Is it a sin for a Christian to vote for a Democrat?

Prayer Warrior · Oct 19, 2020

Josho said:
These people aren't Pharisees though are they?

And I am surprised you didn't use this verse to justify cussing.

In some other thread someone used the same verse or a similar verse to justify bullying...

So now bullying, racism, name-calling, insulting, cursing, to hurt other people, to degrade others, to even demonize others, are now acceptable?

10 years ago, to make fun of someone because they were the bottom of the class, would have been considered "bullying." Making fun of people's speech may have been considered bullying too.

What has happened to conservative Christianity? Has some of it gone too far right? Why has this behaviour become so acceptable.

I will admit, I am annoyed, I was bullied at school. And now some Christians are calling this acceptable behaviour.

You do know how dangerous cursing can be right? And I know the dangers of it.

I know someone who has lost family members because of it, but she survived because Jesus kept her alive.

Apparently the power of the tongue of life and death has been forgotten by some.

If you want the Democrats to change, stop demonizing them, and start praying. You should not do both, you should not speak curses and blessings at the same time, they do not mix.

Some used to think making fun of other kids was innocent, some used to even call straight kids they didn't like gay, look at what has happened to a few of those kids now.

Do not underestimate the power of the tongue.

You missed my whole point, @Josho .

You likened name calling to cursing someone. I said they're not the same thing.

Of course, I believe we need to be careful about what we say! That's one of the reasons I've been going after all the gossip about Trump! But you don't seem to mind it. SILLY, PETTY, CHILDISH GOSSIP!

@Giuliano and I were actually having a good discussion on another thread without that! This world is facing some serious issues. I'm all for discussing the issues like adults! We don't have to agree with one another, but we can set aside the personal jabs and discuss the policies and laws that we find ineffective or even dangerous....

Don't lecture me about prayer. I've probably spent more hours praying than you've been alive.

historyb · Oct 19, 2020

Grailhunter said:
I don't know where the Democrats buried the Golden Rule. Where is the Golden Rule for the babies that are murdered? Where is the Golden Rule for those murdered by the mobs? Where is the Golden Rule for the children that have drugs pushed on them. Golden Rule man, do you know what it means. The Golden Rule does not mean you cannot speak the truth.

It does to some. To others the golden rule only applies to anyone but Conservative Christians

Grailhunter · Oct 19, 2020

Seven of Nine said:
Speaking God’s truth should not include acting like an obnoxious jerk. It’s no wonder young people are leaving the church in droves and rejecting the Gospel. It’s not surprising that non-Christians are calling evangelical Christians hypocrites for supporting a morally depraved man like Trump.

Yes I know, the Bible is obnoxious! Christ it obnoxious! Any one that speaks the truth is obnoxious. We should be quiet and let them have our children to have in every way! We should be quiet while they turn our country to communism. Ever heard that the truth hurts.

Giuliano · Oct 19, 2020

Prayer Warrior said:
You likened name calling to cursing someone. I said they're not the same thing.

Of course, I believe we need to be careful about what we say! That's one of the reasons I've been going after all the gossip about Trump! But you don't seem to mind it. SILLY, PETTY, CHILDISH GOSSIP!

There is this:

Matthew 5:22 YLT but I -- I say to you, that every one who is angry at his brother without cause, shall be in danger of the judgment, and whoever may say to his brother, Empty fellow! shall be in danger of the sanhedrim, and whoever may say, Rebel! shall be in danger of the gehenna of the fire.

Prayer Warrior · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
There is this:

Matthew 5:22 YLT but I -- I say to you, that every one who is angry at his brother without cause, shall be in danger of the judgment, and whoever may say to his brother, Empty fellow! shall be in danger of the sanhedrim, and whoever may say, Rebel! shall be in danger of the gehenna of the fire.

Yes, I'm very familiar with this verse, but @Josho was equating name calling with cursing. I explained to him that Jesus called the Pharisees some names, and I don't think He was cursing them.....

