“The Righteous Requirement of the Law” -NC

[Netchaplain]

The proper rendering of Romans 8:4 is, "That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us" (Rom 8:4 - NKJ). There was only one requirement of the Law covenant, which was the same for the covenant God had with Adam and Eve; obedience or death. “The soul that sinneth, it shall die” (Eze 18:4, 20). “And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die” (Gen 2:16, 17).

It does not say “the Law might fulfilled in us” but the “requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us”. Before the requirement of the Law could be fulfilled in us, Christ had to first fulfill it in Himself; which He did when He said “It is finished” (John 19:30). Because Christ’s perfect life of obedience qualified Him for sacrifice, redemption was not procured through His obedience to the Law, but by Him being "obedient unto death, even the death of the cross” (Phil 2:8). "God sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh" (Rom 8:3). This broke the curse of everlasting death - through the "Everlasting Covenant" (Heb 13:20).

How is the “requirement of the Law” fulfilled “in us”? The Father identified us with His Son in His death to sin; “How shall we that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? “Now if we be dead with Christ . . . .” “Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin.” “Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ . . . .” (Rom 6:2, 8, 11 Col 2:20).

For the Law to be effective (which was not its intent - Rom 8:3), one would have to obey it perfectly without ever breaking any part of it, which only Christ could do. "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all" (Jam 2:10). To "redeem us from the curse of the law" Christ had to be "made a curse for us" (Gal 3:13).

 

[Episkopos]

The proper rendering of Romans 8:4 is, "That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us" (Rom 8:4 - NKJ). There was only one requirement of the Law covenant, which was the same for the covenant God had with Adam and Eve; obedience or death. “The soul that sinneth, it shall die” (Eze 18:4, 20). “And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die” (Gen 2:16, 17).

It does not say “the Law might fulfilled in us” but the “requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us”. Before the requirement of the Law could be fulfilled in us, Christ had to first fulfill it in Himself; which He did when He said “It is finished” (John 19:30). Because Christ’s perfect life of obedience qualified Him for sacrifice, redemption was not procured through His obedience to the Law, but by Him being "obedient unto death, even the death of the cross” (Phil 2:8). "God sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh" (Rom 8:3). This broke the curse of everlasting death - through the "Everlasting Covenant" (Heb 13:20).

How is the “requirement of the Law” fulfilled “in us”? The Father identified us with His Son in His death to sin; “How shall we that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? “Now if we be dead with Christ . . . .” “Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin.” “Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ . . . .” (Rom 6:2, 8, 11 Col 2:20).

For the Law to be effective (which was not its intent - Rom 8:3), one would have to obey it perfectly without ever breaking any part of it, which only Christ could do. "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all" (Jam 2:10). To "redeem us from the curse of the law" Christ had to be "made a curse for us" (Gal 3:13).

You have it backwards...fulfilling the requirement of the law means to fulfill then intent of the law. This means the law is satisfied. The Holy Spirit empowers us...who walk in the Spirit..to do so. You are trying to make a formula that justifies a Christian who doesn't walk in the Spirit.....as most Christians cannot or will not do this. So here is the actual rendering of the text..

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.


The emphasis is to walk in the Spirit. Early Christians had no problem with the idea of a supernatural empowering to walk as Jesus did.

 

[Netchaplain]

You have it backwards...fulfilling the requirement of the law means to fulfill the intent of the law. This means the law is satisfied. The Holy Spirit empowers us...who walk in the Spirit..to do so. You are trying to make a formula that justifies a Christian who doesn't walk in the Spirit.....as most Christians cannot or will not do this. So here is the actual rendering of the text..

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The emphasis is to walk in the Spirit. Early Christians had no problem with the idea of a supernatural empowering to walk as Jesus did.

Hi Episkopos and God's blessing to your Family! The reason why all the modern translations render it "righteous requirements of the law" is because righteousness could never come by the Law: "For if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain" (Gal 2:21). "But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets" (Rom 3:21).

The main point of the Law was to show that man cannot procure fellowship with the Father apart from the work of Christ. This is why the intent and satisfaction of the Law, which you've indicated, could only be met by Christ; which was the design of the law in ceremonial typology relating to Him which only He could fulfill in His obedience and sacrifice, not Israel. This means righteousness cannot be obtained but attained, by the Father imputing Christ's righteousness to us; Christ is "made unto us ... righteousness" (1 Cor 1:30). This way, fellowship with the Father comes from the works of who we are in our new man from Christ--through the Spirit; not from who we are in the old man from Adam.

