Armageddon...What and When is it?

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Stephen

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"I dont know where you came up with half your ideas or your timing but I suggest you read what the early Church fathers taught"

>Try the Bible

>Read my posting of the 70 x 7's time frame

>The earily "church fathers" understood little regarding Bible prophecy and we can know much more today .... especially with the value of a much longer hindsight and informational resources available

>Ezekiel's vision has two distinct parts .... the invasion of Israel at the middle of the 70th week decreed for the nation [same as the 2,520 day tribulation period] ..... and the ensuing resulting battle of Armageddon 1,260 days later
 

Christina

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Lets see he learned from Poly-carp who learned from the apostles and was the bishop of only one of two the churches God was pleased with ...But hey you probably know more right :)
 

Christina

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Why dont you get some real knowledge this is as close to the apostels as you can get but you think you know more ...
..........
Let’s Talk About Who Is Most Qualified to Explain the Book of Revelation, the Book of Daniel, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist:

Nearly everyone knows the Apostle John wrote the Book of Revelation. Although John never mentions “the Antichrist” as such, he certainly does quote a lot of Bible prophecy concerning the End Times; and the things he explains in regard to Satan, the False Prophet and the Beast sound a whole lot like what the Apostle Paul says about the Antichrist in this passage:

Let no one in any way deceive you, for {it will not come} unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. Do you not remember that while I was still with you, I was telling you these things? And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he may be revealed. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains {will do so} until he is taken out of the way. And then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; {that is,} the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. And for this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they might believe what is false, in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3–12) —NASB

Paul’s point is, a lot of folks are going to be deluded by Satan—when he appears in the person of the Antichrist—because they don’t want to believe the Truth in regard to End Times Bible Prophecy, the Antichrist, and the meaning of the Book of Revelation. But that sounds just like what the Apostle John himself says in that regard in the Book of Revelation:

And there was war in heaven, Michael and his angels waging war with the dragon. And the dragon and his angels waged war, and they were not strong enough, and there was no longer a place found for them in heaven. And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
(Revelation 12:7–9) —NASB

And I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spoke as a dragon. And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. And he performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life.
(Revelation 13:11–14) —NASB

One would naturally assume the Apostle John understood the meaning of the things he recorded in the Book of Revelation concerning End Times Bible prophecy and the Antichrist. So who could be more qualified to explain those things than the man who actually wrote them? Have you ever thought about the fact that John must have taught his disciples what those things actually meant? One of the most influential leaders of the second-century Church, a Bishop by the name of Irenæus, tells us John did just that.

Irenæus not only insists that the Apostle John taught his disciples exactly what the Book of Daniel and the Book of Revelation mean; he also claims that he was taught by disciples of John who actually heard the Apostle John explain what he knew about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy. More than that, Irenæus wrote down the things the disciples of the Apostle John taught him.

So who are you going to believe? Someone who got the Truth from the proverbial “horse’s mouth” or someone who got what he believes about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy from the mouth of someone who might have been nothing more than first cousin to a horse? Irenæus says this about the things he wrote concerning his understanding of the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist:

As I have already observed, the Church, having received this preaching and this faith, although scattered throughout the whole world, yet, as if occupying but one house, carefully preserves it. She also believes these points [of doctrine] just as if she had but one soul, and one and the same heart, and she proclaims them, and teaches them, and hands them down, with perfect harmony, as if she possessed only one mouth. For, although the languages of the world are dissimilar, yet the import of the tradition is one and the same. For the Churches which have been planted in Germany do not believe or hand down anything different, nor do those in Spain, nor those in Gaul, nor those in the East, nor those in Egypt, nor those in Libya, nor those which have been established in the central regions of the world. But as the sun, that creature of God, is one and the same throughout the whole world, so also the preaching of the truth shineth everywhere, and enlightens all men that are willing to come to a knowledge of the truth. Nor will any one of the rulers in the Churches, however highly gifted he may be in point of eloquence, teach doctrines different from these (for no one is greater than the Master); nor, on the other hand, will he who is deficient in power of expression inflict injury on the tradition. For the faith being ever one and the same, neither does one who is able at great length to discourse regarding it, make any addition to it, nor does one, who can say but little, diminish it.
(“Against Heresies,” Book I, Chapter XX)

As you can see, the orthodox Church at that time had not yet lost insight into the Truth that Jesus Christ revealed to His Disciples—the Truth concerning the meaning of the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy that the Apostles handed down orally to their disciples, who then handed it down orally to their disciples, one of whom happened to be the man Irenæus. So, if you are looking for the Truth concerning the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy, you might want to pay attention to what Irenæus has to say.



