We need to be able to reconcile that passage with other passages.
Agreed!
I think there was a physical mountain there; and then there was also a spiritual mountain. We see Moses went all the way up, Joshua more than the others, then there were the seventy. The rest were told not to approach -- it is also said they were "under" the mountain -- not "next" to it but "under."
Perhaps referring to this part?
Dueteronomy 4
10 Specially the day that thou stoodest before the Lord thy God in Horeb, when the Lord said unto me, Gather me the people together, and I will make them hear my words, that they may learn to fear me all the days that they shall live upon the earth, and that they may teach their children.
11 And ye came near and stood under the mountain; and the mountain burned with fire unto the midst of heaven, with darkness, clouds, and thick darkness.
12 And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice.
"ye came near and stood under the mountain" on the day "thou stoodest before the Lord thy God in Horeb."
I understand this as being in the plain below the mountain, rather than underneath the mountain.
Compare that to Jesus with Peter, James and John. The other nine disciples did not go with them. Were Moses and Elijah really there? I'd say, of course -- but I also wonder if other people would have seen much or how accurately they would have seen things. We're told Moses' face shone and that Jesus was transfigured. I"d say something went just a tiny bit amiss when Moses came back and his face was still shining. That's usually hidden from the ordinary people -- Jesus looked ordinary to other people after he came down from the mountain.
I think they went up an actual mountain, as saw what it says they saw.
Moses . . . Paul gives understanding about his shine in 2 Corinthians 3, that his face shown, but faded. In contrast, our glory in Christ increases, not fades.
His was outside, standing in God's presence. But God has shown into our hearts with His glory, and now it works it's way outside, increasing, and not fading.
Compare too to Abraham going with Isaac up the mountain. Real mountain? Yes, but I'd also say they went to God's Holy Hill. The two with them (said to be Ishmael and Eliezer of Damascus by Jewish tradition) did not go with them. Now then,did they see a physical ram or a spiritual one? Again I refer to Jewish tradition which says that "ram" had existed before Eden.
I think that there was a real live ram that bled when it was sacrificed, and burned when it was offered. I think the most likely origin of that ram was that it was born from it's mother some short number of years previous.
Incidentally, I also read "mountain" to mean "spiritual mountain" here:
Matthew 17:20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
Matthew 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
Think about that. If people were living on a mountain, wouldn't it be a sin to cast it into the sea? Shouldn't the people have the chance to get off the mountain first? The spiritual mountain would move first. It could take a long time for the physical mountain to follow suit; but eventually it would. [/quote]
I don't know that we choose the mountains! But I like your thinking! Again, I stay simple. Faith can move mountains. Faith can cause a tree to transplant itself into the ocean. Faith can move corporation mountains. Faith can move government mountains. And faith can move giant granite uplifts.
Surely we cannot believe a physical mountain is meant here:
Revelation 21:10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
I that I believe John was seeing a vision, I'd gather that he was not standing on, say, Mount Rushmore, or some other earth location, but maybe, more what I think is that in his vision he was standing on a mountain.
Or here -- do you know of any mountain (physical one) where you can view the whole world?
Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them
Curious . . . what would be the difference in having a supernatural viewing of the kingdoms of the world on physical mountain, or spiritual mountain? Might not have Jesus been taken to a high mountain, and show these things?
What would it mean for Jesus to be on a "spiritual mountain", do you mean, a mountain in a vision, like John?
What does it mean to cast a spiritual mountain into the sea? Wouldn't this be metaphor just the same? That is, if the "mountain" is, say, a balloon payment, or a despised weakness, or the hostility of enemies, what have you, it's not that you are tossing the payment schedule into the ocean . . .
Do you know what I mean that I'm asking? What would a spiritual mountain be? Am I on track with what you mean?