I believe that many pastors here in CB are asked so often, "what denimination?". I can't count the times I've been asked. My answer is Christian, non-deniminational. Then they ask "well who are you accountable to?". My answer Father,Son, Holy Ghost. It is hard to believe that one can pick and choose Scripture and wham got a denomination. I'm forced to ask what do you do with the rest of the Gospel. Jesus said;"He did not come to change the scripture, but that scripture would be fullfilled Matthew 5:17-18,KJV . John 3:16 is the whole Word of God, the complete summation of God's Love Letter to the World. Our Father's Ministries is a Full Gospel Ministry. We believe in the Gifts of the Spirit, that Jesus is the Way,the Truth, and the Life, there is no other Way to the Father but by Jesus Christ. Acts 10:11-13; For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on Him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich, unto all that call upon Him. For whosoever shall call upon the Name of the Lord shall be saved. In John's Revelation 22:18B ; If nay man shall add unto these things God shall add unto him the plagues of this Book . v.19; And if any man shall take away from the words of the Book of Prophecy , God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the Holy City, and from the things which are written in this Book. In our language God is saying quite clearly, "don't mess with it!". Pretty clear with me. We hear people say well it is all according to interpretation, (I smell cop out here), if one is reading God's Word under the Guidance of the Holy Spirit, one would see the One interpretation that counts. If the reader has a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, the same Holy Spirit from Jesus Christ will be in their heart. Denomination is religion nothing short of that, anyone think for one minute that when we stand before Jesus, He will ask us what denomination are we? Any one who does think that I have a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell.lol. There are two types of people in God's eyes believers and non-believers. That is the end of denominational Buffet right there.The only title I'm interested in wearing is "a sinner saved by grace.". The only Words when all is said and done is "well done my good and faithful servant" which I would win only by His grace and righteousness, certainly not on my own. Love You All In Jesus Name..
Denominational Buffet
- Thread starter pastorlesofm
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Selene
New Member
Hello Pastorlesofm,
But there are a lot of people who say that they have the Holy Spirit in them, and still you get different interpretations. So, how can one know for certain who is correct? The fact that there are over 30,000 different Christian sects is evidence that Scripture is difficult to interpret. For example, if I were to write the following statement:
I never said that you stole money.
People reading this above statement 2000 years from now can interprete this simple statement in 4 different ways:
1) "I never said that you stole money" could imply that it was another person who made the statement.
2) "I never said that YOU stole money" could imply that the person stated that it was someone else who stole the money.
3) "I never said that you STOLE money." could imply that the person meant that the money was borrowed rather than stolen.
4) "I never said that you stole MONEY." could imply that it was not money that was stolen but something else.
If it is possible to interpret this one statement into 4 different meanings, how much more the Bible?
In Christ,
Selene
But there are a lot of people who say that they have the Holy Spirit in them, and still you get different interpretations. So, how can one know for certain who is correct? The fact that there are over 30,000 different Christian sects is evidence that Scripture is difficult to interpret. For example, if I were to write the following statement:
I never said that you stole money.
People reading this above statement 2000 years from now can interprete this simple statement in 4 different ways:
1) "I never said that you stole money" could imply that it was another person who made the statement.
2) "I never said that YOU stole money" could imply that the person stated that it was someone else who stole the money.
3) "I never said that you STOLE money." could imply that the person meant that the money was borrowed rather than stolen.
4) "I never said that you stole MONEY." could imply that it was not money that was stolen but something else.
If it is possible to interpret this one statement into 4 different meanings, how much more the Bible?
In Christ,
Selene
There is only one Holy Spirit, One true teacher.
I speak in tongues and have operated in the Gifts many times. God often uses me to give a "Word" to someone and have operated in the Prophet office on a very limited level.
There is one common interpetion factor I have found that determins how one precieves the Word of God, I have also found that the Word is eternal, and limitless in understanding even when just looking at a few scriptures.
God often shows people according to their faith light in the Word. This may not agree with what we saw, be we are not that person.
Mar 11:20 And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Mar 11:21 And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
What do we preach on here? That someone not bearing fruit next to Jesus will dry up at the roots? Certainly we can make that connection. Fig trees with Leaves normally have fruit on them, so this could be a person that from a distance looked as they were Godly, but upon close inspection and looking though the leaves, we see no fruit. they are cut from the vine (Jesus)
We can get a whole sermon out of this.
