“Full Assurance of Faith” (Hebrews 10:22)

[Netchaplain]

What is the believer to be mostly assured of in the Faith?—“eternal salvation.” Nothing within the biblical doctrine of Soteriology can have even a scintilla of meaning if it rests apart from supporting the truth that “He who promised is faithful” (vs 23). “Promised” what? What in all existence has the greatest significance? Is it not endless fellowship with God! Thus, eternal life—via salvation—is the most important promise.

The two most often discussed issues on this subject are when the gift of eternal life becomes a reality within the Christian, and the concept of losing this gift. Firstly, there can be no doubt that salvation begins at the point of faith received, otherwise there can be no other possible explanation concerning its chronological initiation. Secondly, how could it stand to reason to perceive that anything about salvation is temporal, and even if this were possible, that God gives temporal salvation to anyone, since it means “to be eternally redeemed”? This would be to either doubt God’s omniscience concerning His foreknowledge of individuals as to whether or not they will remain in it; or to misunderstand omniscience, or to be uninformed concerning the fact that God possesses omniscience.

Faith in the provisions of these truths hold a greater meaning in this life than in the next, “for why does one still hope for what he sees (Rom 8:24)? As it is written, “We walk by faith, not by sight” (2Cor 5:7), and sight in the next life will then be the connection instead of faith now. The greatest difficulty, due to it being the most important for maturity, is that of releasing one’s own trust in self in order to see the security in the Father’s hand (true even if not realized – John 10:29) for all who are His! I say the greatest difficulty, because it is when all we’ve come to believe in concerning Christ’s mediation is tested and exercised the most, which is simple dependence on Christ’s expiation concerning our “old man” (sin source) and its sins.

It abides well to realize that all the guilt incurred is not from sins or sinning, but from the possession (by association) of the sin source, which is to say that even if one could stop sinning altogether, the curse of guilt would yet abide within, due to the ever-present (Rom 7:17, 18, 20; Gal 5:17) source. Faith is at its pinnacle of glorifying God when exercised in “full assurance” of the Lord Jesus’ Cross-work while coexisting (but never coalescing) with the sinful Adamic nature.

- NC

 

[0bed]

First came Jesus.

Then my burdens rolled away

Then I began to know the Joy of the Lord.

And on it goes, deeper and deeper.

 

[Netchaplain]

First came Jesus.

Then my burdens rolled away

Then I began to know the Joy of the Lord.

And on it goes, deeper and deeper.

Hi Obed and thanks for your reply. The primary issue of the OP is to proclaim that salvation is complete when receiving Christ. The rest, which is evidence of this, comes as we "work out of our salvation" to manifest it all.

Blessings!

 

[Thorwald]

Through attending many Christian churches, I came to realize, the Christian ministers 'stopped growing' in their faith. Once ordination took place, they all agreed with other ministers of the same denomination. I have never met one, that asked God if there was something wrong with what they were teaching their congregation(s), which includes, errors that may be in the Bible. I have not met one minister who has seen Christ, and yet John 14:21-23 tells us, that Christ WILL manifest Himself to those who 'pass the test' of this scripture. Why is this?????

 

[Netchaplain]

Through attending many Christian churches, I came to realize, the Christian ministers 'stopped growing' in their faith. Once ordination took place, they all agreed with other ministers of the same denomination. I have never met one, that asked God if there was something wrong with what they were teaching their congregation(s), which includes, errors that may be in the Bible. I have not met one minister who has seen Christ, and yet John 14:21-23 tells us, that Christ WILL manifest Himself to those who 'pass the test' of this scripture. Why is this?????

Hi Thorwald - Thanks for your reply. I suppose there needs to be a defining of "Christ WILL manifest Himself." The "manifestation" is not in a corporal or physical way but by our being "one" with Him through the Spirit of God (Rom 8:16) as He works in us, not the life of the Spirit but of the Son (Col 3:4), unless you're referring to something else.

Blessings!

