Dispensational theology for nearly 25 years. I'm well versed in the writings of Scofield, Larkin, Woodard, and Ryrie....none of them express this notion. The only one's who enter the Millennium (if we take it literally) are those who are with Christ and/or glorified at his coming and those still living who never took the mark of the beast. These unglorified individuals are often referred to as "the nations" and it is believed that they will have children and populate the earth during the Millennium. Those who died without Christ prior to the Tribulation and during the Tribulation (if there is a future tribulation) remain dead until the final judgment. Can you give me any solid scholarship or scholars holding this view?Before you go to Christina, I like to know where in the scriptures say we will populate the Earth and have children in the Millennium Reign? And I like to see scriptures where there are some people classified as an "unglorified" individuals?
 

Christina

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QUOTE (Christian Mystic @ Mar 12 2009, 03:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70690
Please show me were you get this idea. I have studied Dispensational theology for nearly 25 years. I'm well versed in the writings of Scofield, Larkin, Woodard, and Ryrie....none of them express this notion. The only one's who enter the Millennium (if we take it literally) are those who are with Christ and/or glorified at his coming and those still living who never took the mark of the beast. These unglorified individuals are often referred to as "the nations" and it is believed that they will have children and populate the earth during the Millennium. Those who died without Christ prior to the Tribulation and during the Tribulation (if there is a future tribulation) remain dead until the final judgment. Can you give me any solid scholarship or scholars holding this view?
Congratulations I spent as many years studying God while you may be well versed in men they are just men and the book was closed until knowledge increased and the seal broken. Studying men doesnt give one wisdom from God but confusion of men. And I would like to hear ansewr ti Jordans questions also
 

watchman

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QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 12:31 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70667
You can all believe as you chose but God has a plan so if you think you can change the nature of God and figure out his whole plan by one or two words in a verse being misunderstood be my guest ... There is no burning in hell forever just a lack of man to understand God his nature and his plan .. He says Sodom and gomorrah would burn forever is it still burning ?????????????
Where is that scripture?
 

Jordan

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QUOTE (watchman @ Mar 12 2009, 09:12 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70697
QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 12 2009, 12:31 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70667
You can all believe as you chose but God has a plan so if you think you can change the nature of God and figure out his whole plan by one or two words in a verse being misunderstood be my guest ... There is no burning in hell forever just a lack of man to understand God his nature and his plan .. He says Sodom and gomorrah would burn forever is it still burning ?????????????
Where is that scripture?Instead of going after her all the time, why don't you search it for yourself. In fact, start with my posts on this very thread.
 

Christina

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QUOTE (Jordan @ Mar 12 2009, 07:17 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70699
Where is that scripture?Instead of going after her all the time, why don't you search it for yourself. In fact, start with my posts on this very thread.
I agree Jordan some people cant read just keep repeating the same old same and when you give scripture they dont read it just keep asking Watchman try reading the posts ... if you dont get it take up with God ... His nature does not desire to torture people forever nor does he say this only man wants this fate for his fellow man ... Why dont you start by explaining Jude 1:7 to us ..cause you know what I dont see Sodom still burning and if you want to say this spiritual not literal then maybe you will answer your own question which I have already explained in my above posts
 
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