In the hearts of those who are his, in every denomination across this planet, and outside denominations and in people you would not guess are among the faithful, until you hear them pray...
Bible verses most Christians refuse to believe
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Of course those outside of Christ aren't saved.
I have seen the attitude of Christ in many places and people who are his... I'm not sure what you are trying to say, but it's not coming across.
Wrong. That is NOT what Scripture says. At least not specifically, and not as if someone could SEE those living as God Says, living as Born Again ones, as God DESCRIBES throughout all the Scripture..... the things they DO, visible, to others..... as described by God, in Scripture.
See instead what Scripture says, step by step, describing those who are set apart by God, born again by His Will.
First of all, seeing IN SCRITURE,
what the people of God DO. It is described there in the Old Testment and in the New Testament, and is quite different from how they used to live (before they get saved) and quite different from the neighbors and others around them who are not saved, and quite different from all other groups on earth.
I have looked at the scriptures. Of course they are changed. Where did I say otherwise?
So, you can see it or you can't see it? Because you seem to be contradicting your self here.
I don't know that you did> the point was that their lives were changed, changed completely, and this was visible, this was clearly seen even by unbelievers, and that is THE FIRST PLACE (I Think I posted to look)
to see
the true gathering , the true character , of true believers, as DESCRIBED BY GOD (in His Word), not as described by men elsewhere in error.
THEN, (after the first place) (or together in harmony),
then, true believers might be seen, God Willing, IF there are any, in your daily lives.
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
Let me muse a while, see if you can follow where I'm tracking. I think you all would be familiar with scriptures that would validate my thoughts...
There is power, creative power, in God's word.
As we read and study God's word, we are changed. Jesus said in His prayer to His Father that we are sanctified by the word of truth.
That creative power of God's word recreates us into the image of Christ.
But for that to happen, we must believe that word. We must have faith in God's promises. If we do not believe God, we cannot hope to receive anything from Him. His promises are conditional on faith.
So, we are presented with promises that reveal God's purpose to free us from the power of sin... We are even to have dominion over sin. We are to rule over it as Kings. If we believe.
So we read God's word telling us that so long as we abide in Christ, we cannot sin. Some however would like to point out our imperfections and say ha! See, you must misunderstand God's promises because you are not perfect yet.
But what of the following statement from Solomon?
KJV Proverbs 23
7 For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he:
There have been several studies done in recent years that strongly resonate with the above text. That our thought patterns, and what we think of ourselves, and how we accept or reject what others think of us, directly correlates with who we become!
Thus, if we believe the scriptures that tell us we don't sin, and we identify with God's declaration of who we are, what reason is there that we should not become precisely that person that God identifies? Holy, righteous, sanctified.
This is not about what you believe I am... It is about what you believe you are and thus what you can become through those promises that you accept from a God Who cannot lie.
There is power, creative power, in God's word.
As we read and study God's word, we are changed. Jesus said in His prayer to His Father that we are sanctified by the word of truth.
That creative power of God's word recreates us into the image of Christ.
But for that to happen, we must believe that word. We must have faith in God's promises. If we do not believe God, we cannot hope to receive anything from Him. His promises are conditional on faith.
So, we are presented with promises that reveal God's purpose to free us from the power of sin... We are even to have dominion over sin. We are to rule over it as Kings. If we believe.
So we read God's word telling us that so long as we abide in Christ, we cannot sin. Some however would like to point out our imperfections and say ha! See, you must misunderstand God's promises because you are not perfect yet.
But what of the following statement from Solomon?
KJV Proverbs 23
7 For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he:
There have been several studies done in recent years that strongly resonate with the above text. That our thought patterns, and what we think of ourselves, and how we accept or reject what others think of us, directly correlates with who we become!
Thus, if we believe the scriptures that tell us we don't sin, and we identify with God's declaration of who we are, what reason is there that we should not become precisely that person that God identifies? Holy, righteous, sanctified.
This is not about what you believe I am... It is about what you believe you are and thus what you can become through those promises that you accept from a God Who cannot lie.
101G
Well-Known Member
addressing the OP,
but reading some of the post I just could not believe what I was reading. our spirit are save for we're to get new bodies, and in that we as spirit sin not, for what is flesh is flesh, and what is spirit is spirit. but until the day of the Lord in which we receive our change until then we're in flesh bodies., and have to deal with these flesh bodies. for our sin lieth within our bodies, which is still NATURAL. for this is one of the reason why the Holy Spirit the comforter is come to help us with these bodies that we're still in, where sin was condemned at in... the flesh. scriptures, Galatians 5:16 "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:17 "For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would".
while we’re still in these fleshly bodies we “sin” in the flesh. the scriptures that was given was correct. listen,
***************************************************
That is what CL has been claiming all along. But according to Scripture that is PLAIN DISHONEST.