 

[StanJ]

Salvation is definitely not temporal as far as it relates to the world because it is a spiritual condition wherein we confess to being sinners and accept Jesus as our savior. That confession and the resulting salvation brings us into alignment with God's will that we in the future receive eternal life.
It is however temporal as it relates to time and eternal life.
The fact is that nobody loses their salvation but it also is a fact that anybody can become apostate and walk away from their salvation if they so choose. That is not losing salvation that is becoming apostate and there's a big difference between the two.
There is no doubt at all that God is totally faithful but at the same time man can be totally faithless. Paul said it best in Romans 3:4, and as far as it relates to God that obviously is very true and an absolute.
As Christians we always seem to forget that God created us to live forever and that we screwed it up. His Plan of Salvation was to restore that balance or semblance of order if you will. His intention was never that we live as Spirits with him in heaven forever but that we live as his children in a perfect world and as such that is what Revelation teaches us. Salvation negates the fall and restored us to that position that we had before Adam and Eve sinned. Obviously it is not instantaneous but involves a lifelong process because it's God well knows human beings change their mind everyday like they change their socks or underwear. It is a small price for us to pay to live a life committed to him and die still committed to him. When he returns will be the point when we receive eternal life as Paul clearly teaches. We will be changed in the twinkling of an eye and at that point we will forever be with him.
Amen? Amen!

 

[Netchaplain]

The fact is that nobody loses their salvation but it also is a fact that anybody can become apostate and walk away from their salvation if they so choose. That is not losing salvation that is becoming apostate and there's a big difference between the two.

Hi SJ - Thanks for your input. We do differ in opinions concerning an "apostate." It's my understanding that an apostate is one who was never saved but attempted to appear so outwardly, in profession only.

Blessings!

 

[StanJ]

Hi SJ - Thanks for your input. We do differ in opinions concerning an "apostate." It's my understanding that an apostate is one who was never saved but attempted to appear so outwardly, in profession only.
Blessings!

The Greek word used in Hebrews 6:6 is παραπίπτω (parapiptō), and it's rendered as apostasy which means to fall away from the faith. In 1 Timothy 4:1, Paul states; ...some will desert the faith. The Greek is ἀφίστημι (aphistēmi), which is translated as desert, abandon, or apostasize, depending on the English version.
They both indicate True Believers, who choose to walk away. See 1 Timothy 5:12 as well.

 

[Netchaplain]

The Greek word used in Hebrews 6:6 is παραπίπτω (parapiptō), and it's rendered as apostasy which means to fall away from the faith. In 1 Timothy 4:1, Paul states; ...some will desert the faith. The Greek is ἀφίστημι (aphistēmi), which is translated as desert, abandon, or apostasize, depending on the English version.
They both indicate True Believers, who choose to walk away. See 1 Timothy 5:12 as well.

Gill: "ye are fallen from grace"; that is, either from that grace which they professed to have; for there might be some in these churches, as in others, who were only nominal Christians, and formal professors; who had declared they saw themselves lost and undone sinners, destitute of a righteousness, and professed to believe in Christ alone for righteousness and strength, but now trusted in themselves, and in the works of the law: or from the scheme of grace in the whole of man's salvation, which will admit of no mixture of works; either it is one or the other, it cannot be both; wherefore by their taking on the side of works, they showed that they had entirely dropped the scheme of grace: or else from the Gospel of the grace of God, from whence they were removed, through the influence of false teachers; particularly the doctrine of free justification by the grace of God, through the righteousness of Christ; which was entirely set aside by their seeking to be instilled by the works of the law; and from this they might be said to be fallen, who were on such a bottom."

 

[StanJ]

Gill: "ye are fallen from grace"; that is, either from that grace which they professed to have; for there might be some in these churches, as in others, who were only nominal Christians, and formal professors; who had declared they saw themselves lost and undone sinners, destitute of a righteousness, and professed to believe in Christ alone for righteousness and strength, but now trusted in themselves, and in the works of the law: or from the scheme of grace in the whole of man's salvation, which will admit of no mixture of works; either it is one or the other, it cannot be both; wherefore by their taking on the side of works, they showed that they had entirely dropped the scheme of grace: or else from the Gospel of the grace of God, from whence they were removed, through the influence of false teachers; particularly the doctrine of free justification by the grace of God, through the righteousness of Christ; which was entirely set aside by their seeking to be instilled by the works of the law; and from this they might be said to be fallen, who were on such a bottom."

First of all, John Gill was a very staunch Calvinist, and as such it influenced his commentaries, and secondly, one can just see the assumptions he's making in this commentary. There's nothing in the Greek or English that would cause him to make these assumptions unless he was predisposed to do so by his personal belief in the RT doctrine of OSAS and sovereign election. I do not concur with his assessment on that basis.