Irenæus Explains What He Knew About the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist
If you want to know the Truth concerning what Jesus and the Apostles taught in regard to the Book of Revelation, the Book of Daniel, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist, you can’t find a better source than Irenæus. He sat at the feet of one of the most revered martyrs of the second-century Church, a man named Polycarp, who was Bishop of the local church at Smyrna. Polycarp was not only one of the Apostle John’s most well-known disciples; he was also burned at the stake for his unwavering belief in the things the Apostle John taught him. So he was not the sort of person who would have distorted the Truth he learned from John when he taught those things to his own disciples, one of whom was Irenæus.

Not only did Irenæus learn the Truth about the Antichrist, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the meaning of the Book of Daniel and the Book of Revelation from Polycarp, he also “wrote the book” on what it meant to be a Christian in his day. Sometime around A.D. 185, he sat down and wrote a five-volume work titled “Against Heresies,” in which he clearly stated what one had to believe to be a Christian. That’s where he explained what he knew about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist. So, if you claim to be a “Christian,” you might want to think twice before you contradict what he wrote.

Irenæus’ monumental work is still available in theological libraries around the world today, but most theological students never bother to read it; and those who do aren’t all that interested in what he has to say anyway. The fact is, most who have a go at reading “Against Heresies” probably find the first few volumes so boring that they stop reading before they get a really good start. That’s a shame, because they never get to the really good part. The first three volumes of “Against Heresies” are just about as dry as a bone; but the fourth volume gets a bit more interesting, and the fifth volume will absolutely knock your socks off.



A Second “Witness” Confirms What Irenæus Says About the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist


http://www.voiceofelijah.org/freeoffer/google/prophecy.html?gclid=COrF5peXlZICFRI0awodvgWq-Q
 

lecoop

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May 21, 2008
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Christina said:
I follow the Bible in case niether one of you can read Satan and his locust army are here 5 months He says it twice for emphasis in Rev 9 maybe you two should check it out we call it the Word of God ... You cant prove me wrong in scripture ...go ahead try be my guest if you two think your so good prove me wrong .... Or maybe you think personal attacks makes you a real man of God Stephen .... Thats pretty much the norm when you got nothing to back you but opinions

[sup]5[/sup]And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man
[sup]10[/sup]And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
[sup]11[/sup]And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon

Stephen, sorry, never heard of him. I believe what I believe, because I study what is written with no preconceived glasses, and I activate the Holy Spirit as my teacher, by praying in the spirit for hours as I study. in fact, if you read carefully, you will see that I am saying exactly what is written. If you want to pull out one part, we can discuss it by and with the word of God.

Coop
 

lecoop

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May 21, 2008
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Stephen said:
"Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon"

Here is your answer:

Your reference to the 5 month time frame as you see it is a stunted Murray view of Revelation 9:1-6 [and I can tell you why Murray does this]

This beast will be involved in the entire tribulation time frame from beginning to end of 2,520 days duration .... then the Lord will destroy him and his kingdom of followers in the next 30 days [Micah 5:1-6; Revelation 14:14-20; 19:11-21; 16:1-16]

He will possess the little horn, a human king of the northern Middle East presented in Daniel's visions [Daniel 8:9-12; 23-25; 11:36-45; 12:7]

First his conquering [first 1260 days], and then his unopposed rule for 42 months [next 1260 days] [Daniel 11:36-45; 12:1-12; Revelation 11:2-13; 13:1-9]

A cut from my website:

The return of Abaddon-Apollyon, a fallen angelic prince, is given in scripture and just who the human little human horn that this fallen angelic will possess is not known yet: [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8]

The little horn, a human king, will appear in the northern Middle East rising up among 10 other Middle Eastern kings who will follow him at the time of the end .... his appearance will occur just at the beginning of the tribulation period. [Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 11:36-45; Revelation 9:1-11; 17:8]

Abaddon-Apollyon is the first beast of Revelation who will come out of the abyss .... released by satan himself. Here the term "beast" is used to describe a fallen angelic. [Revelation 9:1; 9:11; 17:8]

