jaybird
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is Moses mistaken as well? Moses was the one that wrote down these commands that were given by the Most High. Moses and the Jews understood the Most High to be a non trinity.
Jesus Christ The Great I AM
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is Moses mistaken as well? Moses was the one that wrote down these commands that were given by the Most High. Moses and the Jews understood the Most High to be a non trinity.
jaybird
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ok but the whole "sit at the right hand" is still the same either way.
this response does not explain anything concerning the phrase and how Jesus and the 12 used the phrase.
Moses used a plural word for God in Deuteronomy 6:4.
He is also the human author of Genesis 1:26.
Nope, not really.
jaybird
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when Moses used the word for the Most High, plural form or whatever, any form you want to throw in there, whatever word Moses wrote down for the Most High, did Moses believe that word to mean trinity?
so to sum it up:
sit at the right hand means one thing
"Jesus" and only Jesus sits at the right hand means something different and the bible fails to explain the new meaning.
and since your new meaning is not defined anywhere you can apply whatever meaning you want.
do people really buy into this? i can spot this one from a mile away.
I will say this because in Ezekiel 21:14 it says that the third time the sword shall do double damage and therefore I believe that every time the sword of the Spirit strikes, it will do damage to false doctrine in people's minds...
In John 8:24, Jesus is referencing back to Exodus 3:14 when He says what He says...
Exo 3:14, And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins.
In John 8:24, Jesus is referencing back to Exodus 3:14 when He says what He says...
Exo 3:14, And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins.
Michiah-Imla
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This is erroneous.
Once again, here is the proper way to understand John 8:24:
John 8:12
Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
Keep this in mind before reading further:
John 8:24
I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he [the light of the world], ye shall die in your sins.
Keep it simple @justbyfaith
There’s no need to jump back dozens of books to find out what “he” Christ was referring to; just go back 12 verses.
The "he" is in italics; which indicates that it is not in the original manuscript.
So, the reality is what we see here.
Exo 3:14, And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins.
But even if you include the "he" in the verse, it should be clear that the he refers to what we find it is referring to in John 8:27.
Jhn 8:27, They understood not that he spake to them of the Father.
Michiah-Imla
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Another erroneous understanding.
John 8:27 is referencing the verse BEFORE it:
John 8:26-27
[26] I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him. [27] They understood not that he spake to them of the Father [which sent him].
It is referring to all the verses before it,
Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
Jhn 8:25, Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.
Jhn 8:26, I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.
Jhn 8:27, They understood not that he spake to them of the Father.
I pray that the Holy Spirit will open your eyes.
At Revelation 3:14, Jesus says: "To the angel of the congregation in La·o·di·ceʹa write: These are the things that the Amen (or Jesus, see 2 Cor 1:20) says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God." And at Colossians 1:15, the apostle Paul writes: "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation."
And at Hebrews 1, Paul states: "Now at the end of these days (or Jewish system of things that ended in 70 C.E.) he has spoken to us by means of a Son, whom he (or God) appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the systems of things. He (or Jesus Christ) is the reflection of God’s glory and the exact representation of his very being (mirroring exactly how Jehovah God judges people, see John 5:22, 30), and he sustains all things by the word of his power. And after he had made a purification for our sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high (or symbolically Jehovah's right hand, see Ps 110:1)."(Heb 1:2, 3)
Now, why is it that people cannot distinguish that a son is not the same as the father, despite perhaps having several children themselves ? Something is amiss with their power of reason, and this is so because the Trinity doctrine can be likened to having a strangle hold on many.
If Jesus is God, then why did he pray to Jehovah ?(Matt 26:36-39; John 11:41, 42) If Jesus is God, then why did he say this: "What I teach is not mine, but belongs to him who sent me. If anyone desires to do His will (and not my will), he will know whether the teaching is from God or I speak of my own originality."(John 7:16, 17; Note: by the use of "or", Jesus clearly distinguished himself from Jehovah God, for he used the Greek word "e" that is "a primary particle of distinction between two connected terms", Strong's Exhaustive Concordance)
If Jesus is God, then why did he pray this just hours before he was executed: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify your son so that your son may glorify you......This means everlasting life, their coming to know you (or Jehovah God), the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ" ?(John 17:1, 3)
If Jesus is God, then why did he say this: "For I have not spoken of my own initiative, but the Father who sent me has himself given me a commandment about what to say and what to speak. And I know that his commandment means everlasting life. So whatever I speak, I speak just as the Father has told me” ?(John 12:49, 50)
If Jesus is God, then why did he says this: "I do nothing of my own initiative; but just as the Father taught me, I speak these things. And the One who sent me is with me; he did not abandon me to myself, because I always do the things pleasing to him" ?(John 8:28, 29)
Cooper
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If Moses or one of the patriarchs had been crucified, would that have been sufficient. No, of course not, and this is why God the Holy Spirit came down from heaven, in the flesh of man, so that the perfect man without stain or spot could pay the penalty for the sins of man. The heavenly Father indwelling the Son, for only God can take away the sins of the world. The Son is God made visible in the flesh. God is One. There on the cross was the One God in the form of man.
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Cooper
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I know we talk about three persons, but my postman delivers letters five days a week, he plays football for a local team on Saturdays, and he is a father and husband seven days a week, while being One. If I ever get to meet my hero the footballer, I might take one look at him and say,"you are my postman, and my neighbours husband." Well, he is, but people do not say he is the greatest three, they say he is the Greatest One.
I only have ONE God. He is Creator, Saviour and Coming King and He is One.
God bless.
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jaybird
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but this is how the trinity doctrine is explained in today's time. thats not what i am talking about. the Jews have never believed the Most High was a trinity. when the Most High said to Moses He was one, Moses understood this to be a non trinity. did the Most High explain it wrong? did Moses not understand correctly, if so you have to ask why would the Lord allow Moses to misunderstand, and worse, teach this misunderstanding for thousands of years. this is not very likely.
Cooper
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The Jews are right to say the god of the Jews is one. The god of the Jews is Lucifer see John 8:44.
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jaybird
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the Jews understand "one" to be non trinity.
John 20:17
Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
you think this is Jesus saying He is ascending back to Satan?
Cooper
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jaybird
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no, i asked if that was what you believed.
you (not me)
said Satan was the god of the Jews, Jesus was Jewish.
John 20:17
Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
you think this is Jesus saying He is ascending back to Satan?
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