I also want you to know that my replies with you are not out of contention, which I'm sure is the same for you, but are meant for bonding with those who are of "the household of faith" and always attempting to be accurate as possible concerning the "word of truth".

 

[Episkopos]

Hi Episkopos and God's blessing to your Family! The reason why all the modern translations render it "righteous requirements of the law" is because righteousness could never come by the Law: "For if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain" (Gal 2:21). "But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets" (Rom 3:21).

The main point of the Law was to show that man cannot procure fellowship with the Father apart from the work of Christ. This is why the intent and satisfaction of the Law, which you've indicated, could only be met by Christ; which was the design of the law in ceremonial typology relating to Him which only He could fulfill in His obedience and sacrifice, not Israel. This means righteousness cannot be obtained but attained, by the Father imputing Christ's righteousness to us; Christ is "made unto us ... righteousness" (1 Cor 1:30). This way, fellowship with the Father comes from the works of who we are in our new man from Christ--through the Spirit; not from who we are in the old man from Adam.

I also want you to know that my replies with you are not out of contention, which I'm sure is the same for you, but are meant for bonding with those who are of "the household of faith" and always attempting to be accurate as possible concerning the "word of truth".

Blessings to you! There is no such thing as "imputing" a righteousness on a person who isn't actually righteous. That is the fiction that has caused Christianity to be a laughing stock among all that are not brainwashed into the thought. Salvation is not a process of becoming brainwashed with a man-invented interpretation of the bible. Rather the bible speaks of power to become truly righteous through the indwelling presence of Christ as we walk in Him. We truly become righteous because of WHO we are carrying. This righteousness is not of us but Christ...so as we are crucified with Christ we are raised to live IN HIM and walk as HE walked. Simple yet miraculous. This power changes the world. The message you are sending might fill pews...but it will never change anything either in heaven or on earth.

 

[Axehead]

Hi Episkopos and God's blessing to your Family! The reason why all the modern translations render it "righteous requirements of the law" is because righteousness could never come by the Law: "For if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain" (Gal 2:21). "But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets" (Rom 3:21).

You are getting mixed up, NetChap. The Law is good and Holy because it came from God.

Rom_7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

...and there is righteousness in the Law as I showed in the 10 commandments. Look at the righteousness of God within the words of the 10 commandments that I showed you earlier in the thread. Now, you are right, righteousness does not come by keeping the law, but the righteousness of God contained within the law is fulfilled in us by Christ as we walk after the Spirit and not the flesh.

And the rendering of the verse that Episkopos used is correct. Christ empowers us to fulfill the righteousness contained in the Law. It is He that enables us to walk in Love before Him and our neighbor and by that, the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us.

We are now, fulfilling the Law of Christ which surpasses the outward righteousness of the letter as we allow God to change us from within, sanctifying us and allowing God to purify our heart (the motives and thoughts). We now are able (through Him and In Him) to "obey Him from the heart".

Rom_6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Jas_2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:


The Royal Law is the Law of Christ.

Axehead

Blessings to you! There is no such thing as "imputing" a righteousness on a person who isn't actually righteous. That is the fiction that has caused Christianity to be a laughing stock among all that are not brainwashed into the thought. Salvation is not a process of becoming brainwashed with a man-invented interpretation of the bible. Rather the bible speaks of power to become truly righteous through the indwelling presence of Christ as we walk in Him. We truly become righteous because of WHO we are carrying. This righteousness is not of us but Christ...so as we are crucified with Christ we are raised to live IN HIM and walk as HE walked. Simple yet miraculous. This power changes the world. The message you are sending might fill pews...but it will never change anything either in heaven or on earth.

Hi Episkopos,

I posted as you posted this. Very well said, indeed!

Axe

 

[Netchaplain]

We truly become righteous because of WHO we are carrying. This righteousness is not of us but Christ...

This is the main point I try to make, that we have no personal-righteousness of our own, it's His righteousness we stand in. Man's obedience does not make him righteous; obedience confirms Christ within because one cannot be obedient without Him. "By the obedience of One shall many be made righteous" (Rom 5:19).

The misunderstanding is when man (not pointing at you) attempts to claim credit; this is why scripture uses the words "imputed for righteousness", which means to credit someone with something that did not originate from himself.

There are only two types of righteousness: false "filthy rags" (Isa 64:6); or true white blood-washed robes (Rev 7:14). I see no other type of righteousness in scripture.