This term is used differently in Daniel's visions and symbolizes the succession of different Middle Eastern empires ... three historical and the future and last of Abaddon-Apollyon's human dominions. [Daniel 7:3-7 .... three of these are historical [neo-Babylon, Persia, and Syrio/Babylonia]; the fourth will emerge at the time of the end]

This final dominion will include two phases ... a 6th smaller dominion in the northern Middle East followed quickly by an expanded dominion of the region with 10 other kings. [Daniel 8:9; Revelation 17:10-14]

His presence, kingdom on the earth, and actions are noted specifically in Revelation chapters 9:11; 11:7; 13:1; 14:9; 16:13; 17:8; and 19:19. He is the "angelic prince" that shall come to rule again and stand against the Messiah Prince .... Jesus Christ at the time of the end. [Daniel 8:9-12; 9:24-27]

This beast [in the little horn, human king of the northern Middle East] will conquer the Middle East including Israel, and will fend off all other national opposition including the noted destruction of the "great city" [civilization] of the Gentiles [the nations]. [Daniel 11:36-44; Revelation 8:7-12; 14:8; 16:19; 17:16-18; 18:1-21; 19:1-3]

Those who oppose his rule from the south, far east, and far north outside of the Middle East proper will be vanquished. [Daniel 11:40-44]

The Lord's two Israelite prophets will stand for the Lord against this angelic prince [Abaddon-Apollyon] and his false prophet [also a fallen angelic who will manifest in two human cleric leaders .... two horns] during the 42 month rule of a conquered Israel [last 1,260 days of the 7 year tribulation period]. [Revelation 11:2-7; 13:11-18]

The Lord will protect His two prophets during their service which will take place in Jerusalem occupied by the little horn and his followers .... the adherents of Islam. [Psalms 83; Ezekiel 38:4-7; Micah 5:5]

The Lord will then turn on him and his human followers and destroy them in the next 30 days consumating at the battle of Armageddon. [Ezekiel 39:17-29; Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:20-21]

This angelic beast and the false prophet will be destroyed in the lake of fire [only the Lord can destroy angelics], the human little horn and his followers will become bird food and their remains will be buried by Israel, and satan will be tossed into the same abyss. [Ezekiel 39:9-16; Revelation 20:1]

This is a future picture of Israel and the nation's Middle Eastern enemies .... the adherents of Islam. Mohammud's claims of a visitation by the angel Gabriel were false, and he was most likely visited by satan himself .... or it is possible that he just made the whole story up to support his ambitions of control and conquest.

The situation in the Middle East today is ripe for the coming of the "other prince" .... the "Mahdi" of the Islamic nation.



Sorry, I must have hit the wrong quote.
 

lecoop

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May 21, 2008
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Christina said:
I follow the Bible in case niether one of you can read Satan and his locust army are here 5 months He says it twice for emphasis in Rev 9 maybe you two should check it out we call it the Word of God ... You cant prove me wrong in scripture ...go ahead try be my guest if you two think your so good prove me wrong .... Or maybe you think personal attacks makes you a real man of God Stephen .... Thats pretty much the norm when you got nothing to back you but opinions

[sup]5[/sup]And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man
[sup]10[/sup]And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
[sup]11[/sup]And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon

That is five months out of the first half of the week. All the trumpets are sounded in the first half of the week, except the 7th which marks the exact midpoint. We can discuss this if you choose. It really is what the author is telling us. In fact, just for fun, if each of the first 6 trumpets took 5 months, and there was a two month reprieve before the next, then 6 (trumpets) times 7 (months) equals 42 months. Hmmm. That makes up one half of the week. I am not saying this is the way it will happen, just the way it could happen. The abomination will be taking place on earth, as the 7th trumpet is sounded in heaven.

Their king is the destroyer, who is Satan.

Coop
 

lecoop

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May 21, 2008
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Christina said:
Why dont you get some real knowledge this is as close to the apostels as you can get but you think you know more ...
..........
Let’s Talk About Who Is Most Qualified to Explain the Book of Revelation, the Book of Daniel, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist:

Nearly everyone knows the Apostle John wrote the Book of Revelation. Although John never mentions “the Antichrist” as such, he certainly does quote a lot of Bible prophecy concerning the End Times; and the things he explains in regard to Satan, the False Prophet and the Beast sound a whole lot like what the Apostle Paul says about the Antichrist in this passage:

Let no one in any way deceive you, for {it will not come} unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. Do you not remember that while I was still with you, I was telling you these things? And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he may be revealed. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains {will do so} until he is taken out of the way. And then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; {that is,} the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. And for this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they might believe what is false, in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3–12) —NASB

