Grace vs Legalism

101G · Aug 3, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
Again, just like 1 John 1:6, 8 and 10, the person struggling in Romans 7:14-25, is still in the flesh, the carnal nature of sin and death, and does not know Christ. But just as you don't know how 1 John 1:9 FREES you from all the sin of the person in 1 John 1:8, neither do you know how Romans 8:2 shows you that the LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST, HAS FREED ME FROM THE LAW OF SIN AND DEATH, which mindset you have chosen to only relate to in Romans 7. What do you do? Just pick and choose scriptures that suit your character and read no further? That is called a justification for sin. Just like your flagrant error regarding nature and the body. But what is truly baffling, you don't WANT to learn the Truth that could take you out of the common spiritual ignorance that plagues the Church.

CONTEXT, CONTEXT, CONTEXT!!!!

IOW, those who are struggling with sin need to come to Jesus and be born again of the Spirit. Not everyone who goes to church has done this requirement, though still go to church wanting a Savior, and are part of the congregation of Paul or John, thus the "we" and "I". Just like you are part of the "we." They believe in Jesus as Savior, but NOT as Christ. Do you know the difference? We must receive both. Jesus Christ/Savior and Lord. Because those that only know Jesus as Savior, Christ doesn't know, and will say to them, "depart from me, I never knew you, you workers of wickedness."

First thanks for the reply, second, you still missed the point. listen, 1 Timothy 1:9 "Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,"
do you understand that?, if so then the Law is mute for you because of his RIGHTIOUSNESS, not yours.. BINGO. now sin and DEATH. listen carefully, Romans 7:20 "Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." get it?, which means that BAPTISM by water gave you your DEATH, and dead men don't sin.. did you get that? I guess not. but keep up ... Y O U R ... effort.

now if you respond to this then I know you didn't understand what I said. so.....

PICJAG

Mr C · Aug 3, 2020

Legalism
by Dave Miller, Ph.D.

It may be surprising to some to learn that the term “legalism” does not actually occur in the Bible. However, numerous extrabiblical words have been coined to describe biblical concepts (e.g., “providence”). In its classical, negative usage, “legalism” entails trusting one’s own goodness. Legalism pertains to one’s attitude about his own person (i.e., having an inflated sense of self-importance—Luke 18:11-12; Proverbs 25:27; Romans 12:3) and practice (i.e., thinking he or she can earn or merit salvation on the basis of performance—Luke 17:10; Romans 3:9-18,23; 11:35; 1 Corinthians 9:16). Legalism does not pertain to the propriety of the practices themselves. God always has condemned the person who is proud of his obedient actions, who trusts in his own goodness, and who expects to receive God’s grace on the basis of those actions (cf. Luke 18:9ff.; Romans 9:31ff.). But He always has commended the person who maintains absolute fidelity to the specifics of His commands (e.g., John 14:15; Romans 2:6-7,13; 6:16; Hebrews 5:9). The difference between the former and the latter is the attitude of the individual—a factor that only God is in a position to perceive (Luke 6:8). How presumptuous it is for one Christian to denounce another Christian simply on the basis that the latter exhibits meticulous loyalty to God’s Word—as if the former is able automatically to know his brother’s motive, and thus somehow read his mind. Purveyors of religious error often redefine otherwise good terms, placing their own spin on the word, and thereby subjecting unsuspecting listeners to their false doctrine. Those of a liberal persuasion have redefined “legalism” in such a fashion, shifting the meaning from the attitude of being self-righteous to the action of conscientious obedience to all of God’s Word...

...“Faithfulness” is, by definition, obedient trust or loyal compliance with the stipulations of God’s will (James 2:17-26). “Righteousness” is, by definition, right doing (Acts 10:34-35; 1 John 3:7). Abraham understood this (Genesis 26:5; Hebrews 11:8). Moses understood this (Deuteronomy 4:2; 6:17; 10:12; 11:8,13,22,27-28). Joshua understood this (Joshua 23:6,11; 24:14-15). John understood this (1 John 5:3). So did Paul (Romans 6:16). Indeed, the Bible never pits the grace of God against obedience to God.

Read more here.