 

[Axehead]

This is the main point I try to make, that we have no personal-righteousness of our own, it's His righteousness we stand in. Man's obedience does not make him righteous; obedience confirms Christ within because one cannot be obedient without Him. "By the obedience of One shall many be made righteous" (Rom 5:19).

The misunderstanding is when man (not pointing at you) attempts to claim credit; this is why scripture uses the words "imputed for righteousness", which means to credit someone with something that did not originate from himself.

There are only two types of righteousness: false "filthy rags" (Isa 64:6); or true white blood-washed robes (Rev 7:14). I see no other type of righteousness in scripture.

Hi NetChap,

No one is claiming credit. ALL glory goes to Jesus Christ. Let me ask you a question. In your walk with God over the last few decades, would you say the Lord has been purifying your heart and motives during this time? Has He been delivering you from strongholds (habits, addictions) in your life. Would you say that you are walking in more righteousness and holiness than years ago, that the Lord has been taking you from faith to faith and glory to glory? Do you have this testimony of "possessing more of the land" in your walk with God?

We cannot claim credit for the Life of Christ. But, are you decreasing and is He increasing in your life in righteousness, holiness and purity?

That's all, simple questions that are biblically based.

I assume you are a Chaplain in real life. I don't know if you go to prisons or not. I have gone to them and preached the gospel. If you go to prisons or wherever you preach, do you preach that Jesus came to set the captives free and can deliver men from ANYTHING that has them bound? Do you preach that this same power to deliver is the same power to enable them to walk in godliness and purity and greater and greater victory in this life?

In you signature you have this: "but it is Christ Himself living His own life through us; 'no longer I, but Christ.'"

What is your testimony for what that life has done in you for your mind, will, emotions, spirit, and body.

thanks, NetChap.

Axehead

By the way, you don't have to get too personal or detailed. I am not asking you to do that. You can just speak in generalities and I will understand.

 

[Netchaplain]

Hi NetChap,

In your walk with God over the last few decades, would you say the Lord has been purifying your heart and motives during this time?

Would you say that you are walking in more righteousness and holiness than years ago, that the Lord has been taking you from faith to faith and glory to glory? Do you have this testimony of "possessing more of the land" in your walk with God?

But, are you decreasing and is He increasing in your life in righteousness, holiness and purity?

Hi Ax - Yes to all the above, but I believe all godly attributes are not in degrees. One is either pure, holy and righteous or not. The variances are within our appropriations of the godliness; as you indicated, how we live in them.

Those in Christ cannot be more pure, holy and righteous than they are at regeneration, for where Christ is, there is the Spirit without "measure" (John 3:34). The evidence of this "supply" (Phil 4:19) within increases as the frequency of its appropriation increases (Heb 5:14). As the Spirit increases our understanding of the "word of truth", only then can it become more experiential to us to live by, and the primary medium of being Spirit-taught is neighborly love.

 

[Axehead]

Hi Ax - Yes to all the above, but I believe all godly attributes are not in degrees. One is either pure, holy and righteous or not. The variances are within our appropriations of the godliness; as you indicated, how we live in them.

Those in Christ cannot be more pure, holy and righteous than they are at regeneration, for where Christ is, there is the Spirit without "measure" (John 3:34). The evidence of this "supply" (Phil 4:19) within increases as the frequency of
its appropriation increases (Heb 5:14). AS the Spirit increases our understanding of the "word of truth", only then can it become more experiential to us.

You say, "Those in Christ cannot be more pure, holy and righteous than they are at regeneration".

So, let me ask you this question. At regeneration, has the Believer realized experientially the fullness of this purity, holiness and righteousness?

It seems by your last sentence that you would say no. That as "our understanding" increases "of the word of truth, only then can it become more experiential to us".

Is it just about UNDERSTANDING or is there anything else involved such as FAITH and OBEDIENCE?

How would this verse play in the life of the Believer and the walk of sanctification?
John 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.

And finally, Paul is writing to Christians and exhorting them to "cleanse" themselves "from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit." The way he is speaking, this is obviously not a one time event but a process that brings one into greater (perfecting) holiness. How does one "cleanse" themselves "from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit"?

2Co 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Thank you for your reply,
Axehead

 

[us2are1]

The righteous requirement is what Christ showed and taught. Follow and do what Christ taught and you will be OK.

 

[MTPockets]

Romans 8:4
Paul addresses the Christians from the Jews and from the Proselytes. They had lived under the laws of Sinai. They knew that they themselves had not been strong enough; that the law also had been unable to set them free. The law, too, had proved weak. While it is indeed true that the law of the Old Covenant was 'holy and just and good', it remained incapable to set free and to deliver bound and imprisoned people; inadequate to break the fetters of the burdened and injured in spirit. It was for this purpose that Jesus came; Jesus gave us the law of the Spirit of life.

