How to be saved (born again) and join the family of God!

justbyfaith · Sep 28, 2020

Mungo said:
You need to take all scripture into account, not just cherry pick.
Jesus said "He who believes and is baptized will be saved"

What it says is "He who believes and is baptized shall be saved..."

As opposed to "whosoever believeth in Him should not perish."

Believing alone means that you should not perish...which to me seems iffy.

If you are baptized also, it changes that iffyness into absoluteness.

I would also point out that this absoluteness can be obtained by fulfilling the condition of the promise in Romans 10:13. For the absolute word "shall" is also used in that verse...

Rom 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Truther · Sep 28, 2020

justbyfaith said:
Baptism does indeed save; but so does a mere calling on the name of the Lord (Romans 10:13).

We call on the name of the Lord(Jesus) during water baptism....

17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

justbyfaith · Sep 28, 2020

Truther said:
We call on the name of the Lord(Jesus) during water baptism.

We cannot do so apart from getting our bodies wet?

It seems to me that the holy scriptures teach that with the mouth confession is made unto salvation (Romans 10:9-10).

Truther · Sep 28, 2020

justbyfaith said:
We cannot do so apart from getting our bodies wet?

It seems to me that the holy scriptures teach that with the mouth confession is made unto salvation (Romans 10:9-10).

17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

...upon whom.

This is speaking of someone calling the name of Jesus over someone else(gentiles).

Water baptism.

Also, I confess Jesus daily to remain saved per Romans 10.

GISMYS_7 · Sep 28, 2020

Truther said:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

...upon whom.

This is speaking of someone calling the name of Jesus over someone else(gentiles).

Water baptism.

Also, I confess Jesus daily to remain saved per Romans 10.

If you are really saved you are saved for all eternity .

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 28, 2020

justbyfaith said:
Hi @Spurgeon's Girl,

It should be clear that in Acts 13:48, the Gentiles who lived in Pisidian Antioch are mentioned as being saved as the result of Paul turning from the Jews towards the Gentiles with the gospel.

However, this does not change the fact that Cornelius and friends were also Gentiles and were among the first of the Gentiles to be saved...and that the transitional period was in fact concerning Cornelius and friends.

As for predestination, I disagree with the hyper-Calvinistic philosophy that we are predestined by God's choice alone.

If that is the case, then God, arbitrarily, chooses people out for hell and they have no say in the matter. Do you see the problem with that? It is a God who is not love; however God is love (1 John 4:8, 1 John 4:16).

But if we are in fact predestinated according to foreknowledge, as the Bible dictates, and even as is mentioned in your blurb, then we are the ones who are responsible as human beings for whether we will be going to heaven or hell.

In the other scenario, God is completely responsible for people going to hell...because if He chooses some for heaven, then the rest go to hell also by God's predetermined choice. And such a concept makes the Lord out to be some sort of cosmic Monster.

Hope this helps...

No, I don't see a problem. Romans 9 says God has mercy upon whom he will have mercy. It also says you have no right to question the decisions God makes from before the foundation of the world. Here it is:

Romans 9:14-21

4 What should we say then? Is there injustice with God? Absolutely not! 15 For he tells Moses, I will show mercy to whom I will show mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16 So then, it does not depend on human will or effort but on God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture tells Pharaoh, I raised you up for this reason so that I may display my power in you and that my name may be proclaimed in the whole earth. 18 So then, he has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy and he hardens whom he wants to harden.

19 You will say to me, therefore, “Why then does he still find fault? For who resists his will?” 20 On the contrary, who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? Will what is formed say to the one who formed it, “Why did you make me like this?” 21 Or has the potter no right over the clay, to make from the same lump one piece of pottery for honor and another for

Scripture clears up your objection;

God is not a cosmic monster. On the contrary, I can make an argument that God is monster by allowing the non-elect to ever be born to make any choice at all. Salvation is completely 100% of the Lord. Nothing that a human does will change that.

