Beards

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icxn

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@icxn: Thank-you; great verses there. I had never linked them with beards, though.
You mean you haven't linked them, the hair that is of your head or of your beard, with wisdom and righteouness. Those verses merely suggest that there is another meaning behind the literal.

Proverbs 16:31
Gray hair is a crown of glory; it is gained in a righteous life.
Wisdom of Solomon 4:9
But wisdom is the gray hair unto men, and an unspotted life is old age.​
 
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farouk

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PS: @2 Chr. 34:19
Beards....
I do think that culturally things are a lot more more fluid. Some rather strict ppl years ago might have identified beards with hippies, rebelliousness, etc., but frankly this is a way over-generalization.

Kind of: "This man wears a beard, therefore he (supposedly)...." etc., etc., just won't work.

Like with other cultural comments also:

(e.g., "Look that that rebellious young man with earrings!" Response: "Umm, my mom took me to the mall to have them done...")

("Look at that rebellious young woman with a tattoo!" Response: "Umm: it was my 18th birthday present from my dad...")
 

prism

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As with tatoos, so with beards...
If you have died with Christ to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were living in the world, do you submit yourself to decrees, such as, "Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!" (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
(Col 2:20-22)
 

amadeus

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@icxn I would not however go to the extent of saying that New Testament believers who are men are supposedly compelled to wear beards. In any case, Hebrews 7 makes it clear that the law was changed (v.12); and what we now have is better than the law (v.19).
But God has never changed and what He ultimately expects of people has never changed. Caleb and Joshua did not make it into Promised Land because they were able to and did precisely obey the letter of the written laws God gave to Moses... Rather...

"But my servant Caleb, because he had another spirit with him, and hath followed me fully, him will I bring into the land whereinto he went; and his seed shall possess it." Num 14:24

The difference now for us is not that God has changed His expectations, but that he has offered a Way to Him without a special man of flesh, a priest [Aaron and sons] always ready to make the connection for us. Now we may be the priest and the rules/laws to obey are to be written in our hearts. The interpretation in the OT was done via another man, found in a human priest or prophet, but now we may be the priest or prophet ourselves with the Interpreter being the Holy Spirit in us. Caleb and Joshua were not legal experts empowered to obey God precisely by their ability to interpret the laws given to Moses but their hearts were pointed in the right direction by that same Holy Spirit... because they loved God. Do we?

If we do, then like Caleb and Joshua we will be allowed to enter into a special place with God... If we love God will we not be seeking always to go His exactly prescribed Way rather the a way which gives of the best to two worlds? This last is double minded and lukewarm and ultimately will cause us lose all that we have been given by God. God's exact and prescribed Way cannot be found by Bible study alone! Ask the scribes and Pharisees who surely knew the scriptures without knowing God!

You speak of the letter of the law, even though you designate it NT law as opposed to an OT law.


"Jesus Christ the same yesterday and to day, and for ever." Heb 13:8

Do we love His promises and blessings more than we love Him? We need to understand the difference between loving the rewards and loving Him?


Looking for letter of the law loopholes according to what is written in the NT is trying to do with the NT what was impossible and unacceptable for men in the OT and is unacceptable now:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?" Acts 15:10
 
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Renniks

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Simple. This was a commandment within the Old Covenant. Christians are under the New Covenant.

As to tattoos, that is an entirely different matter. Pagans used to tattoo themselves within their false religions, and tattooing is forbidden in Scripture (as are all pagan practices). Furthermore today it is generally criminals and gangsters who love tattoos, not Christians. the MS-13 gangsters identify themselves with their tattoos.
Not really. It's not a criminal or gangster thing anymore, it's business men and women and housewives, basically more people tattooed than not. I'm not crazy about it. I also don't think its that important.
 
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amadeus

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2 Months Old (2).JPG As for beards versus tatoos... we were born with hair growing on our bodies... We must choose either to cut or not to cut. No baby born to woman was born with tatoos already in place or ready to develop when he reached puberty. They are not the same thing! The picture of me with my beard when my son was two months old. The beard is gone because my wife, being subjected to raw face asked me to shave. I did and have not stopped shaving regularly since... When I came to God in 1976 nothing changed in that respect.
 
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Renniks

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As with tatoos, so with beards...
If you have died with Christ to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were living in the world, do you submit yourself to decrees, such as, "Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!" (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
(Col 2:20-22)
So then, I should never trim my facial hair or sides of my hair?
 

Enoch111

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Not really. It's not a criminal or gangster thing anymore, it's business men and women and housewives, basically more people tattooed than not.
That is still the ways of the world. And the Bible says "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world". So Christians should ask themselves if Christ or any of His apostles WOULD EVEN DREAM of being tattooed.
 

farouk

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But God has never changed and what He ultimately expects of people has never changed. Caleb and Joshua did not make it into Promised Land because they were able to and did precisely obey the letter of the written laws God gave to Moses... Rather...

"But my servant Caleb, because he had another spirit with him, and hath followed me fully, him will I bring into the land whereinto he went; and his seed shall possess it." Num 14:24

The difference now for us is not that God has changed His expectations, but that he has offered a Way to Him without a special man of flesh, a priest [Aaron and sons] always ready to make the connection for us. Now we may be the priest and the rules/laws to obey are to be written in our hearts. The interpretation in the OT was done via another man, found in a human priest or prophet, but now we may be the priest or prophet ourselves with the Interpreter being the Holy Spirit in us. Caleb and Joshua were not legal experts empowered to obey God precisely by their ability to interpret the laws given to Moses but their hearts were pointed in the right direction by that same Holy Spirit... because they loved God. Do we?

