I'm going to make an observation and would appreciate some constructive thoughts from other children of God. This concerns Armageddon and is to try to understand exactly what it is and the timing of that battle: Revelation 16:14-16 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. Armageddon means "the hill or city of Megiddo" and Megiddo means, "place of crowds."Hebrews 12:1-2 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the Author and Finisher of our faith, Who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. Race is always translated "fight, conflict, etc." except save here. The word means THE PLACE OF ASSEMBLY, and then the games witnessed, and then any contest, a lawsuit, etc. - Companion Bible (KJV), E.W. BullingerMark 13:9-11 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Armageddon is the gathering place of the crowds. There (world-wide...not in one spot) we are delivered for a testimony. We are gathered/assembled with crowds for a witness/testimony. The battle of Armageddon is the "race set before us" when we will allow the Holy Spirit to speak through us. Is that happening now? I don't know...perhaps. Perhaps what we do on forums such as this is indeed allowing Him to speak through us. Is this our Armageddon, where we wage our individual battle? Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight: I believe that if we are looking for a last great battle to be waged in Jerusalem...then we are fooling ourselves. We are now in this battle of Armageddon. We are the crowds of witnesses gathered right now allowing Him to speak through us and His testimony is being witnessed to the world.
Armageddon...What and When is it?
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Im Sorry Whirl I often agree with you or can see merit in what you are saying However I can not buy this as spiritual in meaning. For me it leaves to many verse's hanging with no place to fit ....And it just doesnt feel right if you know what I mean .. In fact it feels very wrong For one thing when we are called up to testify we are told not to premeditate everyone that posts here or anywhere for that matter premeditates on what they are going to say/ask ... We are told not to premeditate because God's holy ghost will speak through us just as he did on penecost day . These will not be our words but Gods ...as you know this is the only time the unforgivable sin is possiable Mar 13:11But when they shall lead [you], and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost Theres also verses like Zec 12:3 And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it. That some say is armageddon .... Megiddo has always been a gathering place for the crowds some of the most famous battles in history have been fought there.... And lastley but most importantly this battle is Gods wrath its not on the saved but the unsaved and that crowd gathered is Satan's. They have gathered to do battle with Jesus Christ. I think trying to change Gods wrath into a spirtual teaching instead of a literal event is walking in dangerous territory... IMHO Rev 16:17And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. Sorry but I honestly do not see how you put this together .... and could come to that conclusionwhirlwind;74188][B]I said:
Mighty Bear
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Being killed in a war doesn't make sense because people will die swiftly. I don't think there's a verse that tells us that people will die swiftly.Matthew 24:29 ESV "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.Matthew 24:30 ESV Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.Matthew 24:31 ESV And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.Matthew 24:46 ESV Blessed is that servant whom his master will find so doing when he comes.Matthew 24:48 ESV But if that wicked servant says to himself, 'My master is delayed,'Matthew 24:49 ESV and begins to beat his fellow servants and eats and drinks with drunkards,Matthew 24:50 ESV the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not knowMatthew 24:51 ESV and will cut him in pieces and put him with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.Matthew 24:27 ESV For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
Christina;74198]Im Sorry Whirl I often agree with you or can see merit in what you are saying However I can not buy this as spiritual in meaning. For me it leaves to many verse said:
Just a quick reply here and some thoughts While I can agree there is spiritual aspect to all this I think you taking it to the extreme taking the literal and reducing it to only spiritual When in fact its both to do that we lose one whole side ... We see this same type thing often in types just because a thing happened in the past doesnt mean it doesnt have a second side a future event prophiesed within the past event. Even though one may see a spiritual aspect to things ..We can not forget it can also be a literal event to only see one side we lose half the interptation and message ... Seems to me what you partley describing is hows its been sense Christ died on the cross, what was the command ?Preach the gospel around the World ...that is what we are doing ... While its true some have a more personal relationship with God than others ..and wisdom is given more to some less to others, on an individual basis ...And some may speak from the spirt more than others..... To call that command what is occuring now has been occuring, the testistomy spoken of in Mark 13 is IMHO way over reaching. This was singled out above the command preach the gospel around the world for a specific reason to occur at a specific time .... When? IMHO when Amos 8:11-12 occurs in its fullness because thats when its needed to bring the hearts of the children back to their fathers ... Its my understanding that the full knowledge of God occompanies his holy Ghost coming full on a person ... the very aspostels themselves often didnt understand Jesus or his Words, parables ... It wasnt until Penecost Day and the Holy spirit came on them they were given this full knowlegde ... If you say Mark 13 testomomy is happening now wheres this full knowledge of God ? Are Your saying we are all subject to the same penality as Satan without having full knowledge as even Satan does, of what it means to deny him ? I do not think this is the way our loving father would work .... Ill come back later. When I have more time. 