Someone else will look at it, and miss all that, but read the verses below and conclude that Jesus was using that tree as an example that there is power in our words, and we will have what we say. They may not even make a connection to the tree not bearing fruit.
The Word is deep, and just a few scriptures can mean different things to different people.
Mat 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
The one common factor that effects scriptures interpetion is, how good do you think God is?
Jesus said see ye first the Righteousness of God, and all these things will be added...........Righteousness just means right standing with God. Understand the free gift of righteousness.
Some will look at that and turn it around. I need to find out how righteous God is.
Rom 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
So, I believe God, and God is righteousness and just to perform his Word, which causes me to have more faith, and believe God, and trust God to meet my needs like Jesus said in Matt 6.
They both can be correct............... How you precieve your standing with God (Righteousness) will determine what your able to recieve from him.
So, how good is God?
We interpet scripture based on our belief of God's character and nature. What level we think God is Good, will determine how we look at many scriptures.
JOB:
Someone that feels God is not that good, will read Job based on their understanding of God's Character and nature.
God is good, but there are times when God will Allow or give permission to have someones children murdered just to prove something. I mean he is God, and can do as he wishes. It is better to have children murdered for God's greater purpose.
Job went though untold grief, but that is how people precieve God, and so interpet the scripture that way.
Someone that believes God is Good, and wants to help and bless us, will look at Job and say, "That can't be so" God would not do that, so they do their study based on God not the one being at fault with what happened to Job.
Some claim that God wants them sick to get some greater glory, but when it comes to their own children they do all they can to ease the pain. God must not be that good of a father, but they don't see it that way.
Jesus Is Lord.
Remeber that God is not the author of confusion. So if God isn't the author who is? Satan=man=religion=confusion. Look at this:
B= Book of
I= Instruction
B=Before
L=Leaving
E=Earth
God's Word is such that the simplest of man could understand it. It is precise every period,comma, question mark,crossing of the letter T God has a purpose and then when reading the Word two very much needed ingredients are needed Prayer and Faith to call upon the Holy Spirit to Teach and Guide, give understanding. When left to man, we wind up with confusion. Why? Because one of the above two ingredients was omitted. When Jesus said "I am the Way,the Truth and the Life, there is no other way to the Father but by Me." Should there be any doubt as to the Way to the Father? It is pretty clear. One evidence is see how many times Jesus demonstrates this in the Gospel, look at what the actual witnesses say about this claim. With prayer and faith and a call on the Holy Spirit the Truth is revealed. Another thing that happens so often is man tries to bring the Lord down to man's way of thinking, this is a fruuitlees effort on the part of man. When God told Adam and Eve not to eat of a certain tree and why, Adam and Eve did not have two different interpretations of what God meant. The author of the confusion in Adam and Eve's case was who? Look at Jesus in the wilderness being tried by Satan, did Jesus and Satan have confusion when Jesus confronted Satan with the Word? Satan tried the same as he did with Adam and Eve by confusion of the Word to tempt Jesus, but when Jesus responded without doubt to Satan, Satan backed down , because he knew Jesus had no doubt in the Word of God. Not even Satan had to check the different interpretations of what Jesus was saying, once confronted with it. This is how the Lord intended for us to read and understand the Word of God. Don't worry how man interprets the Word of God but seek the Holy Spirit to interpret it to you. Satan loves to use his weapon of doubt on the Body of Christ, sadly many times he succeeds. When you go to the Word, pray before you start to read, then, read through the chapter, then go back to the beginning and call upon the Holy Spirit to Guide you through again the chapter, to reveal God's message to you and ask the Holy Spirit to place the meaning in your heart that day to meditate (digest) that day, and apply to your life that day. Do this and I believe there will be no room for any doubt. The Lord Bless You all. Love you in Jesus Name
Great job my Brother, great enlightenment. Praise God for using you as He does.
Wonderful post Pasttorles and so true there is no denominations in Gods Word there is only under the law or under grace but even the law was the school teacher leading to Christ and grace. All denomination are of men all things not written are of men religions of men are based interptations and traditions of men ..the Word was written to all mankind.
A denomination name on your church will not save anyone.
Eveyone claims they are the right church ..there are 7 churches in Revelation all think they were the right church yet God was only pleased with two. They both taught the same thing..and its not taught by any religion today ..
Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
This is exactly why we have denominations. (It's one of those facepalm times.)