Paul’s point is, a lot of folks are going to be deluded by Satan—when he appears in the person of the Antichrist—because they don’t want to believe the Truth in regard to End Times Bible Prophecy, the Antichrist, and the meaning of the Book of Revelation. But that sounds just like what the Apostle John himself says in that regard in the Book of Revelation:

And there was war in heaven, Michael and his angels waging war with the dragon. And the dragon and his angels waged war, and they were not strong enough, and there was no longer a place found for them in heaven. And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
(Revelation 12:7–9) —NASB

And I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spoke as a dragon. And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. And he performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life.
(Revelation 13:11–14) —NASB

One would naturally assume the Apostle John understood the meaning of the things he recorded in the Book of Revelation concerning End Times Bible prophecy and the Antichrist. So who could be more qualified to explain those things than the man who actually wrote them? Have you ever thought about the fact that John must have taught his disciples what those things actually meant? One of the most influential leaders of the second-century Church, a Bishop by the name of Irenæus, tells us John did just that.

Irenæus not only insists that the Apostle John taught his disciples exactly what the Book of Daniel and the Book of Revelation mean; he also claims that he was taught by disciples of John who actually heard the Apostle John explain what he knew about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy. More than that, Irenæus wrote down the things the disciples of the Apostle John taught him.

So who are you going to believe? Someone who got the Truth from the proverbial “horse’s mouth” or someone who got what he believes about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy from the mouth of someone who might have been nothing more than first cousin to a horse? Irenæus says this about the things he wrote concerning his understanding of the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist:

As I have already observed, the Church, having received this preaching and this faith, although scattered throughout the whole world, yet, as if occupying but one house, carefully preserves it. She also believes these points [of doctrine] just as if she had but one soul, and one and the same heart, and she proclaims them, and teaches them, and hands them down, with perfect harmony, as if she possessed only one mouth. For, although the languages of the world are dissimilar, yet the import of the tradition is one and the same. For the Churches which have been planted in Germany do not believe or hand down anything different, nor do those in Spain, nor those in Gaul, nor those in the East, nor those in Egypt, nor those in Libya, nor those which have been established in the central regions of the world. But as the sun, that creature of God, is one and the same throughout the whole world, so also the preaching of the truth shineth everywhere, and enlightens all men that are willing to come to a knowledge of the truth. Nor will any one of the rulers in the Churches, however highly gifted he may be in point of eloquence, teach doctrines different from these (for no one is greater than the Master); nor, on the other hand, will he who is deficient in power of expression inflict injury on the tradition. For the faith being ever one and the same, neither does one who is able at great length to discourse regarding it, make any addition to it, nor does one, who can say but little, diminish it.
(“Against Heresies,” Book I, Chapter XX)

As you can see, the orthodox Church at that time had not yet lost insight into the Truth that Jesus Christ revealed to His Disciples—the Truth concerning the meaning of the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy that the Apostles handed down orally to their disciples, who then handed it down orally to their disciples, one of whom happened to be the man Irenæus. So, if you are looking for the Truth concerning the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, the Antichrist, and End Times Bible Prophecy, you might want to pay attention to what Irenæus has to say.



Irenæus Explains What He Knew About the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist
If you want to know the Truth concerning what Jesus and the Apostles taught in regard to the Book of Revelation, the Book of Daniel, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist, you can’t find a better source than Irenæus. He sat at the feet of one of the most revered martyrs of the second-century Church, a man named Polycarp, who was Bishop of the local church at Smyrna. Polycarp was not only one of the Apostle John’s most well-known disciples; he was also burned at the stake for his unwavering belief in the things the Apostle John taught him. So he was not the sort of person who would have distorted the Truth he learned from John when he taught those things to his own disciples, one of whom was Irenæus.

Not only did Irenæus learn the Truth about the Antichrist, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the meaning of the Book of Daniel and the Book of Revelation from Polycarp, he also “wrote the book” on what it meant to be a Christian in his day. Sometime around A.D. 185, he sat down and wrote a five-volume work titled “Against Heresies,” in which he clearly stated what one had to believe to be a Christian. That’s where he explained what he knew about the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist. So, if you claim to be a “Christian,” you might want to think twice before you contradict what he wrote.

