Spotting the Heretic

Josho said:

Some believe that they are Christian just because they were born to Christian parents. I also saw the other day on Compass an Aussie program on TV, this episode was about the history of Sunday School in Australia, parents used to drop their kids at Sunday School in the 60s, then drive off.

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Ha!
Here in Italy they're still doing it.
And complaining as they drive off because they had more important things to do.
I used to teach catechism in the Catholic Church till a few years ago...
some parents even complained to their children!
Then we wonder why the church is dying....and Christianity.

Candidus said:

Appropriately in the "Spotting Heresy" thread!

I see it! I see it!

Faith in your heresy is not faith in Christ!

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Cool yes. (when truth is known and seen and practiced properly). It seems demon-driven ambition may often talk more about heretics, and try to expose true believers as heretics, as more heretics feel more comfortable and less guilty (though they are obviously guilty, obvious to others that is) .. less guilty when they are harping on other heresies and other heretics and drawing attention/focus away from their own heresy. This seems common anyway.

Oh, in truth, there are heresies exposed daily. Scripture reveals authoritatively God's Knowledge and Purpose and Plan concerning heresies and what to do about them. But it is not known usually - maybe because heresy is so common ?
Or most people do not care to know? They don't want to be bothered ? And so few are able to recognize this ?

Josho said:

parents used to drop their kids at Sunday School in the 60s, then drive off.

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For decades in the USA, this was often done also, and still is.

And how is one to determine what is heresy except by comparing the doctrine in question to God's word?

To @mjrhealth and all.

justbyfaith said:

And how is one to determine what is heresy except by comparing the doctrine in question to God's word?

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HOW did JESUS SAY, Simon barjona KNEW Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, Son of the Living God ?

Joseph77 said:

HOW did JESUS SAY, Simon barjona KNEW Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, Son of the Living God ?

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What I'm saying is that a man may believe that he has a subjective experience that tells him sound doctrine; but if the doctrine in question is contrary to the word of the Lord, it is not sound doctrine.

Because God is not going to contradict Himself.

He has given His revelation of Himself in holy scripture; and He has magnified His word above all His name (Psalms 138:2).

He has even bound Himself to His word: He has said that this is me...my word is the exact reflection of who I say I am; and I eill not depart from it (see Malachi 3:6, Hebrews 13:8).

justbyfaith said:

What I'm saying is that a man may believe that he has a subjective experience that tells him sound doctrine; but if the doctrine in question is contrary to the word of the Lord, it is not sound doctrine.

Because God is not going to contradict Himself.

He has given His revelation of Himself in holy scripture; and He has magnified His word above all His name (Psalms 138:2).

He has even bound Himself to His word: He has said that this is me...my word is the exact reflection of who I say I am; and I eill not depart from it (see Malachi 3:6, Hebrews 13:8).

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But I think you missed the point of what Jesus said/ says/ >
It was not by power nor by might,
it was not by study nor by Scripture,
it was not by reading or some school nor human man nor human means at all,

but the Father Almighty Himself REVEALED to Simon barjona that Jesus IS THE MESSIAH....

Not at all by flesh and blood, nor human activity nor human effort nor human means....

This is not at all about subjective experiences of men anywhere, nor of so-called "sound doctrine" at all , per se...
Not even "doctrine", no.

Absolute Truth , revealed by ABBA ALMIGHTY, as HE PLEASES -
JESUS SAYS it is HIS GOOD PLEASURE SO TO DO.

Joseph77 said:

But I think you missed the point of what Jesus said/ says/ >
It was not by power nor by might,
it was not by study nor by Scripture,
it was not by reading or some school nor human man nor human means at all,

but the Father Almighty Himself REVEALED to Simon barjona that Jesus IS THE MESSIAH....

Not at all by flesh and blood, nor human activity nor human effort nor human means....

This is not at all about subjective experiences of men anywhere, nor of so-called "sound doctrine" at all , per se...
Not even "doctrine", no.

Absolute Truth , revealed by ABBA ALMIGHTY, as HE PLEASES -
JESUS SAYS it is HIS GOOD PLEASURE SO TO DO.