The expression "what the law could not do" does not mean that the law was capable to do part of the work, while the remainder could be added in some way or another. The entire law was totally incapable. And why was this? Simply because the law was unable to deal with the evil spirits; the powers from the kingdom of darkness.

Paul does not indict the law, but instead, the powers in sinful flesh and man which obeyed the powers. Sinful flesh does the exact opposite of what the law commands. The law of the Old Covenant could not count on the help of the flesh because it was in the flesh where the powers reigned supreme. The members are subjected to the inspirations/ influence of the evil spirits which are stronger than the composite of man; his will, the mind and the spirit.. When a man attempts to observe the law, the carnal desires are provoked even more fiercely by the powers of sin, (Rom 7:8).

Jesus had the same flesh as we; a body in which the powers of sin were at work in all other people, and whose members were abused by unclean spirits. Although Jesus came in human flesh, He did not come in "sinful flesh" ... but "in the likeness of sinful flesh". This is why the devil never succeeded in creating one sinful desire in Jesus; or to tempt or violate Him in any way whatsoever. When Jesus was young, He was perfectly consecrated by His Father who is in heaven, and afterwards He was baptized in the Holy Spirit. Thus, Jesus was able to say: "The ruler of this world is coming and he has no power over me", (John 14:30); meaning: that the powers of darkness were unable to make use of His body.

The words "for sin" means: because of sin, in connection with sin.
The Word has become flesh to destroy the works of the devil, (1 John 3:8), to heal that which is damaged, and thus to renew the creation.
To make this possible, the Lord has first ransomed us from the devil by paying our debts with his blood, that is, with His life. After Jesus has made those who believe His property and the powers which worked in the flesh have also been judged. Jesus condemned them by saying that they were no longer to work in us who believe. If they still work in us we may legally and lawfully reject the lawless powers which do not heed their lawful condemnation by Jesus.
The judgment means the separation. In the spirit, a separation is brought about between truth and falsehood; in the soul there comes a separation between righteousness and iniquity; in the body there is effectual separation between the Spirit of life which gives health and the powers of sickness.
"Before Him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do", (Heb 4:13). It is the will of Jesus that we should be on the light side of the dividing chasm in the Kingdom of Heaven and sustained by the power of God. We should triumph over all the evil powers affecting our life and not permit them to influence or violate us anew.

Jesus exposed the powers and made a public display of them; He condemned them in the flesh and conquered them. In this respect, Jesus wants us to tread in His footsteps.

The requirement of the law is to live after the will of God, that is, in righteousness. Since Jesus has taken away his sin, man has become righteous by faith. But the Lord also revealed to us the Kingdom of heaven and indicated the evil spirits as the true causes of sin and sickness. He thus made a separation between man and the causes of evil.
He gave the Holy Spirit to those who believe, and He became one spirit with their spirit. In resisting the evil spirits, the Spirit of God helps the weak human spirit. Together with the human spirit, the Holy Spirit is able to do good works in and through saved men.
This is not a great effort, because the new creation wants and can do nothing else: "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them", (Eph 2:10). It is no effort for a healthy eye to see perfectly; the ear cannot avoid hearing, and the man of God will bring forth good works without strenuous effort.

Yes, there will be some reading this and protest saying that man is unable to live after the will of God; that even the best things he does are still contaminated with sin, and that he will remain a sinner until he dies. For them it is impossible that the requirement of the law could be fulfilled in them.
Instead, they read: "That the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us", and take the requirement to mean the righteousness and justification of Christ which is imputed to us.
But make no mistake! This verse deals with the actions of the Christian himself. The word rendered by "requirement" here has also been translated/rendered as "righteous deeds" elsewhere, (eg: Rev 19:8).

Paul reasons as follows: There are powers which force the man under the law, the man of good will, to do evil deeds against his spirit and also against his will and mind, (Rom 7:20, Rom 7:26). Now the Christian is given a power which supports his spirit and his soul and enables him to do good. Thus the purpose of God, (expressed by the words "in order that"), is achieved which He envisaged when He gave His Son for the sins of the world: the purpose that a justified person should be able to live a life of righteousness.
To walk, or to live, according to the flesh means gratifying the sinful desires and drives of the flesh. The lawless desires are evoked by the unclean spirits. They impregnate the desires and then sin is brought forth into the visible world, (James 1:14-15). Man's desires are made lawless by the temptation or pressure of the evil spirits.

