Why does God allow suffering?

TLHKAJ · Feb 27, 2021

pittsburghjoe said:
That sounds horrific. I'm sorry that happened to you. This fallen reality is temporary. God will know the situations we were put in at Judgement. I'm just saying, sin, in real-time doesn't have to be thing for God. Otherwise, He would have prevented that from happening to you. We all are separated from God in this place.

Honestly, I have to kindly disagree. Once, during a time of ministry with the Lord, remembering some horrible things that happened, I asked Him where He was. He said, "I was there with you." I began to weep and asked, "But why??" And as soon as my question left my thoughts, I looked and saw Him holding me as a child. I could see right into His face...and I saw tears. There was no place on His face that wasn't drenched with tears. I (the child me) took my hands and tried to wipe His tears away, but they would not diminish. At that moment, I understood that I was never alone. He felt it all. He truly is our Great High Priest, touched with the feeling of our infirmities! Inasmuch as they did it to me (the least of these), they did it TO HIM ...literally! Jesus's sufferings have not ended. He suffers with us.

See, what they do in the cult is that as soon as they see the child is able (around age 3) to grasp it, they give the child the true Gospel. They will traumatize the child and then place them in solitude... the child is desperate for comfort and human contact. They will tell him/her, "Jesus is at the door. Call His name and He'll save you." So hope arises in her heart and she calls on Jesus ...and "jesus" (a cult member/programmer) comes through the door and rapes/tortures her. It causes her mind to shatter, and the heart that first trusted God is buried deep inside. They then take those parts of her mind that shattered by the trauma and program them against God. BUT ....this (SRA/MK) is in effect, a persecution of a child who believed the Gospel and placed their trust in Jesus. What the cult endeavors to do is suppress the part/heart that believed and called on Him.

But here's the thing... GOD KNOWS!!! He WILL recompense!! All of this is evidence being piled against satan and his followers. And He hasn't forgotten us.

Idk if this made sense. But I am grateful that Jesus is my Great High Priest ....my suffering is HIS suffering. We will understand it better by and by.

But until then .... taste and see, that God is good!

❤

pittsburghjoe · Feb 27, 2021

Jesus is with children and those that believe. I'm saying God the Father isn't going to modify this reality to fix the evil until the end.

TLHKAJ · Feb 27, 2021

I know there are times when it seems God isn't involved. But I have seen Him intervene and work... not always according to my desires, but all things work together for good for those who love the Lord and are called according to His purpose.

DNB · Feb 28, 2021

My understanding for the reason that evil exists, is because love must not be coerced, feigned or involuntary, it must be deliberate, sincere and authentic. So then, how much can God intervene in human activity, until His providence becomes manipulation, and human nature becomes contrived?

That is, at what point does God step in?
Murder, rape, kidnapping or assault? Some might say yes.
Then what, adultery, stealing, abuse, addictions and pornography? Maybe.
Then what, lies, ridicule, swearing, fighting or factions, cheating at poker? Depends on the degree.
Then what, dirty or evil thoughts, white lies, provocative clothing, getting drunk, gangsta rap, ...? Too invasive?

Love must be free, therefore man must be free to chose who he will love. Ultimately, this time on earth is nothing more than a testing ground - God is looking fore those will will seek Him out and find Him. And thus, He has allowed very trying circumstances in order for us to prove our zeal and devotion towards Him. As the adage states, you don't know who your friends are, until a time of crisis. We would not have seen Peter's, or any of the Apostle's true colours, if Christ had not been arrested. Adam and Eve would've thought that they were pretty good people, had God not allowed them to be tempted. Would David have ever imagined that he would've broken so many of the Ten Commandments, had Bathsheba not been as exposed as she was.

God allows evil because, in so many ways, from either the instigator's or the recipient's involvement, it weeds out the sheep from the goats.

Grailhunter · Feb 28, 2021

I am sure you have seen the poem about footprints...

Ferris Bueller · Feb 28, 2021

TLHKAJ said:
Jesus's sufferings have not ended. He suffers with us.