We are first and foremost Christians. That is a fact that seems neglected amongst the denominational choices out there. I'm doing this to rag on any one person, but we see the above time and again in simple posts like these. Whether it's an inclusive or exclusive statement, you get little caveats like this where certain gifts, actions, etc. have to be possessed in order to qualify someone. It's like instead of just simply saying "I am Christian!" it comes out as "I am Christian...but now read the small print because I am this type..."
You see in threads like this, churches, office discussions, or whatever. I've even seen it on tags, bumper stickers, and t-shirts.
[bible=Ephesians 4:1-6 KJV]
I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.
[/bible]
I try to remember that passage - the whole chapter of Ephesians 4:1-32 when I look upon another friend. I don't qualify it with rapture, tongues, healing, smoking, drinking, past sins or anything else. One faith and one Baptism doesn't mean there are levels and certainly means I am no more than the next person. So I don't create things or state things to make myself feel better or build me up.
My post was not to lift or sperate myself. Every believer should operate in the Gifts of the Spirit. I was responding to Pastor Les statement of faith that they believe in the gifts of the Spirit.
There are denominations that do not believe in that stuff Hence the title of the thread.
Jesus is Lord.
There are denominations that do not believe in that stuff Hence the title of the thread.
Jesus is Lord.
6stringedsignseeker
New Member
There's a church here in Texas... not a big church, in fact it's a store front church where a lot of their congregation are rockers, and punks, and even goths (don't judge... they need Christ too) and such. It's really a come as you are church. I've never visited the church but there's a great big sign on the building reading.... Religion Destroys, Christ Saves. That's really along the lines of how I see things. I won't claim any denomination. Even if I attend a babtist church, I will not call myself Babtist. I will not call myself Penticostal (I know I'm not spelling that right), or Methodist, etc, etc. I simply and only call myself christian. One of the main reasons so many christians are divided on so many issues is denominations and their man made doctrines. This of course doesn't make any denomination any less christian than me or another denomination... we are all part of "THE church," the body of believers of Christ the whole world over. Unfortunately however, many of us see things completely different than the next, causing division. I don't like titles, and will claim only one... christian.
The reason there are so many various denominational churches in the world is the same reason there are millions of threads and millions of viewpoints on (Christian) forums .
Don't fool yourselves into thinking we are some kind of non denominational purist Christians.
We are all guilty of that which we preach against.
OUCH !!
Fire away.
Don't fool yourselves into thinking we are some kind of non denominational purist Christians.
We are all guilty of that which we preach against.
OUCH !!
Fire away.
Brother, the storefront chuch reminds me of the little storefront chuch I was asked to preach in, we sent them fliers that we had as they wanted a big crowd to be there for me. Well when I got there, there was the Pastor ,his wife and two children. The pastor blamed himself and apologized to me as well as wanted to reschedule. The message the Lord layed on my heart was about the many times Jesus ministered to one or two people. Who was there was exactly who the Lord wanted to be there including myself.All I know is that the Lord caused an increase in that church, not because I preached there either, it was the Lord's Will and calling.
Selene
New Member
Hello Pastorlesofm,
Even in this non-denominational forum, you have Christians interpreting the same bibilical scripture differently, and I'm sure these Christians would all say that they have the Holy Spirit in them. For example, in just one thread someone posted about keeping the Sabbath. Under that thread, you will see a Christian saying that they don't need to keep the Sabbath day because he/she interpreted the word "rest" differently and think it has nothing to do with the Fourth Commandment. Others say they don't need to keep the Sabbath because they are not under the law. Others say that the Sabbath should be kept because Jesus never got rid of the law. Then you have some who say the Sabbath is on a Saturday. Others say it's on a Sunday. Then others say it is everyday. This is what I meant.
There are more than 30,000 denominations simply because people interpret the Bible differently and don't agree with the other denominations. So, they leave that church and formed another church or denomination. Thus, because of disagreements, you have a baptist, methodist, presbyterian, etc......and non-denominations are included in this category. Non-denominations exist for the same reason that denominations exist. It's because of disagreements. That is how I see it. So far, from my observation, there seems to be MORE disagreements in non-denomination than in denomination churches. How then would one settle the disagreements in a non-denomination? For example, how does one settle the disagreements regarding the Sabbath Day?
