I WAS WRONG ABOUT THE NEW TESTAMENT

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Doug

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I was wrong in thinking the new testament was only for Israel. Upon further study, I have come to see that the new testament has been applied to the church, the body of Christ, in this dispensation of grace.

The new covenant is not the same as the new testament. The new covenant is future. The new testament was accomplished at the cross. The new testament is only in force with the death of the testator (Hebrews 9:16-17); a covenant does not always require death, or sacrifice (Jeremiah 34:18-19) to be in affect (2 Samuel 7 1 Samuel 18:1-5). The marriage covenant, as an example, does not necessitate death (Malachi 2:14). A covenant from God is by an oath (Psalm 89:3).

The new testament was to redeem the transgressions committed by Israel under the first testament ( the old covenant, the old testament), as seen in Hebrews 9:15. The new testament was accomplished by the death and shed blood of Christ (Matthew 26:28). The new testament was for Israel only, for the many, not for all (Mark 14:24 Luke 22:20).

The old covenant was made only with Israel (Exodus 34:27). Israel is looking for the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ for their salvation (Acts 3:19). The new covenant will be made only with the house of Israel and Judah (Jeremiah 31:31). The new covenant, will be made (it has yet to be fulfilled), will bring Israel into the promised land, will forgive their iniquities, and give them a new heart to keep the law by his spirit (Jeremiah 31:31-34 Deuteronomy 30:1-6 Ezekiel 36:24-28).

Paul was made an able minister of the new testament (2 Corinthians 3:6). By revelations from the Lord Jesus, Paul was given revelations of the mystery (Ephesians 3:3 2 Corinthians 12:7). This mystery was hid in God and not revealed anywhere until Paul (Ephesians 3:9 Ephesians 3:5). The mystery was that the death, resurrection, and shed blood of Christ of the new testament was also for the justification unto eternal life of both Jew and Gentile (Romans 3:22-30 1 Corinthians 12:13). The mystery was that by the new testament sacrifice of Christ he would form a new man, a new creature, the church, the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 12:27 2 Corinthians 5:17 Galatians 6:15 Ephesians 2:15-16).

The body of Christ has been given the spiritual blessings of the new testament (Ephesians 1:3 Romans 15:27).
 
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Joseph77

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Good Seeking God's Kingdom, as God Reveals His Salvation as Jesus Says He Does, to little children ! YEAH !
 
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Mungo

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I was wrong in thinking the new testament was only for Israel. Upon further study, I have come to see that the new testament has been applied to the church, the body of Christ, in this dispensation of grace.

The new covenant is not the same as the new testament. The new covenant is future. The new testament was accomplished at the cross. The new testament is only in force with the death of the testator (Hebrews 9:16-17); a covenant does not always require death, or sacrifice (Jeremiah 34:18-19) to be in affect (2 Samuel 7 1 Samuel 18:1-5). The marriage covenant, as an example, does not necessitate death (Malachi 2:14). A covenant from God is by an oath (Psalm 89:3).

The new testament was to redeem the transgressions committed by Israel under the first testament ( the old covenant, the old testament), as seen in Hebrews 9:15. The new testament was accomplished by the death and shed blood of Christ (Matthew 26:28). The new testament was for Israel only, for the many, not for all (Mark 14:24 Luke 22:20).

The old covenant was made only with Israel (Exodus 34:27). Israel is looking for the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ for their salvation (Acts 3:19). The new covenant will be made only with the house of Israel and Judah (Jeremiah 31:31). The new covenant, will be made (it has yet to be fulfilled), will bring Israel into the promised land, will forgive their iniquities, and give them a new heart to keep the law by his spirit (Jeremiah 31:31-34 Deuteronomy 30:1-6 Ezekiel 36:24-28).