After all, he who neglects to "set his mind on things above" walks according to the flesh and counts only with visible things and is influenced by the visible situation he finds himself in. He who walks according to the spirit counts with the unseen world. His walk is in heaven and he is guided by the Word and the Spirit of God. This is in keeping with the Lord saying, "He (the Holy Spirit) will take what is mine and declare it to you", (John 16:14).
Certain translations have Spirit with uppercase, while others use 'spirit' with lowercase. The first stands for the Holy Spirit and the second for the human spirit. In those Christians who are baptized in the Holy Spirit, these two spirits function as one spirit ... but since the Holy Spirit is the Leader in this arrangement, it is very appropriate to use the capital.

Even Ezekiel already prophesied about this restoration, when he announced this promise of God: "A new heart 1 will give you, and a new spirit 1 will put within you; and I will take out of your flesh the heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I Will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to observe my ordinances", (Ez 36:26-27).

The heart is the inner man, the unseen life of the soul. By means of prayer, laying on of hands, deliverance and healing, God takes away the powers that harden the heart. Thus a healthy inner life is restored, and the hardened, disobedient heart of stone is made into a heart of flesh in which the natural expressions have been restored.

By the word of truth and the power of God's Spirit the human spirit, too, is set free from the powers of falsehood which try to lead man astray. The spirit is restored to its original condition and put in a right relationship with God. Man does not receive a new spirit, rather, his spirit is renewed, as it says: "Behold, I make all things new", (Rev 21:5). God wants His Spirit to dwell In the renewed and purified man so that the law may be fulfilled in them as it was in Jesus.

 

[us2are1]

Romans 8:4
Paul addresses the Christians from the Jews and from the Proselytes. They had lived under the laws of Sinai. They knew that they themselves had not been strong enough; that the law also had been unable to set them free. The law, too, had proved weak. While it is indeed true that the law of the Old Covenant was 'holy and just and good', it remained incapable to set free and to deliver bound and imprisoned people; inadequate to break the fetters of the burdened and injured in spirit. It was for this purpose that Jesus came; Jesus gave us the law of the Spirit of life.

The expression "what the law could not do" does not mean that the law was capable to do part of the work, while the remainder could be added in some way or another. The entire law was totally incapable. And why was this? Simply because the law was unable to deal with the evil spirits; the powers from the kingdom of darkness.

Paul does not indict the law, but instead, the powers in sinful flesh and man which obeyed the powers. Sinful flesh does the exact opposite of what the law commands. The law of the Old Covenant could not count on the help of the flesh because it was in the flesh where the powers reigned supreme. The members are subjected to the inspirations/ influence of the evil spirits which are stronger than the composite of man; his will, the mind and the spirit.. When a man attempts to observe the law, the carnal desires are provoked even more fiercely by the powers of sin, (Rom 7:8).

Jesus had the same flesh as we; a body in which the powers of sin were at work in all other people, and whose members were abused by unclean spirits. Although Jesus came in human flesh, He did not come in "sinful flesh" ... but "in the likeness of sinful flesh". This is why the devil never succeeded in creating one sinful desire in Jesus; or to tempt or violate Him in any way whatsoever. When Jesus was young, He was perfectly consecrated by His Father who is in heaven, and afterwards He was baptized in the Holy Spirit. Thus, Jesus was able to say: "The ruler of this world is coming and he has no power over me", (John 14:30); meaning: that the powers of darkness were unable to make use of His body.

The words "for sin" means: because of sin, in connection with sin.
The Word has become flesh to destroy the works of the devil, (1 John 3:8), to heal that which is damaged, and thus to renew the creation.
To make this possible, the Lord has first ransomed us from the devil by paying our debts with his blood, that is, with His life. After Jesus has made those who believe His property and the powers which worked in the flesh have also been judged. Jesus condemned them by saying that they were no longer to work in us who believe. If they still work in us we may legally and lawfully reject the lawless powers which do not heed their lawful condemnation by Jesus.
The judgment means the separation. In the spirit, a separation is brought about between truth and falsehood; in the soul there comes a separation between righteousness and iniquity; in the body there is effectual separation between the Spirit of life which gives health and the powers of sickness.
"Before Him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do", (Heb 4:13). It is the will of Jesus that we should be on the light side of the dividing chasm in the Kingdom of Heaven and sustained by the power of God. We should triumph over all the evil powers affecting our life and not permit them to influence or violate us anew.