I JOHN 1
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [Dishonesty #1]
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.[Dishonesty #2]
THE RESPOND WAS, Verses 8 and 10 are both about those who do not have Christ, and believe they don't sin, but do. Verse 9 is how to become a Christian.
We must disagree with that last part of the statement, "Verse 9 is how to become a Christian". this is in ERROR, this is for christian, for God never require a sinner to confess their sin in order to be save to become a christian.if that was the case then all of us are doomes, because most of us cannot not remember what we were doing last mont or even last week. and if someone was sinning october 11, 2001 at 7 pm and confess that but forgot the sin on January the 8th. at 6 pm then they are not saved.
understand, God requires a sinner to confess his Son Jesus, and not their sins in order to be saved. confessing sins are for christian. why do one think why we have a mediator, listen, 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:" BINGO.
for John is addressing christians, listen 1 John 1:5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1 John 1:6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth" the "WE" here are christian, because sinners don't have "FELLOWSHIP" with Christt.
Hoped that helped.
PICJAG.
but reading some of the post I just could not believe what I was reading. our spirit are save for we're to get new bodies, and in that we as spirit sin not, for what is flesh is flesh, and what is spirit is spirit. but until the day of the Lord in which we receive our change until then we're in flesh bodies., and have to deal with these flesh bodies. for our sin lieth within our bodies, which is still NATURAL. for this is one of the reason why the Holy Spirit the comforter is come to help us with these bodies that we're still in, where sin was condemned at in... the flesh. scriptures, Galatians 5:16 "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:17 "For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would".
while we’re still in these fleshly bodies we “sin” in the flesh. the scriptures that was given was correct. listen,
***************************************************
That is what CL has been claiming all along. But according to Scripture that is PLAIN DISHONEST.
I JOHN 1
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [Dishonesty #1]
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.[Dishonesty #2]
Click to expand...
THE RESPOND WAS, Verses 8 and 10 are both about those who do not have Christ, and believe they don't sin, but do. Verse 9 is how to become a Christian.
We must disagree with that last part of the statement, "Verse 9 is how to become a Christian". this is in ERROR, this is for christian, for God never require a sinner to confess their sin in order to be save to become a christian.if that was the case then all of us are doomes, because most of us cannot not remember what we were doing last mont or even last week. and if someone was sinning october 11, 2001 at 7 pm and confess that but forgot the sin on January the 8th. at 6 pm then they are not saved.
understand, God requires a sinner to confess his Son Jesus, and not their sins in order to be saved. confessing sins are for christian. why do one think why we have a mediator, listen, 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:" BINGO.
for John is addressing christians, listen 1 John 1:5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1 John 1:6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth" the "WE" here are christian, because sinners don't have "FELLOWSHIP" with Christt.
Hoped that helped.
PICJAG.
"Some faced jeers and flogging, and even chains and imprisonment. 37 They were put to death by stoning;[e] they were sawed in two; they were killed by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated— 38 the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, living in caves and in holes in the ground.
39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, 40 since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect."
Jesus told" IF you want to be Perfect (as God Says), go and sell everything and give it to the poor; then come follow Me"
39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, 40 since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect."
Jesus told" IF you want to be Perfect (as God Says), go and sell everything and give it to the poor; then come follow Me"
The heart is very deceitful. It cannot be trusted.
And should not be - not about others, not about one's own self.
It is not about my opinion, nor about your opinion, of anything - only what God Says - THAT is what is TRUTH, and what remains.
Hi brakelite,
I couldn't agree more!
Be it to you according to your faith.
Much love!
The heart of the man born from Adam is corrupt and depraved. But the heart of the man born from God is pure and true, and receiving the truth of the Word of God brings His life into ours.
Much love!
Very much agreed with this.
That's my issue with the idea that some sins are different from other sins. They were, back when men were not born from God, and it was a matter of natural man born from Adam keeping the lists of Laws of God. But now, when we've been born from God, all that does not come from that new birth, that new person, all else is sin.
Much love!
rather then get cranked up, and yes its frustrating, read your bible (a genuine translation not a paraphrased) see things as they are (hence don't have false hope in human nature, have realistic expectations, God does) and let it be. all you can do is offer what the Lord has given you to others, its on them what happens after that. as Paul has pointed out one must even receive the love of the Truth to have the love of the Truth, and that comes from God.
Except that Paul wrote in the present tense. He wrote about other things in the past tense, and some in future tenses. If you don't go by the tenses he wrote with, then how can you have any idea what he was saying? Will be saying? Might say? Each of these variations are from tense. This was me. This is me. This will be me. If I say, this is me, and you say, that means, it was me, then what would I have to write to say that it "IS" me?
What would Paul have had to write to communicate, should he have wanted to, that there was both sin and righteousness present with him at the same time? And that in his flesh lived sin, while in his spirt he delighted in righteousness?
If that were what he wanted to say, how would he say it, if not the way that he did? And having said it that way, why seek to re-interpret clear use of verb tense?