I fill up in my flesh what is lacking in regard to Christ’s afflictions for the sake of His body, which is the church. Colossians 1:27

Ferris Bueller · Feb 28, 2021

TLHKAJ said:
....this (SRA/MK) is in effect, a persecution of a child who believed the Gospel and placed their trust in Jesus. What the cult endeavors to do is suppress the part/heart that believed and called on Him.

But here's the thing... GOD KNOWS!!! He WILL recompense!! All of this is evidence being piled against satan and his followers.

42But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be thrown into the sea. Mark 9:42

Wouldn't want to be them.

Ferris Bueller · Feb 28, 2021

TLHKAJ said:
all things work together for good for those who love the Lord and are called according to His purpose.

I know this has become kind of cliché and trite, but it's true, and sometimes we just gotta take it on faith and wait to see how it will be true for us.

I don't like what I've been going through in this thing I'm suffering with in my adult life, but after 35 years of being Christian I'm finally seeing it produce singleness of heart for the Lord in me. I'm a slow learner.

As the perfect farmer, God knows how much manure, rain, and sunshine each plot of ground needs to raise the harvest he's looking for according to the seed he has sown in it.

Ferris Bueller · Feb 28, 2021

TLHKAJ said:
....my suffering is HIS suffering.

21For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should follow in His footsteps:
22“He committed no sin, and no deceit was found in His mouth.”g
23When they heaped abuse on Him, He did not retaliate; when He suffered, He made no threats,
but entrusted Himself to Him who judges justly.
24He Himself bore our sinsh in His body on the tree, so that we might die to sin and live to righteousness.
“By His stripes you are healed.”
1 Peter 2:21-24

See, when we suffer at the hands of others, we bear the stripes of their healing, just as Jesus did that for us. We are to follow in his example. That doesn't make for popular sermon material, but it's true nonetheless. That's why we are to pray for those who persecute us and who despitefully use and abuse us.

pittsburghjoe · Feb 28, 2021

When God the Father doesn't know something it always involves something fallen.

Uncertainty Principle

Momentum is about which path of all possible paths (God's Love), no single moments.
Position is a snapshot of a single decohered (fallen) point on a path, but you can't tell which path because it is only a single point.

Humans can't know both exactly at the same time. God is likely limiting His knowledge of fallen decohered position until He has to.

tsr · Feb 28, 2021

So one reason God allows emotional suffering in our lives is because he knows that sometimes there is nothing that will increase our passion to pursue him more than this pain. And when we seek the Lord and find his love and comfort, we experience far more joy and satisfaction in the Lord than the suffering we endured.

pittsburghjoe · Feb 28, 2021

God is only good and infinite, so God is allowing this evil place to exist by limiting His knowledge of it.

Decoherence (fallen) can only exist if Coherence (good) is here first.

Quantum Fields are Coherent and Infinite.

Hidden In Him · Feb 28, 2021

pittsburghjoe said:
Sorry, I don't buy that. What good did that information do us?

It's a running account of the actual events as they were unfolding.

pittsburghjoe said:
Why did God ask Adam and Eve "Who told you that you were naked?"

Same reason. It initiates conversation. Asking questions is a way of getting people talking. He can be doing it even when He already knows the answer, because I do it with people sometimes. It's a way of finding out what they are willing to say and what they are not.

pittsburghjoe said:
When God the Father doesn't know something it always involves something fallen.

Uncertainty Principle

Momentum is about which path of all possible paths (God's Love), no single moments.

Position is a snapshot of a single decohered (fallen) point on a path, but you can't tell which path because it is only a single point.

Humans can't know both exactly at the same time. God is likely limiting His knowledge of fallen decohered position until He has to.

I could answer you here with something that just came to my mind, but I'm guessing it would not be received if you are SDA, which if I was understanding some of your other threads, you are.

