John 6:66 - Why did many disciples stop following Jesus?

Eternally Grateful · Sep 20, 2020

Truthcampaign.org said:
You don't make sense. It's was from Jesus' mouth in John 6. Don't seek to be right, open your heart

Truth Campaign | Gospel of John Chapter 6 | Always Seek The Truth!

Yes, it was Jesus mouth

1. do not work for food which perishes but food which endures forever.

The Eucharist does not endure forever if it did you would not keep eating it

2.whoever eats the food he came to give will never hunger or thirst, never die, live forever, and be raised on the last day

again you eat and are assured of non of the things jesus promised

3. Jesus said in in essence that eating this food was coming to him, believing in him. It is his words which gives life, and that’s what we arw to gnaw on and chew.

4. Jesus said those who left could not understand because they did not believe.

Even peter showed he understood When he said you have the WORDS of eternal life.

Funny how peter got it yet you do not

Heyzeus · Sep 20, 2020

Episkopos said:
We read the bible as a religious fait accompli. My thought is that most believers today would have abandoned Jesus also...given the far out spiritual teachings ...in the face of a very understandable set of laws.

So we are taught an interpretation of the truth that leaves out the controversial and difficult passages. And then we wonder why Jesus was seen as so scandalous in His day.

Very few believers will make it into the life that Jesus was preaching...kingdom life. Jesus Himself said it is very hard and few will find it. But many consider that as wrong...especially in their own regard. These have not understood the teachings of Jesus or the gospel but have accepted a human religious interpretation of it that declaws the truth so as to make it easy and palatable.

But today the state of unreality is so great that most will never know that they are actually NOT in sync with Jesus and His teachings...at all.

So how do we interpret the passage in question - in the context of the entirety of John 6 ? which is a deep passage which requires at least some understanding of concept of the Logos.

I will give it a shot -- starting at John 25.

25 When they found him on the other side of the lake, they asked him, “Rabbi, when did you get here?”

26 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, you are looking for me, not because you saw the signs I performed but because you ate the loaves and had your fill. 27 Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. For on him God the Father has placed his seal of approval.”

28 Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?”

Jesus replies .. 29 The work of God is this - to believe in the one he has sent.

Many might view this passage as support for Sola Fide - but that is not how it appears to me. Belief in the message of Jesus - the teachings .. because this message comes from God via the Holy Spirit .. Christ being a vessel for that Spirit.

We are to eat and drink the teachings of the lord - of which Jesus is a representation - when you partake of this knowledge - you are partaking of Jesus.

When you drink of that cup - you have opened up the path to eternal life. mere belief however is not enough - as stated directly in the Sermon on the Mount - but knowledge "The Truth" is the path.

And we must always seek this Truth

Ferris Bueller · Sep 20, 2020

Truthcampaign.org said:
FeaturedJohn 6:66 - Why did many disciples stop following Jesus?

It says why they stopped following. They did not believe in Jesus.

John 6:60,63-64
60On hearing it, many of His disciples said, “This is a difficult teaching. Who can accept it?”
The words I have spoken to you—they are full of the Spirit and life. 64Yet there are some of you who do not believe.

On the other hand, the Twelve (minus one) did believe and stayed.

John 6:67,69
67So Jesus asked the Twelve, “Do you want to leave too?”
69We believe and know that You are the Holy One of God.

Too many people have ruined Christianity by making the Bible say more than what it says. And honestly, I'm pretty sick of it. We have to read the Bible for ourselves so we don't get polluted by all the stupid teachings in the church today.

Prayer Warrior · Sep 20, 2020

Ferris Bueller said:
It says why they stopped following. They did not believe in Jesus.

John 6:60,63-64
60On hearing it, many of His disciples said, “This is a difficult teaching. Who can accept it?”
The words I have spoken to you—they are full of the Spirit and life. 64Yet there are some of you who do not believe.

On the other hand, the Twelve (minus one) did believe and stayed.

John 6:67,69
67So Jesus asked the Twelve, “Do you want to leave too?”
69We believe and know that You are the Holy One of God.

Too many people have ruined Christianity by making the Bible say more than what it says. And honestly, I'm pretty sick of it.

It really does boil down to whether a person truly believes in Jesus Christ from the heart. There have been many people throughout history who have paid lip service to the gospel of Christ, but very few who have lived it by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Ferris Bueller · Sep 20, 2020

Prayer Warrior said:
It really does boil down to whether a person truly believes in Jesus Christ from the heart. There have been many people throughout history who have paid lip service to the gospel of Christ, but very few who have lived it by the power of the Holy Spirit.

