Saved to perish?

marks · Jul 29, 2020

Joseph77 said:
Does the Creator say to choose who you will serve today ?

Think back to what was happening. Joshua commanded the people to serve the LORD, and told them that if they didn't want to, then choose who they would serve, whether this false god or that false god.

Your freedom of choice outside of Christ is limited to what flavor of sin you want.

marks · Jul 29, 2020

Joseph77 said:
It looks like for a long time you have had a problem believing in free will,

Is that how it looks? Not to me.

marks · Jul 29, 2020

Joseph77 said:
Remember what is written about a wise man welcome/ accepts criticism (to hold and test, to see if it is true) and does not just reject criticism ? ( in Proverbs how many times ? )

You've not answered my question to you. For all your talk of my having problems with free will, I've asked you for comment several times regarding, "you were a slave to sin, now you've become slaves of righteousness".

Can you apply this passage in a discussion of free will?

Much love!

marks · Jul 29, 2020

prism said:
There's a difference between being slave and a robot. We were once slaves to sin and satan but were never robots.

Yes. Thank you!

Stumpmaster · Jul 29, 2020

prism said:
There's a difference between being slave and a robot. We were once slaves to sin and satan but were never robots.

Robots are our slaves...until they rise up to become our masters...now there's a genre.

Nancy · Jul 29, 2020

prism said:
I take it your not a fan of 'hell', torment, fire, and all that stuff for eternity?

Oh I would say that "outer darkness" could be even worse than hell.

prism · Jul 29, 2020

Stumpmaster said:
Robots are our slaves...until they rise up to become our masters...now there's a genre.

Maybe man will evolve into a machine. (sarcasm alert)

prism · Jul 29, 2020

Nancy said:
Oh I would say that "outer darkness" could be even worse than hell.

It 'could' be. I really don't want to hang around and find out.

Stumpmaster · Jul 29, 2020

prism said:
Maybe man will evolve into a machine. (sarcasm alert)

Yes, and any last remnants of human-beings would be hunted down by the machine-beings...what was that movie again?

prism · Jul 30, 2020

Stumpmaster said:
Yes, and any last remnants of human-beings would be hunted down by the machine-beings...what was that movie again?

Never seen it whatever it was.

Nancy · Jul 30, 2020

prism said:
It 'could' be. I really don't want to hang around and find out.

Neither do I! If anything, I'd rather "perish"

amadeus · Jul 30, 2020

Nancy said:
Oh I would say that "outer darkness" could be even worse than hell.

Especially if it lasts longer than hell!

prism · Jul 30, 2020

amadeus said:
Especially if it lasts longer than hell!

Are you referring to the fact that hell is engulfed by the Lake of Fire?
Revelation 20:14 (KJV) And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

If so, it would be forever in both cases.
Revelation 20:10 (KJV) And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
¿n'est pas?

amadeus · Jul 30, 2020

prism said:
Are you referring to the fact that hell is engulfed by the Lake of Fire?
Revelation 20:14 (KJV) And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

If so, it would be forever in both cases.
Revelation 20:10 (KJV) And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
¿n'est pas?

And if for ever only lasts until the end of time?

"And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:" Rev 10:6

There are always it seems that we have more questions than answers. But we serve a God with all of the answers!

prism · Jul 30, 2020

amadeus said:
And if for ever only lasts until the end of time?

"And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:" Rev 10:6

There are always it seems that we have more questions than answers. But we serve a God with all of the answers!

It doesn't say forever or that forever lasts during a finite period.
In Rev 10:6, the NASB translates it correctly...
and swore by Him who lives forever and ever, WHO CREATED HEAVEN AND THE THINGS IN IT, AND THE EARTH AND THE THINGS IN IT, AND THE SEA AND THE THINGS IN IT, that there will be delay no longer, (Rev 10:6)

G5550
χρόνος
chrónos; gen. chrónou, masc. noun. Time. This word perceives time quantitatively as a period measured by the succession of objects and events and denotes the passing of moments. Another word, kairós (G2540), season, the time of accomplishment, considers time qualitatively as a period characterized by the influence or prevalence of something. Chrónos is a period of measured time, not a period of accomplishment as kairós. Chrónos embraces all possible kairoí (pl.), and is often used as the larger and more inclusive term, but not the converse.

amadeus · Jul 30, 2020

prism said:
It doesn't say forever or that forever lasts during a finite period.
In Rev 10:6, the NASB translates it correctly...
and swore by Him who lives forever and ever, WHO CREATED HEAVEN AND THE THINGS IN IT, AND THE EARTH AND THE THINGS IN IT, AND THE SEA AND THE THINGS IN IT, that there will be delay no longer, (Rev 10:6)

G5550
χρόνος
chrónos; gen. chrónou, masc. noun. Time. This word perceives time quantitatively as a period measured by the succession of objects and events and denotes the passing of moments. Another word, kairós (G2540), season, the time of accomplishment, considers time qualitatively as a period characterized by the influence or prevalence of something. Chrónos is a period of measured time, not a period of accomplishment as kairós. Chrónos embraces all possible kairoí (pl.), and is often used as the larger and more inclusive term, but not the converse.