Revelation 16:16 "And he gathered them together into a place called in the He'-brew tongue Ar-ma-ged'-don." If you have repented, and are sealed in your mind, this place does not exist for you. Once you have repented and come to know God's Word, The Antichrist will not be tempting to you. You know Satan is coming first, then after the five months of Antichrist's world rule, the seventh trumpet will sound, and Jesus Christ will return to earth. This gathering at Arm-ageddon [Megiddo] is not the saints of God, but those in Satan's kingdom; to do battle with God. "Megiddo" means "the gathering place of the crowd", and that crowd is Satan's. They have gathered to do battle with Jesus Christ. This is no secret to Satan, only to ignorant Christians who refuse to study God's Word. The Antichrist knows he has five month, for it is written. He knows where and when Christ would return, and every other detail concerning the return of Christ: Why? Because it is written in the Scriptures. That place is on mount Zion, because that is where Jesus Christ is going to return, when His feet touch the ground. Satan will be ruling from there, his people will be there, and that is where the Battle of Armageddon will take place. Because it is written. The whole battle of the end times is over the Word of God, a spiritual battle, and it is through your understanding of that Word [Bible] that you will survive spiritually. It is a battle for your eternal soul. Revelation 16:17 "And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done."This is happening on the "Lord's day", when Christ shall return. The full time of the battle will more then likely, be a time less that an hour. The tribulation, up to the Seventh trumpet is false teaching, and bad religion. On this day of the Lord, God will take His cup of wrath, and pour it out on the earth, on all those who refuse to study His Word. It is aimed at those who follow, or allowed the Kenites to lead them into Antichrist's arms. Satan is the prince of the air, and this vial is poured out upon him, when Satan stands up, following his declaration that he is God. He will have just killed the two witnesses of God, who have plagued the earth in their accusations towards all mankind, and the people of the earth will be in celebration. God will have had His fill of all of them. "It is done", came the voice of God, and the wrath of God is being poured out on the people of the earth. Revelation 16:18 "And there were voices, and thunders, and lightning's; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." When Christ died on the cross, His last words were "It is finished", and we entered into the period we call "Grace" today. It was a new age. When the Antichrist declares himself God in the Abominable act, God will say "It is done", and then we will start another new age. The start of this new age will be the flattening of Jerusalem, where not one stone will be left standing upon another. http://www.theseason.org/revelation/revelation16.htm This is how I see it as well...
agreed N2 My question to you whirl would be sense it is written Armageddon is the end and its against Satan and his ..How you can say its just spiritual and happening now?A. C is not even here yet the tribulation has not even started so how can the end be happening now ...We are told in 2 Thess.2. 1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? You know these things how can the end be before the beginning that God says must occur first ???? As far as Jerusalem being spiritual that's not even necessary all Satan's cohorts will be gathered around him and hes in Jerusalem that's where armageddon takes place all that's required to be there are Satan's crowd ... Christ doesn't need us there he brings his army of saints but even if he does want us there we will be there, thats part of faith that he will have us where he wants us. We are all then changed in the twinkling of an eye we dont need to be in Jerusalem to be changed .... I have gone over and over this all day and even though I think there is a spiritual side here .. You can not turn all literal events into just spiritual events anymore than you can read the Bible as strictly literal without a spiritual side They must be taken together as a whole seeing only one side of the equation will lead one to the wrong conclusion ...
