The meaning of mature.

justbyfaith · May 22, 2020

Heb 10:1, For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

To be consistent with Calvary Chapel teaching, we must define this word perfect as meaning "mature".

Heb 10:2, For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Well, what do you know, if you are "mature" you will have no more conscience of sins; because your sins are purged.

Heb 1:3, Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

quietthinker · May 22, 2020

justbyfaith said:
Heb 10:2, For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Well, what do you know, if you are "mature" you will have no more conscience of sins; because your sins are purged.

Let this be known, this text does not refer to not having a conscience. Conscience by its very nature is active in transgression and innocence.
No more conscience of sins being connected with not sining. It does not mean one sins and does not have a conscience regarding sin.

justbyfaith · May 22, 2020

quietthinker said:
Let this be known, this text does not refer to not having a conscience. Conscience by its very nature is active in transgression and innocence.
No more conscience of sins being connected with not sinning. It does not mean one sins and does not have a conscience regarding sin.

Yes that is how I see it also.

You don't feel guilty any more because you're not guilty any more.

07-07-07 · May 24, 2020

The blood of Jesus indeed washes white as snow.

Isaiah 1
[18] Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
[19] If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:
[20] But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

justbyfaith · May 24, 2020

07-07-07 said:
The blood of Jesus indeed washes white as snow.

Sometimes, even whiter than snow.

Psa 51:7, Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.

justbyfaith · Mar 27, 2021

Addy · Mar 27, 2021

This thread is a year old... Are you bored @justbyfaith ?? LOL

justbyfaith · Mar 27, 2021

Addy said:
This thread is a year old... Are you bored @justbyfaith ?? LOL

Sometimes I bring my old threads to the forefront.

No, I was not searching through all the threads and come upon this one after reading many...

I simply thought of this thread because it has pertinence to something that has been recently discussed.

I did a search on certain words that I knew were in the thread. It came up immediately.

Then I bumped it up.

"."

ChristisGod · Mar 27, 2021

justbyfaith said:
Heb 10:1, For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

To be consistent with Calvary Chapel teaching, we must define this word perfect as meaning "mature".

Heb 10:2, For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Well, what do you know, if you are "mature" you will have no more conscience of sins; because your sins are purged.

Heb 1:3, Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

1 John 2

I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

13 I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.

15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

1 Timothy 5:1
Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;

Proverbs 20:29
The glory of young men is their strength: and the beauty of old men is the gray head.

hope this helps !!!

justbyfaith · Mar 28, 2021

justbyfaith said:
Heb 10:1, For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

To be consistent with Calvary Chapel teaching, we must define this word perfect as meaning "mature".

Heb 10:2, For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Well, what do you know, if you are "mature" you will have no more conscience of sins; because your sins are purged.

Heb 1:3, Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Christophany said:
1 John 2

I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

13 I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.

15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

1 Timothy 5:1
Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;

Proverbs 20:29
The glory of young men is their strength: and the beauty of old men is the gray head.

hope this helps !!!

Of course, the post in question in no way nullifies the reality of what was said in the post that it was responding to...

DNB · Mar 29, 2021

Mama mia JBF, you are the worst exegete out there, you haven't a single clue as to what the pericope of Hebrew 10 is talking about!
The author means perfect, not mature, for he is contrasting the efficacy of Christ's final oblation on the 'altar', as opposed to the prescribed sacrifices of bulls and goats according to the Levitical Law. This is the dichotomy that the author is presenting, Jesus made us perfect, whereas the blood of bulls and goats could not. Jesus did not make us mature, that is not the reason that he died on the cross. For even as we are saved, we are still all a bunch of treacherous little demons, for the sake of argument, anything but mature.

justbyfaith · Mar 30, 2021

DNB said:
Mama mia JBF, you are the worst exegete out there, you haven't a single clue as to what the pericope of Hebrew 10 is talking about!
The author means perfect, not mature, for he is contrasting the efficacy of Christ's final oblation on the 'altar', as opposed to the prescribed sacrifices of bulls and goats according to the Levitical Law. This is the dichotomy that the author is presenting, Jesus made us perfect, whereas the blood of bulls and goats could not. Jesus did not make us mature, that is not the reason that he died on the cross. For even as we are saved, we are still all a bunch of treacherous little demons, for the sake of argument, anything but mature.