But for the other posters on this issue, it might be. I've read accounts of Jesus taking believers to Hell to witness the torments going on there, that they might serve as witnesses to the realities of what is happening there for those who reject God in favor or sin. In these accounts, He often speaks to fallen souls about the sins they committed, as being the reasons for why they are there. Certainly it shows not only an awareness of human evils on the part of God, but of the worst kinds of evils in real time, since many turn to cursing Him to His face when their pleas to be taken out of there are not granted.

I just find the position inconsistent with scripture as well. How many times did the Lord Himself address someone through a prophet to convict them of their sins before Him? This shows full awareness of what they were doing.

But maybe I am still misunderstanding you.

Renniks · Feb 28, 2021

It's A deep subject. The thing to remember is that God isn't the one causing our suffering. It's evil and people agreeing with evil.

pittsburghjoe · Feb 28, 2021

It's not all or nothing kind of knowledge of sin. I'm saying we have a clear answer to why bad things happen here.

TLHKAJ · Feb 28, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
42But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be thrown into the sea. Mark 9:42

Wouldn't want to be them.

Thank you for sharing this. As many times as I've read this, I actually saw this truth in another facet upon reading it in this context.

DNB · Feb 28, 2021

God is omniscient, ...how can He not be, if He created all things under the sun?
You are interpreting passages in a very limited and shallow perspective. Yes, it appears that God is claiming ignorance in certain verses, if one regards the text in a hyper-literal fashion, which is incompetent. Or, if one is unaware of the wisdom behind using such tactics to elicit a more tell-tale response from the culprit.

God created all things, from the seen to the unseen, He knows us better than we know ourselves, and knows exactly how we will behave in any given amount of circumstances, well before they have ever transpired. He knows exactly what threshold of pain any man can tolerate before he succumbs to fainting or death, and knows exactly how much temptation on can resist, before their fleshly desires overtake them.

You are showing a great deal of ignorance by not understanding the attributes and sovereignty, of either Deity or Divinity.

pittsburghjoe · Feb 28, 2021

Here is another example:
Can God limit His knowledge to allow this fallen place to exist? Does this explain why bad things happen here? Does God have full knowledge of those that let Him work through? - Contending for the faith - Quora

You're not getting that God can still be all knowing if He can access the same information on demand.

TLHKAJ · Feb 28, 2021

Hidden In Him said:
It's a running account of the actual events as they were unfolding.

Same reason. It initiates conversation. Asking questions is a way of getting people talking. He can be doing it even when He already knows the answer, because I do it with people sometimes. It's a way of finding out what they are willing to say and what they are not.

I could answer you here with something that just came to my mind, but I'm guessing it would not be received if you are SDA, which if I was understanding some of your other threads, you are.

But for the other posters on this issue, it might be. I've read accounts of Jesus taking believers to Hell to witness the torments going on there, that they might serve as witnesses to the realities of what is happening there for those who reject God in favor or sin. In these accounts, He often speaks to fallen souls about the sins they committed, as being the reasons for why they are there. Certainly it shows not only an awareness of human evils on the part of God, but of the worst kinds of evils in real time, since many turn to cursing Him to His face when their pleas to be taken out of there are not granted.

I just find the position inconsistent with scripture as well. How many times did the Lord Himself address someone through a prophet to convict them of their sins before Him? This shows full awareness of what they were doing.

But maybe I am still misunderstanding you.

It's a ridiculous thought that God wouldn't know every minute detail ...He knows us as we're formed in the womb. He knows the number of hairs on our heads. Jesus met the woman at the well and told her all that she had done, proving He knew her deeds before she came to Christ. Every deed will be judged and every idle word, we will give account for.

Hidden In Him · Feb 28, 2021

pittsburghjoe said:
Here is another example:
Can God limit His knowledge to allow this fallen place to exist? Does this explain why bad things happen here? Does God have full knowledge of those that let Him work through? - Contending for the faith - Quora

You're not getting that God can still be all knowing if He can access the same information on demand.

Hadn't looked yet - kinda busy atm - but you are saying He is selective about some yet not others? I.E. knows about some but chooses not to know about all?

Forgive me, but this is a different concept.

Why does God allow suffering?

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