Jesus isn't Catholic

HisLife said:

You try and redefine the meaning of Church, It's not Romes Version, It is a promise to the Church you are right there but the Church is God Children that have been born again the Ecclesia, the rest of your first statement contradicted what you said

Once again The church is the Followers of Jesus that have been born again not any Denomination

The Pillar is the confession Peter made of Faith In Jesus "you are the Christ the Son of the Living God" no one can be saved without Faith in Jesus

There is a Big Thing you are ignoring, The New testament The new Covenant in his Blood, The Church Period Taught By Paul, Roman Catholicism are not Jews and they aren't under Peter, There are no more alters no more Priests and no more sacrifices, You guys are living in the past trying to apply the old Covenant to the wrong people, There is a new thing It's All About Gods Grace! You can have forgiveness of sins be Born again and get the Gift of Eternal Life Because the Blood of Jesus Its Through Faith in the Finished Work Of Jesus, Its the Best Thing You could ever comprehend

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You're absolutely right that the Church s NOT a denomination - and neither is the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is the original Tree from which Protestantism splintered. It is the Acorn that became the Oak.
As for WHAT the Church is - I think it's time for a Bible lesson . . .

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).
- Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).
- Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).
- Jesus told the leaders of His Church that WHATEVER THEY bound or loosed on earth would ALSO be bound and loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18, John 20:21-23).
- The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).
- The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
- Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

THAT'S the Biblical definition of what Christ's Church i.
It's Christ on earth.

As for the Altar - the ONLY sacrifice that is offered on it is Christ's ETERNAL sacrifice (Rev. 13:8).
Just as there is an altar in Heaven (Rev. 6:9, Rev. 8:3, 11:1, 14:18, 16:7) - there is one in every Catholic Church.

HisLife said:

You ask setup questions and dodge the ones asked of you, it's fine but quite boring.... When someone is born again they receive the Holy Spirit And the Spirit reveals truth to them, They can Read Scripture and understand it, That's why to Carnal men the Bible doesn't make sense and they cant interpret it


Let's turn it around what part of scripture I used do you not agree with

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Lol....It’s not a set up. My questions are based off of YOUR statements sooooo if it is a set up....you set yourself up.

What is the criteria you use to determine if someone is “born again”? OR to put it a different way: who in Christian history would you say was clearly “born again” because clearly the Spirit revealed the Truth to them and they clearly could read Scripture and understand it?

To answer your question on what Scripture you used that I don’t agree with: The Scripture you used was not in context to our discussion sooooo I disagree with you cherry picking Scripture to fit what you believe.

justbyfaith said:

Hi @Marymog,

Here is where I am coming from.

However, the Catholic Church teaches certain false doctrines that I will not abide by (such as Mary being co-redeemer); which also, if anyone abides by them, their salvation is in question from my pov.

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Who decides what a false doctrine is?

Mary

justbyfaith said:

Hi @Marymog,

Here is where I am coming from.

Because if I do not abide by those doctrines, the Catholic Church has the power to exclude me from communion and thus eternal life; but if I do abide by them, I do not have eternal life either.

Therefore, if what you say is true, who can be saved?

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Hi JBF,

Sooooo let me see if I understand you correctly. YOU have decided that The Church teaches false doctrines and since they are false doctrines you will not adhere to them because you want to have eternal life. But you will adhere to YOUR doctrines which are not false so that you will have eternal life?

How do you know that YOUR doctrines are not false? What criteria do you use?

Thank you.....Respectfully, Mary

HisLife said:

The Pillar is the confession Peter made of Faith In Jesus "you are the Christ the Son of the Living God" no one can be saved without Faith in Jesus

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That’s IT???? Faith in Jesus and we are saved?

Why does the Bible have so many words if that is all it takes? Wanna know why.....because it take MORE than that. Lets see if there are passages that say more than that.

I will go first: Romans 10:9

Now you find a passage that Says you need more than faith to be saved....GO!!!

Truthcampaign.org said:

Many seek to be right, and as a result, they fail to seek the truth!

Truth Campaign | Gospel of John Chapter 6 | Always Seek The Truth!

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Have you found the Truth?

HisLife said:

Once again The church is the Followers of Jesus that have been born again not any Denomination

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Hi,
Who do you call when someone among you is sick? (James 5:14)

Curious Mary

BreadOfLife said:

You're absolutely right that the Church s NOT a denomination - and neither is the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is the original Tree from which Protestantism splintered. It is the Acorn that became the Oak.
As for WHAT the Church is - I think it's time for a Bible lesson . . .

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).
- Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).
- Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).
- Jesus told the leaders of His Church that WHATEVER THEY bound or loosed on earth would ALSO be bound and loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18, John 20:21-23).
- The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).
- The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
- Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

THAT'S the Biblical definition of what Christ's Church i.
It's Christ on earth.

