Preaching the Gospel !

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Brother Mike

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Posted by: savedbygrace57
No I dont, but I decide wether i can justify recognizing you as an elect or not..thus far there is no evidence scripturally..I have no reason to see you as an brother in Jesus christ..if you dont believe the truth of the Gospel..so until then your an unbeliever to me..
savedbygrace57, I feel ya bro!!! It is the strangest thing to me also. There are so many unsaved, unbelievers on this forum that know tons of scripture. I mean, how can that be?Where I come from the unsaved, unbelievers are out doing what they want to do, getting drunk, and having sex with everyone. They would never even think to look up something in the bible. The unsaved, and unbelievers on this forum are a whole lot different than the ones we have at home.Keep preaching the truth brother. If they are not elected by God though, I doubt your truth will reach their dull, unrepentant hearts. sad, but true.Jesus is Lord, always and forever!!!!
 

Brother Mike

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Brother Mike, I can never tell when you're being sarcastic or not...
Thats because you don't know the truth, and are not chosen.Deadwheat1224I am just Joking with savedbygrace57. I choose to walk in love toward him, He is a real hoot!!!So, I was most definitely being sarcastic. I side with what you said, 100%Jesus Is Lord.
 

gervais

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Brother Mike"The unsaved, and unbelievers on this forum are a whole lot different than the ones we have at home."BM, I am sure you have read about Satan's temptation of Christ in the wilderness. Satan knows Scripture backwards and forward, he used it to try to tempt Christ, but he changed a word or two putting a completely different spin on the Word. Satan still does that today, through people, pastors, teachers of tradition of man. That's why we need to study the Word and rightly divide the Word.Most on this forum have read some Scripture but do not know how to rightly divide it.
 

Stumpmaster

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[quote name='epistemaniac;72213] So I agree that people must believe' date=' they must engage their wills in order to be "willing to come", the question is not that they must believe, but how is it that some believe and some don't...? And the question is, what exactly is the will which must be engaged in order to decide to savingly believe on the Lord Jesus...? I submit that the reason I am a believer is not because I am smart enough to want to avoid hell, because I have neighbors who are a lot smarter than I am, or that I am more spiritual than my unbelieving neighbor, because I have neighbors who are a lot more spiritual than I am.... but that what separates me from my unbelieving neighbor is not to be found in me at all, but is rather to be found in God and His electing grace and mercy. I do agree that the relationship between man's responsibility and God's sovereignty is an issue that will be discussed/debated until Jesus returns... :) blessings,ken[/QUOTE']Just as Satan was able to influence the will of Eve to disbelieve what God had said, so it is that Satan is able to prevent all lost souls from believing the Gospel. Were it not for the power of the Gospel we would all be lost. Romans 10:14-17(14)"How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?(15) And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!(16) But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?(17) So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God."2Corinthians 4:3-5(3)"But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:(4) In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them."(5) For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.
 

savedbygrace57

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In proclaiming his Gospel, Paul writes this: 1 cor 1: 30But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: God has made Jesus Christ this [these things] unto us first and foremost imputatively, by an Eternal act of His Mind, whereas He declared it so and it was So.. 2 cor 5:21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. These things God has done for us [ Through Jesus Christ] before what He does in us [ Through the Holy Ghost] The things that God has done for the elect through Jesus Christ [good news] is the foundation for the things he does in the elect through The Holy Ghost.. Those reconciled to God by the death of Gods Son, are called into participation of that reconciliation by the The Holy Ghost of God..hence 2 cor 5: 19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. [ for us]20Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. [in us]
 

savedbygrace57

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This is where the calvinist go wrong, in addition to their christology, and that is the point of special faith, that act of the elect through the work of the Holy Ghost, when given to apprehend the righteousness of Jesus christ for Justification of life. This special faith does not give the elect the right to Justification of life [ causatively], but , by Faith they come to enjoy it and finding consciously that peace between them and God on behalf of Jesus Christ obedience on their behalf. The Actual Justification of life, is an eternal immanent act of God the Father, who from everlasting, gave or imputed it to the elect world 2 cor 5:19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. This is simple, the elect world never had their sins laid personally to their charge, because they were laid to the charge of Jesus christ..and in turn His righteousness was imputed to them, which is their Justification before God..The Holy Ghost in time and during the lifetime of each vessel of mercy, He is sent to make Known this Justification that the elect had in their Head from everlasting, even before their creation and subsequent fall in Adam..Both the Armenian and the todays calvinist deny Justification before God solely on the merits of Jesus Christ..Here be the difference..The Armenian believes they are Justified by the flesh, in other words, they deny the need of regeneration to be Justified before God, just an act of their will can produce Justification, their believing, whereas the calvinist believe a work of the Holy Spirit is needed to make one Justified before God..but both teachings deny Justification before God solely by the Work of Jesus Christ alone, apart from freewill and apart from regeneration..__________________
 