You misheard what the video said. Look at it again.

Acts 13:48 says what is says 'those that were ordained were saved.

Do you think that God needs your help to save you?

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 28, 2020

amigo de christo said:
Yes , what was it the eunach asked phillip . See here is water , what does HINDER me from being baptized .
And peter said , Ye may if ye BELEIVE on the LORD JESUS with all your heart .
Infants do not make that choice so that baptism can count for nothing .
Only when a person truly comits to Christ does the baptism truly mean something .
Yes indeed . Let all rejoice in the LORD .

Love it.

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 28, 2020

Truther said:
Baptism for salvation officially began with the N.T. church at Pentecost(Acts 2:38).

Let's see what it says:

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 With many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!” 41 So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about three thousand people were added to them.

Where is 'belief' mentioned? One must believe first, yes?

Acts 13:48 says this:

48 When the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and honored the word of the Lord, and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.

amigo de christo · Sep 28, 2020

Spurgeon's Girl said:
Love it.

i can tell already that Francis would not be pleased with you . I SAY GLORY TO GOD .
Do yourself a favor , if francis ever says that amigo is the perfect christain , YOU better run so fast from me
your own shadow cannot keep up with you . cause that would make me false . He smiles not at my christanity .

amigo de christo · Sep 28, 2020

Spurgeon's Girl said:
Let's see what it says:

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 With many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!” 41 So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about three thousand people were added to them.

Where is 'belief' mentioned? One must believe first, yes?

Acts 13:48 says this:

48 When the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and honored the word of the Lord, and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.

man . francis would not be happy with you . REJOICE .

amigo de christo · Sep 28, 2020

Rejoice when men shall speak evil of you for JESUS sake , for so did they unto the true ones .
BUT WOE unto you when men shall speak well of you , for so did they unto the false prophets .
That is why i am saying REJOICE to spurgeon girl . REJOICE . and then REJOICE Some more .
JESUS is our HOPE and the BIBLE is our BOOK . PRAISE THE GLORIOUS KING JESUS .

GISMYS_7 · Sep 28, 2020

Spurgeon's Girl said:
Let's see what it says:

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 With many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!” 41 So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about three thousand people were added to them.

Where is 'belief' mentioned? One must believe first, yes?

Acts 13:48 says this:

48 When the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and honored the word of the Lord, and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.

So those who accepted his message were baptized===Yes!!! Believe, accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior THEN be baptized!!

Truther · Sep 28, 2020

GISMYS_7 said:
If you are really saved you are saved for all eternity .

...thanks to Acts 2:38.

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 28, 2020

amigo de christo said:
Rejoice when men shall speak evil of you for JESUS sake , for so did they unto the true ones .
BUT WOE unto you when men shall speak well of you , for so did they unto the false prophets .
That is why i am saying REJOICE to spurgeon girl . REJOICE . and then REJOICE Some more .
JESUS is our HOPE and the BIBLE is our BOOK . PRAISE THE GLORIOUS KING JESUS .

You are very kind. We must stand together to fight the evil of the Catholic organization. You are right, the man who praises socialism, worships wooden idols, caters to all manner of sin, and who supports something called a Dignity mass. I think that the majority of Catholics just haven't taken the time to do the work of the Bereans. When they do, they will see things differently. At this point, the Catholic church is Dead. The gates of hell have prevailed against them. They fund abortion, support grievous sin, steal from their own, and teach blatant heresy. May God help them.

Truther · Sep 28, 2020

Spurgeon's Girl said:
Let's see what it says:

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 With many other words he testified and strongly urged them, saying, “Be saved from this corrupt generation!” 41 So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about three thousand people were added to them.

Where is 'belief' mentioned? One must believe first, yes?

Acts 13:48 says this:

48 When the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and honored the word of the Lord, and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.

No baptism, no remission of sins.

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 28, 2020

Truther said:
No baptism, no remission of sins.