Paul was made an able minister of the new testament (2 Corinthians 3:6). By revelations from the Lord Jesus, Paul was given revelations of the mystery (Ephesians 3:3 2 Corinthians 12:7). This mystery was hid in God and not revealed anywhere until Paul (Ephesians 3:9 Ephesians 3:5). The mystery was that the death, resurrection, and shed blood of Christ of the new testament was also for the justification unto eternal life of both Jew and Gentile (Romans 3:22-30 1 Corinthians 12:13). The mystery was that by the new testament sacrifice of Christ he would form a new man, a new creature, the church, the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 12:27 2 Corinthians 5:17 Galatians 6:15 Ephesians 2:15-16).

The body of Christ has been given the spiritual blessings of the new testament (Ephesians 1:3 Romans 15:27).

The New Covenant is in operation now.
I believe your distinction between 'new covenant' and 'new testament' is false.
You are probably misled by the KJV which translates the same word as both covenant and testament.
For example
"For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people."
The word translated covenant in each case is diatheke (G 1242).
Bi=ut the KJV translates diatheke as testament in Lk 22:20, Mt 26:28, Mk 14:24 and 1Cor 11:25.
I can see no reason for such inconsistency.
Modern translations (e.g RSV) use covenant for both examples.
 
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Joseph77

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All is Good when truthfully Seeking God's Kingdom, as God Reveals His Salvation as Jesus Says He Does, to little children ! YEAH !
 

Timtofly

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The New Covenant is in operation now.
I believe your distinction between 'new covenant' and 'new testament' is false.
You are probably misled by the KJV which translates the same word as both covenant and testament.
For example
"For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people."
The word translated covenant in each case is diatheke (G 1242).
Bi=ut the KJV translates diatheke as testament in Lk 22:20, Mt 26:28, Mk 14:24 and 1Cor 11:25.
I can see no reason for such inconsistency.
Modern translations (e.g RSV) use covenant for both examples.
I think that what the OP states is that the new covenant in the verses was not the New Testament. The new covenant for Israel is still future.

The new testament was for all the new saints, both Jew and Gentile for a period of time between the OT and a future time. More than likely the 1000 year reign of Christ.
 

Mungo

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I think that what the OP states is that the new covenant in the verses was not the New Testament. The new covenant for Israel is still future.

The new testament was for all the new saints, both Jew and Gentile for a period of time between the OT and a future time. More than likely the 1000 year reign of Christ.

The New Covenant is in operation now.
I believe your distinction between 'new covenant' and 'new testament' is false.
You are probably misled by the KJV which translates the same word as both covenant and testament.
For example
"For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people."
The word translated covenant in each case is diatheke (G 1242).
But the KJV translates diatheke as testament in Lk 22:20, Mt 26:28, Mk 14:24 and 1Cor 11:25.
I can see no reason for such inconsistency.
Modern translations (e.g RSV) use covenant for both examples.
 

Preacher4Truth

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I was wrong in thinking the new testament was only for Israel. Upon further study, I have come to see that the new testament has been applied to the church, the body of Christ, in this dispensation of grace.

I hope you're going down the correct path now. The above shows hope.

There is one LORD. There is only one Gospel.
 
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Doug

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I hope you're going down the correct path now. The above shows hope.

There is one LORD. There is only one Gospel.

I have not changed my view on this. That the church is new testament aligns and is upheld with scripture as does more than one gospel.
 

101G

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Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah".
Both houses, not tribes but house, meaning both Jews and Gentiles, by Faith.

Galatians 3:16 "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (ONE HOUSE, listen, Hebrews 3:6 "But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end".)... BINGO, ONW HOUSE.

Galatians 3:17 "And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
Galatians 3:18 "For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Galatians 3:19 "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
Galatians 3:20 "Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. (BINGO)
Galatians 3:29 "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

all of us who believe is in HIS "HOUSE". ... the Church.

PICJAG.
 

Joseph77

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I thought the Scripture is God's Revelation Through Jesus of what He Planned, what He did,
and what He will do ?


Not like a bandaid to "apply", man's way, to a wound.

I was wrong in thinking the new testament was only for Israel. Upon further study, I have come to see that the new testament has been applied to the church, the body of Christ, in this dispensation of grace.
 

101G

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agreed.
I thought the Scripture is God's Revelation Through Jesus of what He Planned, what He did,
and what He will do ?


