Do we even have the correct definition of "saved?"

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Taken

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lol

the naive dialectic, the manna, Taken, will you ever eat it
i mean dont if you dont want to ok, not bothering me any
.

Manna, Kept physical body's alive...Bread still does. It goes through the digestive system and waste is expelled.

The Word of God, is likened to bread...gobble it up and it can not be expelled...whether or not you trust it or believe it, you can not unhear it or uneat it.

so you say anyway, but i might invoke any number of scenarios in which ppl, particularly "believers," become um "caught up" in a like a clone-thing, i would even say a "homospiritual" thing, a shadow of unity iow, "When We All Get to Heaven" and etc, perhaps

No they are not cloned...they are in agreement on particular points, sometimes many points, but NOT exactly everything...

No two people read, study the exact same text for the exact same amount of time.
 

bbyrd009

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Seeing how you do not believe the Bible is God's words
? the Bible is def Yah's words imo, It is just not Word, imo, for the reasons i posted already; it has been heard by someone as Word, that i agree, but then he wrote it down and someone else read some words, but they were not there to hear it and so lost a certain amt of context, although they might eventually get to Word again if they are able to hear, which we are not very good at that, are we, hearing what other ppl or prophets say, and then It gets translated into a diff language tow or three times over, to boot?

"Easter" then becomes Word, right?
ill pass for now, ty
Seeing how you do not believe the Bible is God's words, I can see why you wouldn't even bother. Not sure why we are discussing this with you when it is a moot point to you no matter what we say, right?
well, he who says he knows, does not, and yes you are all speaking in satans dialectic so what you say is mostly true for me, but 1 there are others here, and 2 while facts are not truth, they can be useful even to me.

So, as i briefly mentioned earlier and i guess should maybe do more of, a lot of what you say i agree with ok, at least the words if not the intent, which is inevitable right now, as long as you are committed to Death, More Abundantly which pls dont take that wrong, imo there is no judgement for "beliefs," as the Good Samaritan and many others in Scripture make plain, imo

so, Death, More Abundantly and life, more abundantly do not mix, i can agree with that, yes, even though they share a common lexicon they do not speak the same language, and so thus your point at "discussing" is i guess true...

only wadr see no one is much "discussing" anything with me, i am getting a series of lectures or sermons in response to my questions, might be a better way to put it? And of course any questions or observations i make that are uncomfortable are just ignored, even though im letting that slide bc i already know what the alt manifests, so again "discussing" see, prolly not the best characterization
 
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bbyrd009

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No they are not cloned...they are in agreement on particular points, sometimes many points, but NOT exactly everything...
contemplate that most believers are likely in agreement on the stuff that is not true, and in disagreement at the points that are.

For instance no matter what denomination, 10s, 20s, 100s, doesnt matter, all "believe" in some version of the Cult of Sol model, you believe Jesus (Apollos) is literally Returning to take you...somewhere, or Returning to stay, perhaps, or prolly you arent quite sure, ha well i guess you are huh, i mean i never was, but whatevs. The point is (virtually) all are either Zionists or Mithraists, when most likely neither will ever manifest, except in Spirit, imo
 

bbyrd009

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he who seeks to save his soul will lose it

and after all that is ezackly what we mean by "i'm saved," right?
"my soul has been saved from a future pit that i have been taught that most others, virtually everyone else who is not me, will go to"
and when i say we i mean believers

so, as we can witness here in all of the professors condemning every other believer, we do that, and then we go sing "When We All Get to Heaven" and pat each other on the back every Sunday right
and by we here i now mean even pagans, atheists, satanists, everyone. "we"
 
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Taken

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no, it is not, mos def. you have no choice, at least in all giving below...15% of your gross, which who gives more than that?

Ergo "deduct if you please, or not" is functionally untrue, and cannot be done

you have been givien "credit" for a certain amount of donations, whether you give them or not, whether you give them to a "tax deductible charity" or not, which ppl still blindly do anyway, assuming they are more wholesome or whatever, who knows, more authorized i guess.

But see Susan Komen wont tell women that vit D deficiency is a better marker for breast cancer than a mammogram, no, they still say "get a mammogram" yeh, which prolly causes any breast cancers even

There is always the Eager willing to TELL people What to do In "every" aspect of their lives...and there are Many who can NOT function without being Told What to Think, Believe, Do...without question.

X-rays are not by the public at Large as a threat...they are not seen or felt or smell or tasted or touched or heard...IOW, no naueral sense of Warning. Yes, to the trained they can derect...but they are deadly, they Do Kill healthy and bad things.
Convenient Yes...so are "Approved" (ha) chemical compound drugs...might mask your sniffles, but destroy your liver!
People love easy and convenience and the majority will fall for the malarkey every time.

Not just A single Vitamin is the answer either.
We are are CREATED out of the Same Elements as the Earth. It is Elements of the Earth that sustains a healthy body...
And it is using our senses to determine which Elements and how much the body requires to stay in a healthy balance, which in turn the balance maintains optimum health.
 
