Is the one world government Biblical?

quietthinker · Sep 14, 2020

kcnalp said:
Hebrews 8:13 (NKJV)
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete.

Understand what he made obsolete. Here are some considerations....animal sacrifices.....circumcision....various ceremonies which foreshadowed the Messiah.....but never the Decalogue written by God's own finger amidst thunder and lightning and a quaking mountain so that the people tremblingly begged Moses that God not speak to them directly.

To discard the Decalogue by which all men will be judged at the appointed time....the Laws which are the epitome of unselfishness, attempts to justify a deliberate breaking of them and an attempt to hide behind the language of the new covenant.

But......how can any of this matter to you who holds the position of the bible not being meaningful engagement #113

Josho · Sep 14, 2020

Stumpmaster said:
Hi Josho,

Will this do?

Mat 4:8-9 Again, the devil took Him up on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. (9) And he said to Him, "All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me."

Nope not really.

As what we see here is a failed attempt by the devil trying to make himself above Jesus. And we know Jesus then goes on to reply.

10 Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’”

11 Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him.

But in looking at this, I think we could both see how the Anti-Christ in the tribulation could be Satan in the flesh.

But then is it really a one world government? Or is it just the Anti-Christ trying to create a one world religion?

Either way we both know that the Anti-Christ will fail. Because a few will refuse to bow and receive the mark of the beast in those days, and these born again Christian people living in those times that refuse to bow to the Anti-Christ, are not under of the Anti-Christ in the tribulation.

But those born again Christians living in the tribulation that refuse to bow to the beast, are serving the one true God.

So is it really a one world government?

From a spiritual point of view, there is 2 in the Tribulation.

But from a natural point of view, it would look like Revelations 13 seems to suggest that there would be multiple governments serving the Anti-Christ in the Tribulation. (For example.. China, North Korea, Iran they all have separate governments.)

We should also realize though, in John's day, people that did not worship pagan gods before the fall of the western Roman Empire, were put to death, if they were caught.

Really we shouldn't be too dogmatic on our views.

kcnalp · Sep 14, 2020

quietthinker said:
understand what he made obsolete. Here's some considerations....animal sacrifices.....circumcision....various ceremonies which foreshadowed the Messiah.....but never the Decalogue written by God's own finger amidst thunder and lightning and a quaking mountain so that the people tremblingly begged Moses that God not speak to them directly.

To discard the Decalogue by which all men will be judged at the appointed time....the Laws which are the epitome of unselfishness, attempts to justify a deliberate breaking of them and an attempt to hide behind the language of the new covenant.

Decalogue? Nine of the Ten commandments are in the NT. What else are you trying to persuade us in the Law of Moses? I'm not under the Law.

Galatians 3:24-25 (NKJV)
24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

Mayflower · Sep 14, 2020

Giuliano said:
I think you'll be okay as long you don't wear a mask on your forehead or on your hand.

I do all the time. Lol

I have to steal this.

quietthinker · Sep 14, 2020

kcnalp said:
Decalogue? Nine of the Ten commandments are in the NT. What else are you trying to persuade us in the Law of Moses? I'm not under the Law.

Galatians 3:24-25 (NKJV)
24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

1. The 'law' in this context are the ceremonial laws....the slaying of lambs and such which foreshadowed Jesus.
2. Trusting in the sufficiency of Jesus' sacrifice is called faith and thereby the shadow, ie the typical....the slaying of lambs....this being the tutor because it taught God's principle of love....the innocent for the guilty.

The Ten Commandments are not a tutor in that sense. The Ten Commandments high light sin and they still do......that is no reason to discard them or break them.

In this sense the Ten Commandments are a tutor....they point out how far short we have fallen......this is no reason to scrap them.....in fact it is every reason to honour them because they are the epitome of unselfishness.

Your short fall becomes evident in selfishness.

kcnalp · Sep 14, 2020

quietthinker said:
1. The 'law' in this context are the ceremonial laws....the slaying of lambs and such which foreshadowed Jesus.
2. Trusting in the sufficiency of Jesus' sacrifice is called faith and thereby the shadow, ie the typical....the slaying of lambs....this being the tutor because it taught God's principle of love....the innocent for the guilty.

The Ten Commandments are not a tutor in that sense. The Ten Commandments high light sin and they still do......that is no reason to discard them or break them.

In this sense the Ten Commandments are a tutor....they point out how far short we have fallen......this is no reason to scrap them.....in fact it is every reason to honour them because they are the epitome of unselfishness.

Your short fall becomes evident in selfishness.

So what parts of the Law that are not in the NT are you recommending?

quietthinker · Sep 15, 2020

kcnalp said:
So what parts of the Law that are not in the NT are you recommending?

James calls the Ten Commandments 'The Law of Liberty' and 'The Royal Law' James 2:10-12 The context tells us which Law he refers to when he quotes two from the Law of Liberty...don't murder and don't commit adultery .

