How Do We, Will We, See Christ?

A good question whirlwind, but, I got lost in your lengthy post and could not find your own answer in it.
fivesense.

whirlwind said:

I try to keep them short but they keep growing and growing and growing.

Bottom line....I don't believe He literally returns in His earthly body but in His One body...in us.

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O.K.! Got It! Thanks
fivesense

John 14:8-12 Philip saith unto Him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known Me, Philip? he that hath seen Me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father? Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of Myself: but the Father that dwelleth in Me, He doeth the works. Believe Me that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me: or else believe Me for the very works' sake. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on Me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto My Father.

whirlwind said:

14:16-19 And I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. Yet a little while, and the world seeth Me no more; but ye see Me: because I live, ye shall live also.

There He has shown us the Father, the Son and the Comforter. They are One and they are with us...in us...forever!
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whirlwind said:

If we love Him then we love the Father and They "come unto" us and "make Our abode with" us. They "manifest" in us. We are One.

My question in this study is.....Does He literally appear again? Or...is His appearance in us? Is that why the world will "seeth Me no more?" Instead it sees Him in us? Are we the clouds of heaven in which He comes?

He comes in and with the clouds. He dwells in us, walks in us, abides in us. Although we are of His body....

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Yes we are. The cloud is the cloud of witnesses of the past present and future.

Hebrews 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset [us], and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

The cloud also represents the Spirit of God Himself. It is the same cloud ( Spirit ) that led the children of Israel through the wilderness.

whirlwind said:

He IS the Word and He, the Word of God, came unto us. We are "children of the most High." That is AWESOME to understand! But, although those truths are written "and the scripture cannot be broken," it is also written....

Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in My name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.​

As true believers are in Christ and are of Christ....others will say they too are Christ and that He dwells in them but....

11 Corinthians 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.​

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Jesus never directly claimed to be the Father or the Christ, yet He never denied it either when people said He was the Christ.. Jesus always said " I am in Him and He is in me"
John the Baptist was also in Christ and Christ was also in Him but John denied being the Christ and pointed to Jesus as the Christ.

You will notice in scripture that when the disciples said He was the Christ . He told them to not tell anyone that He was the Christ. He told Simon that flesh and blood had not revealed it to him but the Father had given him that revelation. ( Matt 16:17)
Matt 16:20 Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.

The scripture "Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in My name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many." can mean that some people will be calling themselves Christ and will deceive many . However, that would be far too obvious for most people and most Christians would ignore that kind of claim anyway. The deception is far more subtle than that. To me it means that many false teachers will be teaching that Jesus is the Christ and will still be deceiving people. They base their deceptions on the Truth that Jesus is the Christ but still preach false doctrines about Jesus Christ. .
These false teachers and preachers are in Christianity today preaching another Jesus, another spirit, a false Christ and are deceiving many at this very time. The real Jesus will tell them " I never knew you". Why ? because they never knew Him either but had been deceived by a false Christ, another Jesus who is as wishy washy and lukewarm as all hypocrites and who will never offend them by telling them they are hypocrites in case it hurts their feelings or offends their egos.

Mar 13:22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if [it were] possible, even the elect.

Matt 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

whirlwind said:

:lol: I try to keep them short but they keep growing and growing and growing.

Bottom line....I don't believe He literally returns in His earthly body but in His One body...in us.

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That is correct. Jesus returned to His very own disciples before they died as He promised them and that promise is the same for all future disciples.
Jesus promised to never leave us nor forsake us.
Those who are IN HIM and He is IN them have no need to wait for any "second coming" of Jesus since He is always with them and IN them.

Jesus is here on earth today in the flesh of His physical body on earth which is composed of many members
Whatever people do to His children they do it to Him.
Anyone who teaches that Jesus is not on earth in the flesh today is not of God.

1 John 2:4 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh today.
Jesus Christ did come in the flesh in the past.
Jesus Christ will continue to come in the flesh in the future. Not just one time but every day like the sun shines from the east to the west every day and those who LOOK for Him today and in the future will SEE Him in Spirit and in the flesh of HIS body on earth in the cloud of witnesses on earth today.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
The world will never see Him again. The carnal minded worldly people will not see Him.

The world will never see Him in the flesh any more in spite of the fact that He is always standing right in front of them. They will not recognise Him any better than the Pharisees in the bible stories recognized Jesus as being the Son of God.
False prophets and false teachers hate the Word of Truth as much as the Pharisees hated the Truth.
Jesus is that Truth which they hate and reject.

skyangel said:

That is correct. Jesus returned to His very own disciples before they died as He promised them and that promise is the same for all future disciples.
Jesus promised to never leave us nor forsake us.
Those who are IN HIM and He is IN them have no need to wait for any "second coming" of Jesus since He is always with them and IN them.

Jesus is here on earth today in the flesh of His physical body on earth which is composed of many members
Whatever people do to His children they do it to Him.
Anyone who teaches that Jesus is not on earth in the flesh today is not of God.

1 John 2:4 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh today.
Jesus Christ did come in the flesh in the past.
Jesus Christ will continue to come in the flesh in the future. Not just one time but every day like the sun shines from the east to the west every day and those who LOOK for Him today and in the future will SEE Him in Spirit and in the flesh of HIS body on earth in the cloud of witnesses on earth today.

Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
The world will never see Him again. The carnal minded worldly people will not see Him.

The world will never see Him in the flesh any more in spite of the fact that He is always standing right in front of them. They will not recognise Him any better than the Pharisees in the bible stories recognized Jesus as being the Son of God.
False prophets and false teachers hate the Word of Truth as much as the Pharisees hated the Truth.
Jesus is that Truth which they hate and reject.

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Are you quite prepared to surrender your beliefs in submission to the word of God, or does your intricate compilation of mixed dispensations have no room for a humble approach to reason? I should like to point out that much of what you project proceeds out of want to be a teacher, and, as such will receive the stricter judgment of the Body. Should you desire to affect the Body of Christ in an effective and useful way, be prepared to surrender your beliefs to the revealed word of God, and not be so reliant upon reasoning from a human perspective. It appears to me that you have much to give to the saints, but something is in the way.

fivesense

fivesense said:

Are you quite prepared to surrender your beliefs in submission to the word of God, or does your intricate compilation of mixed dispensations have no room for a humble approach to reason? I should like to point out that much of what you project proceeds out of want to be a teacher, and, as such will receive the stricter judgment of the Body. Should you desire to affect the Body of Christ in an effective and useful way, be prepared to surrender your beliefs to the revealed word of God, and not be so reliant upon reasoning from a human perspective. It appears to me that you have much to give to the saints, but something is in the way.

fivesense

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I live in total submission and surrender to the Word Himself not to any man made interpretation of the Word of God.
I abide in Him and He abides in me.
The word of God is the same Yesterday Today and Forever. When you understand that from the Lords point of view with the mind of Christ you will understand that the dispensations of the carnal mind are irrelevant.
Time is irrelevant in the Spiritual realm where a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as a day which is as yesterday which is passed..
I am not of this world.
I am one with the the Lord.
We have the mind of Christ.
Christ is never wrong.
If you doubt that then maybe you need to read your own post and apply it to yourself.

Intruiging skyeangel, did not Jesus say,
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

That makes 3 not 2.

Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
Joh 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
Joh 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
Joh 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

In His LOve

skyangel said:

I live in total submission and surrender to the Word Himself not to any man made interpretation of the Word of God.
I abide in Him and He abides in me.
The word of God is the same Yesterday Today and Forever. When you understand that from the Lords point of view with the mind of Christ you will understand that the dispensations of the carnal mind are irrelevant.
Time is irrelevant in the Spiritual realm where a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as a day which is as yesterday which is passed..
I am not of this world.
I am one with the the Lord.
We have the mind of Christ.
Christ is never wrong.
If you doubt that then maybe you need to read your own post and apply it to yourself.

Click to expand...

So much for unity and maturity, huh? I guess the eye can say to the hand, I have no need of thee, and none of us suffers if one is suffering? Myopic, disconnected, self-serving, gainsaying, people are a dime a dozen. The one that loves God and His son seeks to benefit the whole, not the one. There is a reward for those who will not seek the alliances and interests of the out-called ones, and yet maintains a supposed connnectedness. May the Lord grant you peace and protection in your pursuit of self.

fivesense

mjrhealth said:

Intruiging skyeangel, did not Jesus say,
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

That makes 3 not 2.

Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
Joh 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
Joh 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
Joh 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

In His Love

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If the Holy Spirit ( The comforter) is in a thousand people or a million people does that make a thousand or a million separate spirits or still ONE Spirit? Does that make all the million people a member of the godhead? How many "persons" in the godhead in that case? Do the math.

Do you not realize that the Holy Spirit IS the same Spirit as the Father, they are not two different Spirits? The Holy Spirit is the Father of Jesus according to Luke 1:35

Go back to John 14:18 will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

In that scripture Jesus refers to Himself as the one who is the comforter who will come to the disciples.

In John 14:17. Jesus refers to the comforter as the spirit of Truth.
In John 14: 6. He told them He was the Truth.


The clues that the Holy Spirit was speaking through Jesus all the time are there and can be seen by those who have eyes to see.

The Holy Spirit was always speaking through Jesus. Jesus was never speaking about His own personal and singular fleshly body or physical appearance.

The Lord prayed that he would be ONE with His people in the same way the Father is in Jesus and Jesus is in Him.

John 17: 21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, [art] in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

John 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

When the Comforter comes He comes to be IN His people and become ONE with them.
The only way to see Him is in His people who are His physical fleshly body on earth yesterday today and forever.

fivesense said:

So much for unity and maturity, huh? I guess the eye can say to the hand, I have no need of thee, and none of us suffers if one is suffering? Myopic, disconnected, self-serving, gainsaying, people are a dime a dozen. The one that loves God and His son seeks to benefit the whole, not the one. There is a reward for those who will not seek the alliances and interests of the out-called ones, and yet maintains a supposed connnectedness. May the Lord grant you peace and protection in your pursuit of self.

fivesense

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Please apply your post to yourself. What you see in me is a reflection of yourself.
I forgive you for your implications and false accusations. The turmoil in your own heart condemns you in the same way you condemn me.
The Lord never grants any peace to the wicked.
Isaiah 57:21 [There is] no peace, saith my God, to the wicked.

God Himself cuts off the wicked from Himself.
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, [take heed] lest he also spare not thee.

If you wish to maintain a "supposed connectedness" with the world, are you any different to the Pharisees of Jesus days?

Matt 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast [it] from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not [that] thy whole body should be cast into hell.

If I offend you in any way you are welcome to cut me off since you imply you have no need of me.

I am not of this world.

I am that I am.