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bbyrd009

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Seeing how you do not believe the Bible is God's words, I can see why you wouldn't even bother. Not sure why we are discussing this with you when it is a moot point to you no matter what we say, right?
see, i cant show you the truth of Yah's Words ok, for that you have to rely on Yah

which i understand you meant that with...the best of intentions, alright, but see the assumptions that must be made there, if you will
 

prism

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That's only one side of the equation. The bible also says whoever believes that Jesus has come in the flesh is born of God. And that can be said of anyone who goes to church...including the mafia.
That passage in context is in comparison with those who deny that Jesus has come in the flesh...context, context, context.
I find that people are looking to be saved by reading certain bible verses. And thus deceiving themselves by trying to find legal means to be saved.
yes, there is the natural mind which twists verses to it's own destruction and then there are those who are born again who are taught by the Spirit...but these are already saved.

If we abide in Christ we ought to walk even as He walked. Now that doesn't sound like an easy verse to get saved with. Or else...whoever sins is of the devil. You never hear that verse cited for an easy salvation.
If you think those verses are salvation verses you are gravely mistaken. The first describes the walk of one who is saved, the second of one who is lost.

So to me unless you look at ALL the verses in the bible...you should keep quiet. And even IF you are walking like Jesus...you should not claim anything.

but the carnal man claims and claims...without any evidence. people are looking to justify themselves.
God's promises are true even if spoken once. A person doesn't need to read the whole bible to be saved. Paul sums up the Gospel in 1Cor 1:1-4. The Scribes read the whole bible and had large parts memorized, see where it got them. I walk with Jesus and will continue to proclaim? No man can justify himself...successfully. context, context, context.
 
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Taken

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the Bible is surely not Yah's Word, and It also is not the Book of Truth,


You say what you believe the Bible IS NOT.

So what is your Truth?
Do you believe there IS an Almighty Creator and Maker?

And IF so, What is the Source/Basis For The Existance of your Almighty God?

Feelings? Observance of the World? Phipholosophers Ideas? Fi-Si? Other Books?
Something else?

If not, are you opposed to an Almighty God?
Or are you on the fence, undecided?
 

Enow

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for this wadr you would have to get the naive dialectic, eat the manna i guess is how Scripture says it, and i would have to learn how to speak it lol, which i am not very good at yet. I mean i could try, but you are...not hearing yet, no offense, so...i guess for you at least, right now anyway, i am not the one, as much as i am tempted.

I guess the v i already Quoted at you from that passage will have to serve there, if you would address that maybe

You are reading my English well enough, but whatever.

As for addressing a quote out of context as paraphrased in according to your meaning, I would go to context of scripture but you say you don't do that so we are at an impasse.
 

Enow

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we're tired of this manna, give us some meat to eat!

But that would require going to the scripture which you believe is not the Word of yah as in God.

Hebrews 5:11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing. 12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat. 13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. 14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Yah yah it doesn't say scripture directly.. my interpretation due to being able to discern good and evil from those that mishandle the word of God.

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. 14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Ephesians 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

So when you don't believe scripture to be the Word of God, then how can you correct any one from your paraphrasing quotes out of context? What is the point of it other than to sow doubts to God's words?

Boy, those anti-KJVOnlynist really did a number on you. At one time you use the KJV, but now you can't rely on any version. I may not be a KJVOnlynist but just because I rely on the KJV for the meat of His words to discern good and evil by it, thanks to Jesus Christ, doesn't mean I can't see through all the lies they throw against using only the KJV, thanks to Jesus Christ, even if you can't or won't.

Come back from the dark side, Vader. Walk in the light of His words in the fellowship of the Father & the Son so that your joy may be full.;)
 

Episkopos

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That passage in context is in comparison with those who deny that Jesus has come in the flesh...context, context, context.
yes, there is the natural mind which twists verses to it's own destruction and then there are those who are born again who are taught by the Spirit...but these are already saved.


If you think those verses are salvation verses you are gravely mistaken. The first describes the walk of one who is saved, the second of one who is lost.


God's promises are true even if spoken once. A person doesn't need to read the whole bible to be saved. Paul sums up the Gospel in 1Cor 1:1-4. The Scribes read the whole bible and had large parts memorized, see where it got them. I walk with Jesus and will continue to proclaim? No man can justify himself...successfully. context, context, context.


The context you use is that you are already eternally saved...and everything you read is with that presumption.

So you can just say...that's me because I'm saved...and...that's not me because ...guess what??? I'm saved.

It's like looking at the bible through a straw.
 

Enow

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see, i cant show you the truth of Yah's Words ok, for that you have to rely on Yah

which i understand you meant that with...the best of intentions, alright, but see the assumptions that must be made there, if you will

But you ain't doing it in showing how you read the scripture for what you understand it to be saying so there is no way for God to help me see the truth in how you see it.

