I expect that you are accusing me.
But what I am doing, in all reality, is taking the scripture at face value.
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But what I am doing, in all reality, is taking the scripture at face value.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
But it cannot contradict other scripture, or you'll be forever learning, but never come to a knowledge of the truth. What would you call the time before Christ, and the time after Christ? That is what Paul is discussing, also John.
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I find no contradiction between the verses in question and my understanding of other scripture.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Jesus said, those who sin are slaves of sin. And slaves will not be in heaven forever. But children of God will be in heaven forever. Jesus takes away our sin, and in Him is no sin. How can you not see the obvious? Are you a sinner or a child of God? If Jesus takes away all your sin, will you be lying to say you have no sin now?
The truth that will set you free, is that you are free from sin, IF you are abiding in Christ! By your comment, you are claiming to be a child of God, BUT a sinner. My dear brother, you cannot be both. You either belong to God, or you belong to the devil.
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Indwelling sin (1 John 1:8) does not have to have any say over our behaviour; for if it be rendered dead it is rendered inept; therefore indwelling sin is a different thing from practical sin.
We don't have to commit sin as believers; and if we are vigilant we won't.
But this doesn't change the fact of indwelling sin; which, if rendered dead (Romans 6:6, Romans 7:8, Galatians 5:24) does not have to have any authority over what we do; so that in the practical sense, we don't commit sin as believers.
In Galatians 5:17 it says that we cannot do the things that we would do.
This means that either we would do righteousness and cannot do so; or that we would sin and cannot do so.
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; so that ye cannot do the things that ye would (Galatians 5:17).
This is speaking of those who have the Spirit, obviously.
Therefore having the Spirit does not eradicate the flesh. There will be times of temptation; and that temptation originates itself in your flesh and sin in the flesh.
Did not Peter even say that there would be times of temptation in 1 Peter 1:6-7?
And James in James 1:2-4?
The origins of this temptation is sin in the flesh according to James 1:14-16.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Indwelling sin is from the old nature, which is dead in Christ. We are partakers of the divine nature. Jesus said, we MUST be born again of the Spirit.
2 Peter 1:2-4 shows that the grace of God is not unmerited favor, but the power of God. Study it. And verse 9 says we were cleansed of our past sins, (no where in scripture are our present or future willful sins of lawlessness cleansed as we commit them.)
As a matter of fact this doctrine is in holy scripture.
As believers in Christ our relationship to the law has changed...we are not under it, we are dead to it, and are delivered from it (Romans 6:14, Romans 7:4, Galatians 2:19, Romans 7:6). What this means is that there is no more condemnation from the law; and that therefore we are forgiven of past, present, and future sins.
Because it is clear from other scripture (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16) that the fact that we are not under it, are dead to it, and are delivered from it does not mean that we are no longer governed by it. Therefore it does mean that we are no longer condemned by it.
Also, in Romans 4:8 it is clear that the Lord shall not impute sin to some.
In Romans 8:38-39 things present and things to come (including sins) shall not be able to separate us from the love of the Lord.
And in Hebrews 9:12, it is clear that God has obtained for us eternal redemption.
Yes indeed, and what I have been saying is that it is indeed dead although it has not been eradicated.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
You've misread it as well as misinterpreted it. We are free from SIN, thus we are free from the condemnation of sin, and there is no need for the law of condemnation.
A child of God doesn't even commit present and future willful sins of lawlessness!!!
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Not eradicated??? Jesus said when the Son frees you (from sin) you are free indeed. Indeed means eradicated forever. Totally cleansed.
That is besides the point. The point is that Jesus died for all of our sins before we were even alive; therefore every sin that I have committed in the past was yet in the future when Jesus died for me. If anyone sins, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and this is the point.
Being set free from sin means that sin is no longer your master.
By killing the former master, Jesus has set us free from his power.
But the old master continues to be present in the believer's life, though rendered dead.
It has been said that justification is being set free from the penalty of sin; sanctification from the power of sin; and glorification from the presence of sin.
We will not receive glorification until we go on to the next life.
It has also been said (recently) that every sin we commit is immediately rendered to the past.
Therefore the sin that I commit five minutes from now, will be a past sin 5 minutes and 1 second from now.
Therefore the sin that I commit five minutes from now, will be a past sin 5 minutes and 1 second from now.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
No, now. The steps to glorification of our spirit are in 2 Peter 1:5-10. We can already be sinless, and these are the steps to perfection. Hebrews 12:14 "...without holiness, no man shall see God." Only our bodies will be glorified after death. And if that is all you meant, then I agree, but I doubt you only meant our body.
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If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (1 John 1:8)
Again, the apostle John included himself in that statement.
He could have said, "If you say that you have no sin, you deceive yourself, and the truth is not in you."
And this would have been more in line with your theology.
He could have excluded himself from the viability of the statement by saying "you" instead of "we".
So then, if 1 John 1:8 is speaking of unregenerated souls, then John himself was unregenerated. Because he included himself in the equation.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.
Did John walk in darkness?
1 John 3:9
9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
If that person who has been born of God agrees with John, in chapter 3, is he still lying from chapter one?
Context, context, context!
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and there is no truth in us. 9 But if we confess our sins to God, he will keep his promise and do what is right: he will forgive us our sins and purify us from all our wrongdoing.
If purified from all our past sins, are we still a sinner? Is this really so over your head you keep repeating verse 8 out of context? You don't even recognize that John is using "we" as mankind, just as Paul used it that way in Romans 7 with the word, "I". What are you trying to justify? You keep adding to scripture, such as but it doesn't eradicate sin in us. Do you know what 1 John 3:5 means? 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. THAT is a Christian. 1 John 1:8 isn't UNTIL they do verse 9.
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marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Do you think that the negativeness in your post is the way that you are going to convince people of the rightness of what you claim, especially as most of it is devoid of scripture?
bbyrd009
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ah, just let them keep testifying of themselves i guess, maybe it will dawn on them that they all sound ridiculous
well mostly bc you dont seem to want to have a conversation? You are here to lecture, like the rest of these dunning-kruger types? So if yall are so convinced you are Yah, why not just tell us where we can go to worship you?
bbyrd009
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yeh, and running from the other half. i mean cmon jbf
yall would do better to join forces and form a coven i guess
bbyrd009
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no "to God" in there anywhere, 1 John 1:9 Lexicon: If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
bc we are told whom to confess our sins to by Christ Himself, right
yall should all be locked in a room until only one is left imo.
Oh, snap
Yes, all are under sin, when they are a Christ Rejector.
But once a person is born again, there are not under sin.
They are "Under Grace".
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