Not if you believe that belief has to come first. It absolutely is first.

Here is some commentary by Matt Slick.

Questions for those who believe baptism is necessary for salvation. | CARM.org

Rom. 4:5 says that he who believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness. So do you agree that when a person believes, he is righteous in God's sight?
1. If not, how do you not contradict what the scripture says?
2. If yes, then baptism isn't necessary; otherwise, they wouldn't be righteous in Christ's sight.
If a person who believes is not declared righteous, then why isn't he?
If a person who believes is declared righteous, then is he righteous without baptism?
Is a sinner who has prayed and asked the Lord Jesus to forgive him of his sins actually forgiven, or is he still in a state of damnation until he gets baptized?
If a person prays and asks Jesus to forgive him of all of his sins, is he forgiven or not?
1. Jesus said in John 14:14, "If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it."
2. If he is not forgiven, then aren't you saying that trust and faith in Christ isn't enough?
A ritual is a set of forms and practices. It is a ceremony. Baptism is a ritual, a ceremony where one person administers baptism to another person. Therefore, if you maintain that baptism is necessary for salvation, are you not saying that salvation is by faith and a ritual?
Can you please tell us if such a man who has believed in Christ and received him, yet dies without being baptized goes to eternal damnation?
1. If you say no, then baptism is not necessary for salvation.
2. If you say yes, then he is not declared righteous by faith.

justbyfaith · Sep 28, 2020

Spurgeon's Girl said:
God is not a cosmic monster.

I know that He isn't...

Because He does not arbitrarily send people to hell because it is "His good pleasure" to do so.

Instead, His love doesn't fail to give every person a choice as to whether they will believe God when they hear the word.

It is evident from holy scripture that mankind has free will (Joshua 24:15, Revelation 22:17, John 1:12).

Spurgeon's Girl said:
On the contrary, I can make an argument that God is monster by allowing the non-elect to ever be born to make any choice at all.

Let's hear it.

I would say that the non-elect are only non-elect because God foreknew that they would make the decision to reject Him upon hearing the word. From the perspective of eternity, the Lord knows who will receive and who will reject Him. From the perspective of time, each person makes a choice to either receive or reject Jesus when they hear the word of the Lord. So then, from time's perspective, entrance into heaven or damnation to hell is wholly based on that person's choice to either receive or reject Christ.

So the non-elect are born into time and their salvation is based on their choice in the matter. "If anyone receives Him, to them He gives the power to become a child of God." (John 1:12). "Whosoever wills, let him take of the water of life freely." (Revelation 22:17). "Choose ye this day whom ye will serve." (Joshua 24:15).

So the non-elect do not go to hell because of God's arbitrary choice in the matter; but because they choose to reject Jesus Christ when given the opportunity to receive Him.

How then is God a cosmic monster in that scenario?

He is only a cosmic monster if He has chosen arbitrarily to place certain people in hell and gives them no way out of that situation.

In Calvinism, it appears to me that even if someone wanted to believe in Jesus so that they might be saved, they simply cannot if they are not one of God's elect. This, to me, flies in the face of John 6:37. Jesus said, "If anyone comes to me, I will in no wise cast them out." But if someone is not of the elect, technically Jesus might indeed cast them out, though they may desire to come to Him, because if someone is not of the elect they technically cannot be saved.

It goes to extremes in some circles; to the point that some Calvinists forbad missionary work because the people that the missionary was sent to were of the non-elect and therefore they should just let them go to hell; because they cannot be saved anyway and therefore there is no point in going to them.

It also provides for a defeatist mentality. Those who believe in Calvinism, when faced with a decision to receive or reject Christ, are content to just sit back and wait for God to save them apart from any decision on their part. Que sirra, sirra. Whatever will be will be. A burden for one's own soul is thus discouraged because I can do nothing to save myself but must wait for God to make His decision concerning me and it has nothing to do with the choice of my free will.