I don't think there are any churches that teach the unpolluted truth anymore. It seems the more 'scholarly' church leaders get the less spiritual they are. We had to abandon the polluted and corrupted Catholic church of the 15th century only to fall into the hands of some very un-spiritual leaders who have brought us to this cold, dead religion of today. The only way to go is to go it alone, you and your Bible in a humble seeking of the Spirit's guidance through those words. It's too dangerous and unreliable to consult a church for guidance. That's where I'm at right now.

Hidden In Him · Sep 20, 2020

DNB said:
3. Christ's words were too profound for them.

This is it right here. There are a number of ways the typical Jew could have interpreted the saying, but none of them would have been comfortable in the least. Our new member seems to think the twelve somehow knew exactly what He meant, but the text doesn't bear that out in the least. Peter didn't say, "Obviously they're not as wise as we are, Lord. If they were, they'd know you were going to be a wafer." The text reads:

67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, "Will you go away also?" 68 Then Simon Peter answered him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 And we believe and are sure that you are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

In other words, "Lord, we don't have the foggiest idea what you mean either (Lol), but where else are we going to go, seeing as we believe you are the Messiah?"

I'm not sure what any of us are doing answering our guest, however, since he made it clear to me in his post that our interpretations are of no account anyway. I don't think most of the posters have caught up with that statement yet, but it means he doesn't care what anyone thinks, and he's just playing this community and goading them into responding. The only smart move at that point is to ignore him altogether, though I'm guessing not all are savvy enough to realize it.

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

Eternally Grateful said:
Lol, I am here to discuss the word. Not discuss some website,

1. prove me wrong
2. If you want to discuss something, then discuss it

No, you're here to discuss your interpretation of the Word, the Word that the Catholic Church through the Holy Spirit gave you. It's about you and you being right. Your interpretation, your rules...

Council of Rome - Wikipedia

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

How does one explain transubstantiation at the Last Supper? If Jesus had not yet sacrificed His human nature, how could he offer his body and blood to the Apostles in the form of bread and wine?

The basic answer is that it is not necessary for Jesus to have sacrificed himself on the Cross in order for transubstantiation to occur.

In transubstantiation, two things happen: (1) The substances (i.e., the ultimate, underlying realities) of bread and wine cease to exist, leaving only the properties detectable by our senses and (2) the substance of Christ's body, blood, soul, and divinity become present.

For neither of these things to happen does Christ have to have offered himself on the Cross. God created all matter out of nothing (Latin, ex nihilo), and he can similarly cause it to return to nothing (ad nihilo = where we get "annihiliate").

Similarly, God can make any object he wants present at any location he wants, including multiple locations simultaneously. This phenomenon, known as multilocation, is possible for Christ and for anything else God chooses.

The Last Supper, Good Friday, And Transubstantiation – Jimmy Akin

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

Do Catholics re-sacrifice Jesus? No!

You can continue to believe that Catholics do re-sacrifice Jesus on the cross so that you feel right in your own mind, or you can watch this quick 5 minute clip that tells you what the Mass is about.

The resources are available on the web for you to educate yourself. Are you going to do that? Or just make stuff up about the Church to make you feel better in your own skin? You will have to face God when you die! At least do some honest research and stop misleading people. The information is readily available for people!

Continue to mislead people, or educate yourself on what the Church believes... It's not about seeking to be right, it's about finding the truth!

Do Catholics re-sacrifice Christ?

Ferris Bueller · Sep 20, 2020

Truthcampaign.org said:
In transubstantiation, two things happen: (1) The substances (i.e., the ultimate, underlying realities) of bread and wine cease to exist, leaving only the properties detectable by our senses and (2) the substance of Christ's body, blood, soul, and divinity become present.

How do you get this ridiculous theology out of John 6?
It does not say any of this nonsense.

Stop making up crap, church!

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

More info on the Mass Sacrifice

Is the Mass a Sacrifice?

Enoch111 · Sep 20, 2020

Truthcampaign.org said:
Do Catholics re-sacrifice Jesus? No!

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Christ is re-sacrificed at the Mass:

THE CATECHISM
1357 We carry out this command of the Lord by celebrating the memorial of his sacrifice. In so doing, we offer to the Father what he has himself given us: the gifts of his creation, bread and wine which, by the power of the Holy Spirit and by the words of Christ, have become the body and blood of Christ. Christ is thus really and mysteriously made present.