Jesus exposed the powers and made a public display of them; He condemned them in the flesh and conquered them. In this respect, Jesus wants us to tread in His footsteps.

The requirement of the law is to live after the will of God, that is, in righteousness. Since Jesus has taken away his sin, man has become righteous by faith. But the Lord also revealed to us the Kingdom of heaven and indicated the evil spirits as the true causes of sin and sickness. He thus made a separation between man and the causes of evil.
He gave the Holy Spirit to those who believe, and He became one spirit with their spirit. In resisting the evil spirits, the Spirit of God helps the weak human spirit. Together with the human spirit, the Holy Spirit is able to do good works in and through saved men.
This is not a great effort, because the new creation wants and can do nothing else: "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them", (Eph 2:10). It is no effort for a healthy eye to see perfectly; the ear cannot avoid hearing, and the man of God will bring forth good works without strenuous effort.

Yes, there will be some reading this and protest saying that man is unable to live after the will of God; that even the best things he does are still contaminated with sin, and that he will remain a sinner until he dies. For them it is impossible that the requirement of the law could be fulfilled in them.
Instead, they read: "That the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us", and take the requirement to mean the righteousness and justification of Christ which is imputed to us.
But make no mistake! This verse deals with the actions of the Christian himself. The word rendered by "requirement" here has also been translated/rendered as "righteous deeds" elsewhere, (eg: Rev 19:8).

Paul reasons as follows: There are powers which force the man under the law, the man of good will, to do evil deeds against his spirit and also against his will and mind, (Rom 7:20, Rom 7:26). Now the Christian is given a power which supports his spirit and his soul and enables him to do good. Thus the purpose of God, (expressed by the words "in order that"), is achieved which He envisaged when He gave His Son for the sins of the world: the purpose that a justified person should be able to live a life of righteousness.
To walk, or to live, according to the flesh means gratifying the sinful desires and drives of the flesh. The lawless desires are evoked by the unclean spirits. They impregnate the desires and then sin is brought forth into the visible world, (James 1:14-15). Man's desires are made lawless by the temptation or pressure of the evil spirits.

After all, he who neglects to "set his mind on things above" walks according to the flesh and counts only with visible things and is influenced by the visible situation he finds himself in. He who walks according to the spirit counts with the unseen world. His walk is in heaven and he is guided by the Word and the Spirit of God. This is in keeping with the Lord saying, "He (the Holy Spirit) will take what is mine and declare it to you", (John 16:14).
Certain translations have Spirit with uppercase, while others use 'spirit' with lowercase. The first stands for the Holy Spirit and the second for the human spirit. In those Christians who are baptized in the Holy Spirit, these two spirits function as one spirit ... but since the Holy Spirit is the Leader in this arrangement, it is very appropriate to use the capital.

Even Ezekiel already prophesied about this restoration, when he announced this promise of God: "A new heart 1 will give you, and a new spirit 1 will put within you; and I will take out of your flesh the heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I Will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to observe my ordinances", (Ez 36:26-27).

The heart is the inner man, the unseen life of the soul. By means of prayer, laying on of hands, deliverance and healing, God takes away the powers that harden the heart. Thus a healthy inner life is restored, and the hardened, disobedient heart of stone is made into a heart of flesh in which the natural expressions have been restored.

By the word of truth and the power of God's Spirit the human spirit, too, is set free from the powers of falsehood which try to lead man astray. The spirit is restored to its original condition and put in a right relationship with God. Man does not receive a new spirit, rather, his spirit is renewed, as it says: "Behold, I make all things new", (Rev 21:5). God wants His Spirit to dwell In the renewed and purified man so that the law may be fulfilled in them as it was in Jesus.

If you don't receive the Spirit of God you are not saved yet. The Spirit of God is not the flesh of man. Man is flesh like God himself has said. The Spirit of god is new to those who Receive Him. Now is the time to ask God for His Spirit.

 

[Netchaplain]

You say, "Those in Christ cannot be more pure, holy and righteous than they are at regeneration".

So, let me ask you this question. At regeneration, has the Believer realized experientially the fullness of this purity, holiness and righteousness?

It seems by your last sentence that you would say no. That as "our understanding" increases "of the word of truth, only then can it become more experiential to us".

Is it just about UNDERSTANDING or is there anything else involved such as FAITH and OBEDIENCE?

How would this verse play in the life of the Believer and the walk of sanctification? John 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.