Matt 23:13-36--“But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you shut off the kingdom of heaven from people; for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in. [Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you devour widows’ houses, and for a pretense you make long prayers; therefore you will receive greater condemnation.]
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you travel around on sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
“Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘Whoever swears by the temple, that is nothing; but whoever swears by the gold of the temple is obligated.’ You fools and blind men! Which is more important, the gold or the temple that sanctified the gold? And, ‘Whoever swears by the altar, that is nothing, but whoever swears by the offering on it, he is obligated.’ You blind men, which is more important, the offering, or the altar that sanctifies the offering? Therefore, whoever swears by the altar, swears both by the altar and by everything on it. And whoever swears by the temple, swears both by the temple and by Him who dwells within it. And whoever swears by heaven, swears both by the throne of God and by Him who sits upon it.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cummin, and have neglected the weightier provisions of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness; but these are the things you should have done without neglecting the others. You blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and of the dish, but inside they are full of robbery and self-indulgence. You blind Pharisee, first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness. So you, too, outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers. You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
“Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city, so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Seven of Nine · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
There is this:

Matthew 5:22 YLT but I -- I say to you, that every one who is angry at his brother without cause, shall be in danger of the judgment, and whoever may say to his brother, Empty fellow! shall be in danger of the sanhedrim, and whoever may say, Rebel! shall be in danger of the gehenna of the fire.

1 John 3:15 "Anyone who hates a brother or sister is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him."

1 John 4:20-21 "If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also."

James 3:9-12 "With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse human beings, who have been made in God’s likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers and sisters, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers and sisters, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water."

Giuliano · Oct 19, 2020

Prayer Warrior said:
Yes, I'm very familiar with this verse, but @Josho was equating name calling with cursing. I explained to him that Jesus called the Pharisees some names, and I don't think He was cursing them.....

Matt 23:13-36--“But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you shut off the kingdom of heaven from people; for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in. [Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you devour widows’ houses, and for a pretense you make long prayers; therefore you will receive greater condemnation.]
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you travel around on sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
“Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘Whoever swears by the temple, that is nothing; but whoever swears by the gold of the temple is obligated.’ You fools and blind men! Which is more important, the gold or the temple that sanctified the gold? And, ‘Whoever swears by the altar, that is nothing, but whoever swears by the offering on it, he is obligated.’ You blind men, which is more important, the offering, or the altar that sanctifies the offering? Therefore, whoever swears by the altar, swears both by the altar and by everything on it. And whoever swears by the temple, swears both by the temple and by Him who dwells within it. And whoever swears by heaven, swears both by the throne of God and by Him who sits upon it.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cummin, and have neglected the weightier provisions of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness; but these are the things you should have done without neglecting the others. You blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and of the dish, but inside they are full of robbery and self-indulgence. You blind Pharisee, first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness. So you, too, outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers. You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
“Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city, so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Note please that Jesus was not lambasting the common folks. It is one thing to criticize leaders who are duping their followers and quite another to demonize the people they duped. If someone is following a bad leader, you aren't going to solve his problem by calling him a name. You need to show him how his leader is wrong.

Jesus also did not resort to childish language. It is childish to make fun of names, childish to use words like "demoncrats." If you want to be effective, you use precise language. Using "clever" play on words doesn't make anyone really clever. That's how children sometimes behave before they learn better. If they mature, they learn how to be more convincing by being less insulting.

Some insults backfire. Trump was talking the other day about how he was ahead in states where the people were intelligent. I guess that means if you're from a state where Biden is ahead, it means Trump thinks you're stupid.

Trump did something else I found amazingly foolish. He's trying to appeal to older voters. He really does need to get them out to vote for him. I do not think his retweeting "Biden for resident" helped. Did you see that? He may have been amused by the play on words, changing president to resident; but I think he should have realized some people wouldn't be amused. I thought it was childish.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump...p-tweet-biden-for-resident-meme-nursing-home/

Prayer Warrior · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
Jesus also did not resort to childish language.

Thank you @Giuliano for making my point for me! All this gossipy childish language against Trump needs to stop!

We ALL know that Trump is a rude crude New Yorker. Why do you feel the need to convince us of what we already know???

Let's move on and discuss issues, okay?

Giuliano · Oct 19, 2020

Prayer Warrior said:
Thank you @Giuliano for making my point for me! All this gossipy childish language against Trump needs to stop!

We ALL know that Trump is a rude crude New Yorker. Why do you feel the need to convince us of what we already know???

Let's move on and discuss issues, okay?

That is hard to do if Trump supporters are hurling childish taunts at all Democrats as if they were all demonic. It is also hard to do when his supporters talk about how virtuous he is. It is also hard to do when the President hurls taunts and insults almost daily. The level of discourse is pathetic.

Prayer Warrior · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
That is hard to do if Trump supporters are hurling childish taunts at all Democrats as if they were all demonic. It is also hard to do when his supporters talk about how virtuous he is. It is also hard to do when the President hurls taunts and insults almost daily. The level of discourse is pathetic.

You're exaggerating. Not "all Trump supporters" are "hurling childish taunts at all Democrats." I haven't!

Who's talking about how virtuous Trump is? I haven't!

