Are we our brothers keeper?

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Bobby Jo

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We are love our enemies and do good to those who hate us!

... given that our enemies are in the world. But if they're in the church, we rebuke them even unto DEATH as Peter with Ananias and Sapphira.


People always confuse Christianity with NO ACCOUNTABILITY,
Bobby Jo
 

kcnalp

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... given that our enemies are in the world. But if they're in the church, we rebuke them even unto DEATH as Peter with Ananias and Sapphira.


People always confuse Christianity with NO ACCOUNTABILITY,
Bobby Jo
You would actually kill people???
Luke 6:27
27 "But I say to you who hear: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
 
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Bobby Jo

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You would actually kill people??? ...


GOD says vengeance is HIS. And YES, -- GOD causes people to DIE for their sinfulness. Hasn't it happened to an oppressor which you're aware of?


We're not alone in our fight. GOD is our defender.
Bobby Jo
 

charity

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You can have professed believers who go off course because they focus on personal experiences and are not grounded and settled in the word.
from A Baptist Catechism with Commentary, by W.R.Downing;

Experience can be counterfeited easily, but not Scripture. It is once-for-all delivered!

God’s sure Word makes the simple wise (v. 7). The Hebrew word translated “simple” comes from an expression meaning “an open door.” It evokes the image of a naive person who does not know when to shut his mind to false or impure teaching. He is undiscerning, ignorant, and gullible. But God’s Word makes him wise. “Wise” speaks of one who not merely knows some fact, but of one who is skilled in the art of godly living. He submits to Scripture and knows how to apply it to his circumstances. The Word of God thus takes a simple mind with no discernment and makes it skilled in all the issues of life. This, too, is in contrast to the wisdom of men, which in reality is foolishness (1 Cor 1:20).

, Peter looked to Scripture as a higher and more trustworthy authority than even such a dramatic experience. Commentator Samuel Cox has written, Peter knew a sounder basis for faith than that of signs and wonders. He had seen our Lord Jesus Christ receive honor and glory from God the Father in the holy mount; he had been dazzled and carried out of himself by visions and voices from heaven; but, nevertheless, even when his memory and heart are throbbing with recollections of that sublime scene, he says, “we have something surer still in the prophetic word.” . . .

It was not the miracles of Christ by which he came to know Jesus, but the word of Christ as interpreted by the spirit of Christ.3 Scripture is the product of God’s Spirit moving upon its human authors to produce His Word in written form (2 Pet 1:20-21). As such, it supersedes even apostolic experiences with Jesus Himself.

Perhaps that is why Jesus prevented the disciples on the Emmaus Road from recognizing Him as He “explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures” (Luke 24:27).

He wanted their faith and preaching to be based on Scripture, not merely on their own personal experience—no matter how moving or memorable that experience might be. If that was true of the apostles, how much more should believers today seek to know God’s Word rather than seeking supernatural or ecstatic experiences.
Hello @Anthony D'Arienzo,

When I read your post, my mind went to Hebrews 5:13-14, ...
'For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age,
even those who
by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.'

also to, Colossians 3:16,

' Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom;
teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs,
singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.'

* Our fellowship is with the Father and with the Son by the Spirit, and our fellowship with one another is the overflow from that fellowship. When that is lacking there can be no fellowship with one another, not true fellowship.

* There is only one recorded means by which the Holy Spirit brings us into this fellowship, and that is by the word of God, for it only is His 'sword'. It is also part of the believers armour against the forces of spiritual wickedness, which wage war against our soul (Ephesians 4:17). It is quick and powerful, and the Holy Spirit wields that sword to discern the thoughts and intents of our hearts, and to wash us from the detritus that builds up within us, from simply living in the world day by day (Ephesians 5:26).

* We are to serve one another, in spirit; speaking Truth one to another, or Truthing (Ephesians 5:9): by reminding one another of the Hope that we have in Christ Jesus, and what He has accomplished on our behalf, by lifting one another up in prayer to the One Who alone can know our needs and can meet them. Letting the word of God flow and do it's work between us, that God's will be accomplished and His Name glorified in and through us.


Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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DNB

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in Genesis 4:9 we read;
Then the Lord said to Cain,where is Abel your brother?
He said,I do not know.
AM I MY BROTHERS KEEPER?

1] are we our brothers keeper?

2] in what way are we?

3] is this a duty or an option?

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?

5]are there any boundaries to this?