And finally, Paul is writing to Christians and exhorting them to "cleanse" themselves "from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit." The way he is speaking, this is obviously not a one time event but a process that brings one into greater (perfecting) holiness. How does one "cleanse" themselves "from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit"? 2Co 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

{{By understanding I refer to the Spirit revealing understanding to us, not our own. We may think we understand certain truths but it may not be at the accuracy and depth at which it could be.

Confirmation of a parallel-understanding with the Holy Spirit can be evaluated through hermeneutics, which you may know is using Scripture to interpret and confirm itself, for there is no higher authority by which to base all truth.

The Spirit continually reveals to us deeper understanding and discernment of Scripture, which enhances our fellowship with God, with those in the Body of Christ and for our outreach to others. "Not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual . . . because they are spiritually discerned" (1 Cor 2:13, 14).

Without faith, obedience is wanting; without both, understanding is absent!


How would this verse play in the life of the Believer and the walk of sanctification? John 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.

Contextually, I believe John referred to the increase of the Lord's fame, credit and reputation and the decrease of his own, as presented in the four preceding verses. The primary means of increasing His ministry was by His miracles and doctrines; "For the Jews require a sign" (1 Cor 1:22). "Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe" (John 4:48).

(This is unrelated but wanted to share it) - The significance of attention drawn to Christ and His Apostles was for "confirming the word with signs following" (Mark 16:20; Rom 15:19; Heb 2:3-4); which after its completion can now confirm itself apart from the "signs and wonders". This increases one's faith because belief with physical proof is not blessed as belief without physical proof (John 20:20).

I also like the increase and decrease phraseology to be analogous to the increase of the activities of our "new" nature in Christ and the decrease of the activities of the "old" nature from Adam - all through the spirit of course.

As for 2 Cor 7:1, what I believe and understand in this verse is exactly the same as John Gill's and for this reason and for instructional purposes, I would like you to access the listed link and view "let us cleanse ourselves" and "perfecting holiness in the fear of God".}} http://www.ewordtoday.com/comments/2corinthians/gill/2corinthians7.htm

 

[rand]

If we walk in the light as He is in the light HE CLEANSES us from all unrighteousness. What is the light that He walks in, Truth? I have found over the past few years that He is much better at cleansing me than I am, so I let Him do what He promised.

John 3:30 He must increase and I must decrease = John The Baptist was the law and Jesus was truth and grace. The law must decrease and grace must increase, but we in the church try to hang on to both.

Isn't that what it means to rightly divide the word of truth? Divide from old covenant and new?

 

[Netchaplain]

If we walk in the light as He is in the light HE CLEANSES us from all unrighteousness. What is the light that He walks in, Truth? I have found over the past few years that He is much better at cleansing me than I am, so I let Him do what He promised.

John 3:30 He must increase and I must decrease = John The Baptist was the law and Jesus was truth and grace. The law must decrease and grace must increase, but we in the church try to hang on to both.

Isn't that what it means to rightly divide the word of truth? Divide from old covenant and new?

Hi Rand - God's blessings to you and your Family! I agree and good reply. They were all coming from the Law, even Christ who grew up in it, but now that His ministry began, it was to secede it.

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

The proper rendering of Romans 8:4 is, "That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us" (Rom 8:4 - NKJ).

Hi NetChaplain .... you said ...... "The proper rendering of Romans 8:4 is, "That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us"

May I take it a step further and ask .... who is us ?

It is my opinion that the author is Jewish .... and he is speaking to those Israelis who were under the law and he is explaining the law is now fulfilled .... and the fulfillment is done through Christ

The opening sentence of Romans 7:1 tells us who the letter is addressed to .....
Do you not know, brothers and sisters—for I am speaking to those who know the law

For that reason I do not believe we North American Gentile Christians need to get all hung up about life by the law vs the Spirit.

As non-Jews we are under the Spirit the moment we believe.

 

[us2are1]

If we walk in the light as He is in the light HE CLEANSES us from all unrighteousness. What is the light that He walks in, Truth? I have found over the past few years that He is much better at cleansing me than I am, so I let Him do what He promised.

John 3:30 He must increase and I must decrease = John The Baptist was the law and Jesus was truth and grace. The law must decrease and grace must increase, but we in the church try to hang on to both.

Isn't that what it means to rightly divide the word of truth? Divide from old covenant and new?

Rightly dividing the word of truth is to learn every word that has proceeded out of the mouth of God and write it on your eye lids (figurative speech). Carve it in your heart (figurative speech). Discard all of the nonsense that men have added to it and throw out the trash that is not God.