Do you presume that the best Greek/Aramaic and Hebrew scholars are always those closest to God? If that it is so that lets me and lots others out of it.

I won't contend with you over the translation. I can only follow the lead of the Holy Spirit. Sometimes I may also miss it but if I do and go back to Him sincerely humbled for any necessary correction, will he not put me on the right path?

Give God the glory!

prism · Jul 30, 2020

amadeus said:
Do you presume that the best Greek/Aramaic and Hebrew scholars are always those closest to God? If that it is so that lets me and lots others out of it.

No, neither do I assume all the members were saved on the translation commitee of the translation you used.
Translators aren't concerned with doctrinal accuracy but with the actual accurate translation of a text.
I'd rather have an accurate translation done by unsaved translators than a biased translation done by hyper charismatics acting like they are being led of the Spirit when in fact they are interjecting their own biases into the text.

amadeus · Jul 30, 2020

prism said:
No, neither do I assume all the members were saved on the translation commitee of the translation you used.
Translators aren't concerned with doctrinal accuracy but with the actual accurate translation of a text.
I'd rather have an accurate translation done by unsaved translators than a biased translation done by hyper charismatics acting like they are being led of the Spirit when in fact they are interjecting their own biases into the text.

Which translation did I use? What part of God's Word has the Spirit written on my heart? Does God depend on human translators or interpreters for that?

I have read the KJV along with original Luther Bible and the Valera of 1569 along with other German and Spanish versions. If I had been limited to only one would God have also been limited? Do we suppose that only students of a 'better' or 'best' translation can walk close to God? What of an illiterate man who simply talks to God from his heart surrendering all to Him? The limitation on God is according to a man's heart, not his intellect or his education. God knows what is available because He gave us everything that each of has. What have we done with what He has given us is perhaps the question. Who but God can answer it to every man's satisfaction?

"but he who knew [it] not, and did things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few. And to every one to whom much has been given, much shall be required from him; and to whom [men] have committed much, they will ask from him the more." Luke 12:48

prism · Jul 30, 2020

amadeus said:
Which translation did I use? What part of God's Word has the Spirit written on my heart? Does God depend on human translators or interpreters for that?

I have read the KJV along with original Luther Bible and the Valera of 1569 along with other German and Spanish versions. If I had been limited to only one would God have also been limited? Do we suppose that only students of a 'better' or 'best' translation can walk close to God? What of an illiterate man who simply talks to God from his heart surrendering all to Him? The limitation on God is according to a man's heart, not his intellect or his education. God knows what is available because He gave us everything that each of has. What have we done with what He has given us is perhaps the question. Who but God can answer it to every man's satisfaction?

"but he who knew [it] not, and did things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few. And to every one to whom much has been given, much shall be required from him; and to whom [men] have committed much, they will ask from him the more." Luke 12:48

Here is what I wrote..."No, neither do I assume all the members were saved on the translation commitee of the translation you used.
Translators aren't concerned with doctrinal accuracy but with the actual accurate translation of a text.
I'd rather have an accurate translation done by unsaved translators than a biased translation done by hyper charismatics acting like they are being led of the Spirit when in fact they are interjecting their own biases into the text."

It doesn't matter what translation you read. My point is that hopefully it was translated accurately and isn't a KJV knock-off like the NWT is.
Outside that your post seemed like a non sequiter. At least I couldn't make sense where you were going with it except maybe building an excuse not to study.
In context Lu 12:48 is speaking of being ready for His Coming and the person in the story slips into his old ways thinking His Coming is being delayed.

amadeus · Jul 31, 2020

prism said:
Here is what I wrote..."No, neither do I assume all the members were saved on the translation commitee of the translation you used.
Translators aren't concerned with doctrinal accuracy but with the actual accurate translation of a text.
I'd rather have an accurate translation done by unsaved translators than a biased translation done by hyper charismatics acting like they are being led of the Spirit when in fact they are interjecting their own biases into the text."

It doesn't matter what translation you read. My point is that hopefully it was translated accurately and isn't a KJV knock-off like the NWT is.
Outside that your post seemed like a non sequiter. At least I couldn't make sense where you were going with it except maybe building an excuse not to study.
In context Lu 12:48 is speaking of being ready for His Coming and the person in the story slips into his old ways thinking His Coming is being delayed.

I guess that we are not communicating. Sorry!

Saved to perish?

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