TallMan

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savedbygrace57;71493] . . .zech 12:[B]10[/B]And I will pour[B] upon the house of David said:
[/B] the spirit of grace and of supplications:[repentance]. . .This picture is what occured specifically on the day of pentecost in acts 2..And is the grand example of what occurs with all of Gods elect some time during their journey on earth..
Zechariah 12:10 is a prophecy of the giving of the Spirit in the new way, the beginning of the New Testament whereby people become sons of God.Note it says "grace and supplications". The supplications is a prophecy of what happened when people received that grace - they all spoke in tongues, and taught that this was not a one-off, but the template - see Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-46.There is no other gospel so it must be the same today.Indeed all who believe it is receive the same, which couldn't happen if it were not true.Anyone who says otherwise is truly ashamed of the gospel, and of Jesus Christ, they would rather please themselves or other men, which is spiritual whoredom and murder.
savedbygrace57;71493 said:
The thief on the cross experienced it in the very twilight of his life..
That statement makes Jesus and the apostles liars since they taught that the Spirit would not be given in the New Covenant until after Jesus had died and returned to the Father.
 

Christina

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And you ignore the rest of the story Tallman It was the cloven Tongue and it was evidenced by the very fact that it was understood by all This is the very proof that it was of God ALL understood in their own language and the Greek goes further not only their own language but even down to the detail of their own accent's as we call it today this has not a thing to do with the babbling tongues of today ....... There are 2 tongues spoken of in scripture one on Pentecost day and one in the gifts They are not the same The tongue spoken of in the gifts is even called a lowly gift To even try to say this lowly gift is the same as this Miracle of Pentecost day is huge misinterpretation of scripture Its even worse than a misinterpretation its an insult to God it was through this Cloven tongue that all the knowledge of God was given to the disciples so that could start the church ...If one remembers they did not understand alot of what Jesus said to them ..After Pentecost day they had Gods knowledge because the holy spirit gave it them .... This is further poof this not only a great Miracle but it has nothing to do with ..the tongues of gifts which is not about knowledge.... No one on this earth sense these disciples on Pentecost day has ever experienced the CLOVEN TOUGE OF GOD and to equate the lowly gift of tongues .....to this Miracle of God that gave them all Gods knowledge and all could understand The cloven tongue of Pentecost was a miracle only to be repeated one more time (mark13 when we are not premeditate what we will say because God will speak through us this is was what happened on Pentecost Day This was a miracle of God that occurs twice in scripture once on Pentecost day and once it will occur in the future as written in Mark 13 Its those today who speak today's tongues who misrepresent the Miracle of Pentecost and the cloven tongue with babble of today as the Same thing they are not and never were If the tongues of today were the same anyone hearing it would understand it regardless of what language he she speaks as their natural tongue. THIS IS THE VERY EVIDENCE OF The CLOVEN TONGUE OF GOD The fact today's tongue is not understood by the speaker nor the hearer nor does nor does it give one the full knowledge of God proves in itself it is not the Cloven tongue of Pentecost
 