Legalism

Enoch111 · Aug 3, 2020

Mr C said:
It may be surprising to some to learn that the term “legalism” does not actually occur in the Bible.

This is true. "Legalism" is generally applied by some Christians to others because the others insist that Christians must have a certain code of conduct and deportment (which is perfectly biblical). Many Christians do not want to be discipled or disciplined, so it it convenient to use this pejorative term.

Going on a strictly biblical basis, legalism applied primarily to the Pharisees, who mistakenly believed that they could be justified by the works of the Law of Moses. As Paul made it perfectly clear justification is purely by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption.

CharismaticLady · Aug 3, 2020

101G said:
First thanks for the reply, second, you still missed the point. listen, 1 Timothy 1:9 "Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,"
do you understand that?, if so then the Law is mute for you because of his RIGHTIOUSNESS, not yours.. BINGO. now sin and DEATH. listen carefully, Romans 7:20 "Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." get it?, which means that BAPTISM by water gave you your DEATH, and dead men don't sin.. did you get that? I guess not. but keep up ... Y O U R ... effort.

now if you respond to this then I know you didn't understand what I said. so.....

PICJAG

Let me see if we are on the same page or not. Do you believe Romans 7:20 you quoted is about a Spirit-filled Christian, or a Jew under the Law of Moses? This will tell me if you are listening or not.

The person in Romans 7:20 has sin dwelling in them, right? How can a person with sin dwelling in them, not sin? You say baptism, but what change can baptism have if there in still sin in them. Why quote multiple verses of Romans 7? And if you are baptized, why do you relate to 1 John 1:8?

I hate to burst your bubble, but what you seem to be saying is heretical. So, let's see if you are meaning what you seem to be saying. Tell me if I am misunderstanding you.

1. You believe that Christians have indwelling sin.

2. Baptism kills us positionally (?). IOW even though we live physically, baptism changes our sins we commit, to non-sins, because we are dead, and the dead don't sin.

3. If a baptized Christian murders or commits adultery, are they sinning, or not sinning?

Have you read Behold? Are you on the same page with him?

justbyfaith · Aug 3, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
I hate to burst your bubble, but what you seem to be saying is heretical.

CharismaticLady said:
Tell me if I am misunderstanding you.

1. You believe that Christians have indwelling sin.

I hate to burst your bubble; but your denial of (1) above puts your doctrine in the realm of heresy.

1 John 1:8 is clear, if "we" say that "we" have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

101G · Aug 4, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
Let me see if we are on the same page or not. Do you believe Romans 7:20 you quoted is about a Spirit-filled Christian, or a Jew under the Law of Moses? This will tell me if you are listening or not.

The person in Romans 7:20 has sin dwelling in them, right? How can a person with sin dwelling in them, not sin? You say baptism, but what change can baptism have if there in still sin in them. Why quote multiple verses of Romans 7? And if you are baptized, why do you relate to 1 John 1:8?

I hate to burst your bubble, but what you seem to be saying is heretical. So, let's see if you are meaning what you seem to be saying. Tell me if I am misunderstanding you.

1. You believe that Christians have indwelling sin.

2. Baptism kills us positionally (?). IOW even though we live physically, baptism changes our sins we commit, to non-sins, because we are dead, and the dead don't sin.

3. If a baptized Christian murders or commits adultery, are they sinning, or not sinning?

Have you read Behold? Are you on the same page with him?

GINOLJC, to all.
#1. Romans 7:20 "Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." do you see it now? if not let us explain in as short of time as we can. I asked you the difference between Sin and iniquity right. do you know the difference. now if you do, then I ask you, do you let sin reign, or rule in your mortal body? of course not. Romans 6:12 "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof."
do you understand now CharismaticLady?. look, sin is in you because it was condemn in your flesh. Romans 8:3 "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:" when you say that you're without sin, as John said YOU LIE, and we all are TEMPTED. now if you know the difference between Sin and iniquity then you can overcome the sin that dwells in YOU. and as for baptism is your proof of a answer to a good conscience toward God. 1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:" YOU DID NOT GET THAT, DID YOU...

did you see what God almighty just did, by putting in a 2, (two), very small OVERLOOKED words which many, yes, overlooked, the word, "also", and "now". as in, "even baptism doth also now save us". see water Baptism not only show your death to GOD, as the Lord JESUS "ALSO", but it "ANSWERS" a GOOD conscience toward God. and if you know the difference between Sin and iniquity, YOU will answer God in that consciousness of GRACE that he has given us.