 

[Netchaplain]

First of all, John Gill was a very staunch Calvinist, and as such it influenced his commentaries, and secondly, one can just see the assumptions he's making in this commentary. There's nothing in the Greek or English that would cause him to make these assumptions unless he was predisposed to do so by his personal belief in the RT doctrine of OSAS and sovereign election. I do not concur with his assessment on that basis.

Thanks for the reply! Myself, I see how one would inevitably fall away or leave a false profession (which there has been many, i.e. "A man may say" - Jam 2:18), but never a genuine belief!

Blessings!

 

[StanJ]

Thanks for the reply! Myself, I see how one would inevitably fall away or leave a false profession (which there has been many, i.e. "A man may say" - Jam 2:18), but never a genuine belief!
Blessings!

When then you're ignoring Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened, tasted the heavenly gift, become partakers of the Holy Spirit, tasted the good word of God and the miracles of the coming age, and then have committed apostasy, to renew them again to repentance, since they are crucifying the Son of God for themselves all over again and holding him up to contempt. and
Hebrews 10:35-39
So do not throw away your confidence, because it has great reward. For you need endurance in order to do God’s will and so receive what is promised. For just a little longer and he who is coming will arrive and not delay. But my righteous one will live by faith, and if he shrinks back, I take no pleasure in him. But we are not among those who shrink back and thus perish, but are among those who have faith and preserve their souls.

Which both clearly show that apostasy does come after a true relationship with Christ. Charles Templeton was one of those apostates. In case you didn't know, he was a tag-team Evangelist in the early 40s with none other than Billy Graham.

 

[Netchaplain]

When then you're ignoring Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened, tasted the heavenly gift, become partakers of the Holy Spirit, tasted the good word of God and the miracles of the coming age, and then have committed apostasy, to renew them again to repentance, since they are crucifying the Son of God for themselves all over again and holding him up to contempt. and
Hebrews 10:35-39
So do not throw away your confidence, because it has great reward. For you need endurance in order to do God’s will and so receive what is promised. For just a little longer and he who is coming will arrive and not delay. But my righteous one will live by faith, and if he shrinks back, I take no pleasure in him. But we are not among those who shrink back and thus perish, but are among those who have faith and preserve their souls.

Which both clearly show that apostasy does come after a true relationship with Christ. Charles Templeton was one of those apostates. In case you didn't know, he was a tag-team Evangelist in the early 40s with none other than Billy Graham.

I have yet to see any notable Bible commentators who disagree on nearly all Scriptures, so what you may see from one will usually be the same from them all.

From what I've learned to understand, "enlightened" here refers only to knowledge of the Gospel not acceptance, i.e. to know the truth but not live by it. The phrase "tasted of the heavenly gift" does not intend "receiving" or it would indicate so.

"Made partakers of the Holy Ghost" : Again Gill: "by the Holy Ghost is sometimes meant the gifts of the Spirit, ordinary or extraordinary, 1 Corinthians 12:4 and so here; and men may be said to be partakers of the Holy Ghost, to whom he gives wisdom and prudence in things natural and civil; the knowledge of things divine and evangelical, in an external way; the power of working miracles, of prophesying, of speaking with tongues, and of the interpretation of tongues; for the extraordinary gifts of the Holy Ghost seem chiefly designed, which some, in the first times of the Gospel, were partakers of, who had no share in special grace, Matthew 7:22."

 

[StanJ]

I have yet to see any notable Bible commentators who disagree on nearly all Scriptures, so what you may see from one will usually be the same from them all.
From what I've learned to understand, "enlightened" here refers only to knowledge of the Gospel not acceptance, i.e. to know the truth but not live by it. The phrase "tasted of the heavenly gift" does not intend "receiving" or it would indicate so.