Sooooo, what parts am I recommending from the New Testament?......all of them.

kcnalp · Sep 15, 2020

quietthinker said:
James calls the Ten Commandments 'The Law of Liberty' and 'The Royal Law' James 2:10-12 The context tells us which Law he refers to when he quotes two from the Law of Liberty...don't murder and don't commit adultery .

Sooooo, what parts am I recommending from the New Testament?......all of them.

That wasn't the question. What parts of the Law of Moses that are not in the NT are you recommending? Executing gays, Sabbath workers, adulterers?

quietthinker · Sep 15, 2020

kcnalp said:
That wasn't the question. What parts of the Law of Moses that are not in the NT are you recommending? Executing gays, Sabbath workers, adulterers?

There are none of the 'Royal Law' that are invalid.....but I doubt you bother taking any of what is said seriously.

You manoeuvre to primarily excuse yourself on a deliberate level from the fourth Commandment forgetting that it is not mine but God's.

kcnalp · Sep 15, 2020

quietthinker said:
There are none of the 'Royal Law' that are invalid.....but I doubt you bother taking any of what is said seriously.

The Royal Law? Are you referring to the Law of Moses that COMMANDS you to execute your family members who have a different religion than yours? Are you picking the parts you like?

quietthinker · Sep 15, 2020

kcnalp said:
The Royal Law? Are you referring to the Law of Moses that COMMANDS you to execute your family members who have a different religion than yours? Are you picking the parts you like?

It is clear you are ignorant of the New Testament writings....the ones you boast in.

friend of · Sep 15, 2020

Josho said:
When the beast rises in the tribulation, those without the mark of the beast won't be able to buy or sell, and that happens whether if the world is cashless or not

The chip is the method by which a cashless society would even be possible. What do you think the mark is?

friend of · Sep 15, 2020

@Josho

Furthermore, how do you envision the buy/sell rule would be enforced? If it is indeed a spiritual mark only, then how could such a thing ever be enforced? Right standing with God is an invisibility. We don't know who is and is not saved. How would an atheist salesperson discern the spiritual standing of another human being?

kcnalp · Sep 15, 2020

quietthinker said:
It is clear you are ignorant of the New Testament writings....the ones you boast in.

I know what the NT says about you Law of Moses preachers. You don't obey the Law of Moses. Why are you preaching it?
Galatians 3:10 (NKJV)
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse;

Josho · Sep 15, 2020

friend of said:
The chip is the method by which a cashless society would even be possible. What do you think the mark is?

The problem with that though is the chip isn't even mentioned as "the mark."

Maybe the mark is actually a mark?

I am just saying whether if society is cashless or not, a mark will be required to buy and sell anyway. The beast comes first though....

Josho · Sep 15, 2020

friend of said:
@Josho

Furthermore, how do you envision the buy/sell rule would be enforced? If it is indeed a spiritual mark only, then how could such a thing ever be enforced? Right standing with God is an invisibility. We don't know who is and is not saved. How would an atheist salesperson discern the spiritual standing of another human being?

By that point there may be no atheists.

The reason I am saying this is that when we read about the Two Witnesses before the Beast rises, we see that the world will hate them.

Could this also mean in that point of time that many will also knowingly hate God?

And I am not ruling out the possibility of it actually being a spiritual mark.

See the bit I highlighted, and ask yourself does this sound like in the natural?

Perhaps people are looking too much at the physical and not the spiritual? But from reading this, the beast will definitely be spiritual. And in saying this many Christians today aren't even aware of witchcraft and black magic. Many have forgotten than Pharoah's magicians were also able to turn their staffs into snakes.

Revelation 13:13‭-‬17
He did astounding miracles, even making fire flash down to earth from the sky while everyone was watching. And with all the miracles he was allowed to perform on behalf of the first beast, he deceived all the people who belong to this world. He ordered the people to make a great statue of the first beast, who was fatally wounded and then came back to life. He was then permitted to give life to this statue so that it could speak. Then the statue of the beast commanded that anyone refusing to worship it must die. He required everyone—small and great, rich and poor, free and slave—to be given a mark on the right hand or on the forehead. And no one could buy or sell anything without that mark, which was either the name of the beast or the number representing his name.

kcnalp · Sep 15, 2020

Josho said:
The problem with that though is the chip isn't even mentioned as "the mark."

Maybe the mark is actually a mark?

I am just saying whether if society is cashless or not, a mark will be required to buy and sell anyway. The beast comes first though....

Would you accept a chip implant in your right hand?

friend of · Sep 15, 2020

Josho said:
The problem with that though is the chip isn't even mentioned as "the mark."

The concept of digital technology wouldn't have been something anyone would have understood back then.

Josho · Sep 15, 2020

kcnalp said:
Would you accept a chip implant in your right hand?

No, even with my beliefs on Revelation, I still wouldn't.

Also @friend of @kcnalp have you ever thought, that if the mark was a chip, it would be possible for a person to remove it themselves?

So that brings into question, will a person be able to remove the mark of the beast from themselves?

Josho · Sep 15, 2020

@friend of

Perhaps at this stage in the tribulation maybe everyone will be able to see spiritually?

Is the one world government Biblical?

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