In Christ,
Selene
Do you think the Lord would create 30,000 interpretations of His Word. To me that is chaos, would an orderly God have that as the result of His Word. Some churches that the Lord gave me the priviledge of preaching in did not want me to mention the Blood of Jesus or His sacrifice on the Cross, some didnot want His resurrection mentioned . Jesus tells us to go out and preach, be His witnesses to His Finished Work that others might be saved. Without the above ingredients of the Gospel it is fruitless to expect souls to come to Jesus. Paul said in I Corinthians 1:23a But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block; and unto the Greeks foolishness; v.24; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. v.25; Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. The confusion is when man tries to bring the thoughts of God down to the level of man, instead of exercising faith in the Word and Guidance of the Holy Spirit who inspired man in the very writing of God's Word. If man could believe that the Finger of God through the inspiritation of the Holy Spirit comes directly from the Throne of God.
Selene:
Jesus the Blood the washes away all sin.
Jesus the resurrected one.
Jesus the way, truth and life.
Jesus the crucified for us.
Jesus the only way to the Father.
Jesus is Lord!!!!
Jesus Makes us free, free from sin.
If a Church has got that right, then everything is OK.............................. What day the Sabbath is, is not even important...........We don't have to talk about that over lunch............. You speak in tongues, or do not speak in tongues, is not even important...... we don't have to talk about that. If you should eat port or not, is not even important, we don't have to talk about that over lunch.
We have lots in common and lots we can work together and talk about. if you believe the above.
If you tell me that there are other ways to God, if you tell me there is was no resurrection, if you tell me that Jesus was not crucified for us, If you tell me it's OK to have Gay men and Women take the pulpit.............. Then We have nothing to talk about.
Jesus Is Lord.
Jesus the Blood the washes away all sin.
Jesus the resurrected one.
Jesus the way, truth and life.
Jesus the crucified for us.
Jesus the only way to the Father.
Jesus is Lord!!!!
Jesus Makes us free, free from sin.
If a Church has got that right, then everything is OK.............................. What day the Sabbath is, is not even important...........We don't have to talk about that over lunch............. You speak in tongues, or do not speak in tongues, is not even important...... we don't have to talk about that. If you should eat port or not, is not even important, we don't have to talk about that over lunch.
We have lots in common and lots we can work together and talk about. if you believe the above.
If you tell me that there are other ways to God, if you tell me there is was no resurrection, if you tell me that Jesus was not crucified for us, If you tell me it's OK to have Gay men and Women take the pulpit.............. Then We have nothing to talk about.
Jesus Is Lord.
6stringedsignseeker
New Member
That is so true.... after all, having church doesn't really mean anything about going into a building with a steeple full of people. church is the body of believers, and when even a few are gathered together to teach and hear God's word and fellowship and praise His name... well in my opinion that's church! I have gotten more church sitting with a few friends outside of a coffee shop than I've gotten in a building sometimes.
God can move amongst a few just as he can move amongst thousands!That is so true.... after all, having church doesn't really mean anything about going into a building with a steeple full of people. church is the body of believers, and when even a few are gathered together to teach and hear God's word and fellowship and praise His name... well in my opinion that's church! I have gotten more church sitting with a few friends outside of a coffee shop than I've gotten in a building sometimes.God can move amongst a few just as he can move amongst thousands!
Indeed
Selene
New Member
The question I ask is how do you settle the many disagreements that you have in a non-denominational church when all of them are claiming to have the Holy Spirit? God did not create more than 30,000 different interpretation of His Word because there is only one Truth. But how do you settle the many disagreements that you obviously have and determine who really has the Spirit of Truth?
My brother, under this thread, you were already judged of being in a denomination because you admitted to speaking in tongues.
That is funny........................ cmon Selene........ I know Catholics that have been filled with the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues, they still hold on to their church though. Tongues is not a denominational gift.
My point is, that we can stay on the subject of Jesus, in which we all argree if we are part of the body of Christ. The error comes when we make Jesus out to what He is not. It is focused on Jesus and the Church. Everything else. Healing, tongues, sabbaths, the way we Baptise, Means nothing compared to being born again, and knowing the Lord.
Jesus Is Lord.
Selene
New Member
Brother Mike,
We don't speak in tongues in the way that you mean. My priest is from Ecuador and he speaks 7 different languages. I speak only two different languages.
In Christ,
Selene
01CobraVortech
New Member
Well the good thing about Heaven is that we'll be one denomination and I'm certainly anxious to see what real estate the Lord has waiting for me.
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