1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ's Passover, and it is made present the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present.183 "As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which 'Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed' is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out."184

1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross, because it is its memorial and because it applies its fruit:

In view of this, you are denying what the Catholic Church teaches.

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

Ferris Bueller said:
How do you get this ridiculous theology out of John 6?
It does not say any of this nonsense.

Stop making up crap, church!

The interpretation is from the Church that's 2000 years old and started by Jesus. Jesus started a Church and Church through the Holy Spirit created the Bible 300 plus years after His death.

Where do you get your interpretation from my friend??

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

Enoch111 said:
According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Christ is re-sacrificed at the Mass:

THE CATECHISM
1357 We carry out this command of the Lord by celebrating the memorial of his sacrifice. In so doing, we offer to the Father what he has himself given us: the gifts of his creation, bread and wine which, by the power of the Holy Spirit and by the words of Christ, have become the body and blood of Christ. Christ is thus really and mysteriously made present.

1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ's Passover, and it is made present the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present.183 "As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which 'Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed' is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out."184

1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross, because it is its memorial and because it applies its fruit:

In view of this, you are denying what the Catholic Church teaches.

Notice how you did not put the full explanation of 1366? Later in 1366 it's says "by which the bloody sacrifice which he was to accomplish once for all on the cross would be re-presented, its memory perpetuated until the end of the world.

re-presented is what Jesus command us to do. "Do this in memory of me."

It is not a bloody re-sacrifice on the cross. This was done once for all on the cross. Instead the sacrifice of Jesus we offer in Mass is His glorified body in heaven. We don't put Jesus back on the cross!

Truthcampaign.org · Sep 20, 2020

The sacrifice of Jesus we offer in Mass is His glorified body in heaven. We don't put Jesus back on the cross!

Eternally Grateful · Sep 20, 2020

Christophany said:
Don't you know what a disciple is ?

Yeah
But John 6 is about how one becomes a disciple. Not how one acts like one. Or what a disciple does

context my friend,

Eternally Grateful · Sep 20, 2020

Tong2020 said:
John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

As taught so by Jesus in the verse itself, His words spoken in verse 63 are spirit. In fact He continues to teach that they are life. So, Jesus was speaking spiritually more than symbolically.

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

The Lord is saying that His words are spirit and that they are life. It's not His material flesh and blood really is the matter, but His words. His words is what He refers to as the food which endures to everlasting life. And that is the food man should be seeking for and labor for to feed on.

John 6:27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”

The flesh profits nothing. With that Jesus was saying that they should be laboring to feed their spirit more than their flesh. This matter of food brings to mind what is written said in the following passage:

Deut. 8:3 So He humbled you, allowed you to hunger, and fed you with manna which you did not know nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man shall not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds from the mouth of the Lord.

Tong
R1175

Amen and amen

ChristisGod · Sep 20, 2020

Eternally Grateful said:
Yeah
But John 6 is about how one becomes a disciple. Not how one acts like one. Or what a disciple does

context my friend,

John 6:66 - Why did many disciples stop following Jesus?

Eternally Grateful · Sep 20, 2020

Ferris Bueller said:
It says why they stopped following. They did not believe in Jesus.

John 6:60,63-64
60On hearing it, many of His disciples said, “This is a difficult teaching. Who can accept it?”
The words I have spoken to you—they are full of the Spirit and life. 64Yet there are some of you who do not believe.

On the other hand, the Twelve (minus one) did believe and stayed.

John 6:67,69
67So Jesus asked the Twelve, “Do you want to leave too?”
69We believe and know that You are the Holy One of God.

Too many people have ruined Christianity by making the Bible say more than what it says. And honestly, I'm pretty sick of it. We have to read the Bible for ourselves so we don't get polluted by all the stupid teachings in the church today.

Seems to be the condense, I wonder what that is?

oh yeah, it is what Jesus himself said,

maybe they will hear? If even one hears. Gd is to be praised.amen brother

Eternally Grateful · Sep 20, 2020

Truthcampaign.org said:
No, you're here to discuss your interpretation of the Word, the Word that the Catholic Church through the Holy Spirit gave you. It's about you and you being right. Your interpretation, your rules...

Council of Rome - Wikipedia

seeyou can not even give God credit for this. And you want to convince me you think you speak from God?

you have not even responded to anyone’s post about what John 6 really says.
It’s obvious you are here on a mission.

good luck

John 6:66 - Why did many disciples stop following Jesus?

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