Now when you say you do not believe the Word of Yah, then I can't believe you mean you believe the truth when you read it in how you apply it to mean. So you kind of took the legs out from under you for any "interpretation" when you don't believe the Word of Yah anyway.

Cart before the horse, ya doing it. No one can follow you then, cause you don't believe it.
 

Renniks

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all go to the same place
you and your sons will be here with me
we do not yet know what we will become

thinking, i dont think too much lol, tbh thinking gets me in trouble
i would certainly love to be an immortal myself tho, i mean dont doubt that
Death, More Abundantly is a very attractive proposition, yeh
I really can't even tell what you are trying to say. Please use complete words and punctuation, and explain what you actually believe about heaven and we can perhaps have a discussion.
 

amadeus

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That's only one side of the equation. The bible also says whoever believes that Jesus has come in the flesh is born of God. And that can be said of anyone who goes to church...including the mafia.

I find that people are looking to be saved by reading certain bible verses. And thus deceiving themselves by trying to find legal means to be saved.

But where is the honesty in that?

If we abide in Christ we ought to walk even as He walked. Now that doesn't sound like an easy verse to get saved with. Or else...whoever sins is of the devil. You never hear that verse cited for an easy salvation.

So to me unless you look at ALL the verses in the bible...you should keep quiet. And even IF you are walking like Jesus...you should not claim anything.

but the carnal man claims and claims...without any evidence. people are looking to justify themselves.
LOL... Do you suppose having a very high priced lawyer of man's law will win them their case? Oh, probably there are some [many?] of them around already, specialists in this area, bearing the title of minister or preacher or pastor and so forth...
 
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Episkopos

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LOL... Do you suppose having a very high priced lawyer of man's law will win them their case? Oh, probably there are some [many?] of around already, specialists in this area, bearing the title of minister or preacher or pastor and so forth...
I'm afraid for people who listen to these modern preachers who promise heaven for nothing...in a time limited offer! Just to get another notch on their belt.
 
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Taken

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contemplate that most believers are likely in agreement on the stuff that is not true, and in disagreement at the points that are.

I think "most" people (Believers or not) are either too lazy or too busy to verify what they hear...hell, the democrat politicians Depend on that! And BTW so do many Church organizations, schools, colleges, etc.

Cult of Sol model,

What is ^ That?

you believe Jesus (Apollos)

Uh, where did you get such nonsense?

is literally Returning to take you
..somewhere, or Returning to stay,

Your comment shows you really do not know the Truth or Fullness of what I believe.

I have never called or implied JESUS is called or referred to as Apollos.
Jesus Left the Earth went to the Clouds. Left the Clouds and went to Heaven.
His Returning is in the same manner.
Descending to the Clouds. Then the Earth.
He is NOT returning to Earth to "take me" anywhere.
While He is in the Clouds, He shall call UP TO Him...specific People..."Only" Those That Belong To Him.
Those that belong to Him...Are the:
Forgiven
Sav-ed
Born Again

Those ^ are called:
The Converted IN Christ
Christ's Church

( not the Catholics, baptists, Protestants, Christians, Muslims, Chinese, Russians, Americans, whites, blacks, Hindus, Jews, Gentile's blah, blah, blah... ALL irrelevant )

He shall call UP TO Him...which is "Their" Redemption... (being claimed by the ONE,) "They", gave "their" authority (over their own Life ) "TO."

perhaps, or prolly you arent quite sure,

Of course I'm SURE.

ha well i guess you are huh, i mean i never was, but whatevs.

Funny how people will put their complete Trust...
In Banks to hold and keep their money;
In Babysitters / In Schools/ to have full control over their children;
In Governments to have full control over their housing, food, needs;
In man made Churches to have full control over their Spiritual beliefs;
In physicians to have full control over medical issues...
(Whether or NOT they have but briefly met the "controller" or not at all...
Etc.

And the same WHO have done such things...
Can BECOME everything from rude, crude, snarky, enraged, insulting to assaulting...
Toward people who claim they have Given Control of their Life TO: Christ the Lord Jesus!

The point is (virtually) all are either Zionists or Mithraists, when most likely neither will ever manifest, except in Spirit, imo

All are Zionists or Mithraists?

All people?
Really?
What do those terms mean? (According to you)?
 

Taken

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LOL... Do you suppose having a very high priced lawyer of man's law will win them their case? Oh, probably there are some [many?] of around already, specialists in this area, bearing the title of minister or preacher or pastor and so forth...

Here's the Stat outcome of Attorneys...
50% win
50% lose

So are 50 % of the charged "guilty" and 50% of the charged "not guilty" ?

No. It's more like an Expensive coin toss...and No one is ever found to be declared Innocent!

Straight out, God Himself does Not Save the Innocent.
All are "guilty" ... and All will Not accept His Offer To Become...Saved and Changed.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

Episkopos

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Straight out, God Himself does Not Save the Innocent.

Au contraire mon frere...God is merciful He is a Father to the fatherless and He looks after the afflicted and poor. He saves the widow and the orphan.

Not so with the religious and presumptuous however.