epistemaniac

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savedbygrace57;72483]This is where the calvinist go wrong said:
, but , by Faith they come to enjoy it and finding consciously that peace between them and God on behalf of Jesus Christ obedience on their behalf. The Actual Justification of life, is an eternal immanent act of God the Father, who from everlasting, gave or imputed it to the elect world 2 cor 5:19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. This is simple, the elect world never had their sins laid personally to their charge, because they were laid to the charge of Jesus christ..and in turn His righteousness was imputed to them, which is their Justification before God..The Holy Ghost in time and during the lifetime of each vessel of mercy, He is sent to make Known this Justification that the elect had in their Head from everlasting, even before their creation and subsequent fall in Adam..Both the Armenian and the todays calvinist deny Justification before God solely on the merits of Jesus Christ..Here be the difference..The Armenian believes they are Justified by the flesh, in other words, they deny the need of regeneration to be Justified before God, just an act of their will can produce Justification, their believing, whereas the calvinist believe a work of the Holy Spirit is needed to make one Justified before God..but both teachings deny Justification before God solely by the Work of Jesus Christ alone, apart from freewill and apart from regeneration..__________________
Calvinists do not have it wrong on anything... :)and it is "Arminian", not Armenian... Arminian is a theological position, "Armenian" is an ethnic group.it is your definition of justification that is mistaken.... for salvation is indeed sola fide, sola gratia, Soulus Christus, Sola Dei Gloria... justification is in fact based solely on the work of Christ, period... however it is the application of that work's merits to the unbeliever's heart via the work of the Holy Spirit, regenerating them, causing them to be born again which results in the a person becoming a new creation in Christ. You appear to be denying and perverting the work of Christ by thinking that it is automatically applied to everyone's benefit (in a salvific sense) when Christ clearly said that not all were of His sheep, not all were of the elect, that many are called, but few are chosen, etc... the intent of the atonement was the application of Christ's merits towards the accounts of some sinners such that they exercise faith showing themselves to be of Christ's Bride... if a person does not possess and confess this saving faith, (he who does not confess the Son before men will be denied by the Son before the Father) they are none of His, they are condemned for rejecting Christ... you make a mockery of Christ's work on the Cross by trying to say that it justifies everyone regardless of whether or not they exercise faith.blessings,ken
 