As for the Altar - the ONLY sacrifice that is offered on it is Christ's ETERNAL sacrifice (Rev. 13:8).
Just as there is an altar in Heaven (Rev. 6:9, Rev. 8:3, 11:1, 14:18, 16:7) - there is one in every Catholic Church.

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You just threw verses around that's not a lesson at all but I have said a lot of what you posted anyway is there any verses that contradict what I said? but Your answers are very contradictory. The Romanism You follow started with Constantine and Protestantism splintered from That Because it was false and well Rome would Try and Kill any real Christians at that time So the real church was made up of individual believers which where persecuted and murdered by your Romanism you Even had the Bible on your Banned book list, But the more they killed the more rose up, Baptists existed before Romes Church anyway, But the point is irrelevant, Christians Are Followers Of Christ, His Body He is the Head

Christs Eternal Sacrifice Was at Calvary, You cant back up your words with scripture you post scripture and then put your own twist on it

Marymog said:

Hi,
Who do you call when someone among you is sick? (James 5:14)

Curious Mary

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Not Ghost Busters, From everything I said you just pick up on that.... Like the verse Says Elders in the Church, I would pick Someone that Has A close Relationship with Jesus, I wouldn't Let Idol Worshippers And Covenant Breakers anywhere near me If I had a choice

Marymog said:

That’s IT???? Faith in Jesus and we are saved?

Why does the Bible have so many words if that is all it takes? Wanna know why.....because it take MORE than that. Lets see if there are passages that say more than that.

I will go first: Romans 10:9

Now you find a passage that Says you need more than faith to be saved....GO!!!

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For out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaks.

Actually We are Saved by grace Through Jesus Sacrifice

It's Amazing isn't it, Its called Grace Does Romanism Teach this verse

Ephesians 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Should I ask What a works based Cult says it takes, The Bible has many teachings Sanctification is an awesome Process

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

HisLife said:

Not Ghost Busters, From everything I said you just pick up on that.... Like the verse Says Elders in the Church, I would pick Someone that Has A close Relationship with Jesus, I wouldn't Let Idol Worshippers And Covenant Breakers anywhere near me If I had a choice

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Lol...I like the Ghost Busters reference. Which did you prefer: Original or remake?

The reason I “pick up on that” is because you seem to be anti-denominational. Denominations have elders (men chosen to lead the church, bishops, cardinals etc.). That passage seems to support a hierarchical Church system. Are you against denominations?

HisLife said:

For out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaks.

Actually We are Saved by grace Through Jesus Sacrifice

It's Amazing isn't it, Its called Grace Does Romanism Teach this verse

Ephesians 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Should I ask What a works based Cult says it takes, The Bible has many teachings Sanctification is an awesome Process

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

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Wow....look at you...over achiever. I was looking for one passage and you gave several.

Ok....so now we have Grace, confessing with our mouth, belief to be saved. You cherry picked scripture to fit your belief about ‘works’. James 2:24 says we are not saved by faith alone But by what we do (works). Scripture never lies so we are saved by faith AND works (feeding the poor, tending to sick, etc).

Scripture says by baptism we are saved (1 Pet 3:21) sooo we can add that to the list.

So now we are up to 5 different things scripture says what it takes to be saved. Are you sure you want to stick to your “faith alone” theory?

Bible Study Mary

HisLife said:

You just threw verses around that's not a lesson at all but I have said a lot of what you posted anyway is there any verses that contradict what I said? but Your answers are very contradictory. The Romanism You follow started with Constantine and Protestantism splintered from That Because it was false and well Rome would Try and Kill any real Christians at that time So the real church was made up of individual believers which where persecuted and murdered by your Romanism you Even had the Bible on your Banned book list, But the more they killed the more rose up, Baptists existed before Romes Church anyway, But the point is irrelevant, Christians Are Followers Of Christ, His Body He is the Head

Christs Eternal Sacrifice Was at Calvary, You cant back up your words with scripture you post scripture and then put your own twist on it

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First of all - welcome to the forum.
Unfortunately, you're not going to get away with the unsubstantiated claims above in RED around here, though. There are too many educated Catholics - and non-Catholics who have done their homework.

"Romanism", as you call it, doesn't exist - only the Catholic Church. And the Catholic Church goes all the way back to the Apostles.
You see - unlike your unfounded claims about the Baptist denomination - the Catholic Church actually has the paper trail - and 2000 years of constant living Tradition that proves we are the Apostolic Church.