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?
1] are we our brothers keeper?
Yes

2] in what way are we?
We are to treat them as ourselves, preserve their well-being, as much as we are able.

Exodus 23:4-5
23:4. "If you meet your enemy's ox or his donkey wandering away, you shall surely return it to him.
5. "If you see the donkey of one who hates you lying helpless under its load, you shall refrain from leaving it to him, you shall surely release it with him.

Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people. "'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD. 17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.

Deuteronomy 22:1-4
22:1. "You shall not see your countryman's ox or his sheep straying away, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly bring them back to your countryman.
2. "If your countryman is not near you, or if you do not know him, then you shall bring it home to your house, and it shall remain with you until your countryman looks for it; then you shall restore it to him.
3. "Thus you shall do with his donkey, and you shall do the same with his garment, and you shall do likewise with anything lost by your countryman, which he has lost and you have found. You are not allowed to neglect them.
4. "You shall not see your countryman's donkey or his ox fallen down on the way, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly help him to raise them up.

Ezekiel 3:18-18
3:18. "When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.

3] is this a duty or an option?
There are both sins of commission, and sins of omission.

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?
As long as they are warned, as long as you did all that you could to assist

5]are there any boundaries to this?
Until it does more damage than good.

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?
Yes. Some may resent you for calling them sinners, or assuming that they need help or want it.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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1] are we our brothers keeper?
Yes

2] in what way are we?
We are to treat them as ourselves, preserve their well-being, as much as we are able.

Exodus 23:4-5
23:4. "If you meet your enemy's ox or his donkey wandering away, you shall surely return it to him.
5. "If you see the donkey of one who hates you lying helpless under its load, you shall refrain from leaving it to him, you shall surely release it with him.

Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people. "'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD. 17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.

Deuteronomy 22:1-4
22:1. "You shall not see your countryman's ox or his sheep straying away, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly bring them back to your countryman.
2. "If your countryman is not near you, or if you do not know him, then you shall bring it home to your house, and it shall remain with you until your countryman looks for it; then you shall restore it to him.
3. "Thus you shall do with his donkey, and you shall do the same with his garment, and you shall do likewise with anything lost by your countryman, which he has lost and you have found. You are not allowed to neglect them.
4. "You shall not see your countryman's donkey or his ox fallen down on the way, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly help him to raise them up.

Ezekiel 3:18-18
3:18. "When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.

3] is this a duty or an option?
There are both sins of commission, and sins of omission.

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?
As long as they are warned, as long as you did all that you could to assist

5]are there any boundaries to this?
Until it does more damage than good.

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?
Yes. Some may resent you for calling them sinners, or assuming that they need help or want it.
Thank you for this biblically solid post establishing scripture as our source on this.
I will be online soon to interact on this.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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DNB,
Okay, lets see what we can explore;
[1] are we our brothers keeper?
Yes]
Anyone who is a Christian for any amount of time should know what Kingdom living implies for people we come into contact with.


[2] in what way are we?
We are to treat them as ourselves, preserve their well-being, as much as we are able.]


Exodus 23:4-5
23:4. "If you meet your enemy's ox or his donkey wandering away, you shall surely return it to him.
5. "If you see the donkey of one who hates you lying helpless under its load, you shall refrain from leaving it to him, you shall surely release it with him.

Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people. "'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD. 17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.


Deuteronomy 22:1-4
22:1. "You shall not see your countryman's ox or his sheep straying away, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly bring them back to your countryman.
2. "If your countryman is not near you, or if you do not know him, then you shall bring it home to your house, and it shall remain with you until your countryman looks for it; then you shall restore it to him.
3. "Thus you shall do with his donkey, and you shall do the same with his garment, and you shall do likewise with anything lost by your countryman, which he has lost and you have found. You are not allowed to neglect them.
4. "You shall not see your countryman's donkey or his ox fallen down on the way, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly help him to raise them up.

Ezekiel 3:18-18
3:18. "When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.]

Yes all good sections of scripture about helping out others, except that Leviticus verse that could indicate the tares among the wheat?
Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
"'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.
17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart.

Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.