Christina

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False Doctrines of the "Pope" of Geneva
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One must first study the man, John Calvin, in order to understand the theology that has come to be called Calvinism. Calvin was born July 10, 1509, in Picardy at Noyon, France, to devout Roman Catholic parents as Jean Chauvin and died at Geneva, May 27, 1564, at age 54. The family name, spelled in many ways, was Cauvin, latinized according to the custom of the age as Calvinus. For some unknown reason John is commonly called Maître Jean C. His mother, Jeanne Le Franc, born in the Roman Catholic Diocese of Cambrai, is mentioned as "beautiful and devout." She took her little son to various shrines and brought him up a good Catholic.
John was baptized in the Roman Catholic Church as an infant. On the father's side, his ancestors were seafaring men. His grandfather settled at Pont l'Evêque near Paris and had two sons who became locksmiths. The third, Gerard, became procurator at Noyon and had four sons and two daughters. John Calvin's father, Gerard, an attorney, had purchased the freedom of the City of Noyon where he practiced civil and canon law. Gerard's four sons were made clerics and held benefices at a tender age. John was given one when a boy of twelve. He became Curé of Saint-Martin de Marteville in the Vermandois in 1527 and of Pont l'Eveque in 1529. Three of the boys attended the local Collège des Capettes, and there John proved himself an apt scholar.
Calvin's formal education was complete in 1527 when he was eighteen. According to the Catholics, he drifted from his Roman Catholic faith to become a humanist and a reformer. The "sudden conversion" to a spiritual life in 1529 could possibly be interpreted as his becoming saved, but throughout his life he counted on his Roman Catholic infant baptism as the basis of his regeneration.
John Calvin studied the voluminous writings of Saint Augustine, the Roman Catholic Bishop of Hippo (354-430 AD), much more so than those of Martin Luther, his contemporary. Calvin is continually praising Augustine's work with numerous references and quotations. Augustine was greatly influenced by the Gnostics, an early Christian sect, whose doctrine was heretical. Gnostics believed that mankind was wholly evil, and some sects even renounced marriage and procreation. They also believed in two gods, one evil and one good.
Their teachings are believed to have influenced Saint Augustine in the development of his theology of the "total depravity" of mankind and his concept of God. For nine years Saint Augustine adhered to Manichaeism, a Persian dualistic philosophy proclaimed by Mani (216-276? AD) in southern Babylonia (Iraq) that taught a doctrine of "total depravity" and the claim that they were the "elect." Augustine could not advance in his Manichaeism religion because of his sinful lifestyle. He had a reputation as a "womanizer" and a fornicator.
Augustine then turned to skepticism and was attracted to the philosophy of Neoplatonism. He blended these beliefs with his later Gnostic and Christian teachings. Augustine's prolific writings were more strongly biased by his previously-obtained theology than on his detailed study of the Christian Scriptures. He used Christian Scripture out of context when words or phrases could be adapted to match his theology. Augustine's teachings were in turn passed on to John Calvin through his extensive study of Augustine's writings, the most popular being his book, Confessions.
It is very easy to follow the trail of John Calvin's theology from the pagan religion of Mani in Babylonia to Saint Augustine and into his own writings in France and Geneva that distort the Word of God. Calvin's false doctrine came directly from Augustine.
Calvin's Book Supercedes the Bible
Calvin's famous letter to King Francis I was dated August 23, 1535. It served as a prologue to his book, Institutes of the Christian Religion, the first edition of which was written in March 1536, not in French but in Latin. Calvin's apology for lecturing the king was displayed as placards posted all over the realm denouncing the Protestants as rebels. King Francis I did not read these pages, but if he had done so he would have discovered in them a plea not for toleration, which Calvin utterly scorned, but for doing away with Catholicism in favor of the new gospel. "There could be only one true Church; therefore, kings ought to make an utter end of popery," said the young theologian. The second edition of Calvin's Institutes was written in 1539; the first French translation in 1541; the final in Latin, as revised by its author, in 1559; but that in common use, dated 1560, has additions by his disciples.We know little of Calvin's previous activities, but because of a war between King Charles V and King Francis I, he settled his family affairs and reached Bale by way of Geneva in July, 1536. He persuaded two of his brothers and two sisters to accept the Reformed views he had adopted and took them with him. At Geneva the Swiss preacher, Fare, then looking for help with his propaganda, besought Calvin with such vehemence to stay and teach his theologies that, as Calvin himself relates, he was terrified into submission. As a student, reclusive and new to public responsibilities, he may well have hesitated before plunging into the troubled waters of Geneva, then at their stormiest period.
Calvin had not introduced the legislative articles of Geneva; however, it was mainly by his influence that in January, 1537, the articles were approved which insisted on communion four times a year, set spies on delinquents, established a moral censorship, and punished the unruly with excommunication. There was to be a children's catechism, which he drew up. The articles caused a dispute, and the city became divided into "jurants" who swore an oath to the articles and "nonjurors" who would not accept them. Questions had arisen with Berne concerning the points of major dispute, but Calvin made the claim in Lausanne for the freedom of Geneva. Discourse ensued in Geneva, where the opposition became more obstinate. In 1538 the council exiled Farel, Calvin, and the blind evangelist, Couraud from Geneva.
Calvin complained of his poverty and ill health, but these did not prevent him from marrying Idelette de Bure, the widow of an Anabaptist whom he had converted. Nothing more is known of this lady except that she bore him a son who died almost at birth in 1542, and that her own death took place in 1549.
Calvin's Reign of Terror
After some negotiation, Ami Perrin, commissioner for Geneva, persuaded Calvin to return. He did so, though unwillingly, on September 13, 1541. His entry was modest. Geneva was a church-city-state of 15,000 people, and the church constitution now recognized "pastors, doctors, elders and deacons," but the supreme power was given to the magistrate, John Calvin. In November 1552, the Council declared Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion to be a "holy doctrine which no man might speak against." Thus the State issued dogmatic decrees, the force of which had been anticipated earlier, as when Jacques Gruet, a known opponent of Calvin, was arrested, tortured for a month and beheaded on July 26, 1547, for placing a letter in
Calvin's pulpit calling him a hypocrite. Gruet's book was later found and burned along with his house while his wife was thrown out into the street to watch. Gruet's death was more highly criticized by far than the banishment of Castellio or the penalties inflicted on Bolsec -- moderate men opposed to extreme views in discipline and doctrine, who fell under suspicion as reactionary. Calvin did not shrink from his self-appointed task. Within five years fifty-eight sentences of death and seventy-six of exile, besides numerous committals of the most eminent citizens to prison, took place in Geneva. The iron yoke could not be shaken off. In 1555, under Ami Perrin, a revolt was attempted. No blood was shed, but Perrin lost the day, and Calvin's theocracy triumphed. John Calvin had secured his grip on Geneva by defeating the very man who had invited him there, Ami Perrin, commissioner of Geneva.
Calvin forced the citizens of Geneva to attend church services under a heavy threat of punishment. Since Calvinism falsely teaches that God forces the elect to believe, it is no wonder that Calvin thought he could also force the citizens of Geneva to all become the elect. Not becoming one of the elect was punishable by death or expulsion from Geneva. Calvin exercised forced regeneration on the citizens of Geneva, because that is what his theology teaches.
More if your interested in reading http://www.biblelife.org/calvinism.htm
 