Then no one can trip you.

 

[Netchaplain]

Hi NetChaplain .... you said ...... "The proper rendering of Romans 8:4 is, "That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us"

May I take it a step further and ask .... who is us ?

It is my opinion that the author is Jewish .... and he is speaking to those Israelis who were under the law and he is explaining the law is now fulfilled .... and the fulfillment is done through Christ

The opening sentence of Romans 7:1 tells us who the letter is addressed to .....
Do you not know, brothers and sisters—for I am speaking to those who know the law

For that reason I do not believe we North American Gentile Christians need to get all hung up about life by the law vs the Spirit.

As non-Jews we are under the Spirit the moment we believe.

Hi Arnie - Thanks for your reply and God's blessings to your Family! I understand your point and like your reasoning ability, but I believe it's important to know the purpose of the Mosaic Law, because not only is it part of Scripture, it's also instrumental (when understanding its dispensational aspect) in God’s revelation to Israel and to the rest of the world, His desire and plan for union and fellowship with Himself.

I'll soon be posting an article directly related to this issue.

 

[Axehead]

Hi Rand - God's blessings to you and your Family! I agree and good reply. They were all coming from the Law, even Christ who grew up in it, but now that His ministry began, it was to secede it.

Actually, I don't think it means the law "decreases", because for all those "in Christ", "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth." (Rom 10:4)

", there is no gradual decrease of the Law. It ended (for righteousness) with the New Covenant (Christ). We now fulfill the Law of Christ as we have been baptized into his death and raised with Him in newness of Life when we are born of the Spirit.

There are 2 views of "rightly dividing". One is the dispensational view and the other is the covenantal view.

The dispensational view is literally "dividing up God's Word". Dividing it up as in "cutting up". The result is that they see the Word speaking of Jewish portions and the Church portions of the Word of God. And that is why they teach separate programs for the Church and for Israel. Dispensational view also cuts thing out of the Word of God as no longer applicable to our day.

The other view of "rightly dividing" the Word of truth is to "teach is accurately" dividing it from all false teaching.

Generally, the Covenant Theology group teaches there is one program of God both for the Jew and Gentile stretching from the beginning of time to the consummation of all things. They teach that God has one plan incorporating both the Old and New Covenants and this plan does not separate people but brings them all together in Christ as the focal point for all men.

Here is the word used in 2 Tim 2:15 for "rightly dividing"

orthotomeō
or-thot-om-eh'-o
From a compound of G3717 and the base of G5114; to make a straight cut, that is, (figuratively) to dissect (expound) correctly (the divine message): - rightly divide.



There is a word in the Greek that does mean to "Cut into pieces" and the only scripture that has this word, I think is very revealing.

Php 3:2 Beware of dogs (hound - kuon), beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.

katatomē
kat-at-om-ay'
From a compound of G2596 and τέμνω temnō (to cut); a cutting down (off), that is, mutilation (ironically): - concision (cutting up or off).

The last mention of dogs in the Bible:
Rev 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

"dogs" are never mentioned in a good light in the Bible.

And here is a very descriptive analysis of "dogs".

Isa 56:10 His watchmen are blind: they are all ignorant, they are all dumb dogs, they cannot bark; sleeping, lying down, loving to slumber.

They don't perceive the truth. False doctrine and lies have given them a false security and caused them to slumber and sleep because they think they are fine, built on the Rock, but their "houses" are really on sand.

Isa 56:11 Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter.

They take advantage of God's people for their own gain. They speak lies (false doctrine) in order to gather God's people to themselves rather than preaching the truth to gather the people to God.

Isa 56:12 Come ye, say they, I will fetch wine, and we will fill ourselves with strong drink; and to morrow shall be as this day, and much more abundant.

Wine and strong drink in the OT is a metaphor for lies and false doctrine.

Axehead

 

[Trekson]

Hi Axehead, Your words: "There are 2 views of "rightly dividing". One is the dispensational view and the other is the covenantal view."

I don't know if it has to be either/or. I think it's both. I've always considered myself a quasi-dispensationalist. The typical dispensationalist sees this separation as eternal, I don't. I believe that there are two destinies one for the church and one for the righteous remnant of Israel, however I believe God's ultimate goal is the unity of both and that is what I believe the future "wedding" is all about. The unification of Christ and His body (the church) with Israel (the righteous remnant) and our unified dwelling place is the New Jerusalem which is typified by the gates (the twelve tribes) but resting on the foundation of the church (the twelve disciples in their role as the early church fathers).