However, it is written,

Act 2:40, And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

justbyfaith · Sep 29, 2020

An OnLine site for the Complete WORKS of CHARLES G. FINNEY

He has been spoken against, you can be sure; and yet, he has left behind him a legacy of many who have had lasting salvation and sanctification in Jesus Christ.

Spurgeon's Girl · Sep 29, 2020

justbyfaith said:
I know that He isn't...

Because He does not arbitrarily send people to hell because it is "His good pleasure" to do so.

Instead, His love doesn't fail to give every person a choice as to whether they will believe God when they hear the word.

It is evident from holy scripture that mankind has free will (Joshua 24:15, Revelation 22:17, John 1:12).

Let's hear it.

I would say that the non-elect are only non-elect because God foreknew that they would make the decision to reject Him upon hearing the word. From the perspective of eternity, the Lord knows who will receive and who will reject Him. From the perspective of time, each person makes a choice to either receive or reject Jesus when they hear the word of the Lord. So then, from time's perspective, entrance into heaven or damnation to hell is wholly based on that person's choice to either receive or reject Christ.

So the non-elect are born into time and their salvation is based on their choice in the matter. "If anyone receives Him, to them He gives the power to become a child of God." (John 1:12). "Whosoever wills, let him take of the water of life freely." (Revelation 22:17). "Choose ye this day whom ye will serve." (Joshua 24:15).

So the non-elect do not go to hell because of God's arbitrary choice in the matter; but because they choose to reject Jesus Christ when given the opportunity to receive Him.

How then is God a cosmic monster in that scenario?

He is only a cosmic monster if He has chosen arbitrarily to place certain people in hell and gives them no way out of that situation.

In Calvinism, it appears to me that even if someone wanted to believe in Jesus so that they might be saved, they simply cannot if they are not one of God's elect. This, to me, flies in the face of John 6:37. Jesus said, "If anyone comes to me, I will in no wise cast them out." But if someone is not of the elect, technically Jesus might indeed cast them out, though they may desire to come to Him, because if someone is not of the elect they technically cannot be saved.

It goes to extremes in some circles; to the point that some Calvinists forbad missionary work because the people that the missionary was sent to were of the non-elect and therefore they should just let them go to hell; because they cannot be saved anyway and therefore there is no point in going to them.

It also provides for a defeatist mentality. Those who believe in Calvinism, when faced with a decision to receive or reject Christ, are content to just sit back and wait for God to save them apart from any decision on their part. Que sirra, sirra. Whatever will be will be. A burden for one's own soul is thus discouraged because I can do nothing to save myself but must wait for God to make His decision concerning me and it has nothing to do with the choice of my free will.

However, it is written,

Act 2:40, And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

Tell you what if you can find a verse in the Bible that people have free will involved in their own salvation, post it.

I will address Acts 2:38-47. Do you know what it means to 'cherry pick' scripture outside of its context. Spend a couple of minutes and read through verse 47.

38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” 40 And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” 41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

42 And they devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. 43 And awe came upon every soul, and many wonders and signs were being done through the apostles. 44 And all who believed were together and had all things in common. 45 And they were selling their possessions and belongings and distributing the proceeds to all, as any had need. 46 And day by day, attending the temple together and breaking bread in their homes, they received their food with glad and generous hearts, 47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved.

And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved.

And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved.

It doesn't say they saved themselves, it says that the Lord added to them.

Notice also that the word 'believe' is not used anywhere in these passages.

Mungo · Sep 29, 2020

GISMYS_7 said:
So those who accepted his message were baptized===Yes!!! Believe, accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior THEN be baptized!!

38 And Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
No mention of belief. Just repent and be baptised and then you are saved.

41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.
Doesn't say they were saved before they were baptised.
Believe and be baptised - then they were saved
Just as Jesus said "He who believes and is baptized shall be saved..."

How to be saved (born again) and join the family of God!

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Active Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads