Hebrews 10:26-31

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justbyfaith

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I'm sorry if there is any confusion . . . I've just finished explaining how it is that I don't believe that you or I sin unknowingly, or without having the opportunity to avoid committing that sin.

Are you saying that you think there are sins which you commit which you don't know about, and have no power over?

Much love!

What sin is not willful?

I don't understand. Bad dreams are sin?

If I have a dream that I have done something horrible and then wake up and consider it to have been a nightmare, I believe that I subconsciously and in my sleep, sinned against the Lord. However, that sin was not conscious or deliberate or intentional; it was not a willful sin. We do things in our sleep that we would never do in our conscious moments; because what we do consciously involves our body; and there is more of a will involved in moving our body to do something than there is in dreaming that I am doing something without that conscious volition of moving my body to accomplish that sin. I believe that if I sin in my dream life, I am truly sinning; but that such sin cannot be defined as willful sin.

Hope this helps.
 

marks

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That even may perhaps amount to a false accusation or misrepresentation in as much I have not said that nor said anything to that effect.
There's a lot of that around here, I've noticed. As if the best argument someone can make is to misrepresent someone else's view? That doesn't seem like much of an argument!

Much love!
 

marks

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the person who sins deliberately and willfully is turning his back on the forgiveness of Christ.
Nonsense!

A declaration of condemnation, based on what? Do you really know what's in the hearts of everyone else?

I don't really think you do.

Much love!
 

marks

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Why are you disconnecting "but a certain fearful expectation of judgment" from "there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins"? It's plainly saying the judgment is the result of there being no sacrifice remaining. And that the person for whom there no longer remains a sacrifice for sin is the person who willfully sins. I'm amazed that you can't see these plain words.
If you think you can go back to offering sheep and goats and bulls, because you don't want to come to Jesus Christ, you are flatly wrong. You cannot reject Christ and think a goat is going to make you right with God.

You can't offer sacrifices any more!

So there is no more sacrifice. If that's where you head is at, forget about atonement, all you have is the condemnation for your sin. It's Jesus or nothing.

This is the plain statement of that passage, and that letter to the Hebrews.

Much love!
 
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marks

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But only for so long a time as he determines, according to the person. If they don't repent in the time God gives them he turns them over to their decision to sin in a rejection of Christ and does not let them repent. That's what's so dangerous about playing with willful sin. The church says for the Christian it's covered by grace no matter what. But the Bible shows us you don't know how long you can play around in it and refuse to believe before God doesn't allow you to repent and believe.
You don't seem to see the distinction God makes between His children, and those who are not His children.

To those who are not God's children, they receive condemnation.

But to those who are, they receive God's promises to present them pure, to reveal them in glory, to sanctify them wholy, to preserve them, to present them to Himself faultless, there are many more.

Trust Him!

Much love!
 
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marks

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Newbies...please note....NONE of this is Biblical ....it reflects a brain that is full of Religious Mush and shows what happens if you don’t listen to God- Sent Teachers That can instruct a person in how to “ Rightly Divide”
The difference between trusting in what Jesus did, or on what I think I can or can't do.

Trust God!

Much love!
 
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justbyfaith

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If you think you can go back to offering sheep and goats and bulls, because you don't want to come to Jesus Christ, you are flatly wrong. You cannot reject Christ and think a goat is going to make you right with God.

You can't offer sacrifices any more!

So there is no more sacrifice. If that's where you head is at, forget about atonement, all you have is the condemnation for your sin. It's Jesus or nothing.

This is the plain statement of that passage, and that letter to the Hebrews.

Much love!

Again I would point you to the OP (Hebrews 10:26-31).
 

justbyfaith

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The difference between trusting in what Jesus did, or on what I think I can or can't do.

Trust God!

Much love!
See Romans 8:13; which has to do with what Jesus did in providing the Holy Spirit through His death on the Cross (Luke 23:46); but also has something to do with what we do in our obedience to the Spirit.
 
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mjrhealth

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The scriptures testify of Jesus (John 5:39-40). How is it that you have not received their testimony concerning Him?
It is the Holy Spirit that testifies of Christ why is it you have not received His testimony. Something to do with being carnal, but you are forgiven of your ignorance.
 

marks

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The church has made the terrible mistake of using OSAS to make it so Hebrews 10:26 doesn't apply to them. And so they take false comfort in that. They are deceiving themselves. If they were truly saved they wouldn't be living in deliberate sin.
All sin is deliberate. What sin do you, as a child of God, lack power over? What sin do you commit that you do not specifically allow yourself to commit?

Seriously??

If you've parsed out a certain group of sins, as if these are OK while these others are not, well, In Christ is NO sin. We are dead to sin, not "dead to some sins".

Much love!
 
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justbyfaith

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It is the Holy Spirit that testifies of Christ why is it you have not received His testimony. Something to do with being carnal, but you are forgiven of your ignorance.
The Holy Spirit will never testify that Jesus isn't God.

What testimony of the Holy Spirit have I not received?
 

marks

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9No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.


That could be a “ Promise “—- not a threat! We are under Grace, NOT Law. Yet you see everything through a “lens” of Law ....try switching your Legal Lens for a Grace Lens....The Bible says that the Law is something that is fading away.....so are the legal lenses that were appropriate for that Fading System..

Learning to think without thinking according to "I must perform to be accepted" is, I think, extremely difficult for some people. I know I had issues getting that through my head!

But such hubris to think that I can add to what Jesus did for me!!

"Keep myself saved by contolling my sin"? OK, Jesus . . . I got it from here! Not!!

Much love!
 
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justbyfaith

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All sin is deliberate.

If I have a dream that I have done something horrible and then wake up and consider it to have been a nightmare, I believe that I subconsciously and in my sleep, sinned against the Lord. However, that sin was not conscious or deliberate or intentional; it was not a willful sin. We do things in our sleep that we would never do in our conscious moments; because what we do consciously involves our body; and there is more of a will involved in moving our body to do something than there is in dreaming that I am doing something without that conscious volition of moving my body to accomplish that sin. I believe that if I sin in my dream life, I am truly sinning; but that such sin cannot be defined as willful sin.

Hope this helps.
 

marks

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What church are you saying are deliberately living in sin? And what has this got to do with our discussion? OSAS and all? I never even mentioned OSAS in any of our exchanges. Are you confusing me with someone else?
Ferris seems to bring this up a lot. For me it's a "tell".

Much love!
 
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justbyfaith

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Learning to think without thinking according to "I must perform to be accepted" is, I think, extremely difficult for some people. I know I had issues getting that through my head!

But such hubris to think that I can add to what Jesus did for me!!

"Keep myself saved by contolling my sin"? OK, Jesus . . . I got it from here! Not!!

Much love!

See Romans 8:13; which has to do with what Jesus did in providing the Holy Spirit through His death on the Cross (Luke 23:46); but also has something to do with what we do in our obedience to the Spirit.
 

ChristisGod

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yet you cannot prove your false premise from scripture but hey believe whatever you want about sin and that its unwilful and not deliberate.

BTW- the sins of omission are also deliberate just the same as the sins of commission.

hope this helps !!!
 
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