I absolutely disagree. Armageddon is a place on earth. The area is now called valley of Jezreel. This is where the city of Megiddo stood. It is a city mentioned in the bible. Joshua defeated the city and the area was given to the tribe of Manasseh.Joshua 1711 And in Issachar and in Asher, Manasseh had Beth Shean and its towns, Ibleam and its towns, the inhabitants of Dor and its towns, the inhabitants of En Dor and its towns, the inhabitants of Taanach and its towns, and the inhabitants of Megiddo and its towns—three hilly regions.This is the plain where the Anit-christ will mass his army of 200million troops, The bible does not actually state that the army will be destroyed in that exact location. It may be that the army will be in the process of moving to take Jerusalem when the Messiah appears in glory to intervene and destroy them.All Praise The Ancient Of Dayswhirlwind;74188][B]I said:
I see what is happening now as the latter rain coming down but it is not "full knowledge," so your point is well taken. The unforgiveable sin cannot be committed until that time. Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for He hath given you the former rain moderately, and He will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first (month).During the great tribulation, when Satan is here, then it will be as it was at Pentecost.... 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out My spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:But, getting back to Armageddon being a spiritual battle....I'm still seeing it that way but, I'm still reading.Christina;74242]Just a quick reply here and some thoughts While I can agree there is spiritual aspect to all this I think you taking it to the extreme taking the literal and reducing it to only spiritual When in fact its both to do that we lose one whole side ... We see this same type thing often in types just because a thing happened in the pastdoesnt mean it doesnt have a second side a future event prophiesed within the past event. Even though one may see a spiritual aspect to things ..We can not forget it can also be a literal event to only see one side we lose half the interptation and message ... Seems to me what you partley describing is hows its been sense Christ died on the cross said:It wasnt until Penecost Day and the Holy spirit came on them they were given this full knowlegde ... If you say Mark 13 testomomy is happening now wheres this full knowledge of God ? [/COLOR]Are Your saying we are all subject to the same penality as Satan without having full knowledge as even Satan does, of what it means to deny him ? I do not think this is the way our loving father would work .... Ill come back later. When I have more time.
They are world-wide as we are world-wide. As he gathers his forces in Megiddo consider who lives there..... 1 Chronicles 7:28-29 And their possessions and habitations (were), Beth-el and the towns thereof, and eastward Naaran, and westward Gezer, with the towns thereof; Shechem also and the towns therof, unto Gaza and the towns thereof: And by the borders of the children of Manasseh, Beth-shean and her towns Taanach and her towns, Megiddo and her towns, Dor and her towns. In these dwelt the children of Joseph the son of Israel. Megiddo is the possession and habitation of Ephraim and Manasseh...sons of Joseph. The house of Israel possesses that site. We are the house of Israel. Do we possess or inhabit that area literally? No. This is spiritual. We are placed by our Father to fight this battle for we dwell there now. We are where He wants us to be to fight for Him.n2thelight;74259][FONT=Arial][SIZE=2][B]Revelation 16:16 [/B][I]"And he gathered them together into a place called in the He said:
Satan won't rule from Mt. Zion. Mt. Zion is symbolic of God's very elect and that is where He first returns....in His body of elect.... Joel 3:16-17 The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel. So shall ye know that I am the LORD your God dwelling in Zion, my holy mountain: then shall Jerusalem be holy, and there shall no strangers pass through her any more. (21) For I will cleanse their blood that I have not cleansed: for the LORD dwelleth in Zion.Zion is His very elect, the man child. He dwelleth in them. His voice comes from Jerusalem, the woman...the church. The man child IS His holy mountain Zion. The body of Christ is Jerusalem...His holy city. When Satan is revealed..... 11 Thessalonians 2:3-4 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition, Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the Temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. The falling away is going on now and will only get stronger. He will be revealed as the son of perdition when Christ arrives. God's Temple is Christ, Christ in His body and the son of perdition sits in His body..... John 2:21 But he spake of the temple of His body. 1 Corinthians 3:16-17 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are. Matthew 21:12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves, That was an example of what will be. Jesus will go into His temple, His body of believers, and cast out those that don't belong, those that "defile the temple of God." Those that buy and sell for they have the mark of the beast. [Revelation 13:17]
I agree. It is a spiritual battle for our soul. Armageddon is a spiritual battle.
I agree.
I agree with all except....the "two witnesses" for those "two" are many, not two literal entites. Probably a good topic to keep for another thread.
The literal Jerusalem yes...but not the spiritual Jerusalem. We are safe and in His arms.
Christina;74261]agreed N2 My question to you whirl would be sense it is written Armageddon [U]is the end[/U] and its against Satan and his ..How you can say its just spiritual and happening now?[/QUOTE] [B]It doesn said:
Whirlwind, I do mean everything I say here on out with respect, but I strongly disagree with quite a few of your conclusions here.
The Greek is apostasy. It's used twice in the Bible, and both times it's the same context -it's a falling away from the subject. Apostasy here clearly implies a negative falling away; you don't want to be an apostate where this word is used. Hence the reason the warning is given in the first part of the verse. It's explicitly saying don't be fooled, there will come an apostasy and the man of sin will be revealed in it.The only and final rebuttal for the spiritual concept is clearly found in Ezekiel 38.