Irenæus’ monumental work is still available in theological libraries around the world today, but most theological students never bother to read it; and those who do aren’t all that interested in what he has to say anyway. The fact is, most who have a go at reading “Against Heresies” probably find the first few volumes so boring that they stop reading before they get a really good start. That’s a shame, because they never get to the really good part. The first three volumes of “Against Heresies” are just about as dry as a bone; but the fourth volume gets a bit more interesting, and the fifth volume will absolutely knock your socks off.



A Second “Witness” Confirms What Irenæus Says About the Book of Daniel, the Book of Revelation, End Times Bible Prophecy, and the Antichrist


http://www.voiceofelijah.org/freeoffer/google/prophecy.html?gclid=COrF5peXlZICFRI0awodvgWq-Q

Christina, what little I could find of what he wrote, seems very good. He believed that the 42 months, and 1260 days were speaking of the second half of the 70th week; exactly what John tells us.

Coop
 

Christina

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lecoop said:
Christina said:
I follow the Bible in case niether one of you can read Satan and his locust army are here 5 months He says it twice for emphasis in Rev 9 maybe you two should check it out we call it the Word of God ... You cant prove me wrong in scripture ...go ahead try be my guest if you two think your so good prove me wrong .... Or maybe you think personal attacks makes you a real man of God Stephen .... Thats pretty much the norm when you got nothing to back you but opinions

[sup]5[/sup]And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man
[sup]10[/sup]And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months.
[sup]11[/sup]And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

Either one of you want to tell me who their king is? and who Abaddon

That is five months out of the first half of the week. All the trumpets are sounded in the first half of the week, except the 7th which marks the exact midpoint. We can discuss this if you choose. It really is what the author is telling us. In fact, just for fun, if each of the first 6 trumpets took 5 months, and there was a two month reprieve before the next, then 6 (trumpets) times 7 (months) equals 42 months. Hmmm. That makes up one half of the week. I am not saying this is the way it will happen, just the way it could happen. The abomination will be taking place on earth, as the 7th trumpet is sounded in heaven.

Their king is the destroyer, who is Satan.

Coop


Ok Lecoop I'll play along, lets assume you are right, now look at the scripture, we agree this king is Satan and this is his army

5And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man

So Satan and his army are tormenting Christians five months but lets look at hoe he comes in
Antichrist (Satan) FIRST ACT WILL BE TO RESTORE THE ONE WORLD SYSTEM THAT MEN HAVE FAILED AT HE WILL FIX ALL THAT IS AILING US HE WILL HEAL THE DEADLY WOUND
Daniel 11:21 "And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceable, and obtain the kingdom by flattery's."

Daniel 11:24 "He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done, nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: year, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time."

No WAR.... NO KILLING ...NO CHOAS..no torment

So tell me what is he going to be doing the last half of the tribulation ?

He only can torment for 5 months



ps thanks for least caring enough to take a look at Irenæus says I think you would enjoy the book at the link its safe and free
 

Guestman

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Armageddon (Hebrew Har–Ma·ged´on, meaning "Mountain of Megiddo”), as expressed at Revelation 16:16, is "the war of the great day of God the Almighty," whereby "expressions inspired by demons and perform signs....go forth to the kings of the entire inhabited earth, to gather them together" to this war. The term applies specifically to the condition, or situation, and not to a location, to which “the kings of the entire inhabited earth” are gathered in opposition to Jehovah God and his Kingdom by Jesus Christ.

There does not appear to have been a literal place called “Mountain of Megiddo,” either inside or outside the Promised Land, before or during the days of the apostle John, who recorded the vision. Hence, Har–Magedon evidently draws its significance from the events associated with the ancient city of Megiddo, such as when Judge Barak of Israel was commanded by God to station 10,000 men on Mount Tabor against General Sisera of the Canaanite army, but were woefully underequipped. “A shield could not be seen, nor a lance” among them.(Judges 5:8)

Sisera had the very latest in military technology: “Nine hundred war chariots with iron scythes.”(Judges 4:3) These gave the Canaanites the edge in speed and maneuverability and also an enormous psychological advantage. Though Sisera had vastly superior troops, victory was not through military prowess and equipment. Sisera was lured into the then-dry torrent valley of Kishon. God then gave Barak the signal to descend into the valley plain. But then, unexpectedly, God caused a thunderstorm, in which the Kishon River valley was turned into a raging torrent, completely immobilizing Sisera’s war chariots in a sea of mud. Now thrown into confusion, Sisera’s troops fled in terror, only to be pursued and executed, whereby “not as much as one remained.”(Judges 4:16)