Well I can tell you that in my experience alone I have seen people like Mounce, Moo and Wallace disagree on certain issues consistently.
The Greek word used here for 'enlightened', is φωτίζω (phōtizō), which connotes; to enlighten spiritually, to reveal, to bring to light, make known.
This is exactly what God does when he draws us to Jesus.
The Greek word used here for 'tasted', is γεύομαι (geuomai), which connotes; to have perception of, experience.
This is no different than what Psalm 34:8 exhorts us to do, or what Jesus taught in Matthew 5:13 & 16:28.
Are you proposing that Jesus didn't mean what he said in Matthew or that David didn't mean what he said in Psalm 34? Taste is a metaphorical word for experience. You may be misled because of your understanding of apostasy. What it means is; the abandonment or renunciation of a religious or political belief.
Not a pretend believe but a real belief. You are inferring concepts into the words that are not there in Greek or English. The end of verse four states; "HAVE become partakers of the Holy Spirit". Do you also doubt this is a real experience?

"Made partakers of the Holy Ghost" : Again Gill: "by the Holy Ghost is sometimes meant the gifts of the Spirit, ordinary or extraordinary, and so here; and men may be said to be partakers of the Holy Ghost, to whom he gives wisdom and prudence in things natural and civil; the knowledge of things divine and evangelical, in an external way; the power of working miracles, of prophesying, of speaking with tongues, and of the interpretation of tongues; for the extraordinary gifts of the Holy Ghost seem chiefly designed, which some, in the first times of the Gospel, were partakers of, who had no share in special grace, Matthew 7:22

I have already stated previously that I think Gil is biased in this regard. His take here on the gifts of the holy spirit is not only equivocal but downright erroneous. No one partakes of the gifts of the holy spirit unless they have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. There is no special Grace in The Bible we are all under grace.

EXPOSITORY (ENGLISH BIBLE)
Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(4) For it is impossible for those . . .—The connection of thought has been already explained (Hebrews 6:3); the general meaning will be examined below (Hebrews 6:6). It will be seen that the greater part of this long sentence is dependent on the word “renew” in Hebrews 6:6, “It is impossible to renew again unto repentance those who were once,” &c.
Those who were once enlightened.—This metaphor is introduced again in Hebrews 10:32; neither there nor here does the context contain any notice or expansion of the figure. In that passage, however, it is applied generally to all who are addressed, and includes everything that was involved in the reception of the Christian faith. This inclusive application of the term (familiar from prophecy, from our Lord’s own words, from Apostolic usage; see Acts 26:18; Ephesians 1:18; 1Peter 2:9) throws light on the construction of the verse before us. As the words stand in the Authorised version, “enlightened” is but the first term of a series; but it is far more probable that the clauses which follow should be regarded as explanatory of the enlightenment itself: “. . . those who were once enlightened, having both tasted . . . and been made partakers . . . and tasted . . .”

Tasted of the heavenly gift.—On the first word, see the Note on Hebrews 2:9. From the clear parallelism which exists between these verses and Hebrews 2:3-5 we may infer that the “salvation” offered in the gospel (Hebrews 2:3) is intended by this “gift.” It is a gift which belongs to heaven (comp. Hebrews 1:14), bestowed by Him from whom has come the “heavenly calling” (Hebrews 3:1; Hebrews 2:10). The following words at once recall Hebrews 2:4, “gifts (distributions) of the Holy Ghost.”

As I said above, not all commentators agree on this issue. Is better that we study to show ourselves approved and that we understand what the Bible says rather than depend on others to learn the word of God for ourselves.

 

[Netchaplain]

Well I can tell you that in my experience alone I have seen people like Mounce, Moo and Wallace disagree on certain issues consistently.
The Greek word used here for 'enlightened', is φωτίζω (phōtizō), which connotes; to enlighten spiritually, to reveal, to bring to light, make known.
This is exactly what God does when he draws us to Jesus.
The Greek word used here for 'tasted', is γεύομαι (geuomai), which connotes; to have perception of, experience.
This is no different than what Psalm 34:8 exhorts us to do, or what Jesus taught in Matthew 5:13 & 16:28.
Are you proposing that Jesus didn't mean what he said in Matthew or that David didn't mean what he said in Psalm 34? Taste is a metaphorical word for experience. You may be misled because of your understanding of apostasy. What it means is; the abandonment or renunciation of a religious or political belief.
Not a pretend believe but a real belief. You are inferring concepts into the words that are not there in Greek or English. The end of verse four states; "HAVE become partakers of the Holy Spirit". Do you also doubt this is a real experience?
I have already stated previously that I think Gil is biased in this regard. His take here on the gifts of the holy spirit is not only equivocal but downright erroneous. No one partakes of the gifts of the holy spirit unless they have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. There is no special Grace in The Bible we are all under grace.