As I showed in an earlier post - Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch was a student of the Apostle John - and wrote the following letter on his way to martyrdom in Rome- while John was still presumably alive. It provides a firsthand glimpse into the 1st Century Church:
Ignatius of Antioch
Follow your bishop, every one of you, as obediently as Jesus Christ followed the Father. Obey your clergy too as you would the apostles; give your deacons the same reverence that you would to a command of God. Make sure that no step affecting the Church is ever taken by anyone without the bishop’s sanction. The sole Eucharist you should consider valid is one that is celebrated by the bishop himself, or by some person authorized by him. Where the bishop is to be seen, there let all his people be; just as, wherever Jesus Christ is present, there is the Catholic Church (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).

Now - the Church described above sounds NOTHING like the Baptist denomination with its adherence to the Eucharist, obedience to the Bishops and Clergy - and the NAME of "The Catholic Church."

As for Christ's sacrifice - it is an ETERNAL sacrifice. He died once fore all (Rom. 6:10) here one earth in OUR time - but God is OUTSIDE of time and is not bound by it (2 Pet. 3:8).
Rev. 13:8 tells us that He was "slain before the foundations of the world."
Heb. 7:25 tells us that "he ever liveth to make intercession" for us.

So, there you have it - Scripture AND History.
Unfortunately, instead of doing your homework - you've chosen to believe in myths and fairy tales about the Catholic Church . . .

BreadOfLife said:

Jesus's promise that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church to ALL truth (John 16:12-15) was NOT granted to every individual.

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Right....it was granted to those who would receive the Holy Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39, Luke 11:9-13); either by asking or by being baptized in the name of Jesus.

BreadOfLife said:

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).

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Amen...

And the body of Christ consists of all those who believe in Jesus and what He did for them on the Cross...who are born again of the Holy Spirit.

Marymog said:

How do you know that YOUR doctrines are not false? What criteria do you use?

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The holy scriptures and the Spirit of truth who dwells within me.

For I have been promised through the holy scriptures that I have the Spirit of truth because I have met certain conditions (Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39, Luke 11:9-13).

The Spirit of truth is an unction from the holy one....by whom I know all things (1 John 2:20).

Marymog said:

James 2:24 says we are not saved by faith alone But by what we do (works).

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If that is the case then there is a contradiction in the Bible; because in Romans 4:5-6, Titus 3:5, Ephesians 2:8-9, and Romans 11:5-6, it says that we are saved apart from works.

But in James 2:24 the word is "justified"....which means "accounted righteous."

So, is the person who does works accounted righteous before God or men?

Rom 4:2, For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

We know that Abraham was justified by works...but that his glory, or his justification, was not before God because of his works; but that his works justified him before man.

His justification before God was because of his faith alone according to Romans 4:1-8...

For man looks on the outward appearance; but God looks on the heart (1 Samuel 16:7).

So then, God does not look at our works (which have to do with the outward appearance) to determine our justification; rather, he looks on the inside of us to determine whether we have a living and saving faith.

Because Jesus is both God and man, when we are judged it will be according to our works.

However, our salvation (before God), which makes us inclined towards doing good works, is by faith alone in Jesus Christ alone.

We receive the Holy Spirit by faith (Galatians 3:14) and through the Holy Spirit the love of the Lord (Romans 5:5).

Our salvation has nothing to do with works of righteousness which we have done (Titus 3:5); but with regeneration and renewing of the Holy Ghost, on the inside of us.

"Marvel not that I said unto you, Ye must be born again." (John 3:7)

And this (being born again) is by faith (Romans 5:2).

Marymog said:

Wow....look at you...over achiever. I was looking for one passage and you gave several.

Ok....so now we have Grace, confessing with our mouth, belief to be saved. You cherry picked scripture to fit your belief about ‘works’. James 2:24 says we are not saved by faith alone But by what we do (works). Scripture never lies so we are saved by faith AND works (feeding the poor, tending to sick, etc).

Scripture says by baptism we are saved (1 Pet 3:21) sooo we can add that to the list.

So now we are up to 5 different things scripture says what it takes to be saved. Are you sure you want to stick to your “faith alone” theory?

Bible Study Mary

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Haha Not so fast, from the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks that comes naturally and that was a reference to you , you have to hear or read The Gospel to react to it, James 2:24 doesn't contradict other Scriptures and definitely doesn't say we are saved by Works, Its explaining if you are saved Works will Come Naturally which the Bible Clearly teaches That without Jesus we can do nothing, So if God works through the saved person they will have works Naturally But God gets the Glory, Its Good to Do good things but they don't Save you, they can be evidence one is saved because someone that is saved will have works, Naturally, but who is the fruit inspector?