However, the hostile peoples surrounding Israel quickly forgot this disastrous encounter. Only 47 years later a combination of nations under the lead of Midian “gathered together as one and proceeded to . . . camp in the low plain of Jezreel,” the valley extending from Megiddo. (Judges 6:33) These encamped enemies were “as numerous as locusts.” This time, however, the army of Israel was only a small but courageous band of 300 men, standing “all around the camp” under the leadership of Gideon. At a signal, the 300 blew horns, loudly smashed water jars, waved torches, and let out a terrifying war cry: “Jehovah’s sword and Gideon’s!” The Midianites panicked! “ God proceeded to set the sword of each one against the other,” and Gideon’s tiny band completed the rout ! (Judges, chapter 7)

Some 12 times the Bible speaks of this ancient battle site. Further, Bible prophecy indicates that what took place at Megiddo has serious implications for our day, at the battle or “war of the great day of God the Almighty”, called Armageddon.

“The war of the great day of God the Almighty” at Har–Magedon was not some past event but is depicted in Revelation as future from the time of John’s vision. The gathering of the kings to Har–Magedon is described as being a result of the pouring out of the sixth of the seven bowls containing the “last” plagues that will bring to a finish the anger of God. (Re 15:1; 16:1, 12) Also, indicating that the war at Har–Magedon is closely associated with Christ’s presence is the warning of his coming as a thief at Matthew 24:42-44, which is placed between verses 14 and 16 of Revelation chapter 16.(Rev 16:15)

This war is seen at Revelation 19, in which Jesus is seen seated on a “white horse”, carrying “on war in righteousness”. Also, “the armies that were in heaven were following him on white horses....And out of his mouth there protrudes a sharp long sword, that he may strike the nations with it. He treads too the winepress of the anger of the wrath of God the Almighty.”(Rev 19:11, 14,15) This war or world situation, results in “the kings of the entire inhabited earth” and their military being annihilated, following the complete desolating and “burning” of the world-wide false religious empire, Babylon the Great.(Rev 18:8)
 

lecoop

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Ok Lecoop I'll play along, lets assume you are right, now look at the scripture,  we agree this king is Satan and this is his army

5And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man

So Satan and his army are tormenting Christians five months but lets look at hoe he comes in
Antichrist (Satan) FIRST ACT WILL BE TO RESTORE THE ONE WORLD SYSTEM THAT MEN HAVE FAILED AT HE WILL FIX ALL THAT IS AILING US HE WILL HEAL THE DEADLY WOUND
Daniel 11:21 "And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceable, and obtain the kingdom by flattery's."

Daniel 11:24 "He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done, nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: year, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time."

No WAR.... NO KILLING ...NO CHOAS..no torment

So tell me what is he going to be doing the last half of the tribulation ?

He only can torment for 5 months



ps thanks for least caring enough to take a look at Irenæus says I think you would enjoy the book at the link its safe and free


Christina,

Daniel 11 takes some serious study. There are several "kings of the North" and several "kings of the South" being written about here. Several verses are written about Antiochus Epiphanes. I don't think Daniel leaves off with Antiochus, and starts speaking of the beast of Revelation until verse 36. It is only in 35 that Daniel writes "the time of the end."

Next, you are confusing Satan with the man of sin - the beast of Revelation. Satan will not enter him until right at the midpoint when he is cast down from the heavenlies. Trumpet 5 is before the abomination and before the midpoint.

Coop
 

Christina

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Well thats a misconception on your part Coop lets start with learning the names of Satan if your are going to post about him you need to know his names If you think all these are differnt people theres no sense discussing this
they are all the same man of lawlessness , Devil Son of Perdition,dragon ... Their is only one Anichrist it is Satan that man of sin son of lawness
and he comes first claiming to be christ. And that exactly who Daniel is taking about. there is no human that is possed ... a fiction of men there is
Only Satan and his fallen angels The man is Satan God even calls him a man but first you have to learn his names so you can see what God is saying


Names of Satan

The Bible calls Satan by many different names. Each name has a slightly different meaning. The many other names for Satan give a fuller picture of who Satan is and what he does. There are more names for Satan in the Bible than for anyone else except Jesus Christ.