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While it was while reading Scripture that God revealed Himself to me, it was not brilliant prose, magnificent doctrine, or what I read before this that moved me so deeply. I read John chapter 1 and was unconvinced and unmoved. But the simple story of Jesus turning water into wine, while no deep theological salvation passage, abruptly rang true. At that moment I knew that God existed, that Jesus was the Messiah. I did not really understand what it all meant, but everything moved from being some moral fable to being Divine truth in an instant.

Joseph77 said:

But I think you missed the point of what Jesus said/ says/ >
It was not by power nor by might,
it was not by study nor by Scripture,
it was not by reading or some school nor human man nor human means at all,

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Where does He say that?

We must test the spirits to see whether they are of God; and the best way to do that is to test what they say to you by the word of God.

The Bible is the plumb line by which we determine all other things.

Even Peter, in understanding that Jesus was the Messiah, had biblical substantiation for such an idea.

In Jeremiah 9, the timeline indicating the coming of Messiah was clearly laid out; and there was an expectation in Peter's time (because of holy scripture) that Messiah would be coming at that time in history.

Before I reference this, be for real here >>> did you really not ever read this ? It is Jesus Own Words; (It is plainly written in English in all the English Bibles)

justbyfaith said:

Where does He say that?

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justbyfaith said:

Even Peter, in understanding that Jesus was the Messiah, had biblical substantiation for such an idea.

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Note: it is not AN IDEA.

Note: EVERYONE on earth has BIBLICAL SUBSTANTIATION that JESUS IS THE MESSIAH, SON OF THE LIVING GOD.

Note: Few ever repent, few ever follow Jesus, few get saved.

Note: Thus , Biblical Substantiation is (for most of the world) a man-made device , maybe substitute, for TRUTH. Maybe denying God's Power.

Joseph77 said:

But I think you missed the point of what Jesus said/ says/ >
It was not by power nor by might,
it was not by study nor by Scripture,
it was not by reading or some school nor human man nor human means at all,

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justbyfaith said:

Where does He say that?

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Joseph77 said:

Before I reference this, be for real here >>> did you really not ever read this ? It is Jesus Own Words; (It is plainly written in English in all the English Bibles)

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I mean, Where does He say all of that?

Yes, I want you to reference it.

QUOTE=
"GodsGrace ]How does one not follow Jesus but be Christian? (1)
I'd say that lots of persons think they're Christian but are not. (2)
Maybe this is what you're talking about but in a "Poetic" way. (3)
If so, then I agree. (4)

Which brings up an interesting point... (5)
If this is what you've been taught, (6)
one one is doing their best.... (7)
are they saved? (8)
Maybe they don't know any better? (9)
I think that amongst these persons,,,surely some must be saved. (10)
[/QUOTE
===============================================
(1) Easy Peasy: just join any church that is willing to call you Christian.
(2) True
(3) I don't know.
(4) I doubt it.
(5) Really ?
(6) What someone is taught has no bearing on what is Truth and what is not Truth.
(7) Doing their best never saved anyone. Often it may be the reason they stay condemned for their unbelief.
(8) God Knows. (remember, no one is saved at all by "doing their best"! Only by Trusting the Father and Jesus.
(9) Doesn't matter if they don't know any better or not - whoever Trusts Jesus Has Life. whoever Trusts not Jesus has not Life. God's Word will not change , nor will His Judgment change, for any excuse given.
(10) God Knows Perfectly Who Trusts Him, and Who Does Not Trust Him. He Has Always Known Who Is Saved and Who is Not Saved. He Is God, and not a man, that He Could Lie.

Someone with a nominal, lukewarm, or shallow, faith, can fall away (Luke 8:13) thus losing their salvation.

Someone with a heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and enduring to the end (Matthew 10:22, Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14) has everlasting life; and thus cannot lose their salvation; since their life can never have an end; being everlasting life (John 6:47).

Behold said:

God has already saved you, and all your sin is redeemed.
So, if you tell God you are sorry that you sinned, and your sin is already forgiven, you are not cleansing your own sin, as you seem to think you do.

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Such a thing restores fellowship, relationship, connectedness.