I'll help you out a little.. ok, Romans 6:12 "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof." BINGO.
Romans 6:13 "Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God." BINGO, oh man this is good stuff here.
Romans 6:14 "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace." MY God how plain can one get.

now lets break this down a bit. verse 12, "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body". let is an act of the will, correct. now where is the will found at? in our consciousness. ...

now what did God say by his chosen apostle Peter? lets check the record. 1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

say what? "the answer of a good conscience toward God?" now what is that? I could tell you, but I'm sure you already KNOW, or at least I hope you know. because this is why WATER BAPTISM is so IMPORTANT, it witness with your conscious.. (smile)... oh how the Lord is such a GREAT teacher to those who have ears to hear. that's why the devil have put it in some hearts to say, "Oh you don't need to be WATER BAPTIZE"... LOL, boy that devil, he's nothing but a deciever. see, Baptism is a powerful .... "WITNESS", and without power, the devil will rule in your life. that's why I know that John the Baptist who Baptized with WATER is one of the TWO WITNESS, and his Water baptism is still witnessing ... TODAY. just as the apostle Peter wrote, listen, "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us", NOW, NOW, NOW, not just when you first got baptize, but NOW, NOW, NOW, it even SAVE US. as the Lord said again by his chosen apostle Paul, "And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus." Philippians 3:9 - 12 (KJV)

did you hear what the Lord Jesus, God almighty is saying through his choisen apostle? "That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection" and one cannot KNOW the power of his, the Lord Jesus, resurrection until they themselves answer to God in the same GOOD conscience...

so all those who don't believe you have to be WATER BAPTIZED to be ... SAVE, not just delievered, but as the Lord Jesus chosen apostle said, "NOW", present, today, yesterday, and forevermore, are SAVED. are you reading CharismaticLady? oh if I had the time to edify you in this knowledge.

we suggest you re-read Romans the whole book and 1st. and 2nd Peter also. and maybe this post....

PICJAG.

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

Mr C said:
Legalism
by Dave Miller, Ph.D.

...“Faithfulness” is, by definition, obedient trust or loyal compliance with the stipulations of God’s will (James 2:17-26). “Righteousness” is, by definition, right doin

You posted one more heretic who has a PH.D.
He is a devout Legalst, a self savor, and a Cross denying fool.
We are not "righteous" based on our obedience, as this bible rejector teaches.
We are MADE RIGHTEOUS, by God's CROSS and Jesus's BLOOD, as Paul teaches, and as God OFFERS as "justification BY Faith". = "THe Gift of Righteousness".

CharismaticLady · Aug 4, 2020

101G said:
GINOLJC, to all.
#1. Romans 7:20 "Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." do you see it now? if not let us explain in as short of time as we can. I asked you the difference between Sin and iniquity right. do you know the difference. now if you do, then I ask you, do you let sin reign, or rule in your mortal body? of course not. Romans 6:12 "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof."
do you understand now CharismaticLady?. look, sin is in you because it was condemn in your flesh. Romans 8:3 "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:" when you say that you're without sin, as John said YOU LIE, and we all are TEMPTED. now if you know the difference between Sin and iniquity then you can overcome the sin that dwells in YOU. and as for baptism is your proof of a answer to a good conscience toward God. 1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:" YOU DID NOT GET THAT, DID YOU... did you see what God almighty just did, by putting in a 2, (two), very small OVERLOOKED words which many, yes, overlooked, the word, "also", and "now". as in, "even baptism doth also now save us". see water Baptism not only show your death to GOD, as the Lord JESUS "ALSO", but it "ANSWERS" a GOOD conscience toward God. and if you know the difference between Sin and iniquity, YOU will answer God in that consciousness of GRACE that he has given us.

