What Need I of Grace?

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justbyfaith

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1 John 3:4

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Romans 4:15

Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.




Some say that, as believers in Yahshua, we have no more commitment to the law.

Now if there is no law, there is no transgression. If there is no transgression; there is no sin.

If there is no sin; then I would ask, "what need I of grace?
It is by the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ that you are not under the law, Romans 6:14.
 

HARK!

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Read the verse before that one.if you depend on the law

Why would you assume that I depend on the law?

(CLV) 1Jn 3:1
Perceive what manner of love the Father has given us, that we may be called children of God! And we are! Therefore the world does not know us, for it did not know Him.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:2
Beloved, now are we children of God, and it was not as yet manifested what we shall be. We are °aware that, if He should be manifested, we shall be like Him, tfor we shall |see~ Him according as He is.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:3
And everyone who has this expectation in Him is purifying himself, according as He is pure.

It reminds me of this verse:

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

your faith is meaningless.

(CLV) Gn 15:6
Now Abram believed on Elohim, and He reckoned it to him for righteousness

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

(CLV) Ja 2:24
You see that by works a man is being justified, and not by faith only.
 

justbyfaith

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For all must come before the judgement seat Of Christ to be judged for their works done while in the body, whether for good or for evil

and no one here can Quote "Law, revoked" i guess, hmm

See Romans 6:14, Romans 7:4, Romans 7:6; Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14, Hebrews 7:18-19..

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.

The law abides as the standard by which we judge sin, nothing can be added or taken away from it.

However, as believers in Christ, we are no longer "married to" the law in order that we might be married to Christ.

We are no longer bound by the letter so that we might be obedient to the spirit of what is written.

See Romans 7:1-6 and meditate upon it.
 
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Renniks

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Why would you assume that I depend on the law?

(CLV) 1Jn 3:1
Perceive what manner of love the Father has given us, that we may be called children of God! And we are! Therefore the world does not know us, for it did not know Him.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:2
Beloved, now are we children of God, and it was not as yet manifested what we shall be. We are °aware that, if He should be manifested, we shall be like Him, tfor we shall |see~ Him according as He is.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:3
And everyone who has this expectation in Him is purifying himself, according as He is pure.

It reminds me of this verse:

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.



(CLV) Gn 15:6
Now Abram believed on Elohim, and He reckoned it to him for righteousness

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

(CLV) Ja 2:24
You see that by works a man is being justified, and not by faith only.
Trying to use Romans to justify yourself by the law is like trying to lay in the snow during a blizzard to get a tan.
 

HARK!

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There is no sin on account of imputed Grace. Grace is requisite.

(CLV) Hb 10:26
For at our sinning voluntarily after obtaining the recognition of the truth, it is no longer leaving a sacrifice concerned with sins,
 

HARK!

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Trying to use Romans to justify yourself by the law is like trying to lay in the snow during a blizzard to get a tan.

Why would you assume that I'm trying to justify myself by the law?

(CLV) Gn 15:6
Now Abram believed on Elohim, and He reckoned it to him for righteousness

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

(CLV) Ja 2:24
You see that by works a man is being justified, and not by faith only.
 

bbyrd009

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ha c'mon guys admit that any of you would be on the horn to The Man in a heartbeat, some black guy walking around in the street even prolly lol
why? none of them has revoked the law, and wadr if you think they have you are misunderstanding imo
We are no longer bound by the letter so that we might be obedient to the spirit of what is written.

See Romans 7:1-6 and meditate upon it.
but again, there is a difference in "under the law" (ie a slave to it) and "obeying the law," which we are commanded, over and over, to keep! Do what they tell you, even though they don't, ...than for one jot or tittle to pass from the law, and etc, right? A doctrine can be made out of any one v, but then you gotta ignore all the other vv i guess
 
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Renniks

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Why would you assume that I'm trying to justify myself by the law?

(CLV) Gn 15:6
Now Abram believed on Elohim, and He reckoned it to him for righteousness

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

(CLV) Ja 2:24
You see that by works a man is being justified, and not by faith only.
Because that's what you've been doing every time I see you on this forum or the other. At least you are consistently wrong, lol.

What law are you trying to keep? The Old Covenant law isn't in effect anymore. Jesus took care of it once and for all.
Besides, you can't keep the Levitical law even if you try. Stoning folks is kinda illegal these days and there's nowhere to sacrifice your lambs.
 
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HARK!

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then imo you have to justify away Jesus Himself telling us to "do what they tell you"

James built on it:

(CLV) Ac 15:21
For Moses, from ancient generations, city by city, has those who are heralding him, being read on every sabbath in the synagogues."
 
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DNB

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ok, so i agree that there is a diff in under the law and "obeying the law," but i suggest that "i don't have to keep the law anymore" while simultaneously exhibiting that you, you would certainly be calling the cops post-haste if someone "sinned against you" by breaking the law, right, is hypocritical on its face even?

See bc we have laws about say "minimum speed limits" on a freeway, right, so if i slow way down or even stop on a freeway bc an accident or whatever in front of me, i am technically "breaking the law," but i will be "saved by grace" bc i can justify slowing down below the min speed limit, something more like that maybe

and of course we parrott "Jesus fulfilled the law" without ever really examining that, to certain perspectives at least, He broke pretty much every one of the Decalogue at some point
We are not under the Law of works anymore, but the Law of Faith.
Crimes are still crimes, and all actions are considered to be sin and are abhorrent to God, if they are not derived from love.
But, these specific infractions do not condemn us in the same manner that they did under the Law. If you break one law, you've broken them all. This is not case under the Law of Faith. Eating unclean food in the past, has no bearing on us now. It is no longer a capital crime to break the Sabbath. Stealing does not have the same ramifications as it did under the Old Covenant. We have a mediator and intercessor in Christ, oblations are not required to remedy a sin.
God disdains sin, and no Christian can say that he loves God & Christ, if he continues to sin recklessly and indiscriminately. But when we do, in the way that every well-intending person does, the repercussions do not bear the same weight as they did during the time of the Law.
 

DNB

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(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.
Christ did not let a single letter or serif fall. God does not establish a Covenant that yields no affect, or gets disregarded, this is what Christ meant. Since Christ proved that God's Laws are just and attainable, ...although extremely difficult to fulfill, God, appreciating the obstacle before us, graciously offered another means towards salvation. But again, only once Jesus glorified the Law by fulfilling it, and not letting a single jot or tittle to be removed from it.

So you're saying that the message of Yahshua's entire ministry, the example that he set for us to follow, the example that he followed in perfect obedience to his father's perfect law, unto death, died with him?
The condemnation, yes, not the Christian ethic.

Why then is it to be fulfilled in us?

(CLV) Ro 8:3
For what was impossible to the law, in which it was infirm through the flesh, did God, -sending His own Son in the likeness of sin's flesh and concerning sin, He condemns sin in the flesh,

(CLV) Ro 8:4
that the just requirement of the law may be fulfilled in us, who are not walking in accord with flesh, but in accord with spirit.
Again, you answered the question yourself with the two verses that you just cited. It's explaining that Christ's righteousness, proven by fulfilling the Law, has been imputed to us.
 

DNB

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Hmmm....future tense.

I guess the earth is still here.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.
The context is not future. You're isolating the verse from its context. The author is explaining the Law foreshadowed the good things to come, which have now arrived in Christ. That is the message, despite what the grammar in a very isolated sense conveys.
 

HARK!

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The Old Covenant law isn't in effect anymore. Jesus took care of it once and for all.

Not according to Yahshua.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.