It continues upon to speak about spoil - pure physical spoil. Yet again, the root of all evil (lust, the desire for money) is the reason. Notice the parallel to Satan's original rebellion. Evil desires what it cannot have.Here's the timeline confirmation:
Compare with Revelation 16:18. This is named right after the topos (think our modern topography) which is distinctly a place.I've made mistakes like this before; search it out, but sometimes we look to make things too spiritual and forget that the physical happens as well. At the seventh trump, God breaks down the physical barrier, I think part of the reason we'll be changed at the twinkling of an eye is because these people will be destroyed quite painfully physically. As I write this, I caught a glimpse of it in my mind, and that link was cemented. Sure you could argue a physical punishment for a spiritual evil, but again there's no reason to with the context. God reveals himself at the 7th trump.The army goes out because of a very real desire for spoil and destruction.
n2thelight wrote
I am almost sure both I and John, the writer will disagree with this statement. Could you please amplifiy this a little, so I know exactly what you are saying?
What do YOU see before the 7th trumpet? Where do you see the midpoint of the week?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Whirlwind, why is it so difficult for you to just accept a literal reading? "they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty. " A beginning reader would accept this as literal!
Then John goes on: "17And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, "Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and mighty men, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, small and great."
19Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to make war against the rider on the horse and his army.
How can this be anything but a litteral battle? Birds can't eat figments of our imagination!
Coop
I am almost sure both I and John, the writer will disagree with this statement. Could you please amplifiy this a little, so I know exactly what you are saying?
What do YOU see before the 7th trumpet? Where do you see the midpoint of the week?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Whirlwind, why is it so difficult for you to just accept a literal reading? "they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty. " A beginning reader would accept this as literal!
Then John goes on: "17And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, "Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and mighty men, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, small and great."
19Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to make war against the rider on the horse and his army.
How can this be anything but a litteral battle? Birds can't eat figments of our imagination!
Coop
The tribulation period is the 6th trump it starts in heaven in the 5th trump and when Satan arrives on earth the 6th trumprt blows ..... the sixth trump or tribulation which ever you want to call it lasts 5 months(rev 9) as we are told.
Mid week of 5 months is 2 1/2 months ..thats when we see amobination of Desolation spoken by Daniel .....
the 7th trump is Gods wrath it happens after the first tribulation of Satan... and God wrath is not on the believers but Satan (antichrist ) and his followers ...God has no reason to pour his wrath out on his own ....
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days
shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
and again in Mark 13:24
Mid week of 5 months is 2 1/2 months ..thats when we see amobination of Desolation spoken by Daniel .....
the 7th trump is Gods wrath it happens after the first tribulation of Satan... and God wrath is not on the believers but Satan (antichrist ) and his followers ...God has no reason to pour his wrath out on his own ....
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days
shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
and again in Mark 13:24
Christina said:
Christina, I must wonder what bible you read?
If you study Joel 2 and Isaiah 2, you will see that they point straight to the 6th seal as the warning that the day of the Lord, and the 70th week, are just about to begin. Then the 7th seal is the official "marker" for the beginning of the 70th week. The first 6 trumpets happen during the first half of the 70th week. The 7th trumpet "marks" the exact midpoint. Note 12:6 is about those in Judea fleeing because they have just seen the abomination, which happened at the sounding of the 7th trumpet. Then in chapter 12 we see Satan being cast down, again right at the midpoint. Then chapter 13 is the beast that Satan uses to start his killing machine. The midpoint events goes through chapter 15. Finally, the 70th week ends at the 7th vial.
Any one of these points may be discussed. They are all backed by what is written.
Coop
Coop,
You are engaged with one who follows Arnold Murray's "serpent seed" doctrine .... this is why you are having difficulty understanding what is being said
I would suggest that you research Murray's heresy on the Internet and then you will understand just what is going on
You are engaged with one who follows Arnold Murray's "serpent seed" doctrine .... this is why you are having difficulty understanding what is being said
I would suggest that you research Murray's heresy on the Internet and then you will understand just what is going on
I follow the Bible in case niether one of you can read Satan and his locust army are here 5 months He says it twice for emphasis in Rev 9 maybe you two should check it out we call it the Word of God ... You cant prove me wrong in scripture ...go ahead try be my guest if you two think your so good prove me wrong .... Or maybe you think personal attacks makes you a real man of God Stephen .... Thats pretty much the norm when you got nothing to back you but opinions
[sup]5[/sup]And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man
[sup]10[/sup]And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
[sup]11[/sup]And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.
Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon
[sup]5[/sup]And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man
[sup]10[/sup]And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
[sup]11[/sup]And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.
Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon
"Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon"
Here is your answer:
Your reference to the 5 month time frame as you see it is a stunted Murray view of Revelation 9:1-6 [and I can tell you why Murray does this]
This beast will be involved in the entire tribulation time frame from beginning to end of 2,520 days duration .... then the Lord will destroy him and his kingdom of followers in the next 30 days [Micah 5:1-6; Revelation 14:14-20; 19:11-21; 16:1-16]
He will possess the little horn, a human king of the northern Middle East presented in Daniel's visions [Daniel 8:9-12; 23-25; 11:36-45; 12:7]
First his conquering [first 1260 days], and then his unopposed rule for 42 months [next 1260 days] [Daniel 11:36-45; 12:1-12; Revelation 11:2-13; 13:1-9]
A cut from my website:
The return of Abaddon-Apollyon, a fallen angelic prince, is given in scripture and just who the human little human horn that this fallen angelic will possess is not known yet: [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8]
The little horn, a human king, will appear in the northern Middle East rising up among 10 other Middle Eastern kings who will follow him at the time of the end .... his appearance will occur just at the beginning of the tribulation period. [Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 11:36-45; Revelation 9:1-11; 17:8]
Abaddon-Apollyon is the first beast of Revelation who will come out of the abyss .... released by satan himself. Here the term "beast" is used to describe a fallen angelic. [Revelation 9:1; 9:11; 17:8]
This term is used differently in Daniel's visions and symbolizes the succession of different Middle Eastern empires ... three historical and the future and last of Abaddon-Apollyon's human dominions. [Daniel 7:3-7 .... three of these are historical [neo-Babylon, Persia, and Syrio/Babylonia]; the fourth will emerge at the time of the end]
This final dominion will include two phases ... a 6th smaller dominion in the northern Middle East followed quickly by an expanded dominion of the region with 10 other kings. [Daniel 8:9; Revelation 17:10-14]
His presence, kingdom on the earth, and actions are noted specifically in Revelation chapters 9:11; 11:7; 13:1; 14:9; 16:13; 17:8; and 19:19. He is the "angelic prince" that shall come to rule again and stand against the Messiah Prince .... Jesus Christ at the time of the end. [Daniel 8:9-12; 9:24-27]
This beast [in the little horn, human king of the northern Middle East] will conquer the Middle East including Israel, and will fend off all other national opposition including the noted destruction of the "great city" [civilization] of the Gentiles [the nations]. [Daniel 11:36-44; Revelation 8:7-12; 14:8; 16:19; 17:16-18; 18:1-21; 19:1-3]
Those who oppose his rule from the south, far east, and far north outside of the Middle East proper will be vanquished. [Daniel 11:40-44]
The Lord's two Israelite prophets will stand for the Lord against this angelic prince [Abaddon-Apollyon] and his false prophet [also a fallen angelic who will manifest in two human cleric leaders .... two horns] during the 42 month rule of a conquered Israel [last 1,260 days of the 7 year tribulation period]. [Revelation 11:2-7; 13:11-18]
The Lord will protect His two prophets during their service which will take place in Jerusalem occupied by the little horn and his followers .... the adherents of Islam. [Psalms 83; Ezekiel 38:4-7; Micah 5:5]
The Lord will then turn on him and his human followers and destroy them in the next 30 days consumating at the battle of Armageddon. [Ezekiel 39:17-29; Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:20-21]
This angelic beast and the false prophet will be destroyed in the lake of fire [only the Lord can destroy angelics], the human little horn and his followers will become bird food and their remains will be buried by Israel, and satan will be tossed into the same abyss. [Ezekiel 39:9-16; Revelation 20:1]
This is a future picture of Israel and the nation's Middle Eastern enemies .... the adherents of Islam. Mohammud's claims of a visitation by the angel Gabriel were false, and he was most likely visited by satan himself .... or it is possible that he just made the whole story up to support his ambitions of control and conquest.
The situation in the Middle East today is ripe for the coming of the "other prince" .... the "Mahdi" of the Islamic nation.