I'll help you out a little.. ok, Romans 6:12 "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof." BINGO.
Romans 6:13 "Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God." BINGO, oh man this is good stuff here.
Romans 6:14 "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace." MY God how plain can one get.

now lets break this down a bit. verse 12, "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body". let is an act of the will, correct. now where is the will found at? in our consciousness. ... now what did God say by his chosen apostle Peter? lets check the record. 1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

say what? "the answer of a good conscience toward God?" now what is that? I could tell you, but I'm sure you already KNOW, or at least I hope you know. because this is why WATER BAPTISM is so IMPORTANT, it witness with your conscious.. (smile)... oh how the Lord is such a GREAT teacher to those who have ears to hear. that's why the devil have put it in some hearts to say, "Oh you don't need to be WATER BAPTIZE"... LOL, boy that devil, he's nothing but a deciever. see, Baptism is a powerful .... "WITNESS", and without power, the devil will rule in your life. that's why I know that John the Baptist who Baptized with WATER is one of the TWO WITNESS, and his Water baptism is still witnessing ... TODAY. just as the apostle Peter wrote, listen, "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us", NOW, NOW, NOW, not just when you first got baptize, but NOW, NOW, NOW, it even SAVE US. as the Lord said again by his chosen apostle Paul, "And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus." Philippians 3:9 - 12 (KJV)

did you hear what the Lord Jesus, God almighty is saying through his choisen apostle? "That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection" and one cannot KNOW the power of his, the Lord Jesus, resurrection until they themselves answer to God in the same GOOD conscience...

so all those who don't believe you have to be WATER BAPTIZED to be ... SAVE, not just delievered, but as the Lord Jesus chosen apostle said, "NOW", present, today, yesterday, and forevermore, are SAVED. are you reading CharismaticLady? oh if I had the time to edify you in this knowledge.

we suggest you re-read Romans the whole book and 1st. and 2nd Peter also. and maybe this post....

PICJAG.

You still didn't give a straight answer to my questions. But it did prove one thing; you don't read nor understand my posts so don't reply; let's just stop right here.

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
3. If a baptized Christian murders or commits adultery, are they sinning, or not sinning?

Have you read Behold? Are you on the same page with him?

I certainly hope he is reading me..

So, let me answer your question...
"if charismatic lady kills her mother, has she sinned".

A.) No.

"but behold, how can i kill my mother and it not be SIN".......

Its like this reader.....
God sees NOT the Flesh. = FINAL ANSWER.

Your flesh, (if you are born again)< is your "old man".. Its the part of you that is NOT the "new Creation, In Christ".
This part of you is "DEAD", in God's View.
He does not see it, because God dwells as A Spirit, and God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL
This means, ... that even tho, your born again Spirit is IN your body, it has been separated by God's spiritual circumcision, into the NEW Creation. Colossians 2:11

So, the New Creation, is you as the born again Spirit.
Your body, is going to die, it is your flesh, and it is not recognized by God.
God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL , born again....REAL YOU, that will get a NEW BODY.
God does not recognize your OLD BODY that is crucified with Christ and you are to reckon it as DEAD. Romans 6:11

So, when a bible twister like charismaticlady is trying to get you to SEE YOURSELF as your DEAD non born again Flesh, she is misleading you deceptively, as she is denying Romans 6:11, and instead defining you as your flesh, which is Not how God sees you.
God only sees you as the Born again "SINLESS" , and never does He See you as the "flesh" that can commit works of the flesh, or "sin" as charismaticlady will define it.

CharismaticLady · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
I certainly hope he is reading me..

So, let me answer your question...
"if charismatic lady kills her mother, has she sinned".

A.) No.

"but behold, how can i kill my mother and it not be SIN".......

Its like this reader.....
God sees NOT the Flesh. = FINAL ANSWER.

Your flesh, (if you are born again)< is your "old man".. Its the part of you that is NOT the "new Creation, In Christ".
This part of you is "DEAD", in God's View.
He does not see it, because God dwells as A Spirit, and God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL
This means, ... that even tho, your born again Spirit is IN your body, it has been separated by God's spiritual circumcision, into the NEW Creation. Colossians 2:11

So, the New Creation, is you as the born again Spirit.
Your body, is going to die, it is your flesh, and it is not recognized by God.
God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL , born again....REAL YOU, that will get a NEW BODY.
God does not recognize your OLD BODY that is crucified with Christ and you are to reckon it as DEAD. Romans 6:11

So, when a bible twister like charismaticlady is trying to get you to SEE YOURSELF as your DEAD non born again Flesh, she is misleading you deceptively, as she is denying Romas 6:11, and instead defining you as your flesh, which is Not how God sees you.
God only sees you as the Born again "SINLESS" , and never does He See you as the "flesh" that can commit works of the flesh, or "sin" as charismaticlady will define it.