I have NO control over what Trump says. I've ALREADY said that I don't approve of his rudeness--more than once. BUT I do approve of some of his policies! I have said that I'm proud of him for supporting unborn babies and Israel. But that's not okay, is it? Why do you get to dictate to me what I can and cannot think about my president? Who is trying to control whom?

WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME??? What would make you happy @Giuliano ? If I say terrible things about Trump, like some of you are doing, will this make you happy?

Ziggy · Oct 19, 2020

Is it a sin for a Christian to vote for a Democrat?
What an interesting question.
I personally don't believe anyone should vote for a party. They should vote for the individual that aligns best with their own beliefs.
And each indiviual regardless of party have their own ideology.
Not all Republicans are Christian. And not all Democrats are Atheists.
You should vote in the person not party you feel best represents you.
And you have to pay attention because sometimes they just say what they think you want to hear.
But their actions speak louder than words.
Maybe google someone your interested in. Find out where they've worked, who they associate themselves with. How they have stood on issues in the past.
There are a lot of wolves in sheeps clothing.
You vote for the person you want to speak on your behalf. That has your best interest in mind.
That wants to go in the same direction you want to go.
Sometimes that can be a person on either side of the aisle.
Research is important.
Hugs

BreadOfLife · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
What happened to the Golden Rule?

You BURIED the Golden Rule when you chose to support the abomination of Abortion by voting for a demonic agenda.
Don't look for "mercy" when you show NONE to those who are most vulnerable and innocent.

Shame on ALL of you who support this abomination before God - then throw HIS sacred Word around in a vain effort to cover your sin by condemning others for holding you accountable.

Good luck trying to explain your way OUT of this when you stand before Almighty God on the Day of your Judgement . . .

BreadOfLife · Oct 19, 2020

Ziggy said:
Is it a sin for a Christian to vote for a Democrat?
What an interesting question.
I personally don't believe anyone should vote for a party. They should vote for the individual that aligns best with their own beliefs.
And each indiviual regardless of party have their own ideology.
Not all Republicans are Christian. And not all Democrats are Atheists.
You should vote in the person not party you feel best represents you.
And you have to pay attention because sometimes they just say what they think you want to hear.
But their actions speak louder than words.
Maybe google someone your interested in. Find out where they've worked, who they associate themselves with. How they have stood on issues in the past.
There are a lot of wolves in sheeps clothing.
You vote for the person you want to speak on your behalf. That has your best interest in mind.
That wants to go in the same direction you want to go.
Sometimes that can be a person on either side of the aisle.
Research is important.
Hugs

This is a naive post.
A candidate who has aligned himself with a particular party does so because they accept (for the most part) - the PLATFORM of that particular party. In other words, you won't find a staunchly conservative Democrat - just as you won't find a Leftist Republican.

It's a nice thought, perhaps, to think that you can vote solely for an individual who will NOT be influenced by either Party's agenda - but that's NOT the way politics work in the REAL world . . .

Giuliano · Oct 19, 2020

Prayer Warrior said:
You're exaggerating. Not "all Trump supporters" are "hurling childish taunts at all Democrats." I haven't!

Who's talking about how virtuous Trump is? I haven't!

I have NO control over what Trump says. I've ALREADY said that I don't approve of his rudeness--more than once. BUT I do approve of some of his policies! I have said that I'm proud of him for supporting unborn babies and Israel. But that's not okay, is it? Why do you get to dictate to me what I can and cannot think about my president? Who is trying to control whom?

WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME??? What would make you happy @Giuliano ? If I say terrible things about Trump, like some of you are doing, will this make you happy?

I think asking the question if it is a sin to vote for a Democrat is provocative and judgmental. I believe in freedom of conscience; and I don't need pressure put on me that people will think I'm a sinner if I vote for a Democrat. In fact, it makes me apt to look at Republicans as the party of narrow-mindedness and religious bigotry. When Trump says God is on his side, it repulses me. I don't need or want lectures on religion from a politician. When he waved the Bible, it repulsed me.

Supporting Israel? In my opinion, Jared Kushner whose family gave money to support illegal Israeli settlements was behind that. And churches who think Jesus can't come unless another Temple is built first so Antichrist can come are behind that. I don't think Donald Trump can make Jesus come any faster by supporting the corrupt Netanyahu.

We have already gone over the abortion issue. Trump has done nothing to save lives. It's empty talk to get evangelicals to vote for him. It's hot air.

Ziggy · Oct 19, 2020

BreadOfLife said:
This is a naive post.
A candidate who has aligned himself with a particular party does so because they accept (for the most part) - the PLATFORM of that particular party. In other words, you won't find a staunchly conservative Democrat - just as you won't find a Leftist Republican.