Here is your answer:
Your reference to the 5 month time frame as you see it is a stunted Murray view of Revelation 9:1-6 [and I can tell you why Murray does this]
This beast will be involved in the entire tribulation time frame from beginning to end of 2,520 days duration .... then the Lord will destroy him and his kingdom of followers in the next 30 days [Micah 5:1-6; Revelation 14:14-20; 19:11-21; 16:1-16]
He will possess the little horn, a human king of the northern Middle East presented in Daniel's visions [Daniel 8:9-12; 23-25; 11:36-45; 12:7]
First his conquering [first 1260 days], and then his unopposed rule for 42 months [next 1260 days] [Daniel 11:36-45; 12:1-12; Revelation 11:2-13; 13:1-9]
A cut from my website:
The return of Abaddon-Apollyon, a fallen angelic prince, is given in scripture and just who the human little human horn that this fallen angelic will possess is not known yet: [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8]
The little horn, a human king, will appear in the northern Middle East rising up among 10 other Middle Eastern kings who will follow him at the time of the end .... his appearance will occur just at the beginning of the tribulation period. [Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 11:36-45; Revelation 9:1-11; 17:8]
Abaddon-Apollyon is the first beast of Revelation who will come out of the abyss .... released by satan himself. Here the term "beast" is used to describe a fallen angelic. [Revelation 9:1; 9:11; 17:8]
This term is used differently in Daniel's visions and symbolizes the succession of different Middle Eastern empires ... three historical and the future and last of Abaddon-Apollyon's human dominions. [Daniel 7:3-7 .... three of these are historical [neo-Babylon, Persia, and Syrio/Babylonia]; the fourth will emerge at the time of the end]
This final dominion will include two phases ... a 6th smaller dominion in the northern Middle East followed quickly by an expanded dominion of the region with 10 other kings. [Daniel 8:9; Revelation 17:10-14]
His presence, kingdom on the earth, and actions are noted specifically in Revelation chapters 9:11; 11:7; 13:1; 14:9; 16:13; 17:8; and 19:19. He is the "angelic prince" that shall come to rule again and stand against the Messiah Prince .... Jesus Christ at the time of the end. [Daniel 8:9-12; 9:24-27]
This beast [in the little horn, human king of the northern Middle East] will conquer the Middle East including Israel, and will fend off all other national opposition including the noted destruction of the "great city" [civilization] of the Gentiles [the nations]. [Daniel 11:36-44; Revelation 8:7-12; 14:8; 16:19; 17:16-18; 18:1-21; 19:1-3]
Those who oppose his rule from the south, far east, and far north outside of the Middle East proper will be vanquished. [Daniel 11:40-44]
The Lord's two Israelite prophets will stand for the Lord against this angelic prince [Abaddon-Apollyon] and his false prophet [also a fallen angelic who will manifest in two human cleric leaders .... two horns] during the 42 month rule of a conquered Israel [last 1,260 days of the 7 year tribulation period]. [Revelation 11:2-7; 13:11-18]
The Lord will protect His two prophets during their service which will take place in Jerusalem occupied by the little horn and his followers .... the adherents of Islam. [Psalms 83; Ezekiel 38:4-7; Micah 5:5]
The Lord will then turn on him and his human followers and destroy them in the next 30 days consumating at the battle of Armageddon. [Ezekiel 39:17-29; Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:20-21]
This angelic beast and the false prophet will be destroyed in the lake of fire [only the Lord can destroy angelics], the human little horn and his followers will become bird food and their remains will be buried by Israel, and satan will be tossed into the same abyss. [Ezekiel 39:9-16; Revelation 20:1]
This is a future picture of Israel and the nation's Middle Eastern enemies .... the adherents of Islam. Mohammud's claims of a visitation by the angel Gabriel were false, and he was most likely visited by satan himself .... or it is possible that he just made the whole story up to support his ambitions of control and conquest.
The situation in the Middle East today is ripe for the coming of the "other prince" .... the "Mahdi" of the Islamic nation.
I dont know where you came up with half your ideas or your timing but I suggest you read what the early Church fathers taught and come out of your men traditions and lies second I sugest you do a study on the names of Satan you might be surprised What you learn
http://www.voiceofelijah.org/freeoffer/google/prophecy.html?gclid=COrF5peXlZICFRI0awodvgWq-Q
http://www.voiceofelijah.org/freeoffer/google/prophecy.html?gclid=COrF5peXlZICFRI0awodvgWq-Q
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