You two are the blind leading the blind.

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
You two are the blind leading the blind.

Well hello United Church of God....

God sees NOT the Flesh. = FINAL ANSWER.

Your flesh, (if you are born again)< is your "old man".. Its the part of you that is NOT the "new Creation, In Christ".
This part of you is "DEAD", in God's View.
He does not see it, because God dwells as A Spirit, and God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL
This means, ... that even tho, your born again Spirit is IN your body, it has been separated by God's spiritual circumcision, into the NEW Creation. Colossians 2:11

So, the New Creation, is you as the born again Spirit.
Your body, is going to die, it is your flesh, and it is not recognized by God.
God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL , born again....REAL YOU, that will get a NEW BODY.
God does not recognize your OLD BODY that is crucified with Christ and you are to reckon it as DEAD. Romans 6:11

So, when a bible twister like charismaticlady is trying to get you to SEE YOURSELF as your DEAD non born again Flesh, she is misleading you deceptively, as she is denying Romans 6:11, and instead defining you as your flesh, which is Not how God sees you.
God only sees you as the Born again "SINLESS" , and never does He See you as the "flesh" that can commit works of the flesh, or "sin" as charismaticlady will define it.

Mr C · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
You posted one more heretic who has a PH.D.
He is a devout Legalst, a self savor, and a Cross denying fool.
We are not "righteous" based on our obedience, as this bible rejector teaches.
We are MADE RIGHTEOUS, by God's CROSS and Jesus's BLOOD, as Paul teaches, and as God OFFERS as "justification BY Faith". = "THe Gift of Righteousness".

Ac 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

Mt 7:21 ¶ Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mr 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; (Acts 8:26-40)

Ac 8:35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. 36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

justbyfaith · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
God sees NOT the Flesh. = FINAL ANSWER.

This clearly a gnostic concept.

So, why don't you cite the gnostic document where you got this idea from?

Thread: Hebrews 4:12. (my response).

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

justbyfaith said:
This clearly a gnostic concept.

You see yourself as "flesh", and this is why you say you tell us that you continue to have indwelling sin issues.
So, you have a carnal mindset regarding not being able to realize that you are a "new Creation".

So, when we learn to agree with Paul, we then understand that our Born Again Spirit is our "in Christ" Position as a Son of God.
2 Corinthians 1:21-22
And it is God who establishes us with you in Christ

So, we see that God has established us Spiritually, differently Then we were before we were born again.
You try to continue to think and exist as the dead man, the flesh, with your "indwelling sin" issue.
God does not see your flesh, He sees only the born again that He has established by "new Birth".
This is the part of you that will get the new body, that you can't comprehend.

There is the "dead" part of the believer. This is the part that is DEAD. So, God does not see the DEAD.
You do, because you have no understanding, of even the most basic principle's of regeneration.
You talk and there is no substance.
You see yourself as a teacher, and yet you are only empty words, of pretense.

Listen to Paul.
Learn from Me.

""""""For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God"..."""

You have DIED.
Understand that word, deceiver?
Yet you keep teaching that Paul is a Gnostic, and im teaching Paul.

CharismaticLady · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
Well hello United Church of God....

God sees NOT the Flesh. = FINAL ANSWER.

Your flesh, (if you are born again)< is your "old man".. Its the part of you that is NOT the "new Creation, In Christ".
This part of you is "DEAD", in God's View.
He does not see it, because God dwells as A Spirit, and God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL
This means, ... that even tho, your born again Spirit is IN your body, it has been separated by God's spiritual circumcision, into the NEW Creation. Colossians 2:11

So, the New Creation, is you as the born again Spirit.
Your body, is going to die, it is your flesh, and it is not recognized by God.
God only recognizes the SPIRITUAL , born again....REAL YOU, that will get a NEW BODY.
God does not recognize your OLD BODY that is crucified with Christ and you are to reckon it as DEAD. Romans 6:11

So, when a bible twister like charismaticlady is trying to get you to SEE YOURSELF as your DEAD non born again Flesh, she is misleading you deceptively, as she is denying Romans 6:11, and instead defining you as your flesh, which is Not how God sees you.
God only sees you as the Born again "SINLESS" , and never does He See you as the "flesh" that can commit works of the flesh, or "sin" as charismaticlady will define it.