If we do, then like Caleb and Joshua we will be allowed to enter into a special place with God... If we love God will we not be seeking always to go His exactly prescribed Way rather the a way which gives of the best to two worlds? This last is double minded and lukewarm and ultimately will cause us lose all that we have been given by God. God's exact and prescribed Way cannot be found by Bible study alone! Ask the scribes and Pharisees who surely knew the scriptures without knowing God!

You speak of the letter of the law, even though you designate it NT law as opposed to an OT law.


"Jesus Christ the same yesterday and to day, and for ever." Heb 13:8

Do we love His promises and blessings more than we love Him? We need to understand the difference between loving the rewards and loving Him?


Looking for letter of the law loopholes according to what is written in the NT is trying to do with the NT what was impossible and unacceptable for men in the OT and is unacceptable now:

"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?" Acts 15:10
@amadeus Well, from where I sit, dispensationally we are not now under the law anyway. The law was changed (Hebrews 7.12) and what we now have is better than the law (Hebrews 12.19).
 

Philip James

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The beard is gone because my wife, being subjected to raw face asked me to shave

My wife is also not a fan of my beard.. I shave it off during the warmer months to please her, and she puts up with it during the winter months to please me.

That's a great pic of you and your son!

Peace!
 
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farouk

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My wife is also not a fan of my beard.. I shave it off during the warmer months to please her, and she puts up with it during the winter months to please me.

That's a great pic of you and your son!

Peace!
@Philip James Among couples, stuff like beards, tattoos, etc. are really things that one spouse gets to accommodate with the other; sometimes it's good not to get too worked up about such things, one way or the other....
 
R

Rita

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Do you know what I find interesting, all the comments about not conforming to ‘ the world ‘ - I would challenge any one writing in this forum to show me that they ‘ Never ‘ conform to the world in any shape or form - Hmmm wonder what Jesus would write in the sand .................
Would you like me and others that have tattoos to stand in the middle of you all so that we can be stoned !!! Rita
 
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amadeus

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@amadeus Well, from where I sit, dispensationally we are not now under the law anyway. The law was changed (Hebrews 7.12) and what we now have is better than the law (Hebrews 12.19).
You did not understand what I was saying. What you have is another 'law' drawn up by men using what is written on paper. The people in Jerusalem when Jesus walked the streets had experts on what was written, but they needed was God... not more laws or legal interpretations. Jesus brought the Truth, the Life, but men have reintroduced the ways of the Pharisee via the writings of the NT and Jesus is dead to many even though they speak the word, "Jesus" with their mouths of flesh.
 

farouk

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Do you know what I find interesting, all the comments about not conforming to ‘ the world ‘ - I would challenge any one writing in this forum to show me that they ‘ Never ‘ conform to the world in any shape or form - Hmmm wonder what Jesus would write in the sand .................
Would you like me and others that have tattoos to stand in the middle of you all so that we can be stoned !!! Rita
@Rita

I'm trying just to imagine someone's odd vision of all the nurses, care workers, etc., under a pile of stones because they happen to have ink. :)

BluegrassRN said:
More of the nurses that I work with have tattoos than do not. On my shift, only three don't have them (of 13 nurses). We have several nurses (including myself) who have visible tattoos; one gal has them on her wrists. My hospital does not even have a policy on tattoos any longer
allnurses dot com

Tattoos are what ppl do now, matter-of-factly.
 

Angelina

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amadeus

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Do you know what I find interesting, all the comments about not conforming to ‘ the world ‘ - I would challenge any one writing in this forum to show me that they ‘ Never ‘ conform to the world in any shape or form - Hmmm wonder what Jesus would write in the sand .................
Would you like me and others that have tattoos to stand in the middle of you all so that we can be stoned !!! Rita
Tattoos were not and are not a cause for stoning. People were to be stoned for what was in their hearts... but as with Naboth the written laws were misused. As with the children of Israel in the desert, God ran out of patience with their repeated rebellions and they died without seeing the Promised Land.

Tatoos and beards and alcohol and drugs are not in and of themselves evil. The evil, if there is evil, is in the hearts of people. God made every thing 'very good' and then along came man with his free will which he used to disobey God so as to arrive at the place where he, the man, decided that he wanted to be... rather than seeking the place where God wanted him to be.

When people come to the Lord they have histories of sin and sinful ways. They have scars and wounds left from times before they began to know Jesus. Jesus loves them all as they are. The superficial marks remaining from the past don't matter even though the eyes of flesh can see them. Jesus simply said, "Come unto me...". But... seldom does anyone come all the way unto Him in that beginning. They repent, but not of everything for which they need to repent. This is not you alone and it certainly includes me.

King David did not please God because he always did things right. He pleased God because he loved God and when he messed up he admitted to his error and wanted to do whatever it took to please God. God has not changed in that respect not in anything else if only we can know Him so well...

It was King Saul who was anointed by the prophet of God but was more concerned with what other people were thinking and doing that with what God thought about. Let us not follow the example of King Saul!

We are all of us a selfish hard necked people until and if we allow God to lead us and change us. So many working hard to retain or obtain the "good" things of this carnal life as much or more than what God is offering...

Tattoos have never been the trouble. The trouble has always been in the hearts of men directed first toward anything rather than God.