Can you imagine, or perhaps you have encountered certain disturbed persons, who out of jealousy or envy, seek to undermine a fellow professed Christian???
They slander the person in public, this shows they hate them in their heart.
we are to rebuke them frankly....
Paul experienced such persons; 2 cor.11

25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep;

26 In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;

False brethren are obsessed with their own self-righteousness, gripped by envy and bitterness they stalk real Christians, try to slander and bear false witness against them, in an effort to make themselves appear to be "more spiritual" by trying to put the real Christian down.
They imagine they are being spiritual, or keeping up a facade for some odd perverse reason by engaging in such evil works.






[3] is this a duty or an option?
There are both sins of commission, and sins of omission.

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?
As long as they are warned, as long as you did all that you could to assist]

Yes;
Gal6;
9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

10 As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.


[5]are there any boundaries to this?
Until it does more damage than good.]

Yes, sadly we must withdraw from such persons sometimes,
17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.

20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.



[6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?
Yes. Some may resent you for calling them sinners, or assuming that they need help or want it.]

They behave opposite than the wise person would;
16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:

17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,

18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,

19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.
 
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DNB

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DNB,
Okay, lets see what we can explore;
[1] are we our brothers keeper?
Yes]
Anyone who is a Christian for any amount of time should know what Kingdom living implies for people we come into contact with.


[2] in what way are we?
We are to treat them as ourselves, preserve their well-being, as much as we are able.]


Exodus 23:4-5
23:4. "If you meet your enemy's ox or his donkey wandering away, you shall surely return it to him.
5. "If you see the donkey of one who hates you lying helpless under its load, you shall refrain from leaving it to him, you shall surely release it with him.

Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people. "'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD. 17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.


Deuteronomy 22:1-4
22:1. "You shall not see your countryman's ox or his sheep straying away, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly bring them back to your countryman.
2. "If your countryman is not near you, or if you do not know him, then you shall bring it home to your house, and it shall remain with you until your countryman looks for it; then you shall restore it to him.
3. "Thus you shall do with his donkey, and you shall do the same with his garment, and you shall do likewise with anything lost by your countryman, which he has lost and you have found. You are not allowed to neglect them.
4. "You shall not see your countryman's donkey or his ox fallen down on the way, and pay no attention to them; you shall certainly help him to raise them up.

Ezekiel 3:18-18
3:18. "When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.]

Yes all good sections of scripture about helping out others, except that Leviticus verse that could indicate the tares among the wheat?
Leviticus 19:16-17
19:16. "'Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
"'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.
17. "'Do not hate your brother in your heart.

Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.

Can you imagine, or perhaps you have encountered certain disturbed persons, who out of jealousy or envy, seek to undermine a fellow professed Christian???
They slander the person in public, this shows they hate them in their heart.
we are to rebuke them frankly....
Paul experienced such persons; 2 cor.11

25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep;

26 In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;

False brethren are obsessed with their own self-righteousness, gripped by envy and bitterness they stalk real Christians, try to slander and bear false witness against them, in an effort to make themselves appear to be "more spiritual" by trying to put the real Christian down.
They imagine they are being spiritual, or keeping up a facade for some odd perverse reason by engaging in such evil works.






[3] is this a duty or an option?
There are both sins of commission, and sins of omission.

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?
As long as they are warned, as long as you did all that you could to assist]

Yes;
Gal6;
9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

10 As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.


[5]are there any boundaries to this?
Until it does more damage than good.]

Yes, sadly we must withdraw from such persons sometimes,
17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.

20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.



[6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?
Yes. Some may resent you for calling them sinners, or assuming that they need help or want it.]

They behave opposite than the wise person would;
16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:

17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,

18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,

19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.
Thank you, very good supplement and further exposition.

'Yes all good sections of scripture about helping out others, except that Leviticus verse that could indicate the tares among the wheat?'
Yes, I only included the whole verses for completeness, but actually just wanted to stress the 2 following points

Leviticus 19:16-17
"'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.
Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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Thank you, very good supplement and further exposition.

'Yes all good sections of scripture about helping out others, except that Leviticus verse that could indicate the tares among the wheat?'
Yes, I only included the whole verses for completeness, but actually just wanted to stress the 2 following points

Leviticus 19:16-17
"'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.
Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.
No..I agree it was needful to include this, there are positive duties and sadly negative duties that arise.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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Hello @Anthony D'Arienzo,

When I read your post, my mind went to Hebrews 5:13-14, ...
'For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age,
even those who
by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.'

also to, Colossians 3:16,

' Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom;
teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs,
singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.'

* Our fellowship is with the Father and with the Son by the Spirit, and our fellowship with one another is the overflow from that fellowship. When that is lacking there can be no fellowship with one another, not true fellowship.