I am not, nor believe the teachings of the United Church of God. The doctrines I follow are straight from the Bible, and unfortunately no denomination I know of follows them the same way as I do.

CharismaticLady · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
So, let me answer your question...
"if charismatic lady kills her mother, has she sinned".

A.) No.

@marks this is what I'm talking about. So let me ask you who believes he is on the same page as Behold.

I asked if a Spirit-filled Christian commits murder or adultery are they sinning? And Behold said "No!"

Are you really as naive as he is? If you believe sin is no longer sin in a Christian, then you don't believe what I thought you did.

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
I am not, nor believe the teachings of the United Church of God. The doctrines I follow are straight from the Bible, and unfortunately no denomination I know of follows them the same way as I do.

They teach 1Peter exactly as you do.
I quoted them, sent it to you, and its as if you said it...
So, you have a twin out there..

also what is this you are teaching now , that were are to receive "christ" as well as Jesus, or we are not born again..
Where did this come from?
Maroni?
JW's?
Mary Baker Eddy?

CharismaticLady · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
They teach 1Peter exactly as you do.
I quoted them, sent it to you, and its as if you said it...
So, you have a twin out there..

also what is this you are teaching now , that were are to receive "christ" as well as Jesus, or we are not born again..
Where did this come from?
Maroni?
JW's?
Mary Baker Eddy?

None of those. And are you talking about 2 Peter 1? If so, it is well written and easy to understand. I doubt if I'm the only one who understands it. Except, you and 101.

justbyfaith · Aug 4, 2020

Behold said:
You see yourself as "flesh", and this is why you say you tell us that you continue to have indwelling sin issues.
So, you have a carnal mindset regarding not being able to realize that you are a "new Creation".

So, when we learn to agree with Paul, we then understand that our Born Again Spirit is our "in Christ" Position as a Son of God.
2 Corinthians 1:21-22
And it is God who establishes us with you in Christ

So, we see that God has established us Spiritually, differently Then we were before we were born again.
You try to continue to think and exist as the dead man, the flesh, with your "indwelling sin" issue.
God does not see your flesh, He sees only the born again that He has established by "new Birth".
This is the part of you that will get the new body, that you can't comprehend.

There is the "dead" part of the believer. This is the part that is DEAD. So, God does not see the DEAD.
You do, because you have no understanding, of even the most basic principle's of regeneration.
You talk and there is no substance.
You see yourself as a teacher, and yet you are only empty words, of pretense.

Listen to Paul.
Learn from Me.

""""""For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God"..."""

You have DIED.
Understand that word, deceiver?
Yet you keep teaching that Paul is a Gnostic, and im teaching Paul.

Gnosticism teaches that spirit is good and matter is evil; and that therefore what we do in the flesh doesn't matter.

The latter part of this is, in effect, what you appear to be teaching.

Behold · Aug 4, 2020

CharismaticLady said:
@marks this is what I'm talking about. So let me ask you who believes he is on the same page as Behold.

I asked if a Spirit-filled Christian commits murder or adultery are they sinning? And Behold said "No!"

Are you as naive as he is?

He's not naive...

You are teaching that your FLESH< which is the "sinning" part of you, that is DEAD, that died with CHRIST, is the part of you that God is dealing with.....=so, that's extreme error, theologically, and literally.
You are equating the "New Creation in Christ" as the same as the FLESH, that is DEAD.
You are not to see yourself as "the sinning part", which is your flesh, that is circumcised apart from you, and is DEAD.
God does not charge what is DEAD, with sin.
What is dead? Christ having born your sin, and the old man that was crucified with Christ.
You are teaching the opposite, by misleading people here to think of themselves as sinning flesh, when in fact this is DEAD.

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