If someone is saved they will be Baptized by the Holy Spirit, they go together Doesn't say anything about Water to be saved, it says it shows repentance, But I agree if someone is Saved and Born again they will receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit So they will be Baptized Spiritually, See these things go Naturally together, The work Of God in the Born again persons Life

He who began a Good Work in you will finish it

All works done in our own power are as filthy Rags or.... worse

No, I'm sticking With Gods Grace Alone It's a Gift, you just believe the truth of the Good News and don't add to it, Jesus Lived a perfect Life we couldn't, never did anything Wrong, Died For the sins of the World Defeated Death, And rose from the Dead. Anyone that Believes on him can have Eternal Life The Best Deal and The Best News you could ever Hear, When God puts it on a Characteristic Of his Nature (grace) I wouldn't Dare Limit how Graceful Gods Grace is

BreadOfLife said:

First of all - welcome to the forum.
Unfortunately, you're not going to get away with the unsubstantiated claims above in RED around here, though. There are too many educated Catholics - and non-Catholics who have done their homework.

"Romanism", as you call it, doesn't exist - only the Catholic Church. And the Catholic Church goes all the way back to the Apostles.
You see - unlike your unfounded claims about the Baptist denomination - the Catholic Church actually has the paper trail - and 2000 years of constant living Tradition that proves we are the Apostolic Church.

As I showed in an earlier post - Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch was a student of the Apostle John - and wrote the following letter on his way to martyrdom in Rome- while John was still presumably alive. It provides a firsthand glimpse into the 1st Century Church:
Ignatius of Antioch
Follow your bishop, every one of you, as obediently as Jesus Christ followed the Father. Obey your clergy too as you would the apostles; give your deacons the same reverence that you would to a command of God. Make sure that no step affecting the Church is ever taken by anyone without the bishop’s sanction. The sole Eucharist you should consider valid is one that is celebrated by the bishop himself, or by some person authorized by him. Where the bishop is to be seen, there let all his people be; just as, wherever Jesus Christ is present, there is the Catholic Church (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).

Now - the Church described above sounds NOTHING like the Baptist denomination with its adherence to the Eucharist, obedience to the Bishops and Clergy - and the NAME of "The Catholic Church."

As for Christ's sacrifice - it is an ETERNAL sacrifice. He died once fore all (Rom. 6:10) here one earth in OUR time - but God is OUTSIDE of time and is not bound by it (2 Pet. 3:8).
Rev. 13:8 tells us that He was "slain before the foundations of the world."
Heb. 7:25 tells us that "he ever liveth to make intercession" for us.

So, there you have it - Scripture AND History.
Unfortunately, instead of doing your homework - you've chosen to believe in myths and fairy tales about the Catholic Church . . .

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I Came up with Romanism Glad you liked it You can call it the Roman Catholic Church but it's Rome's Church, Actually Baptists Go all the way back to John, And Jesus Command to go and baptize all nations Im not talking about Denominations Romanism is obsessed with Denominations Because they want to have a part in them But the real Church isn't a Denomination, I picked Constantine Because he Dramatically Changed Romanism, So the Romanism you follow was based on him, Paper Trail and Ignatius that's your authority? Why not the Bible, It says to Follow Paul as he Followed Christ, the first line in your Paper Trail sets out an impossible scenario....to follow your Bishop as obediently as Christ followed the Father...Come on that's impossible and completely disrespectful to Jesus

If you read your last Paragraph you make up Fairy tales you try and add to scripture, you come up with theories you cant back up with Scripture like you said

"He died once fore all here one earth in OUR time"

Sneaky trap to slip in a lie...If only you guys would be Honest And Straight Forward you may be able to come to the Knowledge of the Truth

Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

justbyfaith said:

The holy scriptures and the Spirit of truth who dwells within me.

For I have been promised through the holy scriptures that I have the Spirit of truth because I have met certain conditions (Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39, Luke 11:9-13).

The Spirit of truth is an unction from the holy one....by whom I know all things (1 John 2:20).

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Good morning,

Sooooo anyone that disagrees with your doctrine (your truth) does not have the Spirit dwelling in them because they have not been promised the Spirit of truth like you have?

Why should we go to anyone else for guidance on Scripture if YOU have the Truth?

Curious Mary

HisLife said:

If someone is saved they will be Baptized by the Holy Spirit, they go together Doesn't say anything about Water to be saved, it says it shows repentance, But I agree if someone is Saved and Born again they will receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit So they will be Baptized Spiritually, See these things go Naturally together, The work Of God in the Born again persons Life

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Ummm....1 Peter 3:20-21 in summary says eight persons were saved through water and baptism......now saves you! Soooooo it does say something about water and Scripture makes that clear MULTIPLE times and your own Christian History shows that they practiced water baptism to be saved. But I know I am wasting my time by quoting Scripture and referencing a 2,000 year practice of your ancestors. You accept a 500 year teaching so I digress!