EXPOSITORY (ENGLISH BIBLE)
Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(4) For it is impossible for those . . .—The connection of thought has been already explained (Hebrews 6:3); the general meaning will be examined below (Hebrews 6:6). It will be seen that the greater part of this long sentence is dependent on the word “renew” in Hebrews 6:6, “It is impossible to renew again unto repentance those who were once,” &c.
Those who were once enlightened.—This metaphor is introduced again in Hebrews 10:32; neither there nor here does the context contain any notice or expansion of the figure. In that passage, however, it is applied generally to all who are addressed, and includes everything that was involved in the reception of the Christian faith. This inclusive application of the term (familiar from prophecy, from our Lord’s own words, from Apostolic usage; see Acts 26:18; Ephesians 1:18; 1Peter 2:9) throws light on the construction of the verse before us. As the words stand in the Authorised version, “enlightened” is but the first term of a series; but it is far more probable that the clauses which follow should be regarded as explanatory of the enlightenment itself: “. . . those who were once enlightened, having both tasted . . . and been made partakers . . . and tasted . . .”

Tasted of the heavenly gift.—On the first word, see the Note on Hebrews 2:9. From the clear parallelism which exists between these verses and Hebrews 2:3-5 we may infer that the “salvation” offered in the gospel (Hebrews 2:3) is intended by this “gift.” It is a gift which belongs to heaven (comp. Hebrews 1:14), bestowed by Him from whom has come the “heavenly calling” (Hebrews 3:1; Hebrews 2:10). The following words at once recall Hebrews 2:4, “gifts (distributions) of the Holy Ghost.”

As I said above, not all commentators agree on this issue. Is better that we study to show ourselves approved and that we understand what the Bible says rather than depend on others to learn the word of God for ourselves.

Though we mostly disagree, I like the kind manner and respect you maintain in our correspondence, which can be difficult to find when sharing on multiple sites and tens of thousands of viewers.

Blessings!

 

[0bed]

When then you're ignoring Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened, tasted the heavenly gift, become partakers of the Holy Spirit, tasted the good word of God and the miracles of the coming age, and then have committed apostasy, to renew them again to repentance, since they are crucifying the Son of God for themselves all over again and holding him up to contempt. and
Hebrews 10:35-39
So do not throw away your confidence, because it has great reward. For you need endurance in order to do God’s will and so receive what is promised. For just a little longer and he who is coming will arrive and not delay. But my righteous one will live by faith, and if he shrinks back, I take no pleasure in him. But we are not among those who shrink back and thus perish, but are among those who have faith and preserve their souls.

Which both clearly show that apostasy does come after a true relationship with Christ. Charles Templeton was one of those apostates. In case you didn't know, he was a tag-team Evangelist in the early 40s with none other than Billy Graham.

We can all become cold and fall away from the Lord, even backslide, but that is not to say we turn against Christ as some apostates and atheists have done. These are the ones who actively rebel and turn against Christ as some did in his own lifetime. Judas would be an example. Was that the case with Charles Templeton do you know?

2 Thessalonians 2:3 tells us the apostate turns from God to Satan. There are only two options. The backslider who has not rejected Christ is only a lost sheep, for whom the Good Shepherd will come seeking. The Prodigal Son is welcomed back into the fold. "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away(G646) first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition"
First comes the falling away, and then in a few instances only, open rebellion, defiance and opposition. In my view these are the apostates. They are the ones who are crucifying Christ over again. They are not for him, but are against him. That is a big difference. One is apostate, while the other has simply lost their first fervour.

 

[StanJ]

We can all become cold and fall away from the Lord, even backslide, but that is not to say we turn against Christ as some apostates and atheists have done. These are the ones who actively rebel and turn against Christ as some did in his own lifetime. Judas would be an example. Was that the case with Charles Templeton do you know?

2 Thessalonians 2:3 tells us the apostate turns from God to Satan. There are only two options. The backslider who has not rejected Christ is only a lost sheep, for whom the Good Shepherd will come seeking. The Prodigal Son is welcomed back into the fold. "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away(G646) first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition"
First comes the falling away, and then in a few instances only, open rebellion, defiance and opposition. In my view these are the apostates. They are the ones who are crucifying Christ over again. They are not for him, but are against him. That is a big difference. One is apostate, while the other has simply lost their first fervour.