Hey, it is not my interpretation that the terminology in Hebrews 10:1 is "mature" rather than "perfect".

I was actually attempting to deal with a false theology that is taught in some mainline churches , that anytime you read the word "perfect" in holy scripture, it means "mature" or "complete".

I was merely pointing out that if you are going to apply that across the board, that you have to say that the word "perfect" in Hebrews 10:1 also means "mature" and that therefore "mature" actually means "perfect" because those who are "mature" according to the passage as it is interpreted, have no consciousness of sins; because their sins have been removed from them, even in the practical sense of that.

DNB · Mar 30, 2021

justbyfaith said:
Hey, it is not my interpretation that the terminology in Hebrews 10:1 is "mature" rather than "perfect".

I was actually attempting to deal with a false theology that is taught in some mainline churches , that anytime you read the word "perfect" in holy scripture, it means "mature" or "complete".

I was merely pointing out that if you are going to apply that across the board, that you have to say that the word "perfect" in Hebrews 10:1 also means "mature" and that therefore "mature" actually means "perfect" because those who are "mature" according to the passage as it is interpreted, have no consciousness of sins; because their sins have been removed from them, even in the practical sense of that.

Well, then I'm sorry. If you were denouncing, in a sarcastic way, that type of hermeneutics, then you are correct.
My apologies, I didn't perceive your facetious connotation.

ChristisGod · Mar 30, 2021

justbyfaith said:
Of course, the post in question in no way nullifies the reality of what was said in the post that it was responding to...

Why are you assuming it does ?

All I did was post scriptures about maturity levels.

justbyfaith · Mar 30, 2021

Christophany said:
Why are you assuming it does ?

All I did was post scriptures about maturity levels.

I wasn't assuming it does...I was proclaiming that it doesn't.

ChristisGod · Mar 30, 2021

justbyfaith said:
I wasn't assuming it does...I was proclaiming that it doesn't.

So you are saying there is no maturity level differences between children, young men and fathers ?

justbyfaith · Mar 31, 2021

Christophany said:
So you are saying there is no maturity level differences between children, young men and fathers ?

Young men and fathers are more likely to have received the second benefit (2 Corinthians 1:15, Hebrews 10:14 (kjv)) than children;

But I would not exclude children from being able to receive this benefit.

ChristisGod · Mar 31, 2021

justbyfaith said:
Young men and fathers are more likely to have received the second benefit (2 Corinthians 1:15, Hebrews 10:14 (kjv)) than children;

But I would not exclude children from being able to receive this benefit.

The "2nd benefit" is the Apostle Paul's 2nd Visit to the Corinthian's not some 2nd spiritual blessing or a 2nd work of grace with the spirit.

hope this helps !!!

justbyfaith · Mar 31, 2021

Christophany said:
The "2nd benefit" is the Apostle Paul's 2nd Visit to the Corinthian's not some 2nd spiritual blessing or a 2nd work of grace with the spirit.

hope this helps !!!

I disagree with you there.

Hope this helps.

justbyfaith · Mar 31, 2021

1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 (kjv), Hebrews 10:14 (kjv), 1 John 3:9;

1 john 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6;

Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10;

1 John 3:6, 1 John 2:17;

Romans 6:6 (kjv), Colossians 2:11 (kjv), (NLT),

I don't think that these scriptures are talking about the first benefit of becoming a Christian.

These promises come to us as the result of being transformed by the renewing of our minds.

We obtain these promises by faith (Hebrews 11:33, 2 Peter 1:3-4, 2 Corinthians 1:20, Romans 4:20-22).

The meaning of mature.

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