Abaddon
Hebrew name for Satan meaning “Destruction”. “And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon.” Revelation 9:11

Accuser
“Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, ‘Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down.’” Revelation 12:10

Adversary
“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.” 1 Peter 5:8

Angel of light
“And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.” 2 Corinthians 11:14

Angel of the bottomless pit
“And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon.” Revelation 9:11

Anointed covering cherub
"You were the anointed cherub who covers; I established you; You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones." Ezekiel 28:14

Antichrist
“And every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.” 1 John 4:3

Apollyon
Greek name for Satan meaning “Destroyer”. “And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon.” Revelation 9:11

Beast
“9 Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, ‘If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.’” Revelation 14:9,10 Who is the beast?

Beelzebub
“Now when the Pharisees heard it they said, ‘This fellow does not cast out demons except by Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.’” Matthew 12:24

Belial
“And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever?” 2 Corinthians 6:15

Deceiver
“So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:9

Devil
“He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.” 1 John 3:8

Dragon
“So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:9

Enemy
“The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.” Matthew 13:39

Evil one
“I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one.” John 17:15

Father of lies
“You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.” John 8:44

God of this age
“Whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.” 2 Corinthians 4:4

King of Babylon
“That you will take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say: ‘How the oppressor has ceased, The golden city ceased!’” Isaiah 14:4

King of the bottomless pit
“And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon.” Revelation 9:11

King of Tyre
"Son of man, take up a lamentation for the king of Tyre, and say to him, 'Thus says the Lord GOD: "You were the seal of perfection, Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.”’” Ezekiel 28:12

Lawless one
“8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.” 2 Thessalonians 2:8-10

Leviathan
“In that day the LORD with His severe sword, great and strong,
Will punish Leviathan the fleeing serpent,
Leviathan that twisted serpent;
And He will slay the reptile that is in the sea.” Isaiah 27:1

Liar
“You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.” John 8:44

Little horn
“ 9 And out of one of them came a little horn which grew exceedingly great toward the south, toward the east, and toward the Glorious Land. 10 And it grew up to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground, and trampled them. 11 He even exalted himself as high as the Prince of the host; and by him the daily sacrifices were taken away, and the place of His sanctuary was cast down.” Daniel 8:9-11

Lucifer
"12 How you are fallen from heaven,
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!
13 For you have said in your heart:
'I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.'” Isaiah 14:12-14

Man of sin “3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.” 2 Thessalonians 2:3,4

Murderer
“44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.” John 8:44

Power of darkness
“13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.” Colossians 1:13, 14

Prince of the power of the air
“1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience.” Ephesians 2:1,2

Roaring lion
“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.” 1 Peter 5:8

Rulers of the darkness
“For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.” Ephesians 6:12

Ruler of demons
“But some of them said, ‘He casts out demons by Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.’” Luke 11:15

Ruler of this world
“31 Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. 32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself.” John 12:31,32

Satan
“And He was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted by Satan, and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered to Him.” Mark 1:13

Serpent of old
“So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:9

Son of perdition “3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.” 2 Thessalonians 2:3,4

Star
“Then the fifth angel sounded: And I saw a star fallen from heaven to the earth. To him was given the key to the bottomless pit.” Revelation 9:1

Tempter
“Now when the tempter came to Him, he said, ‘If You are the Son of God, command that these stones become bread.’” Matthew 4:3

Thief
“The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.” John 10:10

Wicked one
“Above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one.” Ephesians 6:16

This list of names for Satan has been taken from the New King James Version of the Bible.

There may be other names for Satan in the Bible. Please send me an email if you know of a name for Satan that I have missed.

Very soon Satan will leave the spirit world that he has lived in for thousands of years. He will become visible to us and will claim that he is God. The Bible calls him the beast.

http://www.markbeast.com/satan/names-of-satan.htm
 

Irish

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Megiddo was the economic center of trade back then, more valuable to the world than Jerusalem and many other cities. Whoever controlled this city controlled the tariff or duty on goods passing through, and this was the most available route. This was the reason for the many wars. This might shed a little light on the reason this word is used here.


Irish
 

Samuel Pickens

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Armageddon --------- basically, this site was the first recorded battle and will be the last. Its theater is a perfect setting for a battle field.

Kind of placing it in western Iraq, NE Isreal, SW Jordan, SE Syria; so a focal point. With China having a 2mm man army poised at Cashmere and nutso Iran and all the oil in Iraq with Russia, China and USA like wolves -- it's a caldron.


When? Some expect it 2011 or 2012 or ?????????????