Apostasy is not the same as backsliding, and what you're referring to in 2 Thess 2 is the great apostasy plus the revealing of the Antichrist. Apostasy is falling away from one's Faith permanently.

 

[StanJ]

Though we mostly disagree, I like the kind manner and respect you maintain in our correspondence, which can be difficult to find when sharing on multiple sites and tens of thousands of viewers.
Blessings!

Only because of you NC. I'm not always this way with a lot of folks because they start the conversation with condescension or derision. You maintain a respectful position which must be reciprocated in a Christian forum.
Blessings to you as well!

 

[0bed]

Apostasy is not the same as backsliding, and what you're referring to in 2 Thess 2 is the great apostasy plus the revealing of the Antichrist. Apostasy is falling away from one's Faith permanently.

That is precisely the point I was making. And they are the people who are crucifying Christ again.

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Hebrews 6:4-6

 

[Thorwald]

Hi Thorwald - Thanks for your reply. I suppose there needs to be a defining of "Christ WILL manifest Himself." The "manifestation" is not in a corporal or physical way but by our being "one" with Him through the Spirit of God (Rom 8:16) as He works in us, not the life of the Spirit but of the Son (Col 3:4), unless you're referring to something else.

Blessings!

Thanks for your response. I believe otherwise, however. I believe it is a 'proof' to the believer, and is no one else's business. This is true with Numbers 12:6, as well. How can anyone 'prove' to others, that they experienced Numbers 12:6 or John 14:21-23? We know that prophecy given by a Prophet can be questioned [Did the prophecy come true?], but in my case, God used Numbers 12:6, as proof TO ME, where the vision and dream in riddles, came from. I have no prophecy to give to anyone. When I experienced Numbers 12:6, I feared that it was from Satan, trying to make me a false prophet, so I went to God in prayer, immediately. He answered me, immediately, using my thoughts, "Satan CANNOT reproduce Numbers 12:6, because if he could, then Numbers 12:6 would be useless as proof for anything."

In my vision, there were 'FOUR' figures present, NOT THREE. The Father [of The Lord God Almighty] and The Holy Ghost [who proceeds from this Father], were at the far end of a 'channel' going upwards from me, to it seemed forever. They controlled the vision, and The Father 'prayed through me, back to Himself'. I said the prayer, but it was The Father who actually provided the words. I was taken back in time, and shown the sins of the world. Only at the end of the vision [approximately three hours from start to finish], did Jesus appear, standing on the right hand of The Lord God Almighty, in the clouds, to the right of the channel. They were solemn-faced, in total subjection to the 'invisible to man' Father, and His Holy Spirit.

My 'job', is to correct the scriptures, but no one believes what I have seen. In the dream 'in riddles', when I accepted this 'job', God asked me, "Do you think you can handle it?" I answered, "Yes." He then provided me with the answer to a question I had been trying to find an answer to. He connected the scriptures, that held the answer. I was then awakened, and told to write the dream down. I spent the next nine years in research, prayer, Bible reading, communicating with many Christian ministers, one Rabbi, and one Imam. I then visited many Christian churches and discussed Christianity on many Christian forums.

God wants this 'error', corrected. There is no such thing, as 'God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost'. The 'SON' of The Trinity, is in fact, The Lord God Almighty, who has a Father from whom The Holy Ghost proceeds. The Lord God Almighty, is The Father of ALL CREATION. He and His Son [The Lord of Hosts] are The Godhead (Isaiah 44:6).

The misunderstanding that is being taught currently in the Christian churches, goes all the way back into the OT. This has been carried forward in the NT, by the Apostles/disciples, through their historical 'understanding'. This is the truth. Read Revelation 1:6, very carefully, especially 'unto God AND HIS FATHER'. It means what it says. Remember, that John was told what to write down, and what not to write down. Then read John 1:18 & 5:37, Acts 7:55-56, Matthew 3:17 & 17:5, and 2 Peter 1:17. This shows the confusion due to misunderstanding the four figures, and what 'position/power' they hold. The scriptures contradict each other. Revelation chapters 4 & 5 consist of The Godhead. There is no mention of The Holy Ghost in either Isaiah 44:6 or Revelation chapters 4 & 5.