Not like a bandaid to "apply", man's way, to a wound.
Isaiah 48:3 "I have declared the former things from the beginning; and they went forth out of my mouth, and I shewed them; I did them suddenly, and they came to pass.

PICJAG.
 
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101G

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I thought the Scripture is God's Revelation Through Jesus of what He Planned, what He did,
and what He will do ?
if most poster didn't know this, what our brother Joseph just said, is a revelation in itself. here's why. Revelation 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John". many christian think, or have a picture in their minds, believing that this is two "persons" standing one next to another and the First one gives the Last one the Revelation. no, it's one PERSON, who is the "First" and the "Last" that gives the revelation to the angel to give to John and unto the churches.

Jesus is the "First" and he is the "Last", for what he "declared" now, (or what he has revealed), was from the beginning already done.

PICJAG.
 

Doug

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Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah".
Both houses, not tribes but house, meaning both Jews and Gentiles, by Faith.

Galatians 3:16 "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (ONE HOUSE, listen, Hebrews 3:6 "But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end".)... BINGO, ONW HOUSE.

Galatians 3:17 "And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
Galatians 3:18 "For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Galatians 3:19 "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
Galatians 3:20 "Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. (BINGO)
Galatians 3:29 "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

all of us who believe is in HIS "HOUSE". ... the Church.

PICJAG.
I would have to study this
 

Mungo

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I have another view on this.

The New Testament tells us of a New Covenant inaugurated by Jesus Christ. Luke refers to a new covenant (Lk 22:20), as does Paul (1Cor 11:25).

Hebrews quotes Jeremiah who prophesied a New Covenant (Jew 31:31)
Heb 8:8
The days will come, says the Lord,
when I will establish a new covenant with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah


Some say this New Covenant was only made with the Jews (the house of Israel and the house of Judah) and not for gentiles. Others say that the Church is the new Israel and therefore includes gentiles.

However there is another way of understanding this that avoids these arguments.
Note that both of these quotes refer to the HOUSE of Israel and the HOUSE of Judah.

What, or who, is the house of Israel and the house of Judah?

I think the answer is the king.
In 2Sam 12:8 the Lord (via Nathan) says to David "I..... gave you the house of Israel and of Judah..."

The king represents in himself the house of Israel and the house of Judah.

Another example of the king personifying the whole house is given in Isaiah 7:13 where Isaiah calls king Ahaz the house of David.

Now who became the King?
Who was promised the throne of David?
Answer: Jesus: "He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High;
and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,
and he will reign over the house of Jacob for ever;
and of his kingdom there will be no end.”
(Lk 1:32-33).

Jesus is the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah; he embodies the Covenant in himself.

In Isaiah, God speaks about the coming Messiah in several "Servant" passages
Is 42:6-7 I have given you as a covenant to the people, a light to the nations, to open the eyes that are blind, to bring out the prisoners from the dungeon, from the prison those who sit in darkness. This is very similar to what Jesus says about himself in Lk 4:18
and
Is 49:8 I have kept you and given you as a covenant to the people,
The implications are that Jesus is a living embodiment of the Covenant

The Messiah is given as a Covenant to the people, an embodiment of the covenant. And note he is to be a "light to the nations". He is not just for the Jews.

3. The Mosaic/Sinai Covenant could be, and was, broken. But if Jesus is the embodiment of the Covenant it can never be broken. That is why it is an everlasting covenant .

God says to Ezekial (and note this is long after David is dead)
My servant David shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall follow my ordinances and be careful to observe my statutes. They shall dwell in the land where your fathers dwelt that I gave to my servant Jacob; they and their children and their children’s children shall dwell there for ever; and David my servant shall be their prince for ever. I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them (Ez 37:24-26).

Anyone can come into this Covenant. Since the Covenant is Christ, if we are "in Christ", a phrase Paul used often, we are in the Covenant.

Baptism is how we become "in Christ.".
For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. (Gal 3:27). In baptism we clothe ourselves with Christ. This is being saved and also being part of the body of Christ

As a body is one though it has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, are one body, so also Christ. For in one Spirit we were all baptised into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, slaves or free persons, and we were all given to drink of one Spirit. (1Cor 12:12-13). Baptism brings us into the body of Christ (the Church).

Through baptism we are brought into the new covenant “In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ; when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.” (Col 2:11-12)
 
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Preacher4Truth

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I have not changed my view on this. That the church is new testament aligns and is upheld with scripture as does more than one gospel.
I figured as much yet I wanted to draw that out of you.

You're still in error.

There is no other gospel, only one, and it is to the Jew and Gentile. Romans 10:12 &c.

The gospel was seen in the message of Abram/Abraham in Scripture, that salvation is of grace through faith, that works show regeneration and true faith; Genesis 12:ff. This is the same message preached to all. Jesus claimed this gospel was to be preached to the world; Matthew 24:14, and this was what was preached by the apostles to the world in Acts, The Acts of the Apostles 20:24-25; 28:23, 30-31.

It is also of note that Paul in his journey's preached the same message to both Jew and Gentile -- he didn't have two messages, as there is only one.
 
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Doug

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I have another view on this.

The New Testament tells us of a New Covenant inaugurated by Jesus Christ. Luke refers to a new covenant (Lk 22:20), as does Paul (1Cor 11:25).

Hebrews quotes Jeremiah who prophesied a New Covenant (Jew 31:31)
Heb 8:8
The days will come, says the Lord,
when I will establish a new covenant with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah


Some say this New Covenant was only made with the Jews (the house of Israel and the house of Judah) and not for gentiles. Others say that the Church is the new Israel and therefore includes gentiles.

However there is another way of understanding this that avoids these arguments.
Note that both of these quotes refer to the HOUSE of Israel and the HOUSE of Judah.

What, or who, is the house of Israel and the house of Judah?

I think the answer is the king.
In 2Sam 12:8 the Lord (via Nathan) says to David "I..... gave you the house of Israel and of Judah..."

The king represents in himself the house of Israel and the house of Judah.

Another example of the king personifying the whole house is given in Isaiah 7:13 where Isaiah calls king Ahaz the house of David.

Now who became the King?
Who was promised the throne of David?
Answer: Jesus: "He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High;
and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,
and he will reign over the house of Jacob for ever;
and of his kingdom there will be no end.”
(Lk 1:32-33).

Jesus is the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah; he embodies the Covenant in himself.

In Isaiah, God speaks about the coming Messiah in several "Servant" passages
Is 42:6-7 I have given you as a covenant to the people, a light to the nations, to open the eyes that are blind, to bring out the prisoners from the dungeon, from the prison those who sit in darkness. This is very similar to what Jesus says about himself in Lk 4:18
and
Is 49:8 I have kept you and given you as a covenant to the people,
The implications are that Jesus is a living embodiment of the Covenant

The Messiah is given as a Covenant to the people, an embodiment of the covenant. And note he is to be a "light to the nations". He is not just for the Jews.

3. The Mosaic/Sinai Covenant could be, and was, broken. But if Jesus is the embodiment of the Covenant it can never be broken. That is why it is an everlasting covenant .

God says to Ezekial (and note this is long after David is dead)
My servant David shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall follow my ordinances and be careful to observe my statutes. They shall dwell in the land where your fathers dwelt that I gave to my servant Jacob; they and their children and their children’s children shall dwell there for ever; and David my servant shall be their prince for ever. I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them (Ez 37:24-26).

Anyone can come into this Covenant. Since the Covenant is Christ, if we are "in Christ", a phrase Paul used often, we are in the Covenant.

Baptism is how we become "in Christ.".
For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. (Gal 3:27). In baptism we clothe ourselves with Christ. This is being saved and also being part of the body of Christ

As a body is one though it has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, are one body, so also Christ. For in one Spirit we were all baptised into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, slaves or free persons, and we were all given to drink of one Spirit. (1Cor 12:12-13). Baptism brings us into the body of Christ (the Church).

Through baptism we are brought into the new covenant “In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ; when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.” (Col 2:11-12)
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