savedbygrace57

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epistemaniac;72500]Calvinists do not have it wrong on anything... :) and it is "Arminian" said:
application[/B] of that work's merits to the unbeliever's heart via the work of the Holy Spirit, regenerating them, causing them to be born again which results in the a person becoming a new creation in Christ. You appear to be denying and perverting the work of Christ by thinking that it is automatically applied to everyone's benefit (in a salvific sense) when Christ clearly said that not all were of His sheep, not all were of the elect, that many are called, but few are chosen, etc... the intent of the atonement was the application of Christ's merits towards the accounts of some sinners such that they exercise faith showing themselves to be of Christ's Bride... if a person does not possess and confess this saving faith, (he who does not confess the Son before men will be denied by the Son before the Father) they are none of His, they are condemned for rejecting Christ... you make a mockery of Christ's work on the Cross by trying to say that it justifies everyone regardless of whether or not they exercise faith. blessings,ken
You are rejecting the Truth which I presented..
 

TallMan

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Christina;72499 said:
And you ignore the rest of the story Tallman It was the cloven Tongue and it was evidenced by the very fact that it was understood by all This is the very proof that it was of God
Cloven tongueS not tongue.Not all languages were recognised by all, individual bi-lingual Jews recognised their particular dialect.Acts 2 was unusual in that bi-linguial people from all over the known world were there.It has been known for foreigners to recognise a gift of tongues in our meetingsActs 2 shows that it is real language but this does not mean that it must be recognised by someone else to be of God.Acts 2 was the transfer from old- to ne testament, hence the fire, a one-off occurrance. There was no fire or languages recognised after that, but all SPOKE TO GOD in tongues.In Acts 10 & 19 what languages were recognised by Peter & Paul respectively?
 

mjrhealth

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One day, and I hope it be soon, Christ will remove the scales from your eyes, and there He will be , standing right in front of you, just waiting for you to say, " Jesus teach me". Then , maybe then chrisians will become unified in Christ instead of bashing eachother over the head with the bible. Its no wonder non believers think we are a bunch of idiots, we cant even love one another, if you where to ask Jesus, He would tell you, matter of factly, " you got Me all wrong". In His Love
 

TallMan

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mjrhealth;72515]One day said:
How do you explain the fact that Christ had major disagreement with the people claiming to be the people of God in his day?How do you judge people to be "Christians"?What do you mean by "love", not to tell someone they are wrong?:rolleyes:
 

TallMan

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savedbygrace57;72530]Wether they walk in the Truth of the Gospel..[/QUOTE][B]the[/B] gospel said:
must[/B] be the same one as was preached by the apostles - they didn't tell people they were saved because they had "prayed the sinners prayer", "given their hearts to Jesus" etc?No, they told people to repent, be baptised and receive the Holy Spirit, and it was known precisely when they received that Spirit by the sign of speaking in tongues. (Acts 2:4, 33-39, 10:44-48).Conversely, believers whop had not spoken in tongues were known not to have received (Acts 8:12-16, 19:5-6).
 

Brother Mike

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savedbygrace57I understand how ya feel bro......... These people refuse to see the truth in God's Word that you do. Look at epistemaniac. He only believes in a watered down version of election that you do. He is not willing to go all the way for the truth. I mean you are in or not in. I think these people need some milk Savedbygrace57. Your wisdom is just to much for them. I can see you trying to correct them over and over, but they just don't have the Word of God knowledge you do.I would suggest tying something simple. Like, Jesus loves the little children. Once you get them to understand simple things, then you can give them the meat.What you say bro?God bless ya!!Jesus Is Lord.