Much love!
reformed1689
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For the record, on a lot of verses that @CharismaticLady says many do not believe, what is the actual situation is they do not believe HER interpretation of these verses out of context.
Yes there is.
No. SINLESS is a term that Applies to one who was/is:
Not born in sin...
Never having committed sin.
(That rules out, All Earthly born natural people).
True for me?
I WAS naturally born in sin.
I Naturally Committed sin.
My sins were:
1) Not knowing the Lord...thus:
I did not know, what I did not know.
I did not love, praise, worship, exalt, submit, TO what I "did not know."
2) my sin Againt God...
WAS my Natural Corrupt self (flesh Body, spirit, and of Gods soul within me)
A) in my natural Carnal Minded Thoughts;
B) in my natural heart's spirit Thoughts;
C) in the souls thoughts, within me, given me, via Gods Breath...that belongs TO Him.
THAT ^ "WAS"....my SIN & SINS Against God...by NO CHOICE of my own TO BECOME Naturally Born.
Also, without MY Choice...I began to Hear of this thing Called A God.
BY my Choice...I chose to Learn and Discover More knowledge and information about this thing Called A God.
I Chose to Believe IN my natural Minds thoughts, and my natural spirit in my heart's thoughts, of this thing Called A God.
I came to a point, when "I chose"...TO BELIEVE and TRUST the Lord God Almighty.
...to repent For my natural Disbelief; and to Heartfully give the WHOLE of myself (Body & spirit...& Gods soul within me) OVER TO this thing... Called The Heavenly, Unseen, Everlasting, Creator and Maker Called The Lord God Almighty.
It is my Absolute Belief, The Lord God Almighty RESPONDED to me in His OWN Truth...
**And Forgave my Sins Against Him.
**Killed my Corrupt Body of Flesh;
* Washed my body in His Blood, Covered my body with His Light, Sanctified (set apart) my body UNTO Him, Justified my body to Be Redeemed (claimed) by Him, SEALED my body Unto Him, (that ONLY He can claim me),
AND...
Gave me HIS risen body to Occupy, while my Physical body, remains "physically" alive.
** Restored my soul..saving his/my soul unto Himself.
** Circumcised my Natural Heart...and gave me a New Heart.
** sowed HIS SEED in my new heart.
** His SEED birthed ME a NEW spirit (within my NEW Heart.)
** His SEED remains with-IN me, FEEDING my NEW spirit "WITH" HIS:
Word of Truth, Knowledge, Wisdom & Understanding.
** He has PREPARED me TO BE Forever WITH Him, (wherever He IS:
For HIS (unknown to me) appointed time...That HE SHALL CALL me UP TO HIM, "Above" the Face of the Earth.."Before" HE "Begins"...
Exercising HIS punishment, UPON the Corrupt Earth and UPON the Corrupt People and Corrupt things "UPON" and "IN" the Earth...exercised BY HIM, because of HIS Wrath AGAINST the Corrupt Earth, the Corrupt things and Corrupt People ON and IN the Earth.
So IS the Whole of me, (body, spirit, soul)...
Forgiven of my sins Against God?
Yes.
Am I FREED, from EVER Again Committing SIN AGAINST God?
Yes.
Am I SINLESS?
No.
Does "being "SINLESS" matter?
No.
Why not?
Because my Sins Against God...
1) Are Forgiven
2) covered with Gods Light
3) His Light Overcomes Darkness
4) Because of His Light, He can no longer SEE, my natural SIN that "WAS" Against Him.
5) That Which God Cannot SEE, He does NOT REMEMBER.
I Trust...He Shall Raise Up my Body, In A SINLESS, UNCORRUPT Body IN GODS "reflective upon my body" Glory...at which Time...Both God and myself WILL SEE, A SINLESS Body.
I chose...He Heard, He Responded, He has Prepared me, for His Redemtion of me.
It is a Relationship Expressly Between The Lord God Almighty and myself.
I do Not Sin Against men, angel's, animals, plants, or any living thing...Nor can "those" Living things sin against me.
BY the same token...Those things CAN NOT Forgive me of sin...nor can I forgive "those" things of sin.
My sin WAS ONLY Against God...and "ONLY" forgiven by God and ONLY GOD FREED me From Sin, that I sin no more.
Praise, Glory, Worship and Thanks be to God,
Taken
I am not understanding how you have determined that Paul was not a Christian in Roman's 7....and are you implying that 1 John nullifies and voids Roman's 7?
I will humbly share a testimony and ask your thoughts on it.
In the past I got caught up in going to the casino with my aunt. It wasn't a problem in my life until years later and it became a lifestyle and I began to suffer financially...
In prayer one night He told me to quit going to casinos. I disobeyed, and continued to go...my situation became critical financially and I was unable to pay my debts on a timely basis. So I cried out to God to help me, repented of my disobedience, and turned away from this.
So I ask, was I no longer a Christian because I sinned against God?
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