It's a nice thought, perhaps, to think that you can vote solely for an individual who will NOT be influenced by either Party's agenda - but that's NOT the way politics work in the REAL world . . .

Kind of reminds me of Paul Ryan. They aren't called RINO's for no reason.
And some Democrats not many I admit are what we would call moderate.
Sometimes a person will cross the aisle so to speak to vote for issues that are not platform based.
It's getting more difficult to find moderates on either side I admit.
That's why I say research is important.
Thank you for replying
HUGS

Grailhunter · Oct 19, 2020

Ziggy said:
Kind of reminds me of Paul Ryan. They aren't called RINO's for no reason.
And some Democrats not many I admit are what we would call moderate.
Sometimes a person will cross the aisle so to speak to vote for issues that are not platform based.
It's getting more difficult to find moderates on either side I admit.
That's why I say research is important.
Thank you for replying
HUGS

Ok, Ziggy, take a deep breath and give me your best answer.
Define moderate....it does not matter....democrat or republican....moderate from a Christian perspective. What would a moderate politician vote against and what would they vote for.
Keeping in mind that it does not really matter if a politician kisses babies or has a nice smile or even if you like him or her...all that matters is the laws they attempt to pass and how they vote. If you do not agree with me then explain what ultimately matters.

Ziggy · Oct 19, 2020

Giuliano said:
I think asking the question if it is a sin to vote for a Democrat is provocative and judgmental. I believe in freedom of conscience; and I don't need pressure put on me that people will think I'm a sinner if I vote for a Democrat. In fact, it makes me apt to look at Republicans as the party of narrow-mindedness and religious bigotry. When Trump says God is on his side, it repulses me. I don't need or want lectures on religion from a politician. When he waved the Bible, it repulsed me.

Supporting Israel? In my opinion, Jared Kushner whose family gave money to support illegal Israeli settlements was behind that. And churches who think Jesus can't come unless another Temple is built first so Antichrist can come are behind that. I don't think Donald Trump can make Jesus come any faster by supporting the corrupt Netanyahu.

We have already gone over the abortion issue. Trump has done nothing to save lives. It's empty talk to get evangelicals to vote for him. It's hot air.

I would like to respond to one issue in this post.
That issue has to do with Trump "waving" the Bible.
Actually he was holding it upside down.

The Master of trolls we call him.
Back in 2000 Bill Clinton stood in front of a church across from the White House and held a Bible upside down just like Trump did.
The media however never made a single comment about it.
There is an article plauding over Clinton and his flaunting of the Bible.
Now there's an act of hypocrisy...
Anywhoo...
The reason why Trump held the Bible upside down in front of the church was to prove the bias of the media.
But like everything else, people take it personally.
And Trump can't control what you think or what your told to believe.
He can only show you the truth of the bias of the media.
I don't suppose I have enough posts to provide a link yet,
but when I do if you like I will post the article.
Or you can look up, 2000 Bill Clinton Church.. keywords
You will find a Politifact article denouncing that Clinton and Trump held up bibles at the "same church" .
There is a picture however that shows Clinton holding the Bible upside down which they don't dispute.
And that is what Trump was trolling.
The Bias of the Media.. thats what he is always trolling... always.
It's not personal. It's not about you or me. It's about Hypocrisy.
Have to love these fact checkers though LOL.
HUGS

BreadOfLife · Oct 19, 2020

Ziggy said:
Kind of reminds me of Paul Ryan. They aren't called RINO's for no reason.
And some Democrats not many I admit are what we would call moderate.
Sometimes a person will cross the aisle so to speak to vote for issues that are not platform based.
It's getting more difficult to find moderates on either side I admit.
That's why I say research is important.
Thank you for replying
HUGS

I am ALL for politicians crossing the aisle and working through compromise. That's what made this a great nation.
However - the agendas of the two largest parties have become so polarized in recent years that they have made it almost impossible for this to happen on many important issues.

I put most of the blame for this on the Democrats because it is THEIR agenda that as gone through the most radical changes in recent years.
The term "Kennedy Democrat", which is what my parents were no longer exists. Kennedy had more in common with the Republican party of today than the Democrat party.

Grailhunter · Oct 19, 2020

Notice the red place keepers at the bottom...right side up

Grailhunter · Oct 19, 2020

Again notice the red place keepers on the bottom

5e4627443c3abec9eb35dfaa7cf1c3e01c-trump-with-bible-dc-protests.rsquare.w700.jpg

Is it a sin for a Christian to vote for a Democrat?

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