* There is only one recorded means by which the Holy Spirit brings us into this fellowship, and that is by the word of God, for it only is His 'sword'. It is also part of the believers armour against the forces of spiritual wickedness, which wage war against our soul (Ephesians 4:17). It is quick and powerful, and the Holy Spirit wields that sword to discern the thoughts and intents of our hearts, and to wash us from the detritus that builds up within us, from simply living in the world day by day (Ephesians 5:26).

* We are to serve one another, in spirit; speaking Truth one to another, or Truthing (Ephesians 5:9): by reminding one another of the Hope that we have in Christ Jesus, and what He has accomplished on our behalf, by lifting one another up in prayer to the One Who alone can know our needs and can meet them. Letting the word of God flow and do it's work between us, that God's will be accomplished and His Name glorified in and through us.


Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Yes, thanks for another solid post. Solid in that you are correctly focused on being word centered right from the start. We are to live and breathe scripture, it is where we live.

20 My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings.

21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart.

22 For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.

23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.
 

marksman

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in Genesis 4:9 we read;
Then the Lord said to Cain,where is Abel your brother?
He said,I do not know.
AM I MY BROTHERS KEEPER?

1] are we our brothers keeper?

2] in what way are we?

3] is this a duty or an option?

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?

5]are there any boundaries to this?

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?

I read the story of a monkey in the zoo reading Darwin's Theory of Evolution. He was heard muttering to himself "Am I my keeper's brother?"
 

marksman

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Romans 1 King James Version (KJV)
1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:

6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:

7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

9 For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;

10 Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you.

11 For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;

And the point of quoting those scriptures are???
 

marksman

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in Genesis 4:9 we read;
Then the Lord said to Cain,where is Abel your brother?
He said,I do not know.
AM I MY BROTHERS KEEPER?

1] are we our brothers keeper?

2] in what way are we?

3] is this a duty or an option?

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?

5]are there any boundaries to this?

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?

I don't wish to be contentious but I have the feeling that we are trying to make a sermon of something that is not there. All I am saying is that Cain was saying he is not responsible for what his brother does or does not do. If you want to make up something to preach about looking after each other, there are numerous passages in the New Testament that address this in context.
 
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Anthony D'Arienzo

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And the point of quoting those scriptures are???
in verse 11, Paul shows that who he is and what he has learned by special revelation has now become his focus to edify his brothers in Christ.
He cannot wait to impart scriptural teaching and wisdom to those he is coming into contact with.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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I don't wish to be contentious but I have the feeling that we are trying to make a sermon of something that is not there. All I am saying is that Cain was saying he is not responsible for what his brother does or does not do. If you want to make up something to preach about looking after each other, there are numerous passages in the New Testament that address this in context.
???
Do you think Cain was trying to edify his brother when he killed him?
Does the narrative not become instructive?
Was Cain motivated by love of his brother?
Do you think that envy, or jealousy might have been involved?
Was Cain addressed by God because he did a good thing?
 

Hidden In Him

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in Genesis 4:9 we read;
Then the Lord said to Cain,where is Abel your brother?
He said,I do not know.
AM I MY BROTHERS KEEPER?

1] are we our brothers keeper?

2] in what way are we?

3] is this a duty or an option?

4] how much or to what extent do we do this?

5]are there any boundaries to this?

6] do we risk losing fellowship over this issue?


Greetings, Anthony, and good morning.

I thought Post #32 was a rather savvy response. What would be your reply to it?

God bless, and hope you have a great day.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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Greetings, Anthony, and good morning.

I thought Post #32 was a rather savvy response. What would be your reply to it?

God bless, and hope you have a great day.
I have not had a morning coffee yet,so I do not know if Unraveling that is in the cards.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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Jan 3, 2019
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Cain is in scripture for several reasons and perhaps that could be several threads worth of discussion.
Here it us safe to say that his envy,and jealousy, were not given as an example of love fulfilling the law.
On a message board you might see from time to time a disturbed individual who gets worked up into a frenzy over a poster who posts different than he does.
He can get so obsessed that although he cannot get close enough to Christian to physically strike him down and commit physical murder,instead he will try and fabricate things to commit slander,and bear false witness against that person.
He tries to murder the persons good name publically , so that in his own mind,he can substitute himself